Garda Sgts facing disciplinary hearing after walkout.

dj jarvis · 27-03-2013 10:43PM

Paulzx wrote: »

So you'd have a higher opinion of them if they lived in state provided housing estates rather than paying mortgages and buying their own houses?

/logic fail

no , it means soldiers are paid less - garda paid more - count themselves lucky

nothing to do with opinion of who lives where , its a comparison

i thought that was clear enough

Claregirl · 27-03-2013 10:43PM

I have no connection with the Gardaí whatsoever although I am a PS worker - I think however today's developments are incredibly sinister. The fact that the delegates who walked out of conference face disciplinary action is a gross misuse of power by the Minister and commissioner and is designed to instil fear in all public servants.

Not only that but an off duty Garda who expressed his opinion to Enda Kenny is also to be investigated.

This government has treated the citizens of Ireland with utter contempt and we are now seeing the arrogance of Ministers on an almost daily basis - Reilly and the shambolic Health Service - Shatter and his comments about disrespect (I was always told as a child that respect has to be earned) and Varadkar telling the little women to stay at home not to mention Rabitte's recent comments in relation to property tax.

I despair at what is happening to this country!!

tayto lover · 27-03-2013 10:43PM

dj jarvis wrote: »

but neither man wrote the 2005 garda act , it national law , it has to be upheld,
the minister would be hung out to dry if he did not enforce the law.

so even if he was politically placed , it makes no difference , they have to act , so you statement makes no sense

He is obviously only acting because Shatter is pulling his strings and that is a disgrace.

Big Davey · 27-03-2013 10:44PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Don't all the prisoners and criminals get the same food in jail

I don't know you tell me I have never been to jail..........

dj jarvis · 27-03-2013 10:45PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Sly digs at the Garda are only highlighting the fact that you are losing the argument
Thought you would have stuck it out a bit better.

me loosing ? pafft

you have been spouting rubbish all night - carry on with your delusion
i have backed up my claims - you have been waffling

dj jarvis · 27-03-2013 10:46PM

tayto lover wrote: »

He is obviously only acting because Shatter is pulling his strings and that is a disgrace.

well that is the minister of justices job - the clue is in the title,

who did you think gives the chief of the garda orders ?

Kristopherus · 27-03-2013 10:46PM

frankie_fisher wrote: »

see bottom of table for garda pay excluding overtime , that was in 2008 prior to the campaign of cuts which for guards would be no greater than 15% exclcuding pension levy

http://www.cso.ie/quicktables/GetQuickTables.aspx?FileName=PSA01.asp&TableName=Public+Sector+Average+Weekly+Earnings&StatisticalProduct=DB_PS

The pension levy is a cut. plain & simple. It does not go into any pension fund. It goes to fill that black hole called Anglo:mad:

tayto lover · 27-03-2013 10:47PM

dj jarvis wrote: »

me loosing ? pafft

you have been spouting rubbish all night - carry on with your delusion
i have backed up my claims - you have been waffling

Were they in the room where the talks were going on?

frankie_fisher · 27-03-2013 10:47PM

Claregirl wrote: »

I have no connection with the Gardaí whatsoever although I am a PS worker - I think however today's developments are incredibly sinister. The fact that the delegates who walked out of conference face disciplinary action is a gross misuse of power by the Minister and commissioner and is designed to instil fear in all public servants.

Not only that but an off duty Garda who expressed his opinion to Enda Kenny is also to be investigated.

This government has treated the citizens of Ireland with utter contempt and we are now seeing the arrogance of Ministers on an almost daily basis - Reilly and the shambolic Health Service - Shatter and his comments about disrespect (I was always told as a child that respect has to be earned) and Varadkar telling the little women to stay at home not to mention Rabitte's recent comments in relation to property tax.

I despair at what is happening to this country!!

the brazen sense of entitlement from that guard who doorstepped enda kenny was revolting , the banal " i didnt cause this mess " line crowned it

frankie_fisher · 27-03-2013 10:48PM

Kristopherus wrote: »

The pension levy is a cut. plain & simple. It does not go into any pension fund. It goes to fill that black hole called Anglo:mad:

i refered to the pension levy as a reduction in garda income

tayto lover · 27-03-2013 10:50PM

dj jarvis wrote: »

well that is the minister of justices job - the clue is in the title,

who did you think gives the chief of the garda orders ?

Ha ha Shatter's little lapdog puppet.
Garda Commissioners should not be political appointees. There should be an independent selection panel in place.
You know it makes sense.

dj jarvis · 27-03-2013 10:52PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Were they in the room where the talks were going on?

no , as has been pointed out to you many many times , they were NEVER going to be in the room , they were outside , with PDFORRA being briefed , as is the norm and how it has been before,

the left this side meeting, and left the talks - or left the "room" as its reported as - this is how they left the room they were never in.

and really , it does not matter if they were in a wardrobe , they were being briefed on the talks and left when they did not like what they were being told.

so your assertion that they were " not in the room " is fairly childish

they gambled their position , and lost - boo hoo

scwazrh · 27-03-2013 10:52PM

frankie_fisher wrote: »

shows the level of delusion which still exists in this country when people continue to believe that 900 per week NET is a modest income , where else would modestly skilled ( for the most part ) people like guards recieve such a wage ?

It's not delusion it's the difference between people who are willing to create their own job and make their own money and people who expect their employer to pay them.We all pick are own earning targets , if you set yours low thats your choice.

You ask where else would guards earn that money which goes back to my point of if their wage isn't enough change jobs

eagle eye · 27-03-2013 10:53PM

I'm glad that some of the Garda Sgts reps stood up and walked out. I think its time we all stood up to these fascist wannabes.

frankie_fisher · 27-03-2013 10:53PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Ha ha Shatter's little lapdog puppet.
Garda Commissioners should not be political appointees. There should be an independent selection panel in place.
You know it makes sense.

politics permeates almost every aspect of AGS , anyone who has dealt with or is intimatley familiar with its culture knows this , its unfair to single out the commisioner , in order to achieve high rank in AGS , you must be aware of and go along with that institutions politics

omahaid · 27-03-2013 10:53PM

I have to say I'm impressed that Shatter is standing up to the garda unions. As a civilian it makes me very nervous to see the way the gardai are behaving over the last few months. I always assumed they were a disciplined force but I see that isn't really the case.

wesleysniper38 · 27-03-2013 10:54PM

I have to say I'm quite uncomfortable at watching this issue evolve from a pay dispute into a potential all out row between our Guards and the Minister/Commissioner.
It reminds me of the early 80's when Political influence within the Garda was rife. Indeed not much has been learned from that experience. I believe that the Garda should be run by an independent inspectorate and not by politically appointed Officers, the majority of whom never wore out one pair of shoes on our streets.
Promotions, recruitment,station allocations, fleet, budget etc should be all decided through this independent body and not by transient Ministers and their chosen Commissioners.

As regards pay, allowances etc. Such matters should also be decided by such a body. Our Police force should be independent of all Governments, Political Parties and budgetry constraints as decided by the Ministers of the day.

dj jarvis · 27-03-2013 10:54PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Ha ha Shatter's little lapdog puppet.
Garda Commissioners should not be political appointees. There should be an independent selection panel in place.
You know it makes sense.

tayto - come on , really , do you not get it
it would not matter who got him the job , he would still have to enforce discipline

frankie_fisher · 27-03-2013 10:56PM

eagle eye wrote: »

I'm glad that some of the Garda Sgts reps stood up and walked out. I think its time we all stood up to these fascist wannabes.

do you think the guards are attempting to strike some kind of blow for the nation as a whole :rolleyes:

the guards are ( grubbily ) trying whatever nesscessery to hold what they had , they are acting entirely out of self interest

tayto lover · 27-03-2013 10:56PM

dj jarvis wrote: »

no , as has been pointed out to you many many times , they were NEVER going to be in the room , they were outside , with PDFORRA being briefed , as is the norm and how it has been before,

the left this side meeting, and left the talks - or left the "room" as its reported as - this is how they left the room they were never in.

and really , it does not matter if they were in a wardrobe , they were being briefed on the talks and left when they did not like what they were being told.

so your assertion that they were " not in the room " is fairly childish

they gambled their position , and lost - boo hoo

No. They say they were not allowed to defend their position and that more cuts were aimed at them than any other section i.e. at their allowances for working out of hours.
So they were not being represented. Read the full facts.

"boo hoo" and "childish" are more appropriate to several of you.

dj jarvis · 27-03-2013 10:56PM

omahaid wrote: »

I have to say I'm impressed that Shatter is standing up to the garda unions. As a civilian it makes me very nervous to see the way the gardai are behaving over the last few months. I always assumed they were a disciplined force but I see that isn't really the case.

bit unfair i think , the ASGI have more to answer on this than the avg garda
they are being wound up on a promise , on a promise that could never have been kept

they KNEW this going in , but tried their luck and looks like they are going to lose

eagle eye · 27-03-2013 10:56PM

scwazrh wrote: »

It's not delusion it's the difference between people who are willing to create their own job and make their own money and people who expect their employer to pay them.We all pick are own earning targets , if you set yours low thats your choice.

You ask where else would guards earn that money which goes back to my point of if their wage isn't enough change jobs

You hardly expect somebody in their late 40s/early 50s who have been public servants their whole lives to suddenly re-educate themselves and go start their own business. They took up a job that had a 30 year contract with a very good pension at the end of it, they are now earning less money as the years go by and their pension will not be worth anything close to what it should be.

It seems its ok to default on the public servants of this country but not on the banks.

end of the road · 27-03-2013 10:57PM

Big Davey wrote: »

It should be morally wrong to any decent Garda to get the flu

how and why should it be moraly wrong for a guard or anyone to get sick? getting sick is a fact of life.

Big Davey wrote: »

any Garda that gets flu is showing his/her hand in my opinion

as i said, people get sick, its the way of the world, get over it.

Big Davey wrote: »

(scum)

you have definitely been arrested before

dj jarvis · 27-03-2013 10:58PM

tayto lover wrote: »

No. They say they were not allowed to defend their position and that more cuts were aimed at them than any other section i.e. at their allowances for working out of hours.
So they were not being represented. Read the full facts.

"boo hoo" and "childish" are more appropriate to several of you.

i did read the facts , i even posted them , look , look up one post , see ?? i put them their for you , no need to thank me

tayto lover · 27-03-2013 10:58PM

dj jarvis wrote: »

tayto - come on , really , do you not get it
it would not matter who got him the job , he would still have to enforce discipline

If he was not a political appointee then it might not have come to this.
Shatter is using his puppet for his own personal agenda here and very few seem to recognise that.
Shatter has a history with the garda force as I read on another thread.

Dwork · 27-03-2013 10:58PM

I was always a bit "meh" when it came to the Gards and how their job was hard, etc etc. Then we got some work off the OPW - at Sundrive Garda station. After spending time working there, I got a whole new appreciation for the level of sh1te they get day to day.

While they can be a pain in the butt dealing with them over petty stuff, road checkpoints, getting forms signed(they don't win many prizes on that front) I watched younger Gards coming in off patrol and slumping into arm-chairs in the stations rest room, knackered, and still having to listen to scumbags roaring, shouting, fighting in the cell block beside it. And then get up and go back out for more.

So, do they deserve their money? I reckon they do. I also think that what they do is a job. You can dress it up as some sort of sacred duty, but it's a job at the end of the day. And everyone wants the best pay they can get for doing their job. And everyone wants to have the power of saying "feck off and leave my pay alone" if they feel it's under threat.

frankie_fisher · 27-03-2013 10:59PM

eagle eye wrote: »

You hardly expect somebody in their late 40s/early 50s who have been public servants their whole lives to suddenly re-educate themselves and go start their own business. They took up a job that had a 30 year contract with a very good pension at the end of it, they are now earning less money as the years go by and their pension will not be worth anything close to what it should be.

It seems its ok to default on the public servants of this country but not on the banks.

the guards are earning less than they were in 2008 but you must realise , all that allowed thier wages to reach that peak was an unsustainable property bubble and the revenue it generated

scwazrh · 27-03-2013 11:00PM

eagle eye wrote: »

You hardly expect somebody in their late 40s/early 50s who have been public servants their whole lives to suddenly re-educate themselves and go start their own business. They took up a job that had a 30 year contract with a very good pension at the end of it, they are now earning less money as the years go by and their pension will not be worth anything close to what it should be.

It seems its ok to default on the public servants of this country but not on the banks.

I don't think their wages should have gone as high as they did.Public sector wages increased because of the workers basically saying look how much everyone in the private sector is earning . Their wages went up in the good times and have to come down in the bad times

true · 27-03-2013 11:00PM

scwazrh wrote: »

This is another case of public sector workers wanting job security , pension and a good weekly wage.

+1. Anyone see the RTE pensions programme last night where it said the average retiring Garda pension was worth 1.3 million. S***lads, no wonder the country is bust.

eagle eye · 27-03-2013 11:00PM

frankie_fisher wrote: »

do you think the guards are attempting to strike some kind of blow for the nation as a whole :rolleyes:

the guards are ( grubbily ) trying whatever nesscessery to hold what they had , they are acting entirely out of self interest

I didn't say they were I said I'm glad that somebody has and hopefully it spreads. We shouldn't be paying off bank debts while people in the public service have to go and look for handouts from social welfare in order to survive.

Garda Sgts facing disciplinary hearing after walkout.

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