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Church bashing in AH

24567…10

Comments

  • #32
    publicious
    Site Banned Posts: 131 ✭✭publicious


    ShooterSF wrote: »
    What bigotry? My position on the RCC is based on their actions. I had no biases before hand. As for hatred, that is the perfect emotion one employs when discussing an organisation whose members raped children, covered it up and continue to look to place the blame elsewhere. Should I not hate such an organisation?

    You're not free to hate individuals on the basis of their religion. We have incitement to hatred laws in this country.


  • #33
    ShooterSF
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,822 ✭✭✭ShooterSF


    publicious wrote: »
    You're not free to hate individuals on the basis of their religion. We have incitement to hatred laws in this country.

    First I'm allowed hate who ever I want. Incitement laws don't make it illegal for me to hate say the old lady down the road who tried to have my dog killed. Second I don't hate *most* people who would describe themselves as Catholic but I do hate the Church. You know the one that facilitated child rape. Like I hate Fianna Fail (not as much) but I don't hate everyone that supports them.


  • #34
    eyescreamcone
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,562 ✭✭✭eyescreamcone


    publicious wrote: »

    So what institute educated you?

    Does it take a PhD to get into negative equity with multiple failed investment properties?

    I suppose you expect me to bail you out too?

    :)
    Way off topic but I'll go there if you like.
    I have qualifications from 3 universities - at home and abroad.

    As for any debts I have. I am presently paying off all my mortgages and am not in arrears to anyone :)

    Unlike the RCC, who still owe this county millions for raping and abusing children of this state.


  • #35
    eyescreamcone
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,562 ✭✭✭eyescreamcone


    Also, in my opinion anybody who backs up the church in any way is helping to cover up their crimes of child rape.

    So you know what I think of you!


  • #36
    endacl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,443 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    eyescreamcone wrote: »
    Also, in my opinion anybody who backs up the church in any way is helping to cover up their crimes of child rape.

    So you know what I think of you!
    +1


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  • #37
    Kold
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,778 ✭✭✭✭Kold


    YEAH! AH used to be something! Used to stand for something more than this! AH is better than this guys...

    Oh wait, no. I'm thinking of something else.


  • #38
    megafan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 410 ✭✭megafan


    [QUOTE=Mammanabammana;82361895 If you want to have a go at the church, start a thread about it, find another forum...

    But stop hijacking my enjoyment of AH with your church bashing. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm not saying stop doing it, I'm not saying ignore your convictions...
    [/QUOTE]



    After Hours is what it is (surely the name AH says it all) & maybe more than other forums would have a better mix of users views than most others.... if the Church is getting bashed it's for good reason & brought on by none other than it's own managment.... BOARDS.ie have loads of Forums in which users can hide from the real world with discussions from their own types.... & maybe the likes of me will dip in with a comment occasionaly to another Forum with my view of others world & be slated by all on that forum (what would I know about farming?) But if you want a good view of the real world AH is it! (might be irreverent at times but what do you expect with a title like After Hours)

    ;)


  • #39
    TwoShedsJackson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,438 ✭✭✭TwoShedsJackson


    B.A._Baracus wrote: »
    I belive in god. I do not believe in the church however. I view it as a 'business'.

    But what I don't like is someone using any excuse to show how atheist they are and slag people of faith. Like there is slagging the chruch, as they have ALOT to answer for :mad:, then there is using that as a means to poke fun of peoples beliefs.

    Someone's religious beliefs are not entitled to any special respect, nor are they above being questioned or satirised, simply because those beliefs are religious in nature.


  • #40
    efb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 35,514 ✭✭✭✭efb


    publicious wrote: »
    I'm not looking for excuses. I'm looking for civility on AH. The bigoted anti-Catholic vitriol is out of control.

    When it comes to Jewish threads, everyone's all hip and cool and tolerant.

    Disagree with the doctrines of the church and highlight wrong-doings all ye like, but please don't try to infest the site with bigoted, anti-Catholic vitriol.

    Bigoted - The RCC is the bigoted one.


  • #41
    9959
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭9959


    TwoShedsJackson wrote: »
    Someone's religious beliefs are not entitled to any special respect, nor are they above being questioned or satirised, simply because those beliefs are religious in nature.

    Agreed.
    Satire and ridicule are probably the best weapons to deploy against theistic gobbledygook and religious cant.
    Monty Python's 'Life of Brian' being an excellent example.


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  • #42
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 3,251 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Tried to say this last year. Was told to get bent by AHers and got a shoulder shrug & "take it or leave it" from mods

    Only one thing really....


  • #43
    Chuck Stone
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,029 ✭✭✭✭Chuck Stone


    publicious wrote: »
    When it comes to Jewish threads, everyone's all hip and cool and tolerant.

    AH was asking 'do you know any Jewish people' not 'what do you think of organised institutional Judaism'. Also, the last time I checked, In Ireland, organised Judaism had no appalling institutional dysfunction that led to wide scale abuse of minors.

    Further, you'll find plenty of threads on here that criticise in no uncertain terms the practice of genital mutilation which Jews partake in.

    If you want to start a thread about the Jewish religion then fire away - nobody is stopping you.


  • #44
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    Mammanabammana wrote: »
    Is it just me? Or is anybody else starting to get tired of seeing thread after thread hijacked by people who can't wait to stick the boot into the church (specifically RC, although there may be others)...it's now getting to a point where I sit reading threads, waiting for somebody to grab any excuse at all to have a go at the church. Now, don't get me wrong, I'm not a church advocate or defender at all, and I'm, as much as anybody else, sickened by the behaviour of the church, not only in Ireland but worldwide. (They're starting to throw their weight around in the Philippines now because of a new government ruling that family planning - as in contraception - should be state funded and properly provided and the hypocrisy is frankly disgusting).

    But it's getting to a point where I seem to be constantly reading threads and then suddenly, out of nowhere, a complete non seqitur pops up just for somebody to have a go at the church and for no other reason. Why bother? What's the point? If you want to have a go at the church, start a thread about it, find another forum...

    But stop hijacking my enjoyment of AH with your church bashing. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm not saying stop doing it, I'm not saying ignore your convictions...

    I'm just saying, find a proper place to talk about it if it pisses you off THAT much, and stop throwing it in my face over and over again!

    I disagree with you OP for a number of reasons:

    1) I think criticism of how the Roman Catholic Church handled child abuse for example is completely welcome. These actions were clearly against Christian teaching.

    2) I think legitimate discussion shouldn't be stifled on boards.ie. I disagree with discussions being ended just because they offend people.

    3) I welcome debate on the subject of Christianity. I'd rather see this than people fob off the subject completely. Rather what we have is a forceful debate on either side if both are willing to listen. I do see a lot of ignorance and lies spouted about Christianity here, but at least it gives me and others the opportunity to stand up and discuss.

    4) If you get "pissed off" by what you read in After Hours, I'd suggest taking a long walk or something and then come to the conclusion that it's the internet. In reality people are going be far more bullish in their argumentation than in real life.

    5) Most people on boards.ie to be honest are atheists. This means that it's going to be inevitable that you're going to get this kind of discussion. Irrespective of how much I disagree with them I think it's fundamentally wrong to tell people to stop telling the truth about what they think in order to make you feel better.


  • #45
    Cee-Jay-Cee
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,234 ✭✭✭✭Cee-Jay-Cee


    Down with this sort of thing.


    Careful now.


  • #46
    alph
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 145 ✭✭alph


    dodderangler wrote: »
    If church was really like this?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=beN7FftWNCM&feature=youtube_gdata_player

    Reminds me of a situation i found myself in while christmas shopping


  • #47
    tallaghtmick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,724 ✭✭✭tallaghtmick


    eyescreamcone wrote: »
    I am an Irish passport holder.
    However, if I decided to ever give up my passport I wouldn't qualify for another country's. I was born here and pay tax here so I'm well entitled to carry a passport.

    As for my education - you'd need a PhD to trump me.



    The RCC has no relevance today.
    They are anti woman
    Anti gay
    Anti health (contraception)
    Anti divorce
    Anti abortion
    They raped our children and covered up their deeds.
    Not to mention the fact that their whole basis for existence is a pack of lies.

    So I make no excuses for coming onto the odd thread and putting the boot in to them. They well desrve it.

    Did you go back in time and have kids in the 40's:pac:


  • #48
    newmug
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,571 ✭✭✭newmug


    ShooterSF wrote: »
    What bigotry? My position on the RCC is based on their actions. I had no biases before hand. As for hatred, that is the perfect emotion one employs when discussing an organisation whose members raped children, covered it up and continue to look to place the blame elsewhere. Should I not hate such an organisation?
    eyescreamcone wrote: »
    Also, in my opinion anybody who backs up the church in any way is helping to cover up their crimes of child rape.

    So you know what I think of you!


    I am a Catholic. I never raped anyone. I never facilitated the rape of anyone. Of the 2 billion or so of us, I've only heard of a handful of rapists who do not represent me or my views, hiding among our ranks. I didnt cover up for them or keep their deeds a secret, I only heard about their un-Catholic, un-Christian acts at the same time as everyone else. I am as repulsed as you, and I wish the government would administer justice to these people.

    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=71742892&postcount=18


    @ OP, I think we should go on the offensive. Every time a good thread gets side-tracked by some random Church bashing, we should highlight the ridiculousness of that by other random off-topic nonsense, eg. start a conversation about classic cars or best flavours of Tayto.


  • #49
    Randy Anders
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 219 ✭✭Randy Anders


    The irony in all of this is that a very high percentage of posters who bitch and moan about religion and all it's wrong doings will end up, or already have ended up, sending their kids to a religious school where prayers and visits from priests are common place. It's absolute hypocrisy

    I personally do not believe the church should have any role whatsoever in the running of public schools but I know for a fact that when my children are old enough to be enrolled in a particular school, they will be attending a secular institution

    I'm completely fed up of people saying ''oh but the best schools in my area are catholic schools so I'll send Johnny there'' and then listening to them bitch on the net or radio about how religion has a stranglehold on society. If people acted on their beliefs and stopped sending their kids to these religious schools, it wouldn't be long before the church started to disappear into oblivion


  • #50
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    tallaghtmick wrote: »
    Did you go back in time and have kids in the 40's:pac:

    The reports indicate that it went on right through the 1990's. I think we need to be careful before making comments like this. We don't know who else is reading, or posting on this thread. Flippant comments like this aren't helpful to anyone.
    Randy Anders wrote: »
    The irony in all of this is that a very high percentage of posters who bitch and moan about religion and all it's wrong doings will end up, or already have ended up, sending their kids to a religious school where prayers and visits from priests are common place. It's absolute hypocrisy

    I personally do not believe the church should have any role whatsoever in the running of public schools but I know for a fact that when my children are old enough to be enrolled in a particular school, they will be attending a secular institution

    I'm completely fed up of people syaing ''oh but the best schools in my area are catholic schools so I'll send Johnny there'' and then listening to them bitch on the net or radio about how religion has a stranglehold on society. If people acted on their beliefs and stopped sending their kids to these religious schools, it wouldn't be long before the church started to disappear into oblivion

    There's not a great alternative in this State for parents who want a secular education. Many people in Ireland send their kids to a faith school just because there is no other alternative.

    I don't agree with getting rid of all faith schools, but I do think there should be more secular choice, and I think there should be less faith schools. That way Catholic schools will be attended by Catholics and will have the freedom to take that ethos more seriously while others in the State have the choice to send their children to a secular school, Church of Ireland schools and so on.

    For example, baptism as a criteria for entering into schools is unhelpful. It makes parents who don't believe in the value of ritual engage in it for expedience. In my class in school there were a number of kids whose parents were Pentecostal / non-denominational who didn't baptise their kids as infants who were restricted in their choice of school as a result.


  • #51
    TwoShedsJackson
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,438 ✭✭✭TwoShedsJackson


    Randy Anders wrote: »
    The irony in all of this is that a very high percentage of posters who bitch and moan about religion and all it's wrong doings will end up, or already have ended up, sending their kids to a religious school where prayers and visits from priests are common place. It's absolute hypocrisy

    I personally do not believe the church should have any role whatsoever in the running of public schools but I know for a fact that when my children are old enough to be enrolled in a particular school, they will be attending a secular institution

    I'm completely fed up of people saying ''oh but the best schools in my area are catholic schools so I'll send Johnny there'' and then listening to them bitch on the net or radio about how religion has a stranglehold on society. If people acted on their beliefs and stopped sending their kids to these religious schools, it wouldn't be long before the church started to disappear into oblivion

    For sure some people are entirely hypocritical on this point, however for many others there is a severe lack of options. 92% of the schools in this country are of a Catholic 'ethos', and once you get outside Dublin etc., the chances of having a non-denominational school anywhere within a reasonable driving distance are low to non-existent.


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  • #52
    Birroc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,070 ✭✭✭Birroc


    Organised religions are a scourge on society. I feel it is my duty to expose them at any opportunity given what they have done for hundreds of years.
    And the Roman Catholic Church is probably the worst of the lot.


  • #53
    Birroc
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,070 ✭✭✭Birroc


    philologos wrote: »
    The...

    Philologos, I see you are still on the run from Nosferatu - he will find you and expose you!! :D


  • #54
    tallaghtmick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,724 ✭✭✭tallaghtmick


    philologos wrote: »
    The reports indicate that it went on right through the 1990's. I think we need to be careful before making comments like this. We don't know who else is reading, or posting on this thread. Flippant comments like this aren't helpful to anyone.

    Its AH,if they expect people not to make jokes they are going to get offended.

    In before the ****storm,I have not and will not make a joke about the abuse,my above post was tongue in cheek.


  • #55
    tallaghtmick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,724 ✭✭✭tallaghtmick


    Birroc wrote: »
    Organised religions are a scourge on society. I feel it is my duty to expose them at any opportunity given what they have done for hundreds of years.
    And the Roman Catholic Church is probably the worst of the lot.

    HMMM yes because Islamic run countries are awesome to live in:P


  • #56
    padd b1975
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,910 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    Birroc wrote: »
    Organised religions are a scourge on society. I feel it is my duty to expose them at any opportunity given what they have done for hundreds of years.
    And the Roman Catholic Church is probably the worst of the lot.
    What have you done to expose them, apart from wind bagging on a random internet forum?


  • #57
    padd b1975
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,910 ✭✭✭✭padd b1975


    philologos wrote: »
    The reports indicate that it went on right through the 1990's. I think we need to be careful before making comments like this. We don't know who else is reading, or posting on this thread. Flippant comments like this aren't helpful to anyone.
    Pick any decade you like and you will find that over 90% of abused children were abused by close members of their own families.
    Thats the real disgrace, a family unit is supposed to be the safest place possible for a child to excist.

    Not so.


  • #58
    Grayson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,442 ✭✭✭✭Grayson


    B.A._Baracus wrote: »
    I belive in god. I do not believe in the church however. I view it as a 'business'.

    But what I don't like is someone using any excuse to show how atheist they are and slag people of faith. Like there is slagging the chruch, as they have ALOT to answer for :mad:, then there is using that as a means to poke fun of peoples beliefs.

    I used to be like you until recently. I disliked athiests as much as bible bashers. To be honest I still don't like dawkins, I think he's a bit smug, and I don't think I'll ever like hitchens.

    I had a very catholic upbringing in rural ireland. The kind of upbringing that you can see satirised when you watch father ted. Unfortunately there are times when that program was a bit too accurate.

    Recently I've swung the other way. The reason is because I've finally realised that religion, all of it, is a load of hokum. I used be be far more tolerant and think that if people wanted to believe something, i should let them.

    But recently I see all the harm that even mild religion can do. Fair enough, most people even believers would say that extreamists are stupid (yet still think that their own beliefs are perfectly rational), but their beliefs still affect others. If you look at recent history and we see what influence the church has had in the failure to legislate on the X case. In africa they tell people with AIDs that condoms are ineffective.

    And yet their congregations in the first world are ok with this. And even if they weren't, they couldn't do anything because the church doesn't change. They are 100% right on everything. So they don't care if people die because of their preachings because it's better to be right than save people. Even when it came to the laundries and the child abuse scandal, it was better to appear right than to help people.

    And that's before we get into the sillyness of believing that a book that is thousands of years old is perfectly right. That there's no mistranslations or that it might have been written by a load of superstitious goat herds. Modern catholics might have dumped the book of leviticus, but remember that everyone in the new testament followed it. They all believed that if a woman had her period that she was unclean and shouldn't be touched. They were immensly superstitious, yet their delusional rambling are taken as gospel truth. See, even the word is used to describe something that is beyond reproach.

    And we haven't even mentioned all the other religions yet. The only reason 99% of people are christian is because they were raised that way. If they had have been raised a different religion they would believe that that one is the true one. It's completly arbitary. They have no trouble saying that Jesus is the son of god etc... yet at the same time saying Mohammad/Budda/Zosater/Moses/etc... was wrong and those people are in fact just plain superstitious.

    So pretty much religions are groups that get children and brainwash them into believing in whatever mystical figure they happen to believe in. They tell them over and over again until it's ingrained. If they waited until people were adults before telling them all about their (and other religions) and then attempt to get someone to sign up whilst making an informed choice, they'd be laughed at. And those children will grow up and be happy little foot soldiers, denying women their rights and happilly hating any minority that happens to be around.

    And that's why I dislike religion.


  • #59
    super_furry
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,387 ✭✭✭✭super_furry


    People are angry at the Catholic church because of their history of raping and abusing children, covering it up, attempting to frustrate investigations into it and then preaching to adults about their sexuality, telling them they're evil for being in loving and stable relationships.

    This anger is reflected on this forum and in many other facets of Irish life.


  • #60
    Real Life
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 942 ✭✭✭Real Life


    the roman catholic church is an evil organisation spreading hate (this goes for pretty much all organised religions actually)
    they dont deserve respect


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  • #61
    philologos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,479 ✭✭✭✭philologos


    padd b1975 wrote: »
    Pick any decade you like and you will find that over 90% of abused children were abused by close members of their own families.
    Thats the real disgrace, a family unit is supposed to be the safest place possible for a child to excist.

    Not so.

    I never said that people weren't abused by their own families. Some were abused by the State. This is completely wrong, and horrific, and equally worthy for our condemnation.

    I think for a lot of people though, it is difficult to underestimate the pain that is involved in people claiming to be the representatives of Jesus Christ being involved in such horrific child abuse. I can understand firmly why many people will never walk into a church again, and I find it deeply regrettable considering that these actions have so little to do with the actual Gospel.

    By the by, I'm a Christian, I have to say though that a lot of the criticism concerning the Roman Catholic Church particularly in how it handled child abuse is completely just. I have to say, if this happened in my own church community, I think I would have to leave it and look elsewhere.


This discussion has been closed.
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