revenue issues threat to every homeowner in the country.

Annasopra · 19-03-2013 04:23PM

MadsL wrote: »

So Sam, as you are cheerleading Ben Gilroy, please do explain...

http://www.attackthetax.com/about.html

"I am a freeman" being the theme I expect. What was said/explained at the meetings?

The freemen have been consistently shown to be peddling nonsense

http://ukhumanrightsblog.com/2012/09/30/freemen-of-the-land-are-parasites-peddling-pseudolegal-nonsense-canadian-judge-fights-back/

http://www.thejournal.ie/readme/column-ignore-the-conspiracy-theories-the-household-charge-must-be-paid-370964-Mar2012/

http://www.lawsociety.ie/Documents/Gazette/Gazette%202012/April2012.pdf

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 04:57PM

dxhound2005 wrote: »

If the President has any doubt about the constitutionality of a piece of new legislation he can refer it to the Supreme Court.

http://www.lawlibrary.ie/viewdoc.asp?DocID=15

Article 26 of the Constitution says that the President may refer Bills to the Supreme Court to get a ruling on whether or not they are constitutional. If the Supreme Court rules that the Bill is constitutional, that Bill cannot be challenged again on its constitutionality.

The President did not consider there was any reason to refer the LPT legislation so all I can say to the amateur lawyers from the Freeman movement or anywhere else is the best of luck.

You may be unaware that Sinn Fein are going to introduce a Bill to repeal the LPT legislation. They didn't introduce the tax in the North but bizarrely they deny that it exists.

As soon as you mentioned the President I stopped reading.
He's a Labour man so he's highly unlikely to refer anything they introduce to anyone.
Christ you'd think to read your post that there was no corruption in Irish politics.

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 05:01PM

Leftist wrote: »

pay your taxes and stop whinging. Sick and tired of everyone moaning about contributing to a society they constantly think owes them something.

Your post reminds me of the posters who are supporting Ming regarding his penalty points corruption. It's like the Legalise Cannabis posters versus the Anti-cannabis posters only on this thread it's the FG/Labour posters versus the anti Property Tax posters.
Can you not think for yourselves lads. Not all taxes are good.

MadsL · 19-03-2013 05:18PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Can you not think for yourselves lads. Not all taxes are good.

Which jurisdictions have no property taxes?

How are these taxes 'bad' in your view?

Income tax
Property tax
Wealth taxes/Death duties
Sales taxes

These type of taxes seem to be pretty universal, Ireland is unusual in having abolished property taxes.

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 05:20PM

MadsL wrote: »

Which jurisdictions have no property taxes?

How are these taxes 'bad' in your view?

Income tax
Property tax
Wealth taxes/Death duties
Sales taxes

These type of taxes seem to be pretty universal, Ireland is unusual in having abolished property taxes.

Is the USC universal?
Are the levies for Quinn, PMPA, Health etc universal?

MadsL · 19-03-2013 05:32PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Is the USC universal?
Are the levies for Quinn, PMPA, Health etc universal?

Payroll taxes are pretty universal so whilst the names differ some form of social insurance is usually taken. Would you prefer not to have a pension?

So you are not paying the property tax because of the Quinn, PMPA, & Health levy? Is that your justification?

MadYaker · 19-03-2013 06:11PM

MadsL wrote: »

So Sam, as you are cheerleading Ben Gilroy, please do explain...

http://www.attackthetax.com/about.html

"I am a freeman" being the theme I expect. What was said/explained at the meetings?

FYI if you want to talk about these idiots or indulge in some more freeman bashing (which I recommend) there is a thread in the Legal Discussion forum.

dxhound2005 · 19-03-2013 06:32PM

tayto lover wrote: »

As soon as you mentioned the President I stopped reading.
He's a Labour man so he's highly unlikely to refer anything they introduce to anyone.
Christ you'd think to read your post that there was no corruption in Irish politics.

You should have continued reading, you missed most of the good bits.

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 06:45PM

MadsL wrote: »

Payroll taxes are pretty universal so whilst the names differ some form of social insurance is usually taken. Would you prefer not to have a pension?

So you are not paying the property tax because of the Quinn, PMPA, & Health levy? Is that your justification?

I never said that. How do you arrive there?
My problem is with having any tax on MY property and I would prefer a tax increase to it.

PS
Don't compare it to my car as we have been through that 100 times at least.

MadsL · 19-03-2013 06:48PM

tayto lover wrote: »

I never said that. How do you arrive there?
My problem is with having any tax on MY property and I would prefer a tax increase to it.

PS
Don't compare it to my car as we have been through that 100 times at least.

What tax would you increase? And if income tax why do you feel squeezing people with no property is preferable to squeezing those with property?

moon_man · 19-03-2013 06:55PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Is the USC universal?
Are the levies for Quinn, PMPA, Health etc universal?

the universal social charge is a tax by any other name , if they scrapped it and simply set a rate for those earning over or under a certain amount , what difference would it make

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 07:00PM

MadsL wrote: »

What tax would you increase? And if income tax why do you feel squeezing people with no property is preferable to squeezing those with property?

Because why should I pay for having the "honour" of paying a stamp duty, mortgage, insurance etc on housing my family while others just rented or received free houses and partied all the time. Income tax is supposed to catch all, not just the same people all the time.

Should nobody purchase homes and just rent or let the Govt house them?

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 07:02PM

moon_man wrote: »

the universal social charge is a tax by any other name , if they scrapped it and simply set a rate for those earning over or under a certain amount , what difference would it make

So are levies in my book. If it's taken from wages without consent then it's a tax. I reckon we are now paying 62% tax at least so why not 64% and scrap this Home Tax?
Why should my children and grandchildren have to pay 56 k debt.

Bullseye1 · 19-03-2013 07:06PM

MadsL wrote: »

What tax would you increase? And if income tax why do you feel squeezing people with no property is preferable to squeezing those with property?

Well you could have a property but be cash poor or you could be cash rich and no property. Say someone has a property and its worth €200,000 they would need to sell the property to realise a value and it might sell for more or less. You could also have someone with €200,000 cash in a deposit account renting.

Maybe there should be a tax on all assits?

In its current form the property tax is poorly thought out like most ideas coming out of Dáil Éireann.

ezra_pound · 19-03-2013 07:20PM

SamHall wrote: »

I'm not getting into a slanging match with you Seamus.

Leeches are the cretins in govt, hundreds of thousands of euro salaries, topped up by vast expenses on top if you don't mind, (some of which are tax defaulters/evaders themselves).

I'll pay the property tax with no resistance and no fuss if they refund the stamp duty I paid in 2007. That alone would is equal to approx fifty years of what (I think) my property tax will be.

Can I ask you Seamus, what tax will be a tax too far for you as an individual, or will you pay every tax applicable to you, regardless whether you can afford to pay it or not? (because its law)

50 years?

Now I cannot believe that I'm sorry.

MadsL · 19-03-2013 07:29PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Because why should I pay for having the "honour" of paying a stamp duty, mortgage, insurance etc on housing my family while others just rented or received free houses and partied all the time. Income tax is supposed to catch all, not just the same people all the time.

Should nobody purchase homes and just rent or let the Govt house them?

Are you for real? You decide to buy a house using the same information open to those who rented. Your reference to partying seems to indicate that you feel you are owed something by buying a house. I don't really see what you feel is wrong with people who rented and used their money to party, as it turned they saved money by renting.

By the way, seeing as you think people should be treated the same, why don't we move mortgage interest relief down to the same level as rent relief.

As to free houses?? Wtf?

MadsL · 19-03-2013 07:31PM

tayto lover wrote: »

So are levies in my book. If it's taken from wages without consent then it's a tax. I reckon we are now paying 62% tax at least so why not 64% and scrap this Home Tax?
Why should my children and grandchildren have to pay 56 k debt.

Why should my child have to pay off the troika debt when no-one in her family speculated on property?

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 07:36PM

MadsL wrote: »

Why should my child have to pay off the troika debt when no-one in her family speculated on property?

Exactly. You made my point. Thanks.
We should only have to pay our own personal debts.

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 07:39PM

MadsL wrote: »

Are you for real? You decide to buy a house using the same information open to those who rented. Your reference to partying seems to indicate that you feel you are owed something by buying a house. I don't really see what you feel is wrong with people who rented and used their money to party, as it turned they saved money by renting.

By the way, seeing as you think people should be treated the same, why don't we move mortgage interest relief down to the same level as rent relief.

As to free houses?? Wtf?

I do not feel owed for buying a house but neither do I feel I owe for the same pleasure.

MadsL · 19-03-2013 07:41PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Exactly. You made my point. Thanks.
We should only have to pay our own personal debts.

Who pays the troika debt then? The leprechauns?

Overborrowing for inflated property prices was the petrol on the flames of the bubble. Therefore a property tax is more appropriate than an income tax.

Explain to me why everyone should pitch in to make life easier for those who overborrowed?

MadsL · 19-03-2013 07:42PM

tayto lover wrote: »

I do not feel owed for buying a house but neither do I feel I owe for the same pleasure.

What's all this partying resentment about then? You feel people who rented should now contribute more because they made good financial decisions??

Very odd.

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 07:54PM

MadsL wrote: »

Who pays the troika debt then? The leprechauns?

Overborrowing for inflated property prices was the petrol on the flames of the bubble. Therefore a property tax is more appropriate than an income tax.

Explain to me why everyone should pitch in to make life easier for those who overborrowed?

Where did I say that everyone should chip in for those who over-borrowed?
I didn't over-borrow and was always able to pay my bills at the expense of holidays etc. Should I have to pay for those who over-borrowed? Should I have to pay while you don't have to?

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 07:55PM

MadsL wrote: »

What's all this partying resentment about then? You feel people who rented should now contribute more because they made good financial decisions??

Very odd.

But you think I should have to pay for my good financial decisions :rolleyes:
Very odd indeed.

MadsL · 19-03-2013 07:58PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Where did I say that everyone should chip in for those who over-borrowed?
I didn't over-borrow and was always able to pay my bills at the expense of holidays etc. Should I have to pay for those who over-borrowed? Should I have to pay while you don't have to?

Because you have the amenity of a house.

Developers were paying property taxes on your behalf for years in the form of a development levy, all that has happened with the LPT is that tax has been transfered back to where it always was - rates on houses.

If renters pay it, then we end up with double taxation.

MadsL · 19-03-2013 07:59PM

tayto lover wrote: »

But you think I should have to pay for my good financial decisions :rolleyes:
Very odd indeed.

Tell me more about partying and "free houses"!

moon_man · 19-03-2013 08:01PM

im in favour of the property tax which i know is unpopular

im also in favour of cuts to forms of wellfare , which i know is also unpopular

Bruthal · 19-03-2013 08:02PM

MadsL wrote: »

Apathy in Ireland has just made it possible for FF to be reelected within living memory, if that happens, frankly I am so done with Ireland, as you will get what you deserve in that scenario.

A but surely it will only be the fault of people who actually vote for them. Is`t that right?

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 08:02PM

MadsL wrote: »

Tell me more about partying and "free houses"!

Surely you are aware of some people in council houses who have never contributed anything. Never worked, never will, always able to go drinking. I see it everyday.

tayto lover · 19-03-2013 08:07PM

MadsL wrote: »

Because you have the amenity of a house.

Developers were paying property taxes on your behalf for years in the form of a development levy, all that has happened with the LPT is that tax has been transfered back to where it always was - rates on houses.

If renters pay it, then we end up with double taxation.

If you are going to expect me to pay because I have the "amenity of a house" then I suggest that they tax you on the capital you have saved as a result of not buying a house. That might sound silly and is probably as silly as your argument.

Bruthal · 19-03-2013 08:08PM

MadsL wrote: »

Because you have the amenity of a house.

Developers were paying property taxes on your behalf for years in the form of a development levy, all that has happened with the LPT is that tax has been transfered back to where it always was - rates on houses.

Well then, people who were paying huge stamp duties were propping you up then, where they not? Where are the warning emails you sent, complaining that you were obviously paying too little tax, due to house buyers paying huge amounts?

If renters pay it, then we end up with double taxation.

Similar to above mentioned stamp duty payers paying the property tax is it?

revenue issues threat to every homeowner in the country.

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