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Hare Coursing

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  • #272
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,461 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    Artful_Badger wrote: »
    Whatever pheasants are in the area usually get shot in hunting season, thats why they have to release more the next year. They dont conserve anything, they just kill what they can while they can and do whatever they can to enable them to do so. Less of a shít could these people give about other peoples property if there was nothing to kill on it.

    No they don't, those that survive the season generally spread out across the surrounding land and new ones are bought, fed, watered and sheltered to raise the concentration of them in the area, those are hunted in season and the cycle begins again.

    So the feed that is left out for the pheasents doesn't provide food for other ground nesting species?


  • #273
    Artful_Badger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,339 ✭✭✭Artful_Badger


    Blay wrote: »
    Just because you didn't see them raise and feed the pheasents doesn't mean it didn't happen.

    Foxes and rabbits are generally shot as a favour for the farmer for letting you use their land.

    Still doesnt change anything, they raise and feed birds to kill them during hunting season. Its farmland, the birds they kill are ones they put there themselves. They are not conserving anything.

    Foxes are not shot as favours for using the land, on very rare occasions do they cause problems for farmers. More often than not they are just spotted and hunters jump at the chance to kill them for the sport.


  • #274
    yubabill1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,301 ✭✭✭yubabill1


    Artful_Badger wrote: »
    Whatever pheasants are in the area usually get shot in hunting season, thats why they have to release more the next year. They dont conserve anything, they just kill what they can while they can and do whatever they can to enable them to do so. Less of a shít could these people give about other peoples property if there was nothing to kill on it.

    All the pheasants do not get shot, it's necessary to release 3 pheasants to harvest one.

    Many more pheasants are killed by cars every year than are ever shot. Foxes eat them, the weather can kill them, even domestic cats kill them. Magpies and grey crows eat their eggs. I could go on....

    I presume you are still talking about the people you know, so again, they sound like poachers.


  • #275
    Hunter21
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 690 ✭✭✭Hunter21


    Artful_Badger wrote: »

    Foxes are not shot as favours for using the land, on very rare occasions do they cause problems for farmers. More often than not they are just spotted and hunters jump at the chance to kill them for the sport.

    Are you a farmer with tillage or grazing fields? Doubtfull as you do not know the damage a few rabbits could do to the land.
    I know a farmer that could not do silage on 25 acres of his 50 acre farm and had to buy in feed for the winter as the rabbits had eaten all his grass and cost him a fair few pound.

    Hunters are given permission by that farmer to help him save his livelyhood.


  • #276
    Artful_Badger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,339 ✭✭✭Artful_Badger


    Blay wrote: »
    No they don't, those that survive the season generally spread out across the surrounding land and new ones are bought, fed, watered and sheltered to raise the concentration of them in the area, those are hunted in season and the cycle begins again.

    So the feed that is left out for the pheasents doesn't provide food for other ground nesting species?

    You think because some birds eat the stuff left out for the hunting birds its conservation ??

    They feed in the wild to keep them in the hunting area and generally only start to leave stuff out approaching hunting season after the release the ones they raised at home. Its not conservation by a long stretch.


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  • #277
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,461 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    Artful_Badger wrote: »
    You think because some birds eat the stuff left out for the hunting birds its conservation ??

    Totally ignoring the number of pheasents that are free in the country as a direct result of a raise, shoot, release system.
    Artful_Badger wrote: »
    Still doesnt change anything, they raise and feed birds to kill them during hunting season. Its farmland, the birds they kill are ones they put there themselves. They are not conserving anything.

    Foxes are not shot as favours for using the land, on very rare occasions do they cause problems for farmers. More often than not they are just spotted and hunters jump at the chance to kill them for the sport.

    They're leaving feeding bins out that help to feed other ground nesting species. I know of people who raise poults to shoot and they provide feed for ducks on the river/lake nearby and they're not shooting them. You're clearly ignorant of how these things are carried out..it's ok.

    Yes they are? A gun club needs land to raise poults on, a farmers price for the use of the land is usually that vermin numbers..both foxes & rabbits are kept down. You're talking to a shooter here that knows people doing these things..so you're talkign bollocks to the wrong person frankly:pac:


  • #278
    fiacha
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 810 ✭✭✭fiacha


    Voted for a ban.

    I'm a hunter myself and would eat a lot of wild meat harvested by myself and rest of the family.
    Hare coursing has nothing to do with hunting. It's 100% a bloodsport...People gambling on the outcome of dogs chasing a live "lure".

    The vast majority of hunters I know have a lot of respect for their quarry. They go to a lot of trouble to ensure that it is killed as humanely as possible. Why any hunter would support the torture of animals in this manner is beyond me, but time and again I'm told that I have to suport all "bloodsports". I don't consider hunting game a bloodsport.

    Just my 2 cents after reading about this thread over on the Shooting forum.


  • #279
    archer22
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭archer22


    Sparks wrote: »
    I'm curious - do the people who support this know of the background of groups like ICABS? Of their links to fairly dodgy characters?

    ICABS Watch.
    I done some research on my own (as opposed to being spoon fed) and found that Michael D Higgins Ireland's current President and the late Tony Gregory TD are both former vice chairpersons of this organisation.


  • #280
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 3,251 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Hunt the hare and turn her
    Down the rocky road
    And all the way to Dublin
    Whack fa loll dee da


  • #281
    Artful_Badger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,339 ✭✭✭Artful_Badger


    Hunter21 wrote: »
    Are you a farmer with tillage or grazing fields? Doubtfull as you do not know the damage a few rabbits could do to the land.
    I know a farmer that could not do silage on 25 acres of his 50 acre farm and had to buy in feed for the winter as the rabbits had eaten all his grass and cost him a fair few pound.

    Hunters are given permission by that farmer to help him save his livelyhood.

    I myself am not a farmer no but I know and grew up with plenty and never seen an issue such as the one you mention. If he had a problem he had a problem but I havent seen its like round here. So just as people would say to me not to tar all hunters with the same brush I'd say to you that just because a guy you knew had a problem doesnt mean that everyone has a problem.

    There isnt even that much rabbits hunted around here and still there hasnt been a problem. Most hunting is of pheasants which were released by the hunters themselves.

    Anyway, back on topic.


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  • #282
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,461 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    Artful_Badger wrote: »

    There isnt even that much rabbits hunted around here and still there hasnt been a problem.

    They're not being because they're not a problem. When they become an issue for the farmers in your locality they will be shot and hunted.


  • #283
    fathersymes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 558 ✭✭✭fathersymes


    A taste of what these extremist groups get up to. http://www.animalliberationfront.com/ALFront/Actions-Ireland/BitebackReports2008.htm


  • #284
    Voodoo_rasher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 521 ✭✭✭Voodoo_rasher


    an unsophisticated, uncivilised form of entertainment cruelty for backward, moronic oafs and

    bumpkins who have yet to have a 21st century experience in their lives.

    What is sporting about 2 extremely agile predatory dogs tearing a defenceless animal to shreds..? The Romans had to have thought of that one.

    Would also be one less leisure pursuit for the parish priest patron..


  • #285
    Artful_Badger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,339 ✭✭✭Artful_Badger


    Blay wrote: »
    Totally ignoring the number of pheasents that are free in the country as a direct result of a raise, shoot, release system.

    Less than there would be if they were left alone I'd wager.
    Yes they are? A gun club needs land to raise poults on, a farmers price for the use of the land is usually that vermin numbers..both foxes & rabbits are kept down. You're talking to a shooter here that knows people doing these things..so you're talkign bollocks to the wrong person frankly:pac:

    If you're a shooter then you have no involvement in the raising of birds because you clearly havent a clue, you dont need farmers land to raise birds nor is it paid for by killing vermin. Killing things isnt wildlife conservation sorry to break it to ya.

    Anyway as I said back on topic.


  • #286
    fathersymes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 558 ✭✭✭fathersymes


    Voodoo_rasher wrote: »
    an unsophisticated, uncivilised form of entertainment cruelty for backward, moronic oafs and

    bumpkins who have yet to have a 21st century experience in their lives.

    What is sporting about 2 extremely agile predatory dogs tearing a defenceless animal to shreds..? The Romans had to have thought of that one.

    Would also be one less leisure pursuit for the parish priest patron..


    Dear oh dear, Inform yourself please, dogs are muzzled during coursing.


  • #287
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,461 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    Artful_Badger wrote: »
    Less than there would be if they were left alone I'd wager.



    If you're a shooter then you have no involvement in the raising of birds because you clearly havent a clue, you dont need farmers land to raise birds nor is it paid for by killing vermin. Killing things isnt wildlife conservation sorry to break it to ya.

    Anyway as I said back on topic.

    The pheasents that are shot are bought as poults, raised and released by the very people shooting them, they're not wild pheasents being shot and those that live through the season spread out into areas that aren't hunted and nest, breed and increase the numbers further.

    Where are the birds released and shot then..a public park? Gun clubs require land permissions from farmers..the benefit they gain is in vermin numbers being kept down. I don't know why I'm even talking you you..you've no clue:pac:


  • #288
    Grizzly 45
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,297 ✭✭✭✭Grizzly 45


    gobnaitolunacy wrote: »
    Limerick, need we say more?


    I don't get how any seemingly civilised person could get their jollies watching it.


    I dont see how any "civilised person " can be so PIG ignorant to run down a city or place by sweeping general comments!! Ever been there??Lived there??Know anyone from there??If not STFU!!

    "If you want to keep someone away from your house, Just fire the shotgun through the door."

    Vice President [and former lawyer] Joe Biden Field& Stream Magazine interview Feb 2013 "



  • #289
    Hunter21
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 690 ✭✭✭Hunter21


    Artful_Badger wrote: »
    I myself am not a farmer no but I know and grew up with plenty and never seen an issue such as the one you mention. If he had a problem he had a problem but I havent seen its like round here. So just as people would say to me not to tar all hunters with the same brush I'd say to you that just because a guy you knew had a problem doesnt mean that everyone has a problem.

    There isnt even that much rabbits hunted around here and still there hasnt been a problem. Most hunting is of pheasants which were released by the hunters themselves.

    Anyway, back on topic.

    Ya you want to get back to the original topic because you are after stepping on your own toes :o

    You stated earlier;
    Artful_Badger wrote: »

    Foxes are not shot as favours for using the land, on very rare occasions do they cause problems for farmers. More often than not they are just spotted and hunters jump at the chance to kill them for the sport.

    Then you stated;
    Artful_Badger wrote: »
    just because a guy you knew had a problem doesnt mean that everyone has a problem.


    Your generalising!
    You know about 0.1% of the Irish population of farmers, but because you know a few farmers you assume no other farmers have rabbit or fox problems.

    The same as you assume that hunters jump at the chance to kill them for the sport.

    Don't generalise as you do not know all the facts, your quoting a small minority of what you have seen or know of.


  • #290
    Sparks
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    Artful_Badger wrote: »
    I didnt accuse anyone of anything merely stated my opinion that killing for sport is unnecessary and cruel. Which it is.
    That's the accusation. Re-read the law; being cruel to animals is illegal under the act.
    Yeah, I was arguing that animals should be represented in government. :rolleyes:
    No, you were just saying they had rights without thinking about what that statement meant.

    This is what I mean when I say that people sweep the difference between animal welfare and animal rights aside like it was some sort of ethereal academic debate that had nothing to do with the real world, even though it's nothing of the sort and is in fact one of the fundamental principles on which our laws in this area are founded.
    It will change in time as most laws do.
    It might; or it might not.
    However, that's all in the future. The law today is what we live by today.
    If the law prohibits unnecessary cruelty to animals then its a civic duty (animals cant be relied on as you say) to stop such a thing if you believe it to be going on.
    Indeed; and we have a means for doing just that. You pick up the phone, dial Gardai and report it.

    You don't start a petition accusing someone of breaking the law without proof.

    Arguing semantics isnt really gonna change it to be honest.
    semantics: The meaning or the interpretation of a word.

    Yeah, because arguing over that would be utterly pointless since we're all telepathic...


  • #291
    Sparks
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    StinkyMunkey wrote: »
    Whats a farmer shooting a predator got to do with hare coursing?
    Both are condemned by ICABS et al in the same breath, by the same means, and as part of the same agenda.

    It's not a slippery slope argument if it's a stated agenda of someone to ban everything in a set order.


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  • #292
    Sparks
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,038 ✭✭✭✭Sparks


    Artful_Badger wrote: »
    Less than there would be if they were left alone I'd wager.
    You'd lose, according to every study ever done on the practice.


  • #293
    Hunter21
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 690 ✭✭✭Hunter21


    Artful_Badger wrote: »

    If you're a shooter then you have no involvement in the raising of birds because you clearly havent a clue, you dont need farmers land to raise birds nor is it paid for by killing vermin. Killing things isnt wildlife conservation sorry to break it to ya.

    I raised my own pheasants, I raised them in a bedroom in my house and had breakfast at the kitchen table every morning with them and dropped them to school.. :rolleyes: :o

    Get a grip will you! Your the one that knows nothing about it, wild birds or any wild animal for higher success rates has the be raised in the surroundings it will live its life- it's called a habitat.


  • #294
    archer22
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭archer22


    I would say the poll might as well be knocked off as its obviously being deliberately manipulated.Or else the People of Ireland have gone mad pro coursing in the last few hours :rolleyes:


  • #295
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,461 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    archer22 wrote: »
    I would say the poll might as well be knocked off as its obviously being deliberately manipulated.Or else the People of Ireland have gone mad pro coursing in the last few hours :rolleyes:

    If it was pro ban it would be legit but if it's anti ban it's being 'manipulated'. You guys crack me up:pac:


  • #296
    Artful_Badger
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,339 ✭✭✭Artful_Badger


    Hunter21 wrote: »
    Ya you want to get back to the original topic because you are after stepping on your own toes :o

    It was getting off topic and the argument was repeating itself.
    You stated earlier;


    Then you stated;


    Your generalising!
    You know about 0.1% of the Irish population of farmers, but because you know a few farmers you assume no other farmers have rabbit or fox problems.


    The same as you assume that hunters jump at the chance to kill them for the sport.

    Don't generalise as you do not know all the facts, your quoting a small minority of what you have seen or know of.


    I was speaking about my own experience in relation to the hunters I knew I made that perfectly clear. If you're too lazy to read the full conversation then dont be so eager to throw your two cents in. Because you just end up looking like a fool.


  • #297
    Hunter21
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 690 ✭✭✭Hunter21


    archer22 wrote: »
    I would say the poll might as well be knocked off as its obviously being deliberately manipulated.Or else the People of Ireland have gone mad pro coursing in the last few hours :rolleyes:

    It's not over yet, but some people are Sour loosers.

    Just because its not going as predicted it was fixed.. God this is the best laugh I've had all week.. :pac:


  • #298
    ejmaztec
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,280 ✭✭✭✭ejmaztec


    It must be that time again :pac:



    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uzae_SqbmDE


  • #299
    archer22
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,116 ✭✭✭archer22


    Blay wrote: »
    If it was pro ban it would be legit but if it's anti ban it's being 'manipulated'. You guys crack me up:pac:
    No it would not be legit being manipulated pro or anti but everybody knows the majority are anti coursing and a poll is an attempt to get a realistic picture of how many are for and against...now its sabotaged and is an obvious meaningless joke.


  • #300
    Witcher
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,461 ✭✭✭✭Witcher


    archer22 wrote: »
    No it would not be legit being manipulated pro or anti but everybody knows the majority are anti coursing and a poll is an attempt to get a realistic picture of how many are for and against...now its sabotaged and is an obvious meaningless joke.

    How do ya know that? Was there a poll done...maybe that was 'manipulated' too:pac:


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  • #301
    yubabill1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,301 ✭✭✭yubabill1


    [QUOTE=Artful_Badger;83445840

    I was speaking about my own experience in relation to the hunters I knew I made that perfectly clear. If you're too lazy to read the full conversation then dont be so eager to throw your two cents in. Because you just end up looking like a fool.[/QUOTE]

    AHEM...


This discussion has been closed.
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