A 56-year-old British woman has been sentenced to death in Indonesia for drugs

A Primal Nut · 22-01-2013 01:32PM

biko wrote: »

“I would never have become involved in something like this but the lives of my children were in danger and I felt I had to protect them.”

I don't get this part, how were the children in danger?

Probably she was blackmailed into being a drug mule...that's how it works.

I'm all for the death penalty for the drug barons, etc, but for the little dealers and drug mules...no way. It doesn't work, because the drug barons on top will always find desparate people who they can blackmail into bringing drugs across boarders. The focus needs to be them, not some 56-year old grandmother carrying the drugs because a gang threatened to kill her children otherwise (chances are her kids are addicts who owe money to a drug gang).

Dravokivich · 22-01-2013 01:33PM

Madam_X wrote: »

Why?

You were probably proofing your post when I mentioned:

"My comment about executing her myself was an off the cuff remark to demonstrate exhaustion from hearing and reading so many stories of this kind."

Above.

A Primal Nut · 22-01-2013 01:48PM

seamus wrote: »

I think you're misreading most people's posts.

It's possible to be pro-drugs, while at the same time calling someone an idiot for trying to smuggle drugs into a country notorious for its harsh anti-drugs penalties. I haven't seen many posts saying, "She's drug-smuggling scum and deserves to die", just a lot of people without much sympathy for her because her actions were monumentally dumb.

So a more intelligent person would have stayed at home and allow the drug dealers to kill her whole family?

Dravokivich · 22-01-2013 01:49PM

A Primal Nut wrote: »

So a more intelligent person would have stayed at home and allow the drug dealers to kill her whole family?

I don't think she's as much of a victim as she's portraying herself to be, even without the stuff Biggins posted.

bucketybuck · 22-01-2013 01:52PM

A Primal Nut wrote: »

So a more intelligent person would have stayed at home and allow the drug dealers to kill her whole family?

"Allow the drug dealers"?

All evidence seems to suggest that she was the drug dealer!!

Again, it suits a liberal viewpoint to portray her as the innocent victim in all of this, but that really does not seem to be the case.

seamus · 22-01-2013 01:55PM

A Primal Nut wrote: »

So a more intelligent person would have stayed at home and allow the drug dealers to kill her whole family?

A more intelligent person would have found alternatives like emigrating or involving the police.

"I had no other choice" in these instances usually means, "I was already completely up to my neck in illegal activities so couldn't run or go to the police".

A Primal Nut · 22-01-2013 01:56PM

bucketybuck wrote: »

"Allow the drug dealers"?

All evidence seems to suggest that she was the drug dealer!!

Again, it suits a liberal viewpoint to portray her as the innocent victim in all of this, but that really does not seem to be the case.

It would be very rare for a powerful drug dealer such as people think this woman is, to be a drug mule herself. Its easy for them to find people who owe them money, poor people, etc to do this stuff for them. Which suggests she falls into the latter category.

It looks like she was upto all kinds of nasty of stuff alright, but I don't doubt for a second that there is a lot more to this story.

old hippy · 22-01-2013 02:02PM

It's a harsh sentence. One wonders how desperate and/or greedy a person would have to be to attempt the crime?

I hope they retract the death penalty.

StinkyMunkey · 22-01-2013 02:08PM

I agree with the death penalty, but not for this type of crime.

I think they are making an example of her, but at the same time, I don't think she will be executed.

greenheart · 22-01-2013 02:35PM

seamus wrote: »

What?
I guarantee you it wouldn't. If the death penalty is so effective, then why are drugs so popular on the Indonesian party scene?

On the other hand if we start fining people €5k for any kind of drug possession and throwing them in jail for second and third offences, regardless of the quantity in possession, then the demand for drugs will hit the floor and the suppliers will move onto something else.

The demand for drugs will never go away, no matter what.
People know what it does, how much misery it causes but still choose to do it.

Killer Wench · 22-01-2013 02:44PM

So are they saying that she was blackmailed into going to Indonesia to pick up the drugs and fly back? Or, while on a random holiday in Indonesia, she was randomly selected by some drug cartel to mule drugs back to the UK and it was a coincidence that this woman happened to have a reputation of having rowdy nightly visitors back in her old hood?

greenheart · 22-01-2013 02:44PM

BraziliaNZ wrote: »

Yeah, we're aware of how stupid their laws are, and we're discussing them. I believe in rational and logical laws, this is why I am irked by this poor woman's plight. She's an idiot yes, but no one should be killed because of recreational drug handling.

Tbf I don't think what this woman had was for recreational use.

Ben D Bus · 22-01-2013 02:53PM

BraziliaNZ wrote: »

the bigger tragedy is a country willing to murder people over a bit of powder.

No.

This "bit of powder" would have wreaked havoc, destruction and potential death wherever it was destined for.

Whoever brings the weapon to the scene of the crime deserves anything they get for destroying lives.

kraggy · 22-01-2013 02:53PM

pickarooney wrote: »

Not one comment on her remark that she did it because her kids' lives were in danger?
Do we know any more about that or should we just ignore it and laugh and point a bit more?

This.

I CANNOT imagine a 56 year old grandmother sourcing 1.6m pounds worth of coke on her own to bring to Bali to make a fortune.

Nor can I imagine her agreeing to be a mule purely for money. I firmly believe that she was threatened into doing it.

Like pickarooney said, why has nobody mentioned it in the first 4 pages? Do people actually read about stuff before commenting anymore or does nobody believe her, at all?

kraggy · 22-01-2013 02:56PM

seamus wrote: »

A more intelligent person would have found alternatives like emigrating or involving the police.

"I had no other choice" in these instances usually means, "I was already completely up to my neck in illegal activities so couldn't run or go to the police".

You've too simple a view on this. It's all well and good to suggest that she should have gone to the police and report them, if indeed she was threatened. But what if someone is holding a knife to your throat saying that they know where you live and where your children live and if you don't agree to muling the drugs that you or they or both will have an "accident".

Even in our own country the father of a murder victim in Limerick had to be brought into witness protection eventually having to sell his business to the government and move abroad.

up for anything · 22-01-2013 02:57PM

hyperborean wrote: »

She stashed a bag (big as it was) of cocaine and tried to get it past customs. Hardly a fucking hanging offense now?

BraziliaNZ wrote: »

She's an idiot yes, but no one should be killed because of recreational drug handling.

Is Cocaine regarded as a recreational/light drug these days? I knew someone with a Cocaine addiction. It destroyed his life and affected the people closest to him. But sure when you take that first snort of a recreational drug you don't think about the day that you might end up drinking after shave, because you can't afford any other kind of alcohol, in order to keep your buzz going.

Hank Scorpio · 22-01-2013 03:01PM

that's the risk you take

col.in.Cr · 22-01-2013 03:01PM

up for anything wrote: »

Is Cocaine regarded as a recreational/light drug these days? I knew someone with a Cocaine addiction. It destroyed his life and affected the people closest to him. But sure when you take that first snort of a recreational drug you don't think about the day that you might end up drinking after shave, because you can't afford any other kind of alcohol, in order to keep your buzz going.

Drinking after shave?
Have you been to lidl?

folan · 22-01-2013 03:03PM

kraggy wrote: »

This.

I CANNOT imagine a 56 year old grandmother sourcing 1.6m pounds worth of coke on her own to bring to Bali to make a fortune.

Nor can I imagine her agreeing to be a mule purely for money. I firmly believe that she was threatened into doing it.

Like pickarooney said, why has nobody mentioned it in the first 4 pages? Do people actually read about stuff before commenting anymore or does nobody believe her, at all?

as ive pointed out before, her son said:

In another statement read out in court, her son Eliot said he believed his mother was forced into trafficking after a disagreement over rent money she paid on his behalf.

there have been no other details. the step from disagreements over rent paid and smuggling 10 lbs of illegal drugs to a nation with the death penalty is pretty big.

Bad Santa · 22-01-2013 03:04PM

*Lifts wooly jumper and presses nipple against glass*

I'm here for you Lindsay! Oooooh God help us.

kraggy · 22-01-2013 03:05PM

up for anything wrote: »

Is Cocaine regarded as a recreational/light drug these days? I knew someone with a Cocaine addiction. It destroyed his life and affected the people closest to him. But sure when you take that first snort of a recreational drug you don't think about the day that you might end up drinking after shave, because you can't afford any other kind of alcohol, in order to keep your buzz going.

He said recreational. Not light.

And what the hell has drinking aftershave due to lack of alcohol got to do with cocaine?

Are you a Joe Duffy caller by any chance?

Itwasntme. · 22-01-2013 03:08PM

BraziliaNZ wrote: »

People do it knowing the consequences, which is tragic in itself, but the bigger tragedy is a country willing to murder people over a bit of powder. It's a case of dumb and dumber. Personally I don't think any crime justifies the death sentence, certainly not drug related.

I agree with you for the most part- no crime justifies the death sentence but it's not just 'a bit of powder'. The drug trade is the cause of a lot of death and misery so while she may not have personally murdered anyone, by participating in the trade, she is an accessory to the loss of life and livelihoods associated with it.

kraggy · 22-01-2013 03:08PM

folan wrote: »

as ive pointed out before, her son said:

there have been no other details. the step from disagreements over rent paid and smuggling 10 lbs of illegal drugs to a nation with the death penalty is pretty big.

Maybe big, maybe not so big. There probably a link between the landlord and drug guy, maybe they're even the same person.

What's unequivocal is that she did a stupid thing out of desparation. She doesn't deserve to die.

And bollocks to anyone who says we've no right to judge on another country's laws. Besides the fact that the death penalty is morally wrong and barbaric, as a system, it doesn't work.

MaxSteele · 22-01-2013 03:09PM

"Drugs destroy lives". :rolleyes:

No people destroy they're own lives quite willfully by the looks of it.

Drug dealers and smugglers are simply middle men cashing in on a very lucrative trade. And why not ? No one is being forced into a junkie lifestyle. I say fair play to anyone who can cash in and make their millions without being caught. You think the likes of Christy Kinahan gives two squirts of piss about our moral opinion on it ? There's probably a few posters here who've snorted his stuff.

A bit of personal responsibility maybe, instead of the tap dancing around poor drug abusers and they're self-inflicted habits. Again, where there is demand, there is a supplier. It's just a trade in an illegal commodity. No one deserves to spend half their life behind bars for it, never mind paying for it with their life. Drugs are becoming legislated across the world right now. Even the south americans are considering it.

And actually yes .... it is just powder. It's up to the user about how they want to treat it.

Biggins · 22-01-2013 03:11PM

kraggy wrote: »

This.

I CANNOT imagine a 56 year old grandmother sourcing 1.6m pounds worth of coke on her own to bring to Bali to make a fortune.

Nor can I imagine her agreeing to be a mule purely for money. I firmly believe that she was threatened into doing it.

Like pickarooney said, why has nobody mentioned it in the first 4 pages? Do people actually read about stuff before commenting anymore or does nobody believe her, at all?

I don't believe it for one second.

She repeatedly over years brought drugs in to the country, got known and built up a reputation amid other importers for the business she too was in.
She operated on a level so much that she then later (to try and save her own neck) was not able just to grass on small guys but was able to grass on the big people in the business.

Is this ability of an innocent person or even a beginner/amateur?

irishconvert · 22-01-2013 03:21PM

MaxSteele wrote: »

"Drugs destroy lives". :rolleyes:

No people destroy they're own lives quite willfully by the looks of it.

Drug dealers and smugglers are simply middle men cashing in on a very lucrative trade. And why not ? No one is being forced into a junkie lifestyle. I say fair play to anyone who can cash in and make their millions without being caught. You think the likes of Christy Kinahan gives two squirts of piss about our moral opinion on it ? There's probably a few posters here who've snorted his stuff.

A bit of personal responsibility maybe, instead of the tap dancing around poor drug abusers and they're self-inflicted habits. Again, where there is demand, there is a supplier. It's just a trade in an illegal commodity. No one deserves to spend half their life behind bars for it, never mind paying for it with their life. Drugs are becoming legislated across the world right now. Even the south americans are considering it.

And actually yes .... it is just powder. It's up to the user about how they want to treat it.

And where there are class A drugs there is serious crime, innocent people assaulted, sometimes murdered, children suffering appalling neglect by their drug addicted parents. By allowing dangerous class A drugs in our society YOU are responsible for allowing these crimes to occur. Are YOU willing to take responsibility for allowing this terrible affliction on our society?

Honestly, I haven't seen such an idiotic stupid post on boards in a very long time.

irishconvert · 22-01-2013 03:24PM

Madam_X wrote: »

Re the rest of what you say: really depends on the drug, the quantity, the circumstances of those who will be buying it. E.g. hash ain't heroin.

T

That is why I clearly said Class A drugs.

Biggins · 22-01-2013 03:31PM

xwave7000 wrote: »

Hearsay and hokum - how do you know these neighbours simply didn't have an agenda against the woman? You don't. Just as I don't know if she was a scumbag. That's third hand information you're using to back up your allegations by the way....:rolleyes:

Yea, of course, again the woman was innocent and her sons (not kids who have not had knives held to their throats) who were busy themselves going around assaulting people (and thus got sent to prison for it) were all entirely innocent to boot!

I seriously don't think a whole estate and a town council decided one day to "have it in for her".
You don't know that they do indeed have an agenda, do you?
To think that everyone got together and decided to pick on anyone, never mind a supposedly aged woman for the hell of it (even if they did!), would be the height of stupidity.

BillyMitchel · 22-01-2013 03:35PM

4.5kg of Coke?? Serious amount, it's not like it was a little bag for herself on a Saturday night.

I think people have to be really focking stupid to do think they'd get away with smuggling a class A drug in their suitcase and expect to get away with it, especially if you could end up paying with your life.

Mess up in these countries and you will end up paying severely for it.

MaxSteele · 22-01-2013 03:36PM

irishconvert wrote: »

And where there are class A drugs there is serious crime, innocent people assaulted, sometimes murdered, children suffering appalling neglect by their drug addicted parents. By allowing dangerous class A drugs in our society YOU are responsible for allowing these crimes to occur. Are YOU willing to take responsibility for allowing this terrible affliction on our society?

Honestly, I haven't seen such an idiotic stupid post on boards in a very long time.

Mod: Islam. No fcuking wonder. Chop there good hand off for stealing a loaf of bread eh ?

These crimes exist regardless of drugs. Complete hysterical bollox by the way. The same could be argued for alcohol, prescription drugs like Xanax etc. And how do you know all neglected children suffer this due to drugs ?

Same argument could be applied to me fuelling O'Briens off licence chain. You know, because me buying a bottle of Huzzar vodka directly impacts victims of crimes committed by raging alcoholics ? who might hypothetically be neglecting their children ?

It's all down to personal responsibility and abuse. Majority of alcohol and drug users do so recreationally.

There's a reason we have courts of law buddy, so those who commit these crimes are tried and punished. Being under the influence isn't a mitigating circumstance most of the time either. So no, I don't allow neglect of children and I'm certainly not responsible for a junkies personal criminal behaviour.

A 56-year-old British woman has been sentenced to death in Indonesia for drugs

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