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Where do I find good Web Programmers, Designers and Seo experts?

  • 23-04-2013 01:27PM
    #1
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭


    Ok, so I have a little bit of a head scratcher. Unfortunately I have been recently let go from my Job where we conceived, developed first stage working web/app models and got grants and investors for development (The latter being my expertise as I have been in this field for many years now)

    I am looking to put together a team of web developer, Seo expert, Designer (Ideally different people) to bring together a number of projects to grant level and then investor level however I have absolutely no capital to put into this as the closing of the job came at a bad time.

    I am looking to see a couple of things - Firstly, is it feasible to pull together a group of experts in different fields to work together effectively for a share of the end product? and effectively give themselves part time for free and secondly where is the best place to look for the relevant experts (As outline above) as in website or location (In the old days we went to the colleges but that is a long time ago now)
    Tagged:


Comments

  • #2
    jhegarty
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,135 ✭✭✭jhegarty


    So the question is, where do I find good Web Programmers, Designers who will work for free ?


  • #3
    Trojan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,415 ✭✭✭✭Trojan


    The "Business Partner" Sticky is a good place to start. Also check out the Work Wanted Superthread in the Design forum.

    Whatever you do, please be aware that web dev/designer folks see one of these requests posted about once a week, so don't get defensive if you're asked to explain why your particular project is better than the regular "You do all the work and I'll give you a tiny % of equity" offers that others have posted previously.

    🎙️ The Recognized Authority Podcast



  • #4
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    jhegarty wrote: »
    So the question is, where do I find good Web Programmers, Designers who will work for free ?

    Thanks for the reply, well yes and no.

    I am looking to put together a group with individual expertise in different fields who will share equally in the project (Financially assuming that we get it to grant and investor level)

    For example my expertise is the conceiving of the project and bringing it to the various grant avenues and ultimately in front of investors (Relationships that I have built up over the years) however it is a chicken and egg scenario in so far as I need first stage working examples to create the capital needed to develop the various projects.

    The idea is that the projects initially dont impact a large amount of time of each individual until they have the cash injection needed to develop further.

    It would suit individuals that are either out of work (Like myself) or individuals with a little excess time on their hands.

    In this way we all risk only a small portion of our time with a potential gain for all (We would all have an equal share in each project)

    I have been doing this in a work sense for many years and am confident of my end however it is like being trying to supply car dealer with your brand of car that you have been dealing with for years and not having the engineers to build the car in the first place.

    As I said I think that like minded people can pull together to do good things for the whole group but I am at a loss where is best to look for them.

    Thanks again


  • #5
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    Trojan wrote: »
    The "Business Partner" Sticky is a good place to start. Also check out the Work Wanted Superthread in the Design forum.

    Whatever you do, please be aware that web dev/designer folks see one of these requests posted about once a week, so don't get defensive if you're asked to explain why your particular project is better than the regular "You do all the work and I'll give you a tiny % of equity" offers that others have posted previously.

    Thanks a mill for that :)


  • #6
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,808 ✭✭✭✭smash


    SynergyMan wrote: »
    For example my expertise is the conceiving of the project and bringing it to the various grant avenues and ultimately in front of investors

    So you get to do nothing until it has been completed by people you've recruited for free...


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  • #7
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    smash wrote: »
    So you get to do nothing until it has been completed by people you've recruited for free...

    Thanks for the reply, a valid question. It is actually the opposite. I would be the only one of the individuals committing full time for free as there is a huge amount of work in setting up each project before its completion (As mentioned this until recently was a full time job for me) .

    Assuming each project is 6 weeks from start to finish (Well first draft for presentation anyway) - While the actual working model is being created I will have to submit the Full business Plan and Model for each body and potential investor also before presentations are brought a number of 1 to 1 with angel investor have to take place in that time (And that is not to mention the complete pitch that will have to slightly differ from investor to investor) also the project management of the project itself. Genuinely it is a massive task to do it properly but as I mentioned it is a tried and tested one from years of doing it in a work sense. Thanks again


  • #8
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,808 ✭✭✭✭smash


    You know what gets me? This bit: "each project"

    You're going out on a whim here to contract people to work for free on various projects in the hopes that one might get investment of some sort. Never going to happen!


  • #9
    Cianos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Cianos


    What's the value of someone working on a project for you if it's just one of many that you'll be trying to bring to market?


  • #10
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    smash wrote: »
    You know what gets me? This bit: "each project"

    You're going out on a whim here to contract people to work for free on various projects in the hopes that one might get investment of some sort. Never going to happen!

    Last year (In my working life) I brought 42 projects to grant stage .. of them 17 went to fully first round investment stage and of them 8 are in second round or working businesses. The minimum grant received was 7.5k (Research Grant) and maximum Grant was 25k and The minimum Investment received was 20k (First Round Investment) and the maximum was 750k (Second Round Investment) . Of them projects 3 of them would be well know in Ireland and in the UK. The conversion of concept to Grant stage is about 2 to 1 (In other words 84 project approx would have been created).

    This is far from a 'Whim' and unfortunatley is brought about from nessessity - If you look at my original post I was simply looking for guidance as to were I can find people online or location in a similar situation to me who possess different skills to myself and that as a equal share partnership team can maybe do something positive and turn this situation around into something good.

    I cant help but feel that you may have been bitten in the past by something like this and although I can understand your position it is not true to say that it is .. 'Never going to happen!'. I know it to be otherwise from vast experience.

    Some of the greatest partnerships in history were started in similar circumstances. Genuinely, I would be delighted to answer any more questions on the subject. Thanks again


  • #11
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    Cianos wrote: »
    What's the value of someone working on a project for you if it's just one of many that you'll be trying to bring to market?
    Hi Cianos, the idea is that the team will be working on ALL projects not just one of them. Thanks again


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  • #12
    srsly78
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,156 ✭✭✭srsly78


    If you are so good at raising money they you should have no problem hiring the staff you need.

    Do you know the market rate for experienced software developers?


  • #13
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,808 ✭✭✭✭smash


    SynergyMan wrote: »
    I cant help but feel that you may have been bitten in the past by something like this and although I can understand your position it is not true to say that it is .. 'Never going to happen!'. I know it to be otherwise from vast experience.

    My issues are that I have the skills you have listed and have heard your type of pitch a thousand times. Of all the pitches I've heard and refused, none of them have ever worked out. As mentioned previously, if you asked this question in the web/programming forums you'd get slated.


  • #14
    Cianos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Cianos


    Where are the ideas for these projects coming? Are they focused on a particular industry etc?

    Can you provide proof of your funding successes in the past, and if you've been successful in bringing that amount of projects to funding how come you're now in your current position? (not prying on a personal level, just a business level)


  • #15
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    smash wrote: »
    My issues are that I have the skills you have listed and have heard your type of pitch a thousand times. Of all the pitches I've heard and refused, none of them have ever worked out. As mentioned previously, if you asked this question in the web/programming forums you'd get slated.

    Thanks for coming back to me. I understand completely now :)

    I think that the problem as a whole with this type of thing (Which I have seen many times over the years) is that there are too many cowboys that think that they can just pick an idea out of the air and con people into helping them for greedy means with only one winner (The organizer) being rewarded at the end.

    You are completely right in being cautious as (In my previous existence) we would listen to literally thousands if not more project concepts through various feeder networks and ourselves and choose only about 70-100 to bring to first stage (Of which only half of them made a dent - approx 1 in 2 would get some type of grant money).

    What I bring to the table is bringing the product and concept to money and funding and it is a specialist skill as is web development. Thats why the idea of the team of like minded people working together appealed to me. Everybody invests a small amount of time for potential reward at the end.

    Truthfully, this type of thing doesn't work without the sum of all parts. As in - Concept, Creation, Development, Funding and implementation. Very few people possess it all.

    Lastly, I think it is important that nobody under values the contribution of themselves and others (Which is why I was looking to divide share equally). A car is useless without and engine not matter how else well it is put together.

    Thanks again for your reply and valid opinion, I am a newbie to Boards.ie and I think it is good to flesh out feed back from everybody. It might not work as a concept because of some unethical people out there but I think it would be a shame if not.


  • #16
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    srsly78 wrote: »
    If you are so good at raising money they you should have no problem hiring the staff you need.

    Do you know the market rate for experienced software developers?

    Thanks for the reply. Good question mate. In years past it would have been easier to pitch the idea first without the actual first stage development done but now because of the competition and cut backs they make you jump through every hoop know to man.

    In fact when the banks were lending it would have been a single phone call to get the funding for the project that would have paid itself back with a grant very quickly.

    Unfortunately gone are those days and without first draft development of product to pitch it is impossible.


  • #17
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    Cianos wrote: »
    Where are the ideas for these projects coming? Are they focused on a particular industry etc?

    Can you provide proof of your funding successes in the past, and if you've been successful in bringing that amount of projects to funding how come you're now in your current position? (not prying on a personal level, just a business level)

    Hi Cianos, thanks for the reply. All valid questions. They are specifically project ideas/Concepts that are remnants from the 'most likely to succeed' category of the company that I worked in (That is now closed down - Tax man and bad management killed it) - All projects have been extensively market researched with full route to market potential explored. All are web/app. The industries I can go into on a one to one basis.

    I regard to proof of past funding success that is no problem at all also (Again it would be in person) - I think it is important that everybody in this scenario has to justify what they bring to the table (In other words it wouldn't be good enough to just have the skill, each person would have bring a level of professionalism with them).

    On the last note through personal circumstances I went from hero to zero money wise and then the job I was working in ended. So as I am never one to shy away from a challenge I am effectively trying to bring these projects to funding with little or no capital. Thanks again


  • #18
    Cianos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Cianos


    SynergyMan wrote: »
    Hi Cianos, thanks for the reply. All valid questions. They are specifically project ideas/Concepts that are remnants from the 'most likely to succeed' category of the company that I worked in (That is now closed down - Tax man and bad management killed it) - All projects have been extensively market researched with full route to market potential explored. All are web/app. The industries I can go into on a one to one basis.

    I regard to proof of past funding success that is no problem at all also (Again it would be in person) - I think it is important that everybody in this scenario has to justify what they bring to the table (In other words it wouldn't be good enough to just have the skill, each person would have bring a level of professionalism with them).

    On the last note through personal circumstances I went from hero to zero money wise and then the job I was working in ended. So as I am never one to shy away from a challenge I am effectively trying to bring these projects to funding with little or no capital. Thanks again

    Thanks for the reply. Who had these ideas/concepts originally and how come you have the rights to continue developing them? What reassurance can you give that if one was to get involved there'd be no legal complications down the line from either your ex coworkers or those who submitted the ideas originally?


  • #19
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    Cianos wrote: »
    Thanks for the reply. Who had these ideas/concepts originally and how come you have the rights to continue developing them? What reassurance can you give that if one was to get involved there'd be no legal complications down the line from either your ex coworkers or those who submitted the ideas originally?

    Hi there. 3 ideas that I could take were my own, which is how I know how in dept the the research and analysis has been done on them and the other 2 are outside people who I have keep in touch with. I will have also others coming through some of the colleges and other feeders but they will be New so there will be no legal impediment. Thanks again


  • #20
    eireannBEAR
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,713 ✭✭✭eireannBEAR


    synergy contact DBS etc your ideas and experience could help skilled students or other IT techs who are also willing to help you in return.

    all the best people might be giving you a hard time here,but hey at least you are being proactive. as i am sure you know there are many cases in the IT world of even untrained people or people who have had simple ideas being a huge success in that sector. just dont lose the drive.

    all the best.


  • #21
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    eireannBEAR wrote: »
    synergy contact DBS etc your ideas and experience could help skilled students or other IT techs who are also willing to help you in return.

    all the best people might be giving you a hard time here,but hey at least you are being proactive. as i am sure you know there are many cases in the IT world of even untrained people or people who have had simple ideas being a huge success in that sector. just dont lose the drive.

    all the best.

    Thnaks a mil, really appreciate that :)


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  • #22
    Cianos
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Cianos


    SynergyMan wrote: »
    Hi there. 3 ideas that I could take were my own, which is how I know how in dept the the research and analysis has been done on them and the other 2 are outside people who I have keep in touch with. I will have also others coming through some of the colleges and other feeders but they will be New so there will be no legal impediment. Thanks again

    So you've brought 42 projects to grant stage so far, but I presume none of these have been your own ideas? And now that you've left the company you want to team with people who can bring 3 of your own ideas to realisation? For me there'd be a worry there that if they weren't your own ideas you might have dismissed them already, but since they're the only ones you can continue with that you may as well?

    I don't mean to be cutting here, just want a clear idea of the motivation!


  • #23
    SynergyMan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭SynergyMan


    Cianos wrote: »
    So you've brought 42 projects to grant stage so far, but I presume none of these have been your own ideas? And now that you've left the company you want to team with people who can bring 3 of your own ideas to realisation? For me there'd be a worry there that if they weren't your own ideas you might have dismissed them already, but since they're the only ones you can continue with that you may as well?

    I don't mean to be cutting here, just want a clear idea of the motivation!

    Hi there. Of the 42 there were 13 that were mine (of which I got a creative royalty payment and the company got the grants investments etc) as part of my agreement with them on exiting I was allowed to keep the creative licence to the undeveloped projects and pursue the pick of the other undeveloped project with the input and agreement of the person who was the project concept creator. Which I did. I initially took 5 of the best researched and most likely to succeed but there are lots and lots of great ideas out there that will never get to market as we don't make it easy in this country to carve a path and help in an easy manner. Thanks again :)


  • #24
    Chevy RV
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 468 ✭✭Chevy RV


    Hello Synergy Man,


    I think what you are doing is a great idea.

    Unfortunately, many people out there with plenty of time on their hands fail to realize that a part of "something" is a whole lot better than a lot of "nothing" that they may achieve by hanging around overrating their skills in a dole queue.

    I for one would certainly be interested but not sure if i could add any real value as my skills are in the Accounting & Finance / Sales / Training areas and am based in Tipperary.


    Regards,




    Chevy RV


  • #25
    The Corinthian
    Closed Accounts Posts: 19,772 ✭✭✭✭The Corinthian


    SynergyMan wrote: »
    Hi there. 3 ideas that I could take were my own, which is how I know how in dept the the research and analysis has been done on them and the other 2 are outside people who I have keep in touch with. I will have also others coming through some of the colleges and other feeders but they will be New so there will be no legal impediment. Thanks again
    You have one of the better business models I've heard in a while - although that's also because it's not original. Develop a business idea from concept to business plan, basic prototype and technical requirements document; then do this for multiple ideas and pitch them at VC's and other potential investors.

    Some will hit, most will not, but the former pays for the total work. I'm familiar with the model and I have seen it work.

    Firstly, what you'll want it to be able to sell your skills, experience and connections in the, what is effectively, management consulting side of things to any potential partner. Secondly, you'll want to sell to them a package that they'll feel is worth the risk of them investing their time (it may be minimal, but it won't be negligible).

    I presume that you're not planning on simply stopping once you've put your three ideas through the process; what then? Hand or sell them off and continue with more ideas? Stick with the successful one(s) and develop them further? Both? Any partner will want to know the long term plan and potentially be part of that bigger picture. Or they may simply want to be involved short term (for the first three).

    The only other thing I'd advise is you don't necessarily need all the resources you mentioned straight away. Design and development, sure. Even analysis (for those nice, pretty, ever pitchable requirements documents that so excite VC's). But SEO probably not in the short term and so that may be better later once the cash flow is there and you can just outsource on a project basis.
    Chevy RV wrote: »
    Unfortunately, many people out there with plenty of time on their hands fail to realize that a part of "something" is a whole lot better than a lot of "nothing" that they may achieve by hanging around overrating their skills in a dole queue.
    No, sometimes doing "nothing" is better than doing a worthless "something". It's called opportunity cost. What you may be talking about is misidentifying "something" as worthless.


  • #26
    Someuser
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1 ✭Someuser


    I may be able to help you.
    Send me a private message.


  • #27
    BostonB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,053 ✭✭✭✭BostonB


    What constitutes "first draft/stage development". What is " first stage working". Its seems like a lot of work the vast majority of which would have no return, of time invested. Most of the pitches I've ever seen for software/web development, were done without anything working, specially in order to avoid this kind of wastage.


  • #28
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    So you want a web developer, Seo expert, Designer?

    The idea you have is Apps?

    Web Developers and SEO Experts are usually skills that go together.
    A Designer as in an App Designer?

    Does the Web Development Skills apply to developing a really Tech Website with Ecommerce?
    SEO would not really matter so much to get people to your website if your Apps are good enough.

    People who mention "what Web Developers make" mean to say "What Developers USED to make" back when there was actually money in the country.

    There are more people out there who would be interested in this than you think.


  • #29
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,808 ✭✭✭✭smash


    EIREHotspur wrote: »
    Web Developers and SEO Experts are usually skills that go together.
    False
    EIREHotspur wrote: »
    SEO would not really matter so much to get people to your website if your Apps are good enough.[/qoute]
    False
    EIREHotspur wrote: »
    People who mention "what Web Developers make" mean to say "What Developers USED to make" back when there was actually money in the country.
    False
    EIREHotspur wrote: »
    There are more people out there who would be interested in this than you think.
    Doubt it.

    E- must try harder!


  • #30
    edanto
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,802 ✭✭✭edanto


    Synergy, how is this going, did you find a group to start working with?

    I'm just curious, wouldn't be skilled to be involved myself.


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