Begging for food and charity.

Truncheon Rouge · 10-02-2013 07:41PM

frfintanstack wrote: »

Scammed for 30quid, ouch.

Giving people begging on the streets money only achieves 2 things.

1. It makes people who dont think about the consequences of their actions feel good about themselves.

2. Keeps junkies/alcos addicted to their drug of choice and on the street.

Its probably one of the more harmful and selfish things people can do.

makes me feel all warm and fuzzy.

so does heroin.

ITS_A_BADGER · 10-02-2013 07:43PM

frfintanstack wrote: »

Scammed for 30quid, ouch.

Giving people begging on the streets money only achieves 2 things.

1. It makes people who dont think about the consequences of their actions feel good about themselves.

2. Keeps junkies/alcos addicted to their drug of choice and on the street.

Its probably one of the more harmful and selfish things people can do.

makes me feel all warm and fuzzy.

OP didnt give her 30 quid he brought her food worth 30 quid,
also how is giving money to a homeless person selfish? you make it sound like people get a buzz off giving homeless people money. If that was the case how come everybody isnt giving money to every homeless person they pass. Giving someone the chance to help themselves is not selfish. not every homeless person is a junkie or alco either, Your just tarring all of them with the one brush, e.g oh he/she is homeless they must be junkie and or alco. There are other reasons people are homeless because of either physical or mental abuse at home being just a couple of examples. Cop on and stop taking such a narrow view of people worse off then you

tdv123 · 10-02-2013 08:05PM

frfintanstack wrote: »

Scammed for 30quid, ouch.

Giving people begging on the streets money only achieves 2 things.

1. It makes people who dont think about the consequences of their actions feel good about themselves.

2. Keeps junkies/alcos addicted to their drug of choice and on the street.

Its probably one of the more harmful and selfish things people can do.

makes me feel all warm and fuzzy.

Did you even read the OP you ****ing mug?

Junkies sell other drugs, rob people, steal from shops etc... to keep their habit going. Charitable donations from the public is one of the most least likely ways to help keep their habit going.

frfintanstack · 10-02-2013 08:07PM

ITS_A_BADGER wrote: »

OP didnt give her 30 quid he brought her food worth 30 quid,
also how is giving money to a homeless person selfish? you make it sound like people get a buzz off giving homeless people money. If that was the case how come everybody isnt giving money to every homeless person they pass. Giving someone the chance to help themselves is not selfish. not every homeless person is a junkie or alco either, Your just tarring all of them with the one brush, e.g oh he/she is homeless they must be junkie and or alco. There are other reasons people are homeless because of either physical or mental abuse at home being just a couple of examples. Cop on and stop taking such a narrow view of people worse off then you

I was directing that to the numerous people who mentioned giving cash to people begging on the streets in this thread.

OP was just scammed.

If people want to help people on the streets they should give money to charities that help them get off the streets.

Not throw some cash in the cup so they can waltz on by thinking they did a good deed when all they've done is contribute to keeping them on the street.

A large majority of homeless people in dublin have either drug or alcohol problems or both.

Whether it was the cause of them becoming homeless or its keeping them there matters not.

Most of the time you give people begging money you are actually doing harm.

Over 2/3 of people sleeping rough are drug/alcohol abusers according to Focus Ireland.

frfintanstack · 10-02-2013 08:13PM

ITS_A_BADGER wrote: »

Giving someone the chance to help themselves is not selfish. not every homeless person is a junkie or alco either,

Giving someone who more than likely has a drug habit/drink problem cash is only going to result in one thing.

ITS_A_BADGER wrote: »

not every homeless person is a junkie or alco either,

not all, but the majority

frfintanstack · 10-02-2013 08:16PM

tdv123 wrote: »

Junkies sell other drugs, rob people, steal from shops etc... to keep their habit going. Charitable donations from the public is one of the most least likely ways to help keep their habit going.

You should tell that to the guy with the pinpoint pupils asking me for money at the Jervis stop on the red line today......don't think he got the memo

mattjack · 10-02-2013 08:38PM

frfintanstack wrote: »

Giving someone who more than likely has a drug habit/drink problem cash is only going to result in one thing.

not all, but the majority

How many homeless are addicts or alcoholics ? I'm not necessarily looking for an answer regarding rough sleepers but more regarding people who fall under the homeless criteria ?

Roughly 90 odd rough sleepers in Dublin and about 3500 homeless in Ireland.

frfintanstack · 10-02-2013 08:49PM

mattjack wrote: »

How many homeless are addicts or alcoholics ? I'm not necessarily looking for an answer regarding rough sleepers but more regarding people who fall under the homeless criteria ?

Roughly 90 odd rough sleepers in Dublin and about 3500 homeless in Ireland.

http://www.focusireland.ie/files/publications/Caught%20In%20A%20Trap.pdf

2/3 current drug users according to this Focus Ireland study. Doesn't include alcohol in that stat.

And thats of the people who's lives weren't too chaotic to be able to take part in the study and whose data was excluded. A big problem in compiling these studies.

tdv123 · 10-02-2013 08:50PM

frfintanstack wrote: »

You should tell that to the guy with the pinpoint pupils asking me for money at the Jervis stop on the red line today......don't think he got the memo

So the one person you seen today asking for money at Jervis stop now represents every homeless person?

There's also a very big distinction between a middle aged woman begging for food & people trying to intimidate others into giving them money.

ITS_A_BADGER · 10-02-2013 08:54PM

frfintanstack wrote: »

If people want to help people on the streets they should give money to charities that help them get off the streets.
Not throw some cash in the cup so they can waltz on by thinking they did a good deed when all they've done is contribute to keeping them on the street.
A large majority of homeless people in dublin have either drug or alcohol problems or both.
Whether it was the cause of them becoming homeless or its keeping them there matters not.
Most of the time you give people begging money you are actually doing harm.

Giving someone who more than likely has a drug habit/drink problem cash is only going to result in one thing

Giving money to charities, while it is a lovely thing to do, doesnt help the person there and then, Whos to say that person would survive the nite by the time the charity got near them, My preferred method is to buy food and a drink but if i dont have time id throw maybe 3-4 euro their way, you dont know for sure what they are going to use it on, but you can give them an option to have food or not, i dont do it for feeling of a good deed done, i do it because i feel sorry for them and a hope that they would use it for the right reasons. how can you tell before you help them what they are going to use it on? the actions of one does not speak for the majority

Bad Santa · 10-02-2013 08:55PM

ButtersSuki wrote: »

This scam was featured on Joe Duffy and in the papers pre-Christmas. Sorry OP.

I have bought many a person food and a hot drink but I regret two of them as they were without question, scams. First one was around 2008 and it later became clear that they were part of a group as I began to see her getting out of cars and being left at the same spot many times later over the last few years. It's a girl with jet black hair, around 19 and she has some younger sisters who are sometimes with her. Dawson St is her main port of call.

Second one is more recent. Was the summer of 2011 when I first seen her. She is about early 50s and focuses on Abbey St, O'Connell St and Wicklow St. I see her there all the time now. Her hair looks like she hasn't brushed it and seems wet and her clothes raggedy. She has a disheveled look too but the fact that she always looks the very same each time, even though over a year has passed, to be suggests that this is something she does purposefully in order to look downtrodden.

The latest scam in Dublin is the guy who covers one of his shoes in a plastic bag when it rains to make it look like he only has one show but will see him hours later when the rain stops and he's shoes are fine. The guy with no shoes is a fcuker altogether. Hides his shoes and socks and sits on Henry St shivering like he has just being in a plane crash in the Andes. Loads of kind folks have bought him footwear and socks but apparently he always asks them for the receipt. Seen the Guards move him a few times.

Think I'd have no bother giving to genuine people who would seem like they'd appreciate food and the like but mostly, I generally have no time for begging as it's rarely genuine. Especially ATM ones. Giving to FOCUS and the Simon Community are the best places to give money, or maybe even your time.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 10-02-2013 08:58PM

frfintanstack wrote: »

I was directing that to the numerous people who mentioned giving cash to people begging on the streets in this thread.

OP was just scammed.

If people want to help people on the streets they should give money to charities that help them get off the streets.

Not throw some cash in the cup so they can waltz on by thinking they did a good deed when all they've done is contribute to keeping them on the street.

A large majority of homeless people in dublin have either drug or alcohol problems or both.

Whether it was the cause of them becoming homeless or its keeping them there matters not.

Most of the time you give people begging money you are actually doing harm.

Over 2/3 of people sleeping rough are drug/alcohol abusers according to Focus Ireland.

I wasn't trying to get her off the streets, she wasn't homeless, just hungry. I wouldn't give money directly to anybody who is begging. I'd buy them something instead.

I worked in the Capuchin center in Smithfield for some months. That's a real eye opener.

frfintanstack wrote: »

http://www.focusireland.ie/files/publications/Caught%20In%20A%20Trap.pdf

2/3 current drug users according to this Focus Ireland study. Doesn't include alcohol in that stat.

The sample size is tiny. There's like 25 respondents at a glance.

mattjack · 10-02-2013 09:05PM

frfintanstack wrote: »

http://www.focusireland.ie/files/publications/Caught%20In%20A%20Trap.pdf

2/3 current drug users according to this Focus Ireland study. Doesn't include alcohol in that stat.

And thats of the people who's lives weren't too chaotic to be able to take part in the study and whose data was excluded. A big problem in compiling these studies.

Is that not a very old survey, it mentions the EHB.
I work with homeless people and I can't find a definitive figure but I don't think its 2/3 , there's a lot of people homeless now for economic reasons .

I thought you may have had an up to date figure.

Chemical Burn · 10-02-2013 09:07PM

I really admire this lady. Throwing away her pride and genuinely asking for food and not money. Instead of the scummy types of people who would break into a house and terrorise the owners and rob thousands of euro and tv and computers, and say "I'm just feeding my family".

frfintanstack · 10-02-2013 09:07PM

Salvatore Hissing Hanger wrote: »

The sample size is tiny. There's like 25 respondents at a glance.

due to high drop out rates because of chaotic lifestyles.

do you think its the homeless people with the less chaotic lifestyles that have higher drug and alcohol problems?

these studies probably underestimate the problem

Wabbit Ears · 10-02-2013 09:09PM

Its a funky kind of opiate these beggars sell. The OP, and several dozen more exactly like him day in day out get a warm fuzzy feeling and they get bag fulls of stuff to trade/sell/whatever. win win.

sh1tstirrer · 10-02-2013 09:15PM

mattjack wrote: »

Never look down on someone unless your're helping them up .

Jesse James

Jesse James looked down on many men with a ball and cap revolver before he shot them. He wasn't a Robin Hood either.

http://www.legendsofamerica.com/we-jessejames.html

frfintanstack · 10-02-2013 09:16PM

mattjack wrote: »

Is that not a very old survey, it mentions the EHB.
I work with homeless people and I can't find a definitive figure but I don't think its 2/3 , there's a lot of people homeless now for economic reasons .

I thought you may have had an up to date figure.

It's hard to find anything more up to date.

I work in healthcare and see the chaotic lifestyles these people lead.

As someone who works with homeless people do you think handing them cash helps?

In a state with a pretty generous social welfare system the people who end up begging arent the ones who just need a few quid for a bag of spuds. The money is going elsewhere in my experience

tdv123 · 10-02-2013 09:17PM

Wabbit Ears wrote: »

Its a funky kind of opiate these beggars sell. The OP, and several dozen more exactly like him day in day out get a warm fuzzy feeling and they get bag fulls of stuff to trade/sell/whatever. win win.

It's probably oxycodone.

mattjack · 10-02-2013 09:19PM

frfintanstack wrote: »

due to high drop out rates because of chaotic lifestyles.

do you think its the homeless people with the less chaotic lifestyles that have higher drug and alcohol problems?

these studies probably underestimate the problem

I'm just having a look at that survey , its methodology section names very specific staff members who took part in that survey , I don't know if the crisis team still exists but the EDS and the Outreach teams work with very specific groups of people, who would be the very chaotic group.

Giblet · 10-02-2013 09:40PM

€30 for veg and some bread? Jesus, get yourself to lidl and you would have only been scammed for €5

Peanut · 10-02-2013 10:06PM

Esel wrote: »

One of the better pan-handling approaches is "I'm not going to lie to you - I need money for drink!". You would be surprised how many marks fall for that one.

Bought a homeless guy a beer once. I knew it wasn't a scam after seeing the wall of empty tinnies behind him, but you can never be too careful.

AlekSmart · 10-02-2013 10:20PM

xLexie wrote: »

I'd be fairly gullible tbh. Used to work just off harcourt street and the first few weeks I was down about a tenner from the red luas to work, feeling sorry for people begging. Hardened up somewhat after that, but would still give to some people.

Remember outside heuston station this fella racing around asking everyone by the luas for money, story was he was out the night before and spent every cent he had and had no money to get his car out of the train station car park. I felt awful sorry for him and gave him a fiver, he asked other people and they gave him money too so I know he collected the 14 euro to get the car, he went into heuston station and came back out with a bottle of coke, asking people again for money. He approached me the second time and asked me again... Now he made sure to tell people he was from Carlow and that he wasn't on drugs. "Do I look like a junkie". Maybe he was genuine cause I didnt see him there again, but he got a lot more than the car park fare that morning.

Oh Oh.....This could spark quite a revolt in some circles,believe me !!!

AlekSmart · 10-02-2013 10:36PM

Czarcasm wrote: »

Fùcks sake lads, it was €30, not €300, it was a small gesture that made the OP feel like they did a good deed for the day. I'd have done the same tbh.

There are some genuine down on their luck cases, there are some that you know they're a scam, but you don't care, and there are some that have chips the size of cinder blocks on their shoulders that expect you should feel sorry for them. I do, but only because they're so bitter at the world, not because they're homeless.

After reading the OP's well written account I was on-the-fence,until I got to the end....

Iamxavier:I did tell the lady that I wouldn't give her money, she said she didn't want money at all, only some food to feed her kids. The poor divil. She was down from Sligo as her child was very ill and needed special care. I didn't intrude and ask what was wrong or anything. She was staying in a hostel and didn't have any money for food. Imagine, she went out onto the streets to beg for spuds and carrots to feed her kids.

It was only 30 euro, but in the shop I was asking her if she would like this or that and she declined on several occasions.

I'm not quite sure why I am telling ye this but I would hope that it will inspire some to give when you can. No matter how bad you think you have it, there are a lot of people who would dream of being in your position.

Have you ever done any charity work?
__________________

Those who have not found their true wealth, which is the radiant joy of being and the deep unshakeable peace that comes with it, are beggars. Even if they have great material wealth. They are looking outside for scraps of pleasure or fulfillment, for validation, security or love, while they have a treasure within, that not only includes all these things, but is infinately greater than anything the world can offer...

All a bit too preachy TBH....kinda vested interest in the situation really.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 11-02-2013 11:42AM

AlekSmart wrote: »

After reading the OP's well written account I was on-the-fence,until I got to the end....

All a bit too preachy TBH....kinda vested interest in the situation really.

I am not quite sure I understand what you mean by vested interests.

Czarcasm · 11-02-2013 11:45AM

Salvatore Hissing Hanger wrote: »

I am not quite sure I understand what you mean by vested interests.

I think they mean the fact that you felt good after doing a good deed, terrible stuff altogether! :pac:

AlekSmart · 11-02-2013 01:39PM

Czarcasm wrote: »

I think they mean the fact that you felt good after doing a good deed, terrible stuff altogether! :pac:

Nope,Im all for a visit from Dr Feelgood,and none better than this particular one....

http://www.clashmusic.com/news/wilko-johnson-diagnosed-with-terminal-cancer

Get a consultation in before it's too late I say !!

However,to return to Topic....I was reading Xaviers post as being from a Jose Soap until I came to the final paragraph and signature,which I interpret as defining Xavier as somebody active in the Poverty Relief sector.

There's nothing wrong with that at all,BUT I would have preferred if this was at the top of his post rather than the bottom.

It merely puts context on the his view that's all.

I'm neither for it nor agin it,but it's not what I would do myself.

Begging for food and charity.

Comments