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Why are there so few few trained accountants in the Gardai

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Comments

  • #32
    Pappa Charlie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 853 ✭✭✭Pappa Charlie


    McCrack wrote: »

    Indeed, since when was policing a "profession". It's a job or a career if you want to call it that but not a profession in the true sense.

    You're a funny guy!!


  • #33
    Wile E. Coyote
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,563 ✭✭✭Wile E. Coyote


    jonsnow wrote: »
    Given the explosion in white collar crime and the increasing sophistication of criminals why is it that the Gardai seem so reluctant to upskill and recruit or train qualified accountants and then place these in the specialist units tasked with keeping a handle on financial crimes.Or at least recruit some more civilian accountants on secondment from the top accounting firms?

    There has always been white collar crime. If the pay in the Gardai was as good or better than what a qualifed accountant was earning during the Celtic Tiger and prior to the recruitment freeze then why didn't more accountants join the force of their own free will without waiting for someone to come headhunt them?


  • #34
    SB2013
    Closed Accounts Posts: 805 ✭✭✭SB2013


    McCrack wrote: »
    Indeed, since when was policing a "profession". It's a job or a career if you want to call it that but not a profession in the true sense.

    Maybe since the requirements for getting out of probation required to completion of a dissertation and the aquisition of a HETAC degree through examinations. Just a guess.
    Wile E. Coyote wrote: »
    There has always been white collar crime. If the pay in the Gardai was as good or better than what a qualifed accountant was earning during the Celtic Tiger and prior to the recruitment freeze then why didn't more accountants join the force of their own free will without waiting for someone to come headhunt them?

    Because nobody wants to start at the bottom again, no matter what the job. There's also the risk element. An accountancy practice takes a long time to establish and its a lot to give up on the chance doing something you may not be able for. But i think you'll find that there are quite a few college graduates in the Gardaí trained to degree level in various subjects including accountancy, law and engineering.


  • #35
    eddieham
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 94 ✭✭eddieham


    Not sure that the figures given are correct, seems to be a specific answer to a specific question.

    My brother qualified as an accountant in the mid 90's and three of his classmates joined up immediately after graduation and another joined about two years later.
    A friend I went to school with qualified and worked as an accountant for a few years and then joined.

    Of these, I know that 3 have done very well promotion wise and are using their accountancy skills in relevant sections/roles. The other 2 I have no idea where they are.

    Take from that what you will, but I dont think the minister refer'd to any of the above, so who knows how many there really are within the force


  • #36
    angelfire9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,226 ✭✭✭angelfire9


    wohoo something I am actually QUALIFIED to talk about in the ES forum :D
    I'm a forensic accountant i did this course:

    https://www.charteredaccountants.ie/en/CPD/Courses/Course/?ProductId=1352
    I did it because i'd lost my job and needed to diversify my career path


    I deal in family law which to be honest i dont enjoy (its depressing and gut wrenching at times) but I cant afford to quit :(

    I do not have a law degree my BA was in Law and Accountancy in UL (not even sure if that degree exists anymore)

    I would have loved to be a Garda (following in the family footsteps) but failed the medical :(

    My other half is a cop
    I earn far more than he does
    Would being a member of the fraud squad be more satisfying you bet it would
    Would it be more interesting almost certainly
    Would it put food on the table and pay the mortgage doubt it
    Would it pay for childcare which i would have to get if i weren't working a 9-5 job
    NOPE

    Would i be able to walk into AGS and swan into the fraud squad with my dual qualifications... not a hope
    You work your way up the ladder and pull is probably a help

    Should the fraud squad have a team of qualified accountants/forensic accountants in the squad... yes in my opinion they should
    Because i know how much a contracted accountant charges (i'm one of em) and the garda salary would be far cheaper
    Short term economy, long term diseconomy but what else would you expect from Government pencil pushers in the upper echelons?
    A contracted employee is not included in the Garda pay figures released every year
    its in the justice budget for sure, hidden under some miscellaneous category
    Complete waste of money

    I'd probably jump at the chance of a fraud squad position if it were offered even with a pay cut but thats probably cos the current job drives me to tears every week LOL


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  • #37
    goldie fish
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,195 ✭✭✭goldie fish


    So you are saying that its better to have garda accountants so the state can save money by paying them less than what they would get as an actual accountant?


    Best of luck with that.


  • #38
    discus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭discus


    McCrack wrote: »
    Indeed, since when was policing a "profession". It's a job or a career if you want to call it that but not a profession in the true sense.

    The notions surrounding the word 'profession' are archaic at best, pretentious otherwise.


  • #39
    Pappa Charlie
    Closed Accounts Posts: 853 ✭✭✭Pappa Charlie


    discus wrote: »
    The notions surrounding the word 'profession' are archaic at best, pretentious otherwise.

    Bitter bitter people!


  • #40
    discus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,049 ✭✭✭discus


    Pappa Charlie wrote: »
    Bitter bitter people!

    What, me? Nah, not bitter. I'd consider policing to be a profession just as I'd consider soldiering to be likewise. But what bothers me is when certain sectors want it kept as a protected term for their chosen careers.


  • #41
    Geansai
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 164 ✭✭Geansai


    goldie fish wrote: »
    So you are saying that its better to have garda accountants so the state can save money by paying them less than what they would get as an actual accountant?


    Best of luck with that.


    Even if you pay the accountant the same as they would get from the firm they would otherwise we hired by, it would still save the state money.
    It's the same issue with the agency nurses.

    With using a contractor, as opposed to an employee, you are paying the contracting company, be it KPMG or whoever, a massive premium, which the accountant themselves is not receiving.

    However, for that with that premium payment you get increased flexibility (as in you can stop the service at any time) and you also get the support fo the contracting company. In the example of the KPMG account working for the GBFI this would include more specialised techcnial expertise, legal expertise, specific computer systems and applications.


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