Cut foreign aid!

joydivision · 10-12-2012 01:40PM

RandomName2 wrote: »

Opinion piece

[SIZE="4"]FROM 2004[/SIZE]

We were at the time net recipients from the EU - we were expected to start paying the EU more than we were receiving but...

Newsflash

We're broke.

Anachronistic opinion pieces are excellent talking point though

Yeah using big words like anachronistic might make you feel smart but its a real barrier in getting your point accross . I dont even know what your for or against .

Death and Taxes · 10-12-2012 01:40PM

joydivision wrote: »

Is this the "let the negroes starve thread " .

Would it be considered ok to wear a pillowcase is here ?

Youre the only one to have mentioned race, maybe you need the pillowcase!:mad:

RandomName2 · 10-12-2012 01:41PM

Blisterman wrote: »

Of all government expenditure, foreign aid probably does more good work per euro spent than any other.

joydivision wrote: »

Is this the "let the negroes starve thread " .

Would it be considered ok to wear a pillowcase is here ?

Could someone explain how Ireland not sending half billion of its borrowed money to countries like Nigeria, India and China, all of which are richer than us, will lead to people starving.

Let me repeat the salient bit. These countries are predominantly richer than us. Leave aside the 'drop in the ocean' bit for the moment - what use is money in these situations at all?

Hell, what use has it been.

Can ANYONE point out where it has been useful? Where it has stopped civil war, built lasting infrastructure, aided human rights? And from a pragmatic point of view - in the same sort of pragmatism that led to the EU developing Ireland - where do we stand to gain from our significant annual investment?

But if you do believe that monetary aid is useful, there is NOTHING stopping you from dipping into your pocket, as I said earlier, and putting your own money into the hands of charities. Your money. Your own money.

joydivision · 10-12-2012 01:42PM

WileyCoyote wrote: »

Youre the only one to have mentioned race, maybe you need the pillowcase!:mad:

Of course I need a pillowcAse . What else am I supposed to keep my pillow in ?

eyescreamcone · 10-12-2012 01:42PM

joydivision wrote: »

Is this the "let the negroes starve thread " .

Would it be considered ok to wear a pillowcase is here ?

My favorite stat.
In the mid 1980s ...when Bob Geldof was collecting for the starving in Ethiopia, ...the population of Ethiopia was 30 million people.
The current population of Ethiopia is...90 million.

They're taking the piss.
Anyone who donates to "foreign aid" is a sucker.
This includes the Rep of Ireland.

€500,000,000 is a lot of dosh, we should be spending on the needy here.

RandomName2 · 10-12-2012 01:45PM

joydivision wrote: »

Yeah using big words like anachronistic might make you feel smart but its a real barrier in getting your point accross . I dont even know what your for or against .

Check the thread title

joydivision · 10-12-2012 01:49PM

RandomName2 wrote: »

Check the thread title

Nope . You messed up . You wont get my vote I will not go searching for information to help me think like you . Im happy the way I am .

Iwannahurl · 10-12-2012 01:50PM

RandomName2 wrote: »

Opinion piece

FROM 2004

We were at the time net recipients from the EU - we were expected to start paying the EU more than we were receiving but...

Newsflash

We're broke.

Anachronistic opinion pieces are excellent talking point though

It's all relative. As I said, it's a bit late -- and a bit rich -- for us to start repudiating foreign aid, since we benefited hugely from it ourselves.

RandomName2 · 10-12-2012 01:53PM

Iwannahurl wrote: »

It's all relative. As I said, it's a bit late -- and a bit rich -- for us to start repudiating foreign aid, since we benefited hugely from it ourselves.

Two wrongs don't make a right.

Particularly when your foreign aid isn't being paid back to those who previously aided you.

In fact, those that helped contribute to Ireland also formed the backbone of our bailouts... :pac:

RandomName2 · 10-12-2012 01:55PM

joydivision wrote: »

Nope . You messed up . You wont get my vote I will not go searching for information to help me think like you . Im happy the way I am .

Nooooooooooo.... my brainwashing ploy has failed... as have my hopes of election!

pontia · 10-12-2012 01:57PM

Iwannahurl wrote: »

It's all relative. As I said, it's a bit late -- and a bit rich -- for us to start repudiating foreign aid, since we benefited hugely from it ourselves.

what are you talking about ? eu loans isint foreign aid,it has to be paid back,were there trocaire boxes with pictures of irish kids in china or somewhere were not aware of

BOHtox · 10-12-2012 01:57PM

Gurgle wrote: »

Yeah, right on!
Why should those greedy fcukers eat when we're struggling to pay for sky sports?

What does foreign aid actually do? In my eyes it forcibly takes money from the poor in this country and gives it to the rich in poor countries. John O'Shea long ago said that Uganda was a dodgy spot for aid. Only now are we stopping this. I'm a supporter of Aid and of charity but foreign aid leaves a lot to be desired with regards to both. Private charities are far more efficient and get more done!

Zillah · 10-12-2012 01:59PM

Iwannahurl wrote: »

It's all relative. As I said, it's a bit late -- and a bit rich -- for us to start repudiating foreign aid, since we benefited hugely from it ourselves.

This would be a relevant point if we had been accepting aid from nations that were virtually insolvent and borrowing massive amounts to stay afloat. Which was not the case.

humanji · 10-12-2012 02:01PM

Does anyone have an actual list of all the countries that receive aid from Ireland and what it's used for, or are we just going to go round in circles, belittling each other while no one actually has any facts?

BOHtox · 10-12-2012 02:04PM

Iwannahurl wrote: »

Perhaps it's a little bit late -- and a little bit 'rich' -- for Ireland to reject foreign aid at this juncture.

Opinion piece from 2004, when the Celtic Casino partay was in full swing:
Ireland Tops Cash per Head Income Aid from European Union

Despite being one of the richest countries of the European Union, Ireland will continue to receive significant amounts of what can be termed 'Foreign Aid,' until 2007.

Other European taxpayers are still funding us [in 2004], with the largest shares paid by the Netherlands, Germany and Sweden. Germany has been the leading contributor to Ireland's net receipts of €34 billion since joining the then European Community in 1973-the amount would be considerably higher if stated in current money values. Today [2004], Germany has many economic problems in particular in the former East Germany where unemployment is 20%.

Only four countries benefited from EU money in 2003- Portugal, Greece, Ireland and Spain - while the rest were net contributors. In terms of cash per head, the funding amounted to a net receipt of €391.70 for each Irish national. At the other of the scale, Dutch, Luxembourg and German nationals pay €120, €125 and €92.7 respectively, while each Briton pays €46.50.

In 2002, Irish Finance Minister Charlie McCreevy said that the 2001 net EU receipts in 2001, were equivalent to 4% on the standard rate of income tax and that the total in cash benefits since joining was almost equal to the then national debt.

Ireland has done very well, nationally and regionally, from EU Structural and Cohesion funds (aka foreign aid), a fact that countries like Turkey are careful to note.

neither a borrower nor a lender be

Grayson · 10-12-2012 02:04PM

BOHtox wrote: »

What does foreign aid actually do? In my eyes it forcibly takes money from the poor in this country and gives it to the rich in poor countries. John O'Shea long ago said that Uganda was a dodgy spot for aid. Only now are we stopping this. I'm a supporter of Aid and of charity but foreign aid leaves a lot to be desired with regards to both. Private charities are far more efficient and get more done!

Is your issue with us paying money to aid? Ot how the aid is spent. Because i do agree, money could be spent better. But that's a different issue to "cut foreign aid".

Boombastic · 10-12-2012 02:06PM

Cut all monetary aid. Send out our surplus PS workers to donate their time and skills. Pay them at their current rate.

LivelineDipso · 10-12-2012 02:06PM

Charity begins at home. Easy.

The Aussie · 10-12-2012 02:08PM

BOHtox wrote: »

What does foreign aid actually do? In my eyes it forcibly takes money from the poor in this country and gives it to the poor

It gives you that warm inner glow that makes you feel smug as you drive past Irish kids who have not had a decent breakfast on their way to school in old clothes. That will teach them for being born into a poor or unfortunate family.

Am I close.

BOHtox · 10-12-2012 02:08PM

Boombastic wrote: »

Cut all monetary aid. Send out our surplus PS workers to donate their time and skills. Pay them at their current rate.

Christ on a bike!

Boombastic · 10-12-2012 02:10PM

BOHtox wrote: »

Christ on a bike!

Ah, we'd stretch to paying their airfare

admiralofthefleet · 10-12-2012 02:10PM

Jester252 wrote: »

Not to mention that the aid is just a way to build international relations but Ireland doesn't look to good right now due to the Galway case. It wouldn't help attempets to improve our standing if we made any cuts to foreign aid and closed ranks. I'm far from a "bleeding heart"(which all the poster saying to cut foregin aid will be if it was about cutting welfare)

countries like India have far worse human rights records than us. forced marriage is just one example

Rented Mule · 10-12-2012 02:11PM

The majority of foreign aid is spent withing the host country.

Dodge · 10-12-2012 02:57PM

Where are people getting China from?

http://www.irishaid.gov.ie/countries.html

Ethiopia
Mozambique
Uganda
Lesotho
Tanzania
Timor Leste
Zambia
Vietnam
Malawi

Here's the 2011 Irish Aid annual report;
http://www.irishaid.gov.ie/uploads/2011%20Irish%20Aid%20Annual%20Report.pdf

Page 78 there will give you the full breakdown by country. €3.4 million spent on a project in India.

RandomName2 · 10-12-2012 03:50PM

Dodge wrote: »

Where are people getting China from?

http://www.irishaid.gov.ie/countries.html
Ethiopia

Mozambique

Uganda

Lesotho

Tanzania

Timor Leste

Zambia

Vietnam

Malawi

Here's the 2011 Irish Aid annual report;
http://www.irishaid.gov.ie/uploads/2011%20Irish%20Aid%20Annual%20Report.pdf

Page 78 there will give you the full breakdown by country. €3.4 million spent on a project in India.

Well besides the fact that on one page it says "over 80 countries have benefited from foreign aid" p70.

We are giving money to Zimbabwe, South Africa, India, Vietnam, and... eastern Europe?

Dodge · 10-12-2012 03:54PM

Read the report and all the annexes, thenc ome back with any questions. Enjoy

Jester252 · 10-12-2012 03:55PM

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

countries like India have far worse human rights records than us. forced marriage is just one example

What has that got to do with anything?

eyescreamcone · 10-12-2012 03:59PM

RandomName2 wrote: »

Well besides the fact that on one page it says "over 80 countries have benefited from foreign aid" p70.

We are giving money to Zimbabwe, South Africa, India, Vietnam, and... eastern Europe?

Zimbabwe - seriously??? :mad:

Death and Taxes · 10-12-2012 03:59PM

Dodge wrote: »

Read the report and all the annexes, thenc ome back with any questions. Enjoy

Read it, it basically says we are chucking over a half a billion euros at forigen countries, some of which have huge natural wealth and endemic poloitical corruption, it also says we often just give bags of cash to religious groups to spend on their projects.

Enough is enough, we cant affort this insanity, time to say no more.
Let individuals make donations if the want.

Dodge · 10-12-2012 04:09PM

WileyCoyote wrote: »

Read it

No, you didn't.

Nobody 'chucks' anything, and nobody gives money away. Every penny spent by Ireland, they'll expect to get back in many multiples. Its how international diplomacy works. most programmes co-ordinated by thr EU, the UN and the world bank. We're just keeping up appearances

Cut foreign aid!

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