Was Stalin worse than Hitler?

dd972 · 10-01-2013 12:09PM #1

Created Famines in the USSR that wiped out 5-10 million people, equally brutal with opponents and underlings, the fact that he wasn't prone to the follys of Hitler and died in his sleep of old age somehow makes him worse, I think so anyway, at least AH got his comeuppance.

Death and Taxes · 10-01-2013 12:10PM

dd972 wrote: »

Created Famines in the USSR that wiped out 5-10 million people, equally brutal with opponents and underlings, the fact that he wasn't prone to the follys of Hitler and died in his sleep of old age somehow makes him worse, I think so anyway, at least AH got his comeuppance.

They were both batsards!
Statistically, he (Stalin) was responsible for more deaths I think.

Amirani · 10-01-2013 12:11PM

Probably yes.

Zebra3 · 10-01-2013 12:11PM

Probably better at chess.

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar · 10-01-2013 12:12PM

hitler did his **** in western europe so he's automatically more evil, stalin was more eastern europe and russia.. really, who cares

kfallon · 10-01-2013 12:13PM

Zebra3 wrote: »

Probably better at chess.

And betting......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctewgQcAeNc

Where To · 10-01-2013 12:13PM

Stalin was a better totalitarian.

Franticfrank · 10-01-2013 12:13PM

They weren't so bad, they never played jungle music at 4:00 in the morning.

sbsquarepants · 10-01-2013 12:14PM

Ah, sure the were both little divils to be honest:D

Lad Of Banter · 10-01-2013 12:16PM

Two peas in a pod

LiamMc · 10-01-2013 12:17PM

I don't eat in Mao Tse Tung restaurants neither.
http://www.cafemao.com/restaurant/

touts · 10-01-2013 12:33PM

Without a doubt the extremists on both the Right and the Left were some of the most evil bastards that ever existed. However the media in Ireland tends to be Left wing so the genocide of socialists is somewhat ignored or excused. Hence we don't bat an eyelid at having a Minister (Quinn) with a beard and hair style to pay homage to his hero Lenin or a President who speaks fondly of the writings of Marx. Could you imagine the uproar if Enda Kenny donned a Hitler tash or if Leo Varadkar cited the organisational skills of Mussolini as inspiration for his reorg of CIE.

Death and Taxes · 10-01-2013 12:36PM

touts wrote: »

Without a doubt the extremists on both the Right and the Left were some of the most evil bastards that ever existed. However the media in Ireland tends to be Left wing so the genocide of socialists is somewhat ignored or excused. Hence we don't bat an eyelid at having a Minister (Quinn) with a beard and hair style to pay homage to his hero Lenin or a President who speaks fondly of the writings of Marx. Could you imagine the uproar if Enda Kenny donned a Hitler tash or if Leo Varadkar cited the organisational skills of Mussolini as inspiration for his reorg of CIE.

Whatdafuq did Marx do? , far as I know he neither killed anyone nor did he advocate it!

Where To · 10-01-2013 12:38PM

WileyCoyote wrote: »

Whatdafuq did Marx do? , far as I know he neither killed anyone nor did he advocate it!

Have you not seen Duck Soup?

Lenin Skynard · 10-01-2013 12:40PM

touts wrote: »

Without a doubt the extremists on both the Right and the Left were some of the most evil bastards that ever existed. However the media in Ireland tends to be Left wing so the genocide of socialists is somewhat ignored or excused. Hence we don't bat an eyelid at having a Minister (Quinn) with a beard and hair style to pay homage to his hero Lenin or a President who speaks fondly of the writings of Marx. Could you imagine the uproar if Enda Kenny donned a Hitler tash or if Leo Varadkar cited the organisational skills of Mussolini as inspiration for his reorg of CIE.

Enda Kenny has a similar hairstyle to Ted Bundy. This wouldn't be allowed if we didn't have such a left wing media!

Madam_X · 10-01-2013 12:41PM

touts wrote: »

the media in Ireland tends to be Left wing so the genocide of socialists is somewhat ignored or excused.

Genocide by extreme communists is not ignored or excused.

Hence we don't bat an eyelid at having a Minister (Quinn) with a beard and hair style to pay homage to his hero Lenin or a President who speaks fondly of the writings of Marx. Could you imagine the uproar if Enda Kenny donned a Hitler tash or if Leo Varadkar cited the organisational skills of Mussolini as inspiration for his reorg of CIE.

Marx/Lenin were not genocidal dictators, so you're not comparing like with like. I know their views inspired genocidal dictators but that was not their intention, and many of the points they made about inequality were valid. If Quinn imitated the Stalin look or voiced an admiration for Chairman Mao, then there would be uproar.

I always find this debate strange - they were as bad as each other, if sometimes in different ways. I do find the question always brings a "The left ignore communist mass murder" commentary out of the woodwork, as above - I suspect to have a go at... oh noez... people with socialist (fairness and equality) ideals. That is not the same as admiring a brutal communist regime like North Korea/China under Mao/the Soviet Union under Stalin.

Btw, Quinn doesn't have much of a "hairstyle"

and big swing, he has a beard. You'd swear both were so remarkable and unusual. :pac:

bullpost · 10-01-2013 12:42PM

Simple difference - Stalin did not discriminate whereas Hitler did. So Hitler badder!

Ray Palmer · 10-01-2013 01:10PM

If wasn't for Stalin Hitler would have won.

Where To · 10-01-2013 01:23PM

bullpost wrote: »

Simple difference - Stalin did not discriminate whereas Hitler did. So Hitler badder!

Try telling that to the Kulaks.

LuckyLloyd · 10-01-2013 01:37PM

Ray Palmer wrote: »

If wasn't for Stalin Hitler would have won.

I think (with maybe one or two arguable exceptions) every Russian ruling setup since Peter the Great would have repelled the German (or any) foreign invasion.

Scanlas The 2nd · 10-01-2013 01:37PM

Madam_X wrote: »

Genocide by extreme communists is not ignored or excused.

Marx/Lenin were not genocidal dictators, so you're not comparing like with like. I know their views inspired genocidal dictators but that was not their intention, and many of the points they made about inequality were valid. If Quinn imitated the Stalin look or voiced an admiration for Chairman Mao, then there would be uproar.

I always find this debate strange - they were as bad as each other, if sometimes in different ways. I do find the question always brings a "The left ignore communist mass murder" commentary out of the woodwork, as above - I suspect to have a go at... oh noez... people with socialist (fairness and equality) ideals. That is not the same as admiring a brutal communist regime like North Korea/China under Mao/the Soviet Union under Stalin.

Socialism isn't about fairness and equality. It's about the redistribution of wealth. That's unfair and unequal.

Ghandee · 10-01-2013 01:37PM

Great bunch of lads, the pair of em. :cool:

Duggy747 · 10-01-2013 01:56PM

Hitler looked like a Bond villain, Stalin looked like an evil Mario.

Rented Mule · 10-01-2013 01:59PM

Where To wrote: »

Have you not seen Duck Soup?

Hail Freedonia !!

Brussels Sprout · 10-01-2013 02:03PM

Stalin was a bigger monster in my opinion. Nobody was safe in his sphere. In fact the people who were closest to him were often the ones who suffered most. He murdered countless generals out of sheer paranoia and his own wife even committed suicide.

anncoates · 10-01-2013 02:04PM

Stalin didn't inspire numerous generations of hipsters with parted hair, pencil taches and khaki shirts so no.

starskey77 · 10-01-2013 02:13PM

Neither of the boys were without fault, but what has changed in europe
Germany top dog we need a hard right wing goverment not this bunch
of nobodys useless heads below radar chancers. stalin was worse hitler was
right in sum of his outlooks not all though

anncoates · 10-01-2013 02:16PM

starskey77 wrote: »

Neither of the boys were without fault

I always admire an understated analysis.

flutterflye · 10-01-2013 02:17PM

Define "worse" in this context.

Leftist · 10-01-2013 02:22PM

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

Socialism isn't about fairness and equality. It's about the redistribution of wealth. That's unfair and unequal.

SafeSurfer · 10-01-2013 02:32PM

Brussels Sprout wrote: »

Stalin was a bigger monster in my opinion. Nobody was safe in his sphere. In fact the people who were closest to him were often the ones who suffered most. He murdered countless generals out of sheer paranoia and his own wife even committed suicide.

And when he visited his son in hospital after he attempted suicide he berated him for being a bad shot.

The victors write history. The only difference between Nazi Germany and the USSR is that the USSR were on the side that won. Even 60 years after the war academic study of Nazi Germany is a controversial area, and I'm not just talking about the holocaust. The activities of the German einsatzgruppen in the east are well documented, as are the murder and starvation of countless numbers of Russian POWs. There is little attention paid to Soviet atrocities committed as early as their invasion of Poland, 16 days after the Nazis or of the murder and starvation of German POWs and their detention until the mid to late 1950's.

Both dictators used slave labour, killed millions of civilians, including their own people. Perhaps the only difference is that the Germans committed their genocide on a more organised, industrial scale in gas chambers while the soviets allowed famine, disease, forced winter marches and mass shootings to dispatch the people they wished to exterminate.

Was Stalin worse than Hitler?

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