Loyalist mobs attacking Alliance Party offices and homes.

glenkeeran · 11-12-2012 07:45AM

Just after seeing a report that the Belfast council and British government are meeting today regarding this issue. My only fear is that they reverse their decision as i believe that all hell would break loose.

"Theres only one thing to resolve theses issues, Ban all parades on both sides, ban all flags only the flag of Northern Ireland to be allowed" Both of these are just an ignition to the dynamite!

gallag · 11-12-2012 09:56AM

As a taxi driver these scum bags are taking my children's presents from under the tree, what a stressful week at work, I just wish some of the people posting in here showed the same outrage when the other side do it I.e dropping a breeze block on a woman cops head at the ardoyne riots only a few months ago. I checked a few people's post history and they did not care so much then????

Leftist · 11-12-2012 09:58AM

gallag wrote: »

As a taxi driver these scam bags are taking my children's presents from under the tree, what a stressful week at work, I just wish some of the people posting in her showed the same outrage when the other side do it I.e dropping a breeze block on a woman cops head at the ardoyne riots only a few months ago. I checked a few people's post history and they did not care so much then????

because they are sectarians.

They only care once they can identify what religion they are.

.jacksparrow. · 11-12-2012 10:07AM

So this is the great patriot Ulster Scots KeithAFC was banging on about for years:)

Great bunch on lads.

anncoates · 11-12-2012 10:20AM

Disenfranchised? Where do they think they are, North Korea?

The problem here is that generations of lawbreakers on both sides of the community have become used to justifying their misdemeanors with political cant.

LordSutch · 11-12-2012 11:39AM

And it was all going so well up until recently, shame really, but I guess that if the flag hadn't been an issue then something else might have surfaced to cause rioting (on one side or the other). Seems like the the peace in NI is only skin deep.

citytillidie · 11-12-2012 11:53AM

glenkeeran wrote: »

Just after seeing a report that the Belfast council and British government are meeting today regarding this issue. My only fear is that they reverse their decision as i believe that all hell would break loose.

"Theres only one thing to resolve theses issues, Ban all parades on both sides, ban all flags only the flag of Northern Ireland to be allowed" Both of these are just an ignition to the dynamite!

Flag of Northern Ireland is offically the Union Flag

citytillidie · 11-12-2012 11:57AM

gallag wrote: »

As a taxi driver these scum bags are taking my children's presents from under the tree, what a stressful week at work, I just wish some of the people posting in here showed the same outrage when the other side do it I.e dropping a breeze block on a woman cops head at the ardoyne riots only a few months ago. I checked a few people's post history and they did not care so much then????

This past week 29 police officers have been hurt by whats going on and yet we still see the soft approach they are taking.

We can all see there is very different action taking by police when each side riot

Loyalist riot and they sit back and watch, Republican's riot and they attack

gallag · 11-12-2012 12:26PM

citytillidie wrote: »

This past week 29 police officers have been hurt by whats going on and yet we still see the soft approach they are taking.

We can all see there is very different action taking by police when each side riot

Loyalist riot and they sit back and watch, Republican's riot and they attack

Nonsense. Back this up with facts, they are using water cannon, button rounds and making arrests with many more arrests coming soon. Personally I think they treat them all to softly, if you are throwing a petrol bomb you should expect to be shot like every other country.

gallag · 11-12-2012 12:40PM

The police are neutered up here, they are scarred of the DUP Sinn fien etc complaining about police brutality the next day, police getting burnt by petrol bombs or their heads caved in by breeze block. Mabey a bit of police brutality is what is needed.

Leftist · 11-12-2012 01:21PM

gallag wrote: »

Nonsense. Back this up with facts, they are using water cannon, button rounds and making arrests with many more arrests coming soon. Personally I think they treat them all to softly, if you are throwing a petrol bomb you should expect to be shot like every other country.

citytillidie's **** talking put in it's place. :cool:

Madam_X · 11-12-2012 01:22PM

gallag wrote: »

As a taxi driver these scum bags are taking my children's presents from under the tree, what a stressful week at work, I just wish some of the people posting in here showed the same outrage when the other side do it I.e dropping a breeze block on a woman cops head at the ardoyne riots only a few months ago. I checked a few people's post history and they did not care so much then????

There are biased people from either point of view. You could equally say why aren't those who normally reserve their outrage for republican atrocities on this thread. Sickening as the bias from either group is, it's an unfortunate reality and I personally have taken to focusing just on the balanced posts. No interest for instance in the occasional attack on all unionism on this thread.

anncoates · 11-12-2012 01:24PM

gallag wrote: »

The police are neutered up here, they are scarred of the DUP Sinn fien etc complaining about police brutality the next day, police getting burnt by petrol bombs or their heads caved in by breeze block. Mabey a bit of police brutality is what is needed.

While I agree that you have a curious anomaly in this forum where loyalist scum are, well, scum and the kids rioting every year in the likes of Ardoyne (I've been there when it happens btw) are supposed to be disenfranchised, oppressed youth or whatever, I think it's also unhelpful to say the police are going easy only on one side (not saying you are...)

Like everyone, I think the police should bash them all off the streets but I assume the police just have to tread carefully because of the basic ingrained culture of 'politicization of disorder' encouraged by politicians on all sides. No matter that the loyalists are the worst offenders: the culture is the same.

I doubt it's also not helpful for people to suggest that institutionalized sectarianism still exists to a great extent in the PSNI. given that it is now a religiously mixed force, under a devolved government and presided over by an Alliance politician.

Always gives me a chuckle though to see any kind of widespread mindless rioting by lads in tracksuits in the North (of any religion) being defended as a revolutionary anti-disenfranchisement act by the same type of chin-strokers in AH that wet their pants in righteous ire about the same social class down here.

Does that mean lads down here in tracksuits (and living in a stable social democracy) attacking the fire services and Gardai are also engaging in a fervent anti-disenfranchisement act?

Madam_X · 11-12-2012 01:28PM

gallag wrote: »

The police are neutered up here, they are scarred of the DUP Sinn fien etc complaining about police brutality the next day, police getting burnt by petrol bombs or their heads caved in by breeze block

Yeh I'd be very surprised if the PSNI was biased in its dealings. Now the RUC many years back, I'd believe it. But even then, I remember seeing a bunch of loyalist hardmen denying this on a tv docu around the mid 90s and saying the police were just as tough on them as they were on republicans yobs.

fasttalkerchat · 11-12-2012 01:48PM

Madam_X wrote: »

Yeh I'd be very surprised if the PSNI was biased in its dealings. Now the RUC many years back, I'd believe it. But even then, I remember seeing a bunch of loyalist hardmen denying this on a tv docu around the mid 90s and saying the police were just as tough on them as they were on republicans yobs.

Everyone here is agreeing that they have been very soft on the loyalists and we don't have to look too far to find a harder line being taken against republicans.
Since the PSNI did not purge all of the ex-RUC members its possible that this is because of the few bad eggs left or that the sample is to small. Over the next decade there will be clearer figures to see the bias (if any).

11-12-2012 01:48PM

Madam_X wrote: »

Yeh I'd be very surprised if the PSNI was biased in its dealings. Now the RUC many years back, I'd believe it.

The difference in treatment at checkpoints after GAA-ing up a vehicle would suggest otherwise. Hardly empirical I know. :pac:

But even then, I remember seeing a bunch of loyalist hardmen denying this on a tv docu around the mid 90s and saying the police were just as tough on them as they were on republicans yobs.

When were they hard on them, before, during or after they suggested some Catholics for them to kill? :pac:

citytillidie · 11-12-2012 01:52PM

gallag wrote: »

Nonsense. Back this up with facts, they are using water cannon, button rounds and making arrests with many more arrests coming soon. Personally I think they treat them all to softly, if you are throwing a petrol bomb you should expect to be shot like every other country.

Just look at when the Ardoyne protestors have a sit down protest on marching how the cops come in and hit them with battons and drag them up and arrest them, compare that to what they have done for the past week until last night when they 1st used the water cannon

If they had of used the water cannon on the 1st night would not be going on for this long

Iwasfrozen · 11-12-2012 02:11PM

citytillidie wrote: »

Just look at when the Ardoyne protestors have a sit down protest on marching how the cops come in and hit them with battons and drag them up and arrest them, compare that to what they have done for the past week until last night when they 1st used the water cannon

If they had of used the water cannon on the 1st night would not be going on for this long

Don't be ridiculous. Northern Ireland is a tinderbox, if the police appeared to be heavy handed all hell would break lose. There's talk of a compromise where the union flag will be displayed permanently on a cenotaph in the grounds. Maybe that will help defuse the situation.

Mardy Bum · 11-12-2012 02:14PM

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Don't be ridiculous. Northern Ireland is a tinderbox, if the police appeared to be heavy handed all hell would break lose. There's talk of a compromise where the union flag will be displayed permanently on a cenotaph in the grounds. Maybe that will help defuse the situation.

Allowing ignorance to prevail is the worst thing they could let happen.

gallag · 11-12-2012 02:24PM

citytillidie wrote: »

Just look at when the Ardoyne protestors have a sit down protest on marching how the cops come in and hit them with battons and drag them up and arrest them, compare that to what they have done for the past week until last night when they 1st used the water cannon

If they had of used the water cannon on the 1st night would not be going on for this long

So when I was driving down Bradbury place on Friday night what was that big white wagon the police had spraying the rioters with water? In my ignorance I thought it was a water cannon??? Or at cloughfern corner on Saturday night?????

Iwasfrozen · 11-12-2012 02:26PM

Mardy Bum wrote: »

Allowing ignorance to prevail is the worst thing they could let happen.

What do you mean?

anncoates · 11-12-2012 02:28PM

fasttalkerchat wrote: »

Since the PSNI did not purge all of the ex-RUC members its possible that this is because of the few bad eggs left or that the sample is to small. Over the next decade there will be clearer figures to see the bias (if any).

That's like saying ex-IRA or UVF members shouldn't hold political office if that involves representing victims of terrorism.

I think they should obviously, but you can't use the fact that it's obvious that some bigots remain in a police force as a de facto case for institutionalized bias. Well, not if you're normal, I mean. It appears to fly here, as a rule.

laoch na mona · 11-12-2012 02:30PM

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

What do you mean?

hanging a flag just to keep a minority happy despite the fact it offends people and was democratically removed sounds ignorant to me

citytillidie · 11-12-2012 02:34PM

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Don't be ridiculous. Northern Ireland is a tinderbox, if the police appeared to be heavy handed all hell would break lose. There's talk of a compromise where the union flag will be displayed permanently on a cenotaph in the grounds. Maybe that will help defuse the situation.

Ahh so its ok to go in heavy handed on republicans that will inflame the situation to a full scale riot but dont do it on loyalists incase all hell will break lose.

freddiek · 11-12-2012 02:35PM

there has already been a compromise, which allows the union flag to be flown on certain days. the matter should be closed

the only further action necessary as i see it is education for these protesters on how democracy works

philologos · 11-12-2012 02:38PM

Although I think that the flag issue was a bit of a stunt by SF and SDLP I do think it was an interesting revelation of some of the loyalist tribalism that still exists particularly in East Belfast but also elsewhere in Northern Ireland.

I condemn pointless nationalistic tribalism in all it's forms in Northern Ireland. The sooner people become apathetic on both sides of this pointless debate the better.

citytillidie · 11-12-2012 02:41PM

gallag wrote: »

So when I was driving down Bradbury place on Friday night what was that big white wagon the police had spraying the rioters with water? In my ignorance I thought it was a water cannon??? Or at cloughfern corner on Saturday night?????

Ok then so it took the 5 days to use a water cannon

Fratton Fred · 11-12-2012 02:43PM

philologos wrote: »

Although I think that the flag issue was a bit of a stunt by SF and SDLP I do think it was an interesting revelation of some of the loyalist tribalism that still exists particularly in East Belfast but also elsewhere in Northern Ireland.

I condemn pointless nationalistic tribalism in all it's forms in Northern Ireland. The sooner people become apathetic on both sides of this pointless debate the better.

It was a stunt, designed to piss off Loyalists. Like idiots, the Loyalists took the bait and went on the rampage.

How I love Northern Ireland.

Iwasfrozen · 11-12-2012 02:44PM

laoch na mona wrote: »

hanging a flag just to keep a minority happy despite the fact it offends people and was democratically removed sounds ignorant to me

That's not what the word ignorant means. But yeah If a compromise can be reached then it should be. Don't forget nationalists are still the minority in NI. The majority of people want to stay within the union.

citytillidie wrote: »

Ahh so its ok to go in heavy handed on republicans that will inflame the situation to a full scale riot but dont do it on loyalists incase all hell will break lose.

No it's not ok to go heavy handed with republicans either where did I say that?

citytillidie · 11-12-2012 02:44PM

philologos wrote: »

Although I think that the flag issue was a bit of a stunt by SF and SDLP I do think it was an interesting revelation of some of the loyalist tribalism that still exists particularly in East Belfast but also elsewhere in Northern Ireland.

I condemn pointless nationalistic tribalism in all it's forms in Northern Ireland. The sooner people become apathetic on both sides of this pointless debate the better.

Why a stunt it brings the city hall into line with most of the rest of the UK city halls with the flag only flying in certain days of the year

Loyalist mobs attacking Alliance Party offices and homes.

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