How would you improve public transport in order to save money and avoid fare increase

dickwod1 · 03-12-2012 09:34PM

Get rid of the junkies/scumbags by having decent security with co-operation from the Garda plus stiff sentences for anti social behavior etc. and a lot more people would use Dublin bus/Luas and revenue would go up.

03-12-2012 09:38PM

Neewbie_noob wrote: »

Have advertisements on board trains and buses and piped radio stations so they can gain more revenue

CIÉ tried this in 1976 but it didn't last long due to negative feedback from passengers.

Neewbie_noob wrote: »

Have a smoking carriage on trains and you have to pay an extra 20 Euro to sit in it, heavy smokers will be happy

They used to have these too, but the smoking ban brought an end to them.

tim_sims · 03-12-2012 09:39PM

charge pensioners to use public transport , they can afford to pay due to a very generous state pension

weldoninhio · 03-12-2012 09:40PM

Remove wifi from buses, no need for it. Incentivise drivers contracts to hit certain times on routes. Remove the real time schedules from bus stops, again no need for it. Allow buses use the hard shoulder on motorways/dual carriages.

On certain routes employ security staff. On peak time services, have standing only buses with a certain amount of seats for handicapped/elderly. Stagger bus timetables so you don't have a 33 and a 33a on the same route at the exact same time.

Rodin · 03-12-2012 09:41PM

I don't do public transport (except for planes). The thought fills me with dread.

miamee · 03-12-2012 09:41PM

Can't believe no one has said this yet...
Charge for baggage, make people pre-book buses - an exact bus or a time slot, e.g. between 7.45-8.00am. If you miss it you pay extra to get the next available one.
Sell newspapers, magazines and bus driver calendars

Could be from vending machines to save on manpower.

Chinasea · 03-12-2012 09:48PM

single decer buses deployed on off peak and Sundays.

Run it like a business as opposed to a government back unionised 1970's organisation.

Grian1 · 03-12-2012 09:57PM

Have a charge for 'luxury seats' and seatbelts.

Run_to_da_hills · 03-12-2012 10:32PM

Reintroduce night time 2 car formation Dart sets.

This was the way it began.

Cut down on security, wear & tear, and power.

(Would only work with Siemens 8100 units)

MadsL · 03-12-2012 11:12PM

Neewbie_noob wrote: »

Where / when do you pay MadsL?

Multiple options all designed to eliminate dwell times at stops.

Paper ticket single use sold at shops - punch validated with a date stamp - punches inside the bus, not at the door.

Smart cards zapped on the bus - inside the bus, not at the door.

Monthly/annual tickets are photo ID smart cards paid online. Single route monthly tickets also available.

Feathers · 04-12-2012 12:28AM

Make Dublin Bus completely free to use, and have an income tax surcharge if you live in an area served by the buses — if everyone has to pay whether they use them or not, more people will use them; the income up front means you've the money to expand the fleet & have more security, etc; less people using their cars will mean freer roads for the buses & more services on time.

Failing that unpopular opinion, bring back mid-week Nitelinks on routes that were clearly profitable, like the 39N.

R0ot · 04-12-2012 01:10AM

- Inspectors on every train because there are so many fare evaders it's stupid. As OP mentioned they'll pay for themselves mostly through fines.
- Disabilty does not equal free transport in my opinion so either subsidize or remove not 100% free for ANYONE.
- Higher security for the dangerous routes to ban/kick off scumbags and let people feel safe on the buses and trains again.
- Free WiFi for 30 mina then charge for the reat, except for inter city trains.

That's all I got.

An Coilean · 04-12-2012 03:12AM

Neewbie_noob wrote: »

As the thread title says, how would you improve public transport in order to save money and avoid fare increases. This is not a thread to rant and rave about what routes should be changed or moaning about people leaving bags on seats.
I am asking for people's ideas on how to "Michael O'Leary" up things to save cash instead of adding to fares.

My ideas:
Have advertisements on board trains and buses and piped radio stations so they can gain more revenue

Charge for passengers occupying seats (give free ones to elderly / disabled) and have an inspector enforcing this (inspector will pay for itself in the long run)

Free WiFi should only be for holders of monthly / weekly /annual / tax saver tickets, enter code number on ticket to gain access etc, otherwise text away to 531231 or one of those numbers to get a code (and pay a euro or something)

Have a smoking carriage on trains and you have to pay an extra 20 Euro to sit in it, heavy smokers will be happy

Put a €2 slot on the door of the Jacks

Any other ideas folks ??

To be honnest with you, messing around the fringes, charging for using the Jacks and the like won't do a damm thing to improve public transport.
Structured and strategic longterm investment in public transport is what is needed.
We do not need any more major road projects, those remaining on the books should be cancled and the money put into developing the national rail network and investing in viable alternatives to the car in large population centers.

Adding another lane to the M50, or other schemes to expand the number of cars that can be crammed into Dublin is not going to help commuters or lesson traffic problems. Expanding Luas and Dart services, developing the Metro and a comprehensive cycle network, both of cycle lanes and a wider role out of bike rental schemes in Dublin and elsewhere will.

PS: It should also be noted that the value of Public Transport is not the profit it returns but in how it facilitates the wider economy.

Kevski · 04-12-2012 04:10AM

weldoninhio wrote: »

Remove the real time schedules from bus stops, again no need for it.

God no, that's the best thing that Dublin Bus has introduced in a long long time.

cloud493 · 04-12-2012 08:48AM

Kevski wrote: »

God no, that's the best thing that Dublin Bus has introduced in a long long time.

This. jesus, otherwise you miss your bus and you have no idea when the next one. Even if their spectacularly inaccurate most of the time.

snubbleste · 04-12-2012 09:17AM

gobnaitolunacy · 04-12-2012 09:17AM

Neewbie_noob wrote: »

My ideas:
Have advertisements on board trains and buses and piped radio stations so they can gain more revenue

Charge for passengers occupying seats (give free ones to elderly / disabled) and have an inspector enforcing this (inspector will pay for itself in the long run)

Free WiFi should only be for holders of monthly / weekly /annual / tax saver tickets, enter code number on ticket to gain access etc, otherwise text away to 531231 or one of those numbers to get a code (and pay a euro or something)

Have a smoking carriage on trains and you have to pay an extra 20 Euro to sit in it, heavy smokers will be happy

Put a €2 slot on the door of the Jacks

Any other ideas folks ??

1. Highly irritating Ryanair-esque idea, passengers will desert in droves rather than put up with that sh!t unless fares are REALLY dirt cheap.
2. You'll get a whole load of ppl standing and safety issues.
3. You can survive without Wifi. Bells and whistles stuff.
4. The law as it stands won't allow smoking carriages, unless you remove the roof.
5. Are you really Michael O'Leary?

IMHO scrap the free OAP travel, say a small contribution to the kitty, €10 return to Dublin or whatever. Free travel for all comers is unsustainable, plus they're about the only lot with a few bob these days.

Overthrow · 04-12-2012 09:40AM

A smarter network of regional routes connecting with a small number of city-bound routes. This means more frequent runs for the regional buses, rather than going all the way in to and out of town with a small number of passengers each time.

It'd be the difference between waiting up to 30 or 40 minutes for a bus in to town that takes an hour to get there, or waiting up to 10-15 minutes for a feeder bus that comes every 5 minutes going directly in to town.

jester77 · 04-12-2012 09:44AM

Consolidate the different modes of transport so that your ticket is valid between them all. Here in Hamburg your ticket covers bus, the 2 train systems and the ferries.

Have management look up in a dictionary what the word timetable actually means.

melekalikimaka · 04-12-2012 09:47AM

cloud493 wrote: »

This. jesus, otherwise you miss your bus and you have no idea when the next one. Even if their spectacularly inaccurate most of the time.

what if your bus comes every 45 mins and you dont know if you have missed it, its decided between taxi and bus many a time for me

Frank Black · 04-12-2012 09:51AM

I would scrap IE entirely and replace with additional inter-urban buses.
The motorway network has plenty of spare capacity to cater for the increase in traffic.
In a country the size of Ireland rail transport makes very little economic or environmental sense. Travel times would not be significantly altered.
Almost all freight is already transported by road - so no change there.
We would save millions of €'s by not having to subsidise an inter-urban rail transit system and could turn the rail lines into bicycle/hiking corridors which would be benificial to the tourist industry.

STForSale · 04-12-2012 10:31AM

Introduce competition and let CIE sink or swim.
/Thread

CruelCoin · 04-12-2012 10:31AM

Neewbie_noob wrote: »

Free WiFi should only be for holders of monthly / weekly /annual / tax saver tickets, enter code number on ticket to gain access etc, otherwise text away to 531231 or one of those numbers to get a code

Any other ideas folks ??

I would suggest an optional extra cost for wifi.

The driver/machine could print a ticket with a 30 minute wifi code for 50cent or something like that.

STForSale · 04-12-2012 10:43AM

jester77 wrote: »

Consolidate the different modes of transport so that your ticket is valid between them all. Here in Hamburg your ticket covers bus, the 2 train systems and the ferries.

Have management look up in a dictionary what the word timetable actually means.

Radical stuff here!

Only problem is the next minister of transport won't be able to herald the arrival of integrated ticketing, as the current and previous 2 have.

LivelineDipso · 04-12-2012 11:29AM

It is very easy.

The main issue with CIE is they function for the unions lifestyle needs and not the public. Therefore they will alway fail as a public service.

Abolish CIE - this cancer has to be destroyed
Privatise BE - National Express in the UK would be a better model
Give away IE (it is a surpringly viable network if railfrieght and meaningful timetables is included which CIE discard as the unions do not want to work at night) have all rail services administered by the RPA. They do a great job with Luas which very few people complain about.
Privatise DB
Susidies for less used and late night routes - and not union, management and Barry Kenny's massive wages compared to all other EU transport providers

Open up the marketplace and INTERGRATE IT ALL!

Transport Police.

LivelineDipso · 04-12-2012 11:46AM

STForSale wrote: »

Introduce competition and let CIE sink or swim.
/Thread

The Luas massively outperforms CIE on every route it competes with.

When the Green Line was coming on service CIE stood up to the challenge by having a strike.

Says it all.

Green Diesel · 04-12-2012 11:48AM

coonecb1 wrote: »

Put on more orbital bus routes that circle the city rather than having every route travel through the city centre.

Making every route go through town is impractical, doesn't suit everyone

THIS. M50 bus route please.

enda1 · 04-12-2012 12:04PM

Deprivatise the entire network.
Offer bundles of routes as offer for tender.
Keep the livery and service comparable and seamless to the customer.
Get of rid of all free transport. No OAP passes, definitely no poor person/unemployed passes.
All workers for Dublin Bus to have there contracts cancelled. Then some of them can be rehired by the newly formed private companies.
Suburban bus routes to express bus corridors.
Large out of town park and ride with regular express bus services.

Frank Black · 04-12-2012 12:34PM

LivelineDipso wrote: »

It is very easy.

Give away IE (it is a surpringly viable network if railfrieght and meaningful timetables is included which CIE discard as the unions do not want to work at night) have all rail services administered by the RPA.

Rail freight in Ireland makes up less than 1% of the total and is declining. Nearly all Irelands freight is carried by road. Studies have shown (EC Communications 2007 Logistics: Keeping Freight Moving, Memo) that road is cheaper than rail for freight movement less than 400km. In acountry the size of Ireland, you can see why freight transport declined by nealy 50% between 2003 and 2006 and continues to decline.
Add in the high costs associated with rail maintenance and the high levels of investment required to attempt to keep rail somewhat
competitive and the whole concept of an inter-urban rail network begins to look like a luxury the country simply can't afford.

Nem_e · 04-12-2012 12:46PM

Since it's a brainstorming session,

1) Remove the drivers and use a computer to drive the bus, link to a database that tracks all buses on the network and calculate bus speed's to economize fuel consumption and minimize wait times at stops, better utilize fleet run time (no driver breaks)

2)Give buses method to override traffic lights, ideally to avoid breaking or stopping, alternatively only have bus stops at traffic lights and always have the bus cause the lights to go red. Less stop starting should mean better fuel consumption.

3)Vending machines on buses to give an additional revenue stream. (Drinks, Chocolate, other ticket purchases)

4)Base the cost of the ticket on a person’s weight including bag's.

5)Include on bus stop time tables bar code to be scanned by smart phones to show the bus route and stops on a map on the phone, good tool for tourist's. (ok no cost saving but nice idea

)

6) Discount on Car TAX , VRT if you purchase yearly bus/Train ticket, may swing drivers to move to public transport for some journeys increase customer base.

7) some form of Bus mile / Train mile system, kind of like frequent flyer miles. May encourage people to sign up for swipe cards and use public transport more often.

How would you improve public transport in order to save money and avoid fare increase

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