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This a little wierd?

2

Comments

  • #32
    Hoop66
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,273 ✭✭✭Hoop66


    danniemcq wrote: »
    People should be free to practice their own beliefs in private so if they want to start a group let them work away but do it quietly ffs
    In the same way that mainstream religion is practised without any fuss or bother? Sure you'd hardly know they were there.


  • #33
    Micky Dolenz
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 44,079 ✭✭✭✭Micky Dolenz


    Is there anything these Atheists aren't capable of? The mad yokes.


  • #34
    orestes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,972 ✭✭✭orestes


    pmcmahon wrote: »
    ehh..thats not right

    Really? What church or religion is AA associated with?


  • #35
    danniemcq
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,163 ✭✭✭✭danniemcq


    Hoop66 wrote: »
    In the same way that mainstream religion is practised without any fuss or bother? Sure you'd hardly know they were there.

    think you missed the second part of my post
    by the way the quiet bit goes for all religions. Doesn't the bible say something like do not met the right hand know what the left hand does when you give to charity and that those who scream their religious beliefs will have their reward but those who do it in private will be welcomed to kingdom of heaven


  • #36
    danniemcq
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,163 ✭✭✭✭danniemcq


    bluewolf wrote: »
    So an atheist group being an atheist group makes them militant and very annoying even though people should be allowed have their own groups.

    no i did say some in the same way that some religious people are militant (watch jesus camp)

    my issue is with those who people know are Athiests. If you are an Athiest what point is there in telling someone else.

    Its like the iphone joke. how do you know someone has an iphone, they tell you. I get the same with athiests, i don't think i ever had someone tell me in a converstaion that they were jewish/catholic/protestant etc


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  • #37
    wobbles-grogan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 558 ✭✭✭wobbles-grogan


    orestes wrote: »
    How is it ironic? Or do you consider every political/scientific/humanitarian/trade/hobby/sci-fi convention to be a church?

    No, I dont. Its just that a group of atheists (<gross generalization> People who dont believe in a higher power </gross generalization>)
    get together to discuss things they believe in (or dont believe in, as the case may be).
    Getting together to discuss things the group believes in is usually resigned to the land of religion.

    I believe this may be the definition of ironic.

    Anyone else believe this is the meaning of ironic want to meet up?


  • #38
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,626 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    orestes wrote: »
    Really? What church or religion is AA associated with?

    It's intrinsically linked to theism in general. It requires people to accept that a God exists, even if it's worded in a woolly headed way like "as we understand Him", and it asks people to believe that he will be the one that helps them beat alcoholism.


  • #39
    Procasinator
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,311 ✭✭✭Procasinator


    pmcmahon wrote: »
    Sounds more humanist than athiest.Im fairly sure attending sermons isn't athiest,by their logic,me going out at the weekend is a sermon.

    Being a humanist group does not preclude it from being an atheist group, unless they are aligning their humanist views with ones rooted in theism.

    The sermon was the BBC language from what I can tell, they never label it as such on the Sunday Assembly website.

    They don't seem to label themselves at all really, only calling themselves a Godless congregation.


  • #40
    orestes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,972 ✭✭✭orestes


    My name is URL wrote: »
    It's intrinsically linked to theism in general. It requires people to accept that a God exists, even if it's worded in a woolly headed way like "as we understand Him", and it asks people to believe that he will be the one that helps them beat alcoholism.

    So in what way was I not right when I said AA isn't connected to any church or religion?


  • #41
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,808 ✭✭✭✭smash


    I believe!!!!!


    no, wait....


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  • #42
    Dravokivich
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Music Moderators, Politics Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 22,424 CMod ✭✭✭✭Dravokivich


    What's next a periodical? Bet the editors of Alive are shaking in their boots now.


  • #43
    Dj Grimreefer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 93 ✭✭Dj Grimreefer


    I tried to join but they believed I didn't belong there


  • #44
    kylith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,745 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    It seems to be a group of likeminded people getting together to discuss what they have in common. How is that weird? You only think it's weird because they're called a 'church' in the paper, though I suppose "Group of People Meet To Discuss Common Interests and Experiences" doesn't sell as many papers...


  • #45
    Adyx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,997 ✭✭✭Adyx


    kylith wrote: »
    It seems to be a group of likeminded people getting together to discuss what they have in common. How is that weird? You only think it's weird because they're called a 'church' in the paper, though I suppose "Group of People Meet To Discuss Common Interests and Experiences" doesn't sell as many papers...
    It's described as part atheist church by the master of ceremonies. That's where the paper got it from. Like-minded people getting together to talk about common interests isn't weird obviously.

    Personally, I honestly don't see what there is to talk about regarding atheism. Organised atheism sounds as bad as organised religion.


  • #46
    My name is URL
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,626 ✭✭✭✭My name is URL


    orestes wrote: »
    So in what way was I not right when I said AA isn't connected to any church or religion?

    I never said you were wrong about it not being connect to any particular church, but it's disingenuous to say that it isn't connected to religion. It relies heavily upon the religiosity of those partaking in the program.


  • #47
    orestes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,972 ✭✭✭orestes


    My name is URL wrote: »
    I never said you were wrong about it not being connect to any particular church, but it's disingenuous to say that it isn't connected to religion. It relies heavily upon the religiosity of those partaking in the program.

    How can it be a religious program if it is not connected to any religion? I said it was a spiritual program, not a religious one, and when other people said I was wrong and that it was explicitly religious I asked them to explain how so. Rather than explaining how it is a religious program the response was "well it's not associated with any actual religion or church, but it's kinda religious in general since it needs people to believe in something bigger than themselves". That's not religion, it's spirituality.

    Religion and spirituality are not the same thing, that's my point.


  • #48
    Procasinator
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,311 ✭✭✭Procasinator


    Adyx wrote: »
    Personally, I honestly don't see what there is to talk about regarding atheism. Organised atheism sounds as bad as organised religion.

    They seem to talk about issues as wide ranging as particle physics to dealing with bereavement. They also have tea afterwards.

    It gives people a community that has some of the benefits of a church group without the actual religion.

    Doesn't really sound all that bad to me.


  • #49
    krudler
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,788 ✭✭✭✭krudler


    danniemcq wrote: »
    at this stage militant Athiests are getting more annoying than militant Christians.

    except with christians you can have a decent arguement and both can come away feeling good and show a general respect for each other.

    These athiests though are so far up their own fecking arse at this stage thinking that because they are to smart and clever to fall for a belief of a god and that anyone could be that stupid.

    People should be free to practice their own beliefs in private so if they want to start a group let them work away but do it quietly ffs

    by the way the quiet bit goes for all religions. Doesn't the bible say something like do not met the right hand know what the left hand does when you give to charity and that those who scream their religious beliefs will have their reward but those who do it in private will be welcomed to kingdom of heaven

    and yes i know they aren't the correct quotes but i'm to lazy to look them up right now

    Atheism, the arrogant belief that the entire universe wasn't created just for your species.


  • #50
    Adyx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,997 ✭✭✭Adyx


    Procasinator wrote: »

    They seem to talk about issues as wide ranging as particle physics to dealing with bereavement . They also have tea afterwards.

    It gives people a community that has some of the benefits of a church group without the actual religion.

    Doesn't really sound all that bad to me.
    Oh, I agree. It does sound interesting. But I don't see a need to bring religion or lack thereof into it. That's just me though.


  • #51
    kylith
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,745 ✭✭✭✭kylith


    Adyx wrote: »
    It's described as part atheist church by the master of ceremonies. That's where the paper got it from. Like-minded people getting together to talk about common interests isn't weird obviously.

    Personally, I honestly don't see what there is to talk about regarding atheism. Organised atheism sounds as bad as organised religion.

    My mistake. In that case, he's being very silly. 'Church' is defined as 'a building...organisation of Christian worship'. I can only assume that he's trying to be humourous.


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  • #52
    danniemcq
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,163 ✭✭✭✭danniemcq


    krudler wrote: »
    Atheism, the arrogant belief that the entire universe wasn't created just for your species.

    not just atheists that belief there could be alien life in the universe

    ‎"If science proves some belief of Buddhism wrong, then Buddhism will have to change." -The Dalai Lama

    and

    Highly evolved extra terrestrial lifeforms may be living in space and would be welcomed into the church - "no matter how many tentacles", one of the Pope's astronomers has said.

    and

    To return to our topic about extraterrestrials: There are verses in the Qur'an that apparently favor the belief in the existence of such creatures, though we cannot find any particular verse explicitly stating their existence.


  • #53
    orestes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,972 ✭✭✭orestes


    Adyx wrote: »
    Oh, I agree. It does sound interesting. But I don't see a need to bring religion or lack thereof into it. That's just me though.

    The Church of Satan was founded as an anti-christian humanist institution, with all of the pseudo-religious terminology and ceremony used intentionally being opposite to christian teachings and traditions, in order to show that they were delibirerately setting themselves up as a counter-point to christianity (morally, culturally, idealistically, socially, politically, etc.). Even the name "Church of Satan" was an intentional polarisation, since the institution didn't worship the devil, but Satan as representative of the opposite and enemy of god. All terminology and symbolism, but conducive to the idea behind the establishment.

    An athiest church would essentially be doing the same thing, but instead of setting themselves up as contrary to a particular religion or church, it would be setting itself up as the counter-point to the entire concept of transcendantal deitie/s and what it represents (secular education, religious rights, tax exemption, institutional marriage, etc.). Rather than being passively humanist, an athiest church would be by definition actively contrary to religion.


  • #54
    poeticseraphim
    Closed Accounts Posts: 930 ✭✭✭poeticseraphim


    Atheism is the new snake oil.

    What you believe is not going to change your life.


    You don't need to change /discuss your beliefs just get on with life.

    Sermonizing a lack of belief is going to be difficult unless it is condemnation of other religions.


    Maybe they are just lonely and miss the bonding experience of communal belief.
    Rather than being passively humanist, an athiest church would be by definition actively contrary to religion.

    The problem is that it is turning out to be exactly the same as religion. Judgmental and pontificating to everyone else. Hierarchy etc. Or worse all the bureaucracy self importance and money making with none of the real life dedication to charity.

    It is just like every other group or tribe....to be honest I don't think humans can do anything else.

    I imagine atheism to be an empty revelation. I expect it to be filled with much philosophical tripe over the coming years as atheists attempt to make meaning out of it.

    We already have a non religious institution too unite us...it is called the state....I don't want another one.


    This is simply a replacement for the community that is missing.

    It is when these groups make a play for power or more people etc that it gets dangerous.


  • #55
    ITS_A_BADGER
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,232 ✭✭✭ITS_A_BADGER


    Ah not really its just a group of people coming together to celebrate their non beliefs of something, its just the same as like say pokemon fans coming celebrate pokemon, They all have something in common so they are just going to meet like minded people, no harm done like


  • #56
    Death and Taxes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,775 ✭✭✭Death and Taxes


    pmcmahon wrote: »
    a group organising congregations for the celebration of spiritual matter is in my view a church.

    A key requirement of any religion is a deity or deities, in the abscence of said deities one could hardly call this group a religion or church.


  • #57
    Adyx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,997 ✭✭✭Adyx


    orestes wrote: »
    The Church of Satan was founded as an anti-christian humanist institution, with all of the pseudo-religious terminology and ceremony used intentionally being opposite to christian teachings and traditions, in order to show that they were delibirerately setting themselves up as a counter-point to christianity (morally, culturally, idealistically, socially, politically, etc.). Even the name "Church of Satan" was an intentional polarisation, since the institution didn't worship the devil, but Satan as representative of the opposite and enemy of god. All terminology and symbolism, but conducive to the idea behind the establishment.

    An athiest church would essentially be doing the same thing, but instead of setting themselves up as contrary to a particular religion or church, it would be setting itself up as the counter-point to the entire concept of transcendantal deitie/s and what it represents (secular education, religious rights, tax exemption, institutional marriage, etc.). Rather than being passively humanist, an athiest church would be by definition actively contrary to religion.
    Exactly! If you have to join an organisation for atheists, then (in my opinion) you're over-thinking the whole thing. It's far too much effort. I decided 20 years ago when I was in primary school that I didn't need or want to believe in a god. In those 20 years not once have I felt the need to discuss atheism with like-minded individuals or reinforce my beliefs by reading books. I just don't see the point. It really has no bearing on my daily life so I don't even think about it. Nobody bothers me with their religion so I don't bother them. I avoid the A&A forum as much as I avoid the Christianity forum.

    There is another issue that I've mentioned it before here and that is the preachiness exhibited by some atheists which at times is as bad as evangelic Christians. Even if I wanted to, I don't think I could stand talking to other atheists like that.

    This is of course all my own opinion on the matter. What other people choose to do is their own business as long as they don't try to involve me.


  • #58
    Procasinator
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,311 ✭✭✭Procasinator


    Adyx wrote: »
    Exactly! If you have to join an organisation for atheists, then (in my opinion) you're over-thinking the whole thing. It's far too much effort. I decided 20 years ago when I was in primary school that I didn't need or want to believe in a god. In those 20 years not once have I felt the need to discuss atheism with like-minded individuals or reinforce my beliefs by reading books. I just don't see the point. It really has no bearing on my daily life so I don't even think about it. Nobody bothers me with their religion so I don't bother them. I avoid the A&A forum as much as I avoid the Christianity forum.

    There is another issue that I've mentioned it before here and that is the preachiness exhibited by some atheists which at times is as bad as evangelic Christians. Even if I wanted to, I don't think I could stand talking to other atheists like that.

    This is of course all my own opinion on the matter. What other people choose to do is their own business as long as they don't try to involve me.

    I suppose you could call yourself an apathetic atheist. It appears some people are enthusiastic atheists. :P

    Then, of course, you have antitheists.

    I would think this group are just a group of enthusiastic atheists.


  • #59
    Ruudi_Mentari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,801 ✭✭✭Ruudi_Mentari


    wobbles-grogan wrote: »

    So, a group of people whom have similar beliefs meet up regularly to discuss said beliefs.
    Ironic isnt it?

    very much.. Atheism is more dangerous than Catholicism

    I was agnostic for years like a thorn in the churchs side always questioning it til I dismissed it completely and made my own choices


  • #60
    Chuck Stone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,029 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    I don't trust anyone who'd make a sleepy child get out of his bed to go to a big cold room and listen to gobshites prattling on about shit.

    That's just cruel and unusual.


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  • #61
    Ruudi_Mentari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,801 ✭✭✭Ruudi_Mentari


    Thing with a cult like atheism, you don't wanna throw out the baby with the bathwater


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