Hinds found guilty of murder

Grayson · 19-03-2013 10:05PM

bcdfghjklm wrote: »

As much as I oppose murder or any crimes, he was presumed innocent until proven guilty and now he'll face a prison sentence, unfortunately a possibly lenient one.

Back on topic, I don't see how that somehow represents how 'backwards' the US is, considering that I've been living here for a while and, from what I've read, it's mostly his friends and family supporting him.

Futhermore, had he committed the crime in the States I can guarantee he'd face a much longer and harsher sentence.

I have probably more negative than positive views of the US and i don't think he's representative.

If anything it's representative of people in general. Remember that group down in Kerry that all lined up to support the guy who was convicted of rape? Pretty much whet I'm saying is that people are stupid everywhere.

DazMarz · 19-03-2013 10:06PM

bcdfghjklm wrote: »

Futhermore, had he committed the crime in the States I can guarantee he'd face a much longer and harsher sentence.

This.

Unquestionable. Add to the fact that he was black and his victim was white. In no other country in the world would that earn you a one-way ticket to Death Row (depending on the State) than in the good ol' U.S. of A.

I highlighted this earlier, that he is incredibly lucky that he was tried and convicted in Japan, and that he was under 20 when the crime was committed. Japan has the death penalty, and I'd be fairly sure that he would have been hanged if he was 20 or older. In the USA, he would almost assuredly (depending on the State) have been sent to Death Row.

I do not agree with the death penalty at all. I believe it is inherently wrong to take another life, regardless. But I'm merely pointing out what could potentially have happened in other jurisdictions.

Wattle · 19-03-2013 10:12PM

DazMarz wrote: »

This.

Unquestionable. Add to the fact that he was black and his victim was white. In no other country in the world would that earn you a one-way ticket to Death Row (depending on the State) than in the good ol' U.S. of A.

I highlighted this earlier, that he is incredibly lucky that he was tried and convicted in Japan, and that he was under 20 when the crime was committed. Japan has the death penalty, and I'd be fairly sure that he would have been hanged if he was 20 or older. In the USA, he would almost assuredly (depending on the State) have been sent to Death Row.

I do not agree with the death penalty at all. I believe it is inherently wrong to take another life, regardless. But I'm merely pointing out what could potentially have happened in other jurisdictions.

Death sentences in Japan are usually only given in the case of multiple murders.

Rezident · 19-03-2013 10:27PM

5 YEARS!? For that? I thought they had the death penalty in Japan. Is this something to do with the fact that he's American and Japan is their ally in that region?

19-03-2013 10:28PM

Rezident wrote: »

5 YEARS!? For that? I thought they had the death penalty in Japan. Is this something to do with the fact that he's American and Japan is their ally in that region?

Have you read any of the thread?

KKkitty · 19-03-2013 10:39PM

Heard Ms. Furlong's dad on the radio earlier saying he didn't want to hear the name of his daughter's murderer ever again but every day for the rest of Mr. Furlong's life that very name will be etched in his brain. 5 years is way too lenient but whatever this scumbag goes through in prison it will never bring Ms. Furlong back to her family. I truly hope he comes out of prison in a body bag.

namloc1980 · 19-03-2013 10:42PM

Rezident wrote: »

5 YEARS!? For that? I thought they had the death penalty in Japan. Is this something to do with the fact that he's American and Japan is their ally in that region?

Been following this one closely then?

DazMarz · 19-03-2013 10:45PM

Wattle wrote: »

Death sentences in Japan are usually only given in the case of multiple murders.

Didn't know that... Thought it was just like they administer in the USA, for capital crimes (including murder, regardless of the number of victims)

I Luv Crysis · 19-03-2013 10:54PM

Just on the race issue, off the top of my head - Irish girls murdered abroad last year both suspects in the cases of Jill Meagher and Catherine Gowing are white. I think the message here for girls (at home and abroad) from this case is never drink too much - be careful of your drink and surroundings and never go back to hotels or houses with random strangers you meet on a night out.

My name is URL · 19-03-2013 10:57PM

I Luv Crysis wrote: »

Just on the race issue, off the top of my head - Irish girls murdered abroad last year both suspects in the cases of Jill Meagher and Catherine Gowing are white. I think the message here for girls (at home and abroad) from this case is never drink too much - be careful of your drink and surroundings and never go back to hotels or houses with random strangers you meet on a night out.

I think that message should apply to everyone.. not just girls

Da Shins Kelly · 19-03-2013 11:01PM

I Luv Crysis wrote: »

Just on the race issue, off the top of my head - Irish girls murdered abroad last year both suspects in the cases of Jill Meagher and Catherine Gowing are white. I think the message here for girls (at home and abroad) from this case is never drink too much - be careful of your drink and surroundings and never go back to hotels or houses with random strangers you meet on a night out.

I don't understand why the responsibility always has to be placed with the girls. How about the message being that lads shouldn't drug and take advantage of young girls?

Also, Catherine Gowing was murdered in her own home, it had nothing to do with drink or going back to a stranger's house.

Kinski · 19-03-2013 11:35PM

Da Shins Kelly wrote: »

I don't understand why the responsibility always has to be placed with the girls. How about the message being that lads shouldn't drug and take advantage of young girls?

That goes without saying. Advising people that they need to exercise caution when drinking/drug-taking is not about blaming the victim; it's the same as warning people not to walk through a notoriously-rough area late at night.

Electric Sheep · 19-03-2013 11:42PM

Me_Grapes wrote: »

I'm firmly of the opinion that 5 years for murder and rape does not under any circumstances equate to justice being done, no matter what the Japanese or any other constitution states.

Nicola was not raped, according to the expert testimony at the trial.

Chucky the tree · 19-03-2013 11:45PM

Da Shins Kelly wrote: »

I don't understand why the responsibility always has to be placed with the girls. How about the message being that lads shouldn't drug and take advantage of young girls?

This issue is never raised over any other crime, why is sexual assault different?

donfers · 19-03-2013 11:45PM

Da Shins Kelly wrote: »

I don't understand why the responsibility always has to be placed with the girls. How about the message being that lads shouldn't drug and take advantage of young girls?

i don't agree - equating the actions of a few murderous psychopaths and saying all lads should take heed

note: lots of people drink, therefore advice about drinking can be applied to large groups, whereas with murderous psychopaths thankfully they are few and far between so "lads" will be ok without your rather misguided advice

oh and while we are on the topic of patronising nonsensical advice giving, we may as well tell all the murderers out there not to murder because that's about as useful as lofty reactionary sanctimonious preaching ever is

anyway, way off topic, i agree with the general consensus that the guy got off lightly and that it is unfortunate japanese law is so generous in its grading of minors

i would also suggest that the vast vast majority of us should not curtail our behaviours because of the existence of a relatively rare number of murderous psychopaths out there, live your life, have fun .....these happenings are thankfully rare but of course that doesn't lessen the tremendous tragedy it is and the incredible suffering the family must be going through

Da Shins Kelly · 19-03-2013 11:48PM

Kinski wrote: »

That goes without saying. Advising people that they need to exercise caution when drinking/drug-taking is not about blaming the victim; it's the same as warning people not to walk through a notoriously-rough area late at night.

Of course everyone should try and be as responsible as possible, but I don't understand why the 'moral of the story' should only be aimed at girls. Lads should shoulder some of the responsibility too. And one of the examples given in the above post had absolutely nothing to do with that particular woman's responsibility since her attacker broke into her house and murdered her.

Grayson · 20-03-2013 12:01AM

Da Shins Kelly wrote: »

I don't understand why the responsibility always has to be placed with the girls. How about the message being that lads shouldn't drug and take advantage of young girls?

Also, Catherine Gowing was murdered in her own home, it had nothing to do with drink or going back to a stranger's house.

With Drink, The guys right. A girl could be assaulted. We could be mugged or assaulted even. For anyone, it's always best to be a little bit wary, especially od strangers. It's rarely anyone's fault that they are a victim of a crime. The onus is always on someone else not to commit the crime. In a perfect world we should be able to pass out anywhere (not that we should) and wake up with our wallets and phones intact.
But it's not a perfect world. It's why we avoid dark alleyways and warn children about strangers.

Greentopia · 20-03-2013 12:51AM

Thank goodness that ordeal is now over for the family. I hope the imprisonment of those guys will in time offer them some small comfort.

I can understand their anger at how lenient the sentence appears to be though, especially if the perp. is freed after as little as 5 years served if he behaves himself inside.

I hear though that many Europeans and Americans often develop mental health problems in Japanese prisons, and no doubt the ordeal of these prisons stay with them long after they are released, which could be considered punishment in itself I suppose.

space_man · 20-03-2013 12:56AM

Greentopia wrote: »

Thank goodness that ordeal is now over for the family. I hope the imprisonment of those guys will in time offer them some small comfort.

I can understand their anger at how lenient the sentence appears to be though, especially if the perp. is freed after as little as 5 years served if he behaves himself inside.

I hear though that many Europeans and Americans often develop mental health problems in Japanese prisons, and no doubt the ordeal of these prisons stay with them long after they are released, which could be considered punishment in itself I suppose.

5 years is an insult.

Me_Grapes · 20-03-2013 01:05AM

Electric Sheep wrote: »

Nicola was not raped, according to the expert testimony at the trial.

Regardless, the point still stands. 5 years for crimes of such magnitude is not just.

Greentopia · 20-03-2013 01:09AM

space_man wrote: »

5 years is an insult.

I think it is overly lenient given what he did to that poor girl, but unless any of us here have actually served time in a Japanese prison I don't think we are in any position to really know what 5 years labour served in enforced absolute silence and in obeyance to hundreds of strict rules would really be like.

Reading up on it I would feel pretty sure it would break me anyway and given the choice I would much rather serve a somewhat longer sentence in jail in this country rather than the hells of a lesser one over there.
At least at the end of that I could hope to return to society with my sanity intact!

ChunkyLover54 · 20-03-2013 01:35AM

I found the details of this case particularly upsetting.

I feel so sorry for that poor family. I remember reading part of an interview given by Nicola's father a few months ago and he seemed so dignified, like he wasn't interested in vengence but more so in the carrying out of justice for his daughter's murder.

However, you could see how devastated the family were by the evidence and by the behaviour and testimony of Hinds during the trial. The heartache and anger they must feel is unimaginable.

It seems pointless to make any comment on the leniency of the sentence or any retribution meted out to Hinds - that dirty bastard probably believes he did nothing wrong.

It sounds pretty dismal but I'm just glad someone so wicked didn't get off on some technicality. That's all.

Ruudi_Mentari · 20-03-2013 04:00AM

Greentopia wrote: »

Reading up on it I would feel pretty sure it would break me anyway and given the choice I would much rather serve a somewhat longer sentence in jail in this country rather than the hells of a lesser one over there.
At least at the end of that I could hope to return to society with my sanity intact!

A Japanese prison would probably be like some sort if hikikomori holiday camp and I think if anywhere I could deal with it there.

Probably more inmates for stealing bicycles than anything anyhow, I can't possibly relate to hinds' culture and would fear being physically broken in some alien memphis jailhouse by his ilk and I know a lot of people could relate to the sights and sounds of that more, but no.

Snickers Man · 20-03-2013 07:43AM

HondaSami wrote: »

Were the girls unconscious? is there cctv of this?
.

There is CCTV of the two girls in the taxi and of them being put into wheelchairs in the hotel. In both cases, according to newspaper reports (I haven't seen the footage) the girls were semiconscious or unconscious.

Some here seem very agitated about the suggestion that the two young men may have been responsible for getting the girls into that state, either through disguising the strength of the alcoholic drinks they gave them or slipping some drugs (not proven by toxicology tests on Nicola Furlong) into their drinks.

My point, and for once I'm agreeing with the feminists here, is that it is irrelevant how the girls got into that state. The men had NO RIGHT to infer that a sexual liaison was being consented to by a woman in that state. Hinds is just as guilty for forcing himself on her whether her stupor was self inclicted or he had spiked her drink.

Plazaman · 20-03-2013 10:13AM

Me_Grapes wrote: »

Regardless, the point still stands. 5 years for crimes of such magnitude is not just.

Well it has been pointed out in a roundabout fashion here that if this case was here in Ireland he probably would have not being charged of murder but manslaughter. Going by the most recent cases he may have got 10 years and with a portion of that suspended and remission, it's about the same sentence.

There's no remission in Japan so 5 years is 5 years and if he acts the git or doesn't follow the strict prison regime over there, they keep adding to that sentence up to 10 years. From what I read, no one ever knows their final prison sentence until they're leaving prison.

PS personally I think hanging's too good for him but hopefully he'll go mad and top himself.

K-9 · 20-03-2013 11:06AM

seamus wrote: »

One where the macho stereotypes are continually reinforced.

This case had me thinking about the football "stars" rape video which has also been talked about a lot recently. In some groups, this kind of misogynistic machismo is encouraged and lauded by peers. It's an attitude which paints women as little more than trophies to be won, and belittles any woman who might attempt to assert herself as an equal.

This can be seen by the attitudes which paint the men as victims of "boys will be boys" getting a little out of hand, excusing straight-up sexual assault and rape as if it's not that big a deal and something that happens to everyone at some point.

This exists everywhere, this isn't an American issue or a rural issue. Culturally and socially it's been mostly eradicated from the public eye, but strip away the politically-correct language and the watchful eyes of the opposite sex, stick a group of macho-minded friends into a room with some beer and you'll see a lot of scummy language come out, uncorrected.

That's a good example of how the problem seems to be getting worse, or maybe it was always there, but people should know far better by now. Sexuality is much freer that before, but attitudes seem stuck in the 50's at times.

Caliden · 20-03-2013 11:39AM

I think people saying "5 years is a joke" need to understand that according to Japanese law, he is a minor.

He was given the maximum sentence a minor can be given and should commend the Japanese for that. It's understandable that people are upset because he would've been tried as an adult here but the bottom line is it didn't happen here.

Here's hoping it's a long 10 years.

the_monkey · 20-03-2013 11:39AM

Vizzy wrote: »

Coudn't agree more and hopefully his christian upbtinging will help in the contemplative process.
If I was him,however,I'd be cafeful bending down in the shower.

Again, the fact that he is "Religious" for me shows he's more of a sociopath then anything - people who don't want to do bad - ONLY cos they think God will punish them are dangerous people.

People should be good out of respect for their fellow person - not out of fear for being punished ...

20-03-2013 11:49AM

He got 5 years minimum.

MINIMUM. Absorb that word or else look up its meaning.

People need to read what's written.

Kinski · 20-03-2013 12:18PM

It is a galling sentence all the same. Even if he serves the full ten years, he won't yet be 30 by the time he gets out. Old enough to tour Japan as a professional musician, but not old enough to be tried as an adult for his heinous crime.

Hinds found guilty of murder

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