NCT and Car maintenance?

29-04-2013 01:54PM

I also think the pre-nct thing is daft. Either it'll pass or it won't, just put it through and see what they say. If it needs a service too or something else, just get it all done together.

29-04-2013 01:57PM

Pre-nct's are a total scam. As others have said put it through without doing anything and then fix what it fails on, it might even pass first time.

Faith+1 · 29-04-2013 02:05PM

Wibbs wrote: »

700 quid is a bit high for a service I'd have thought? Plus paying for a pre NCT check is a bit of a scam. A pretest test. Ehhh, no. Put it through the NCT and find out what they think is wrong, fix accordingly and save the "pretest" fee.

I'm starting to think Advance Pitstop is taking the p*ss with me at this stage :mad:

Faith+1 · 29-04-2013 02:08PM

Alun wrote: »

It's not a "rubber dust jacket" It's a CV boot, which keeps the grease in and keeps road dirt and grit out of a vital part of what drives your front wheels. If that fails while you're driving along, you'll certainly notice it, and could potentially cause an accident if you lose control of your car as a result.

And would you believe that's what was printed on my NCT failure list! Well thanks for the update!

Minderbinder · 29-04-2013 02:09PM

I had the NCT a couple of weeks ago but one of their machines broke down during the test. I got a full refund and they told me some areas I needed to fix. Went back a week later and passed. Cost €28 in total. Very good system in my opinion.

Faith+1 · 29-04-2013 02:15PM

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

If you mean the thing that covers the CV joint, then yes that is important to get sorted as soon as. But I'd be very annoyed with any garage that charged you €700 and missed one of them. I'd be even more annoyed if they charged me to replace a CV boot and couldn't show me where the old one had a fresh cut since they did the inspection.

€760 :eek:
'tis a pity the bangernomics thread in motors is closed

It's sorted now, brought it straight back to my garage who only charged me for parts and not labour. The reason everything was 700 was because I got 3 new tyres, new wipers, repair of oil leak, wheel balancing, light alignment, service etc.. I was surprised when they told me they had to replace 3 tyres. The threads were fine but they said they were cracked and showing signs of age .i.e original tyres.

http://www.flix66.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/Planes-Trains-and-Automobiles-3.jpg

You'd swear I was driving that car from Trains, planes and automobiles!

Sleepy · 29-04-2013 02:24PM

I'd like to see a much more thorough NCT tbh. A new NCT is no indication that the timing belt won't snap next week, that the head-gasket isn't fit to blow etc. Were the car fully inspected rather than a simple box-checking exercise we have at the present, a fresh NCT could be a great indicator that a used car is in decent condition.

I dropped my car in at the weekend knowing it has a few issues and expecting a whole list of things to be fixed for it to pass. It failed on a reversing light bulb (visual re-check) when I know myself there's far more than that needed on it (which it'll be getting next weekend).

One thing I didn't see mentioned in this thread is the fear of large bills. Although I like my cars I don't know a huge amount about a lot of the internal workings (beyond basic oil and filter changes, I'd be no use under the hood) and I've even less knowledge about the costs associated with things. e.g. I know my car has something awry with it's rear suspension. Given the age of the car, and the fact they're a consumable part, I'm guessing the bushings might need replacing but I've no idea how big or expensive a job that is.

While I could confidently know a regular service won't cost me more than, say, €150 there's the fear of bringing the car in and finding out there's hundreds of euros worth of work needed. With the current economy there's many of us that can't handle a €500 bill (or worse) out of a single months wages and can't survive without our cars so it can seem easier to stick the head in the sand and just keep on running it until something goes bang. It's far more expensive in the long run of course but the thoughts of calling to collect a car from a service to be told "I can't let you drive away with it like that and it'll cost €800 to put right" is enough to make many people think far more short term than they should.

29-04-2013 02:26PM

Sleepy wrote: »

I'd like to see a much more thorough NCT tbh. A new NCT is no indication that the timing belt won't snap next week, that the head-gasket isn't fit to blow etc. .

Friend has just texted her gasket is gone and it only passed NCT last week...

carzony · 29-04-2013 02:28PM

Wurly wrote: »

Do you not need a valid NCT when renewing for car insurance? Also, would you not get fined if you were stopped at a garda checkpoint?

well my car hasnt been nct'd yet and when I rang my insurance they insisted on nct details, Then when I decided to go in to the place they didnt even think to ask me about nct details, I'm sure if somthing happens technically I won't be insured but what can ya do, I'm waiting for a booking.

My insurance is due for renewal next week and most companies asked me every question under the sun but they never mentioned nct? I suppose it's your own business if it's nct'd.. It's just another way they can weasel out of paying you when you actually do have a claim..

MurdyWurdy · 29-04-2013 02:31PM

carzony wrote: »

well my car hasnt been nct'd yet and when I rang my insurance they insisted on nct details, Then when I decided to go in to the place they didnt even think to ask me about nct details, I'm sure if somthing happens technically I won't be insured but what can ya do, I'm waiting for a booking.

My insurance is due for renewal next week and most companies asked me every question under the sun but they never mentioned nct? I suppose it's your own business if it's nct'd.. It's just another way they can weasel out of paying you when you actually do have a claim..

What's the point in getting insurance if you are fairly sure they won't pay out if you cause an accident? Surely paying 50 for an NCT is far better than getting stung if you hit someone uninsured down the line. It's just seems silly.

EDIT: just re-read post and you are waiting for a booking, so you do plan on getting the NCT. Fair enough

Wibbs · 29-04-2013 02:52PM

listermint wrote: »

Your statement would be typical of the average irish motorist though. Clueless on costs.

Servicing an 8 Cylinder engine would not be the same as your average avensis for example...

Well duuuuh, though I still call ballsology. I know quite a bit about costs and unless the OP is driving some high end motor with equally high end parts prices at a main dealer, or the "service" included a clutch or cam belt/chain, an otherwise standard service including brakes at 700 quid is more than a tad steep, especially if they've not spotted a shagged CV boot. Then again I've seen chancers charge near 200 quid for an oil change so...

Hobbes wrote: »

If you fail with that much cost to get it repaired the car isn't road worthy.

Depends on what the definition of roadworthy is. A dead catalytic convertor could cost that to replace, especially at main stealer prices and that would have absolutely zero effect on safety

Hobbes wrote: »

You would also get fined at a Garda check point. The whole thing is automated as well now. So the guards can find out straight away if you have booked an NCT or not.

Funny how I've gone through umpteen Garda checkpoints, didn't even have an old one displayed and only once was it even commented upon. They may be changing, but for a very long time it was clearly of very low priority as my experience isn't unusual.

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

If you mean the thing that covers the CV joint, then yes that is important to get sorted as soon as. But I'd be very annoyed with any garage that charged you €700 and missed one of them. I'd be even more annoyed if they charged me to replace a CV boot and couldn't show me where the old one had a fresh cut since they did the inspection.

+1 A knackered CV joint can go on for ages grinding and knocking as it goes, but it's a helluva lot cheaper to replace the CV boot cover than having to replace the joint/entire shaft itself. Then again cheap appears to be relative considering the prices the OP's garage seems to be charging.

29-04-2013 02:56PM

Sleepy wrote: »

I'd like to see a much more thorough NCT tbh. A new NCT is no indication that the timing belt won't snap next week, that the head-gasket isn't fit to blow etc. Were the car fully inspected rather than a simple box-checking exercise we have at the present, a fresh NCT could be a great indicator that a used car is in decent condition.

A lot of problems are very difficult if not impossible to diagnose in advance like this so you won't see them added to the nct.

For instance the only way to guarantee the condition of a timing belt io to change it on schedule, no mechanic will try to judge the condition of one.

Wibbs · 29-04-2013 03:05PM

Faith+1 wrote: »

It's sorted now, brought it straight back to my garage who only charged me for parts and not labour. The reason everything was 700 was because I got 3 new tyres, new wipers, repair of oil leak, wheel balancing, light alignment, service etc.. I was surprised when they told me they had to replace 3 tyres. The threads were fine but they said they were cracked and showing signs of age .i.e original tyres.

OK fair enough, however I'd still be asking questions, IE why three tyres and not the four? Forth one newer? It's more usual to either change the lot or two at a time(front or back).

bluewolf wrote: »

Friend has just texted her gasket is gone and it only passed NCT last week...

To be fair B, it would be hard enough to spot such a thing beforehand. Ditto for Sleepy's suggestion re cam belts. An ancient cam belt can look OK, near new indeed. If they signed off on one and it went, lawsuit ahoy. I suspect that's why things like that aren't in the test. Generally speaking if the head gasket is blowing it should show up on the emissions test. Plus you know yourself, items have a service life, some items are very binary like that, they either work or they stop working and depending on when you test them... I've certainly known well dubious cars to fail the NCT, when others actually pretty healthy end up with a fail. A few years ago I had a right gimp of an NCT tester(most I've found to be cool) who informed me my car's engine was knackered, uneconomical to repair. Yea right, just needed an O2 sensor and a cat. Four years and 80,000k later it's still going strong with HC of under 30 PPM.

listermint · 29-04-2013 03:05PM

Lilliana Odd Tungsten wrote: »

A lot of problems are very difficult if not impossible to diagnose in advance like this so you won't see them added to the nct.

For instance the only way to guarantee the condition of a timing belt to to change it on schedule, no mechanic will try to judge the condition of one.

Yep! completely correct. There is things you just cant diagnose via NCT.

This is why regular and planned service maintenance is essential.

Things that just have to be done at certain mileages i.e. coolant system overhaul.

mathie · 29-04-2013 03:07PM

Jester252 wrote: »

That not how they get paid. They have a fixed salary. They don't make money off the people whose cars they test.

Did I say the employees were ripping people off?

ScumLord · 29-04-2013 03:12PM

Wibbs wrote: »

700 quid is a bit high for a service I'd have thought? Plus paying for a pre NCT check is a bit of a scam. A pretest test. Ehhh, no. Put it through the NCT and find out what they think is wrong, fix accordingly and save the "pretest" fee.

The problem with modern cars is they're a bitch to service yourself. To change the air filter on mine you have to remove the wipers and the assembly they're attached too. They've turned an easy job into one that you require specialised tools for. Even something simple like changing the light bulbs has been made as awkward as possible.

It's not that the job is particularly hard it's just time consuming, which adds big expense to any repair work done in a garage.

Faith+1 · 29-04-2013 03:15PM

Wibbs wrote: »

OK fair enough, however I'd still be asking questions, IE why three tyres and not the four? Forth one newer? It's more usual to either change the lot or two at a time(front or back).

No need because I got a flat only a few weeks ago so the 4th tyre was brand new!

Wibbs · 29-04-2013 03:22PM

ScumLord wrote: »

The problem with modern cars is they're a bitch to service yourself. To change the air filter on mine you have to remove the wipers and the assembly they're attached too. They've turned an easy job into one that you require specialised tools for. Even something simple like changing the light bulbs has been made as awkward as possible.

It's not that the job is particularly hard it's just time consuming, which adds big expense to any repair work done in a garage.

Handy for the dealers, but yep I do take your point. Very much so. I've seen similar on mates new(er) cars. Real headscratching stuff where you're thinking "what fcuking moron put that there", then you realise it was an accountant.

Same with the electronics. A mate's car needed a fuel pump. Simple enough you'd think, but oh no, the pump is simple if pricey, the installation is simple enough too, but the pump has to be synced to the car's brain to work. Requiring main Dealer involvement(usually). You could source the part and fit it yourself, but the dealer price to sync the brain is nigh on the same price as them doing the whole job. Another reason I'll be hanging on to my old yoke as long as possible. It's an absolute doddle to DIY compared to newer kit.

Ush1 · 29-04-2013 03:24PM

Before you get a car, check the if there's a Haynes manual for it. You can normally know then if a service is difficult or not.

donutheadhomer · 29-04-2013 03:44PM

mathie wrote: »

I've seen a car with a broken radio areial fail a test.
And one with no European Union sign fail

How is that about safety?

a previous car of mine failed for dust behind the perspex on my rear numberplate

listermint · 29-04-2013 03:49PM

ScumLord wrote: »

The problem with modern cars is they're a bitch to service yourself. To change the air filter on mine you have to remove the wipers and the assembly they're attached too. They've turned an easy job into one that you require specialised tools for. Even something simple like changing the light bulbs has been made as awkward as possible.

It's not that the job is particularly hard it's just time consuming, which adds big expense to any repair work done in a garage.

On your model this is true. Not true for 'all' modern cars.

carzony · 29-04-2013 03:51PM

MurdyWurdy wrote: »

What's the point in getting insurance if you are fairly sure they won't pay out if you cause an accident? Surely paying 50 for an NCT is far better than getting stung if you hit someone uninsured down the line. It's just seems silly.

EDIT: just re-read post and you are waiting for a booking, so you do plan on getting the NCT. Fair enough

Well in all honesty i'd rather not nct it, It's just another bill I don't need. I just don't need the guards taking my car off me, Happened once before and I was very embarressed about it..

Please Kill Me · 29-04-2013 04:02PM

My OH and I are both out of work. We have three children (including a newborn) we need a car to get up and down to the school with the older lad (no buses before the smart-arses start) I service the car myself, tyres are replaced when needs be, alignment done when needs be. The car is insured as it's only €20 a month. I tax it for 3 months, let it slide for 3 months, taxed for 3 months etc. Hasn't been NCT'd in 2 years as it's a money-making scam! I've seen good, well-taken care of cars fail, and piles of shite pass. Doesn't make sense. If the cops take the car off me, I'll just get another cheap runaround. Simples.

Irishcrx · 29-04-2013 04:11PM

Please Kill Me wrote: »

My OH and I are both out of work. We have three children (including a newborn) we need a car to get up and down to the school with the older lad (no buses before the smart-arses start) I service the car myself, tyres are replaced when needs be, alignment done when needs be. The car is insured as it's only €20 a month. I tax it for 3 months, let it slide for 3 months, taxed for 3 months etc. Hasn't been NCT'd in 2 years as it's a money-making scam! I've seen good, well-taken care of cars fail, and piles of shite pass. Doesn't make sense. If the cops take the car off me, I'll just get another cheap runaround. Simples.

Yeah I feel similar to this , my car only cost me a couple of hundred quid and it gets me to work and back. I don't expect it to last more than another few month's , I know if I ran it through the NCT I'd end up having to spend a few hundred on it and I just can't justify spending more than it's worth on it only for it to go bang a few weeks later , it's Taxed and Insured and I've never been asked about the NCT at a checkpoint.

If it needs anything immediatly I'll change it , ie wiper blades, tyres etc. I'f the car was newer and worth a few thousand I'd NCT it and keep service history and that because I'd want to keep it in as good condition as possible to hold it's value.

Please Kill Me · 29-04-2013 04:14PM

Irishcrx wrote: »

Yeah I feel similar to this , my car only cost me a couple of hundred quid and it gets me to work and back. I don't expect it to last more than another few month's , I know if I ran it through the NCT I'd end up having to spend a few hundred on it and I just can't justify spending more than it's worth on it only for it to go bang a few weeks later , it's Taxed and Insured and I've never been asked about the NCT at a checkpoint.

If it needs anything immediatly I'll change it , ie wiper blades, tyres etc. I'f the car was newer and worth a few thousand I'd NCT it and keep service history and that because I'd want to keep it in as good condition as possible to hold it's value.

In fairness, I TRIED to get it NCT'd, they failed it on a bent track-rod end and sticking back brakes. I got that sorted and brought it back and they failed it on the number plate lights. The screws are rusted and rounded off so I didn't bother bringing it back if that's the "only" problem they could find with it.

Celly Smunt · 29-04-2013 04:29PM

Faith+1 wrote: »

I'm starting to think Advance Pitstop is taking the p*ss with me at this stage :mad:

Advance pitstop is the last place to go to get anything done.No matter what's wrong with your car they'll fond something else that's "wrong" with your car if you get me.

Faith+1 · 29-04-2013 04:43PM

pmcmahon wrote: »

Advance pitstop is the last place to go to get anything done.No matter what's wrong with your car they'll fond something else that's "wrong" with your car if you get me.

That wasn't the case I found a few years ago but now it seems my car is falling apart with them. Can you recommend anyone? Preferably on the northside?

Sleepy · 29-04-2013 05:11PM

Lilliana Odd Tungsten wrote: »

A lot of problems are very difficult if not impossible to diagnose in advance like this so you won't see them added to the nct.

For instance the only way to guarantee the condition of a timing belt io to change it on schedule, no mechanic will try to judge the condition of one.

Oh, I get that but there are plenty of things that aren't checked which should be. For example, my previous car passed it's NCT despite having an oil leak. The NCT mechanic even pointed it out to me as something to get my mechanic to take a look at when it was next in for a service...

While I wouldn't expect anyone to be able to stand over a timing belt on a visual inspection, a stamped log book/receipts showing it to have been changed on schedule wouldn't be an impossible thing to require for cars above a given reg plate (i.e. let people know in advance).

I'm not arguing that an NCT should be a guarantee the car is perfect but it should tell you that there's nothing wrong with it that you'd expect any mechanic you brought along with you to look at a second hand car to notice. (a pass "with advisory" might be a useful addition here e.g. Car gets a pass with an advisory that A/C is not working / tyres are only just legal, brake pads approaching needing replacement etc.)

ScumLord · 29-04-2013 05:12PM

Wibbs wrote: »

Same with the electronics. A mate's car needed a fuel pump. Simple enough you'd think, but oh no, the pump is simple if pricey, the installation is simple enough too, but the pump has to be synced to the car's brain to work. Requiring main Dealer involvement(usually). You could source the part and fit it yourself, but the dealer price to sync the brain is nigh on the same price as them doing the whole job.

Had the exact same problem lately, I bought a van in that had a new fuel pump fitted outside of the dealership but we still had to bring it in to be reset. I stood at the driver door, mechanic stood at the passenger door with the laptop plugged in. Taps a few keys, tells me to turn the car off, taps a few keys, turn the car on again, taps a few keys.. Job done. It's about as complicated as updating drivers on your PC.

Celly Smunt · 29-04-2013 05:21PM

Faith+1 wrote: »

That wasn't the case I found a few years ago but now it seems my car is falling apart with them. Can you recommend anyone? Preferably on the northside?

I don't really know about the Northside.Perhaps the lads in the motors forum could recommend somebody who does good work

NCT and Car maintenance?

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