Are Ireland's 17,600 Nigerian residents able to send home 468 M last year???

losthorizon · 19-05-2013 02:59PM

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Oh, you're like a broken record at this point.
You honestly don't think that it's even slightly worth investigating why fewer than 6,000 people (ie the 60% who are in employment and also aren't kids) are able to live in this economy and still remit c. 60,000 each back to Nigeria, AFTER tax?
Are they all CEOs or TDs? Bank directors? Rock stars?

Source for 6000 figure please?

mikom · 19-05-2013 03:00PM

Cavehill Red wrote: »

Oh, you're like a broken record at this point.
You honestly don't think that it's even slightly worth investigating why fewer than 6,000 people (ie the 60% who are in employment and also aren't kids) are able to live in this economy and still remit c. 60,000 each back to Nigeria, AFTER tax?
Are they all CEOs or TDs? Bank directors? Rock stars?

Deposed princes going by my spambox.......

Montroseee · 19-05-2013 03:03PM

losthorizon wrote: »

Source for 6000 figure please?

40% of 17.6k is around 7 k. 17.6 k - 7k = 10.6k. Out of 17.6k, its not unrealistic that around a quarter of those are children, which brings the working population to around 6k.

BrendaN_f · 19-05-2013 03:07PM

Montroseee wrote: »

Nigerian's have the highest unemployment rate per nationality in the country, yet are able to send home the largest amounts per person by far. Do you not think that needs looking at?

sure it does. but suggesting a change in social welfare specific to nigerians, or that this money is coming from social welfare is just ridiculous

actuallylike · 19-05-2013 03:11PM

mango salsa wrote: »

I'm not racist but...

Oh cop the fcuk on. Posted at 15:19, exactly a minute after the OP. Not enough time to read the post. Just saw the title and thought you'd get in quick with your snide little bullshít. "But wait, this is AH"...no excuse to imply someone's racist and to belittle their story especially when you hadn't even read it.

Cavehill Red · 19-05-2013 03:12PM

losthorizon wrote: »

Source for 6000 figure please?

More than a quarter of Nigerians in Ireland are kids, and hence not working. Source: http://www.cso.ie/en/media/csoie/census/documents/NON%20IRISH%20NATONALS%20LIVING%20IN%20IRELAND.pdf
That leaves c. 13,000 of which 40% are unemployed. That leaves 7,800 or so in paid work. We know that many of these are employed in visible low-income industries such as security or taxi-ing, so being generous, that leaves no more than 6,000 in fabulous jobs where they can afford to remit 60,000 euro per annum to Nigeria after paying their bills and all taxes.

The Barefoot Pizza Thief · 19-05-2013 03:13PM

gallag wrote: »

Head in sand.

Yeah, but's idealistic sand.

Montroseee · 19-05-2013 03:13PM

BrendaN_f wrote: »

sure it does. but suggesting a change in social welfare specific to nigerians, or that this money is coming from social welfare is just ridiculous

I know it is, I never suggested that. However, Shatter needs to tackle and investigate this issue urgently. Horrible to see when myself, my parents and many close friends are struggling hard with a depressing disposable income figure available to us.

Make It Happen 968 · 19-05-2013 03:20PM

Miss Lockhart wrote: »

It's pretty pathetic to see the "smart" condescending comments attempt to shut down any discussion on this topic. Entirely predictable though.

These figures certainly warrant some further investigation. It's not a problem with people sending money home. It's a question of where did this money come from.

The figures just don't seem to add up, given the number of Nigerian residents of working age actually in employment.

Fully agree, but let's not point fingers, the OP has already i think made up his mind that Nigerians living here are fiddling the country. I dont see any evidence of that in the original article. I have no issue with immigrants coming here to work in the jobs that irish people have turned up their noses too, however the number of immigrants must be limited now that the Eastern Europeans are on the mass move.

the groutch · 19-05-2013 03:24PM

the problem is the availability of the likes of Western Union.
large sums of money easily transferred out of the country with zero or little accountability for where the money came from.
if I was to send the kind of money they send via paypal or via a bank account I'd probably be investigated for money laundering.

Miss Lockhart · 19-05-2013 03:25PM

Make It Happen 968 wrote: »

Fully agree, but let's not point fingers, the OP has already i think made up his mind that Nigerians living here are fiddling the country. I dont see any evidence of that in the original article. I have no issue with immigrants coming here to work in the jobs that irish people have turned up their noses too, however the number of immigrants must be limited now that the Eastern Europeans are on the mass move.

I disagree with most of what you say.

My only problem is with criminal behaviour. I just think these figures don't add up and indicate that it is likely that something illegal is going on.

Posters who aren't interested in finding out what's going on should simply state that or not bother posting. Posters who want to shut down discussion and cry racism are just pathetic.

losthorizon · 19-05-2013 03:26PM

Montroseee wrote: »

40% of 17.6k is around 7 k. 17.6 k - 7k = 10.6k. Out of 17.6k, its not unrealistic that around a quarter of those are children, which brings the working population to around 6k.

So you would have to do the same for say the British population which sends more money back and is bigger granted but has more people on pensions which Nigerians dont have. You cant just pick and choose and adjust data like that to suit an argument.

squod · 19-05-2013 03:28PM

Montroseee wrote: »

, .......Shatter needs to tackle and investigate this issue urgently. .......

He's not going to. This country is a targeted destination for traffickers, scammers and people genuinely trying to better their' lot generally. We left the door open. They came in.

Shatter says Ireland will not opt into EU directive as it is contrary to statutory position that asylum seekers shall not work

Shatner seems happy to outsource the Irish labour market from Lithuania, Poland or Bulgaria. But not Nigeria. No way hosé.

squod · 19-05-2013 03:31PM

Miss Lockhart wrote: »

My only problem is with criminal behaviour. I just think these figures don't add up and indicate that it is likely that something illegal is going on.

Likely they're paying back loans to people who sent them here in the first place. No chance of the gubberment taxing this revenue stream though. That might be sensible.

Montroseee · 19-05-2013 03:32PM

losthorizon wrote: »

So you would have to do the same for say the British population which sends more money back and is bigger granted but has more people on pensions which Nigerians dont have. You cant just pick and choose and adjust data like that to suit an argument.

There are many British men and women in highly paid positions in Ireland, the same cannot be said for Nigerians, really shouldn't really have to spell this out. In my College department for example there are 3 senior lecturers who are English. As far as I know, there are plenty of English surgeons and consultants working in Ireland etc. etc. I can take a bit of comfort knowing the Dail and Shatter are going to address this issue.

charlemont · 19-05-2013 03:38PM

Prodigious wrote: »

I have collected for concern numerous times and I swear to God not a single black individual put a penny in my bucket.

Cool, I reckon they know better than to donate as they probably know it won't change anything..

VONSHIRACH · 19-05-2013 03:41PM

I read in today's SINDO that crystal meth is gaining a foothold amongst drug addicts in Dublin, where there are supposedly 20,000 to 30,000 heroin addicts. The crystal meth originates in Africa and is distributed from some business premises acting as fronts for African drug dealers. A lot of large sums of money going to Nigeria surely can largely be attributed to criminal proceeds. There are, no doubt, many decent people remitting money to relatives in Nigeria, but that sum of money from 26,000 men, women and children in Ireland is not all clean.

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/african-gangs-use-front-businesses-to-sell-meth-29278015.html

Make It Happen 968 · 19-05-2013 03:47PM

Miss Lockhart wrote: »

I disagree with most of what you say.

My only problem is with criminal behaviour. I just think these figures don't add up and indicate that it is likely that something illegal is going on.

Posters who aren't interested in finding out what's going on should simply state that or not bother posting. Posters who want to shut down discussion and cry racism are just pathetic.

Sending money home is not criminal behaviour, again like the OP you are jumping too conclusions without facts. This is the type of irish racism that would not be openly mentioned in public, but is conversed behind netted curtains whilst sipping Barrys tea.

The_Gatsby · 19-05-2013 03:49PM

SamHall wrote: »

If the money was worked for, earned legit, what's the problem?

Because that money would be better served going back into our own economy.

We need to try and encourage them to spend that money in our own economy so we can benefit from them being here. That's part of the reason Ireland is so lax on immigration laws.

SeanW · 19-05-2013 03:52PM

mikemac1 wrote: »

Lots of money in organized crime.

Posters will dismiss the Indo but there are lots of links out there, even their papers over there cover crime and wiring money.

Leftist pinhead wrote:

But ... but ... but ... you're a RACIST!!! Besides, your story wasn't carried in the Guardian so it must be false!

Make It Happen 968 wrote: »

Sending money home is not criminal behaviour, again like the OP you are jumping too conclusions without facts. This is the type of irish racism that would not be openly mentioned in public, but is conversed behind netted curtains whilst sipping Barrys tea.

That didn't take long ...

Montroseee · 19-05-2013 03:52PM

Make It Happen 968 wrote: »

Sending money home is not criminal behaviour, again like the OP you are jumping too conclusions without facts. This is the type of irish racism that would not be openly mentioned in public, but is conversed behind netted curtains whilst sipping Barrys tea.

You must lack common sense. The figures simply don't add up, a 10 yr old could see that. The facts are there, how can a working force of around 6000 send home in excess of 50 k each, it would be hard to do that on 100 k pre tax. It's ludicrous to suggest this is open racism.

Miss Lockhart · 19-05-2013 03:52PM

Make It Happen 968 wrote: »

Sending money home is not criminal behaviour, again like the OP you are jumping too conclusions without facts. This is the type of irish racism that would not be openly mentioned in public, but is conversed behind netted curtains whilst sipping Barrys tea.

I am jumping to no conclusions. I want a further investigation. If it's all legit then great. Nobody said sending money home was illegal. Please don't put words in my mouth. I have no problem with legitimately earned money being sent anywhere.

Your accusations of racism are hilariously misdirected.

hatrickpatrick · 19-05-2013 03:54PM

Sorry but eh...
468 million being taken out of the economy by Nigerians who are giving it to their families back home who probably don't have all that much to live on is like a microscopic blip compared to the 80 BILLION we've given away to foreign and domestic bank investors who don't understand the principle that when you make a risky investment, it's your own tough sh!t if it falls through.

I agree about the general problem of money being removed from the economy, but let's have some perspective here. Bondholders are getting 160 times what these people are sending home and they've done absolutely nothing to deserve it - at least most of the Nigerians you've referenced probably worked honestly for the money they've made over here. :mad:

Montroseee · 19-05-2013 03:59PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Sorry but eh...
468 million being taken out of the economy by Nigerians who are giving it to their families back home who probably don't have all that much to live on is like a microscopic blip compared to the 80 BILLION we've given away to foreign and domestic bank investors who don't understand the principle that when you make a risky investment, it's your own tough sh!t if it falls through.

I agree about the general problem of money being removed from the economy, but let's have some perspective here. Bondholders are getting 160 times what these people are sending home and they've done absolutely nothing to deserve it - at least most of the Nigerians you've referenced probably worked honestly for the money they've made over here. :mad:

I understand and agree your point but this is an issue that clearly needs looking at, no matter how small it is in comparison.

maoi · 19-05-2013 03:59PM

Montroseee wrote: »

Disillusioned read this article: http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/nigerians-send-nearly-500m-a-year-home-from-ireland-29278045.html

500 Million is quite a large loss to the Irish Economy. A staggering figure when you break it down to 26 k per person, including children.

The CSO also shows that nearly 40% of Nigerian were unemployed in 2011 so I wouldn't imagine it's a much better figure now - http://www.thejournal.ie/one-in-five-unemployed-2011-non-nationals-534685-Jul2012/.

I know these people left the cruelty and corruption of Nigeria to come here for asylum but these are tough times and the Irish people can't afford to be carrying the can for other countries people. How this amount of money is able to be sent home truly beggars belief. I know France had a problem with many non-nationals sending money home and introduced a tax on transferring money out for the country.

Before anyone says this a foreigner bashing thread, it is not. I have worked with several Nigerians in the past and have nothing but good to say for them and their work ethic. What I do have a problem with is these incredible figures and how this kind of money is being sent out of the country, I know it's an issue that has been raised in the Dail in recent times.

Edit: It seems some posters need it spelt out, how is it that this amount is able to be sent home? 40 % are unemployed, a few thousand of that 17.6 k would be children. If you are on the social it would be impossible to have anything near that amount to send home. You would have to have a very high paying job to have 26 k a year to send home.

I'm Nigerian and I've looked through the statistics from the World Bank Report 2011 and i seriously feel it there must have been a typographical error in that report....No chance Nigerians here would send that kind of money home from here...even though a lot of us work high paying jobs like doctors, nurses etc but 500 million euros...lol...those on welfare are dead broke and continuously in need of money...i'm actually very curious myself if its true and would definitely want the government to investigate and hopefully if its legitimate i would want to know want they are up to so i join that line of business..lol..and even if its illegal transactions/business cant even see myself to believe Nigerians would be involved in that amount of illegitimate business(we cant all be drug dealers) and the average Irishman would never close his eyes to all of that without been curious.. impossible..the irish are well stuck into our business in this country and you just cant make that kind of money from any illegitimate business..NEVER..the world bank officials are humans and mistakes can be made in writing a report.

Montroseee · 19-05-2013 04:05PM

maoi wrote: »

I'm Nigerian and I've looked through the statistics from the World Bank Report 2011 and i seriously feel it there must have been a typographical error in that report....No chance Nigerians here would send that kind of money home from here...even though a lot of us work high paying jobs like doctors, nurses etc but 500 million euros...lol...those on welfare are dead broke and continuously in need of money...i'm actually very curious myself if its true and would definitely want the government to investigate and hopefully if its legitimate i would want to know want they are up to so i join that line of business..lol..and even if its illegal transactions/business cant even see myself to believe Nigerians would be involved in that amount of illegitimate business(we cant all be drug dealers) and the average Irishman would never close his eyes to all of that without been curious.. impossible..the irish are well stuck into our business in this country and you just cant make that kind of money from any illegitimate business..NEVER..the world bank officials are humans and mistakes can be made in writing a report.

Hi Maoi, despite what a few idiotic posters here will have you think, I am not a racist. I have Nigerian neighbours and have worked with a few Nigerian lads who had an exemplary work ethic. I know many have questioned the credibility of the figures in the report but I seriously doubt that they are wildly inaccurate. Anyhow as I said, the Dail and Shatter are going to examine the situation according to recent reports and I look forward to any resolutions.

AndyMc · 19-05-2013 04:06PM

We really cant say much. Its a bit of the pot calling the kettle black. We done the very same thing many years ago. Possibly still do.

corktina · 19-05-2013 04:07PM

Prodigious wrote: »

I have collected for concern numerous times and I swear to God not a single black individual put a penny in my bucket.

i've never put a penny in your bucket (or anyone else's either)...what does that prove....? In any case, cash sent to Nigeria by releatives probably does a lot more good than giving money to Concern to help pay large salaries....

Augmerson · 19-05-2013 04:09PM

Montroseee wrote: »

I can take a bit of comfort knowing the Dail and Shatter are going to address this issue.

ah lol

Montroseee · 19-05-2013 04:10PM

Augmerson wrote: »

ah lol

I only said a bit

Are Ireland's 17,600 Nigerian residents able to send home 468 M last year???

Comments