Maggie Thatcher death discussion thread - Mod rules in first post

TheUsual · 16-04-2013 09:04PM

Feel a bit sorry for Ruairi Quinn having to go over to represent Ireland.
I'm sure he is f**ing delighted that he got this trip.

We should have sent John Bruton, he LOVES rubbing shoulders with our betters.

Spook_ie · 16-04-2013 09:26PM

Happyman42 wrote: »

:D Jesus, talk about selective reading. Wickipedia may not be always accurate but don't distort what it does manage to say.

He was not being 'extradited' at all under domestic or international law, he was being released by the British government. Quite a different thing to what you are trying to imply.

Not selective reading on my part at all. The extradition was being based on foot of domestic law, just because it wasn't successful doesn't make it any less true. I've edited my post to hopefully clarify this matter.

Rob A. Bank · 16-04-2013 09:52PM

Pity Ruairi Quinn all right... having to rub shoulders with the scum who will be there.

The USA have decided to send NO ONE who is in government at present.

The yanks attending are mostly washed up Republican right wingers who subscribed to Thatcher's toxic neo-liberal claptrap as preached by Milton Friedman and the Chicago Boys.

Chile was subjected to the same extreme Friedmanesque (Thatcherite) nonsense... which may explain Thatcher's admiration of it's tin pot dictator.

Friedman advised governments in economic crisis to follow strict austerity measures, combining radical cuts in social services with the full-scale privatization of their more lucrative assets. Many countries in Latin America auctioned off everything standing -- from energy and water utilities to Social Security -- to for profit multinational firms, crushing unions and other dissenters along the way.

If that prescription sounds familiar... It's because the IMF believe in Friedman's disaster capitalism too and we are all suffering from it at present.

Rob A. Bank · 16-04-2013 09:56PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SQuFjH3AUA

We all expect politicians to be evasive and a little ‘economical with the truth’, but Thatcher‘s misquote* of the Prayer of Saint Francis when she first entered no. 10 Downing Street “Where there is discord... may we bring harmony" must rank near the top for politician’s unashamed barefaced lies.

*she demonstrated her delusions of grandeur by using the royal ‘we’

Playboy · 16-04-2013 10:00PM

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

Pity Ruairi Quinn all right... having to rub shoulders with the scum who will be there.

The USA have decided to send NO ONE who is in government at present.

The yanks attending are mostly washed up Republican right wingers who subscribed to Thatcher's toxic neo-liberal claptrap as preached by Milton Friedman and the Chicago Boys.

Chile was subjected to the same extreme Friedmanesque (Thatcherite) nonsense... which may explain Thatcher's admiration of it's tin pot dictator.

If that prescription sounds familiar... It's because the IMF believe in Friedman's disaster capitalism too and we are all suffering from it at present.

lol so the UK economy was doing fine at the time then? Have we seen the the UK economy implode since Thatcher or is it consistently one of the strongest economies in the world?

Spook_ie · 16-04-2013 10:01PM

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0SQuFjH3AUA

We all expect politicians to be evasive and a little ‘economical with the truth’, but Thatcher‘s misquote* of the Prayer of Saint Francis when she first entered no. 10 Downing Street “Where there is discord... may we bring harmony" must rank near the top for politician’s unashamed barefaced lies.

*she demonstrated her delusions of grandeur by using the royal ‘we’

OMG she was a witch from day one because she misquoted a prayer, maybe it was a masonic thing and it was a secret message to various masonic cults.... Shock n Horror :rolleyes:

edit If she'd said I you'd probably accuse her of being egocentric!

Happyman42 · 17-04-2013 12:06AM

She couldn't leave us without one final obscenity.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/datablog/2013/apr/16/margaret-thatcher-funeral-10-million

true · 17-04-2013 12:28AM

Mrs Thatcher did say that she didn't want a lying in state, which would have cost more money, and she didn't want a fly-past – that would have cost more money – so the figure could have been even higher than whatever it's going to be. Security does cost a lot, but police etc does have to be paid for anyway. And its reported in the media that her estate will be paying something towards the cost of the funeral.

Considering she was the longest serving p.m. of the 20th century, , and improved the UK economy so much over the course of her reign , she is worth every penny. Think of all the employment she is creating

end of the road · 17-04-2013 12:59AM

true wrote: »

Mrs Thatcher did say that she didn't want a lying in state, which would have cost more money, and she didn't want a fly-past

thats big of her

true wrote: »

she was the longest serving p.m. of the 20th century

nobody cares

true wrote: »

she is worth every penny.

no she isn't

Playboy · 17-04-2013 01:53AM

end of the road wrote: »

nobody cares

Well obviously they do as she is getting a big funeral and obviously you do as you are taking the time to post on here.

end of the road · 17-04-2013 02:37AM

Playboy wrote: »

Well obviously they do as she is getting a big funeral

she's only getting such a big funeral because her little rich friends the tory party are in government

ozzirt · 17-04-2013 02:39AM

stevenmu wrote: »

When the Irish Ambassador invited her to the embassy for a symbolic glass of Guinness, she mentioned that she much preferred a nice glass of port.

That bitch!

Sounds about right.

The tart who never forgave the world for having been born a commoner.

Rascasse · 17-04-2013 09:25AM

The Telegraph has published an interesting extract from an upcoming book by the former British ambassador to South Africa from 87-91.

Unsurprisingly it definitively proves that the ridiculous claims that 'Thatcher supported apartheid' are nonsense.

Before there are any claims about him being a Tory, he was actually given a peerage by Blair and sat on the Labour benches until recently (now a crossbencher).

Playboy · 17-04-2013 09:48AM

end of the road wrote: »

she's only getting such a big funeral because her little rich friends the tory party are in government

There is a huge amount of people in the UK who admire her and are thankful for what she did for the country, that's why she is getting a funeral.

--Kaiser-- · 17-04-2013 09:48AM

Rascasse wrote: »

The Telegraph has published an interesting extract from an upcoming book by the former British ambassador to South Africa from 87-91.

Unsurprisingly it definitively proves that the ridiculous claims that 'Thatcher supported apartheid' are nonsense.

Before there are any claims about him being a Tory, he was actually given a peerage by Blair and sat on the Labour benches until recently (now a crossbencher).

Most of the people here speaking against against Thatcher aren't interested in proof, they're interested in self-righteous indignation and mindless regurgitation of popular proletariat propaganda

golfball37 · 17-04-2013 09:51AM

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/thatcher-dubbed-all-irish-liars-mandelson-says-591549.html

Thatcher dubbed all Irish 'liars', Mandelson says

Peter Mandelson said today that the only thing Margaret Thatcher ever told him was that the Irish were “all liars” and not to be trusted.

The Labour former cabinet minister revealed the 1999 exchange as he explained why he did not want to attend the former premier’s funeral service.

“I didn’t feel I knew her well enough” to apply for the tickets offered to peers, he told BBC Radio 4’s Today.

“Although I helped to organise the Labour Party’s opposition to her policies throughout the 1980s, I only ever met her once.

“It was the day I was appointed Northern Ireland secretary and our paths crossed.

“She came up to me and she said, ’I’ve got one thing to say to you, my boy … you can’t trust the Irish, they are all liars’, she said, ’liars, and that’s what you have to remember, so just don’t forget it’.

“With that she waltzed off and that was my only personal exposure to her.”

Lord Mandelson, one of the central architects of New Labour, has criticised the scale of the funeral but accepted the Iron Lady “reframed British politics”.

“I think what she was right to do was to bring home to us the reality that Britain could not afford rampant inflation, that state monopolies needed commercialising, that personal tax rates were too high and that enterprise was too unrewarding,” he said.

“She was also right to argue that deregulation can be a valuable spur to innovation and efficiency and of course she tackled what was then a very disruptive and irresponsible trade union culture.

“But the truth is also that in cutting back the state necessarily, she overlooked what the state can also do successfully.”
---

I wonder what the likes of Lucinda Creighton make of this?

Happyman42 · 17-04-2013 09:59AM

Rascasse wrote: »

The Telegraph has published an interesting extract from an upcoming book by the former British ambassador to South Africa from 87-91.

Unsurprisingly it definitively proves that the ridiculous claims that 'Thatcher supported apartheid' are nonsense.

Before there are any claims about him being a Tory, he was actually given a peerage by Blair and sat on the Labour benches until recently (now a crossbencher).

One man's unvouched 'opinion' is definitive proof now? :rolleyes: You'll get hundreds of other men's and women's 'opinions' if you look.

bnt · 17-04-2013 10:00AM

I was living in South Africa during the '80s, and never got the impression that Britain "supported" Apartheid under Thatcher. There were no British programs on TV, for example, and British businesses pulled out (e.g. Barclays Bank divested and what was left became First National Bank).

It's another case of people confusing a lack of obvious action for total inaction. I think Thatcher understood the history of the country a bit better, particularly how the Afrikaners are an extremely stubborn people. They do not respond to ultimatums and overt threats. The history of South Africa was shaped by their pig-headedness, to the point where it took three years and masses of British troops to defeat a smaller Afrikaner army in 1899-1902 (the Second Boer War) - and even then they didn't give up the political struggle.

So, telling them "Apartheid is bad, m'kay?" wouldn't work, and indeed hadn't worked for the previous 40 years. A more subtle diplomatic approach was required.

WhatNowForUs? · 17-04-2013 10:09AM

bnt wrote: »

I was living in South Africa during the '80s, and never got the impression that Britain "supported" Apartheid under Thatcher. There were no British programs on TV, for example, and British businesses pulled out (e.g. Barclays Bank divested and what was left became First National Bank).

It's another case of people confusing a lack of obvious action for total inaction. I think Thatcher understood the history of the country a bit better, particularly how the Afrikaners are an extremely stubborn people. They do not respond to ultimatums and overt threats. The history of South Africa was shaped by their pig-headedness, to the point where it took three years and masses of British troops to defeat a smaller Afrikaner army in 1899-1902 (the Second Boer War) - and even then they didn't give up the political struggle.

So, telling them "Apartheid is bad, m'kay?" wouldn't work, and indeed hadn't worked for the previous 40 years. A more subtle diplomatic approach was required.

A more subtle diplomatic approach was required.[/QUOTE] and Thatcher :eek:

ballsymchugh · 17-04-2013 10:13AM

hmmmmm

https://vine.co/v/bFYwaXFujI9

bnt · 17-04-2013 10:16AM

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

"A more subtle diplomatic approach was required." and Thatcher :eek:

Yes.

"Contradictions do not exist. Whenever you think that you are facing a contradiction, check your premises. You will find that one of them is wrong."

And learn how to quote messages properly. You weren't replying to everything I wrote, so why did you quote everything I wrote?

Rascasse · 17-04-2013 10:17AM

ballsymchugh wrote: »

hmmmmm

https://vine.co/v/bFYwaXFujI9

Good old Father Horan. Still has the same outfit 10 years later.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/northamptonshire/3081921.stm

Fratton Fred · 17-04-2013 10:18AM

Happyman42 wrote: »

One man's unvouched 'opinion' is definitive proof now? :rolleyes: You'll get hundreds of other men's and women's 'opinions' if you look.

And yet one man's opinion is enough to convince people she wanted a Cromwellian solution to northern Ireland?

I also posted an article that gave a similar account, how many do you want to see before you'll believe that she didn't "support" apartheid?

guttenberg · 17-04-2013 10:23AM

Either the BBC are pre-empting them, or there is no visible protest? I thought the catholic church were bad, but some of the outfits of the priests/bishops etc. present are mental looking!

bnt · 17-04-2013 10:31AM

guttenberg wrote: »

Either the BBC are pre-empting them, or there is no visible protest? I thought the catholic church were bad, but some of the outfits of the priests/bishops etc. present are mental looking!

The real funeral procession along the Strand and Fleet Street is only just starting, so we'll now see what protests arise. Some will be subtle and easy to miss unless pointed out e.g. people simply turning their backs on Thatcher.

Pherekydes · 17-04-2013 10:37AM

bnt wrote: »

The real funeral procession along the Strand and Fleet Street is only just starting, so we'll now see what protests arise. Some will be subtle and easy to miss unless pointed out e.g. people simply turning their backs on Thatcher.

The horses are protesting by shíting all over the road. The Police have their backs turned.

Most are clapping. Some boos.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 17-04-2013 10:41AM

Have to give credit to the British forces, they're head and shoulders above everyone else at pomp and ceremony... And people boo'ing in the crowd, lol.

space_man · 17-04-2013 10:42AM

the rent a mob has failed to turn up.
probably too busy collecting their giros.

Happyman42 · 17-04-2013 10:46AM

Fratton Fred wrote: »

And yet one man's opinion is enough to convince people she wanted a Cromwellian solution to northern Ireland?

I also posted an article that gave a similar account, how many do you want to see before you'll believe that she didn't "support" apartheid?

The article was quoted, not by me and I made no comment on it.
The poster used the words 'definitive proof', which it most certainly ain't.

space_man · 17-04-2013 10:50AM

space_man wrote: »

the rent a mob has failed to turn up.
probably too busy collecting their giros.

No! No! I was wrong!
They're all down @ St. Paul's.:D

Maggie Thatcher death discussion thread - Mod rules in first post

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