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Lance armstrong drops fight against doping charges

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,000 ✭✭✭✭opinion guy


    hardCopy wrote: »
    Lance has benefited hugely from Livestrong, in a horribly cynical way. Both directly, in terms of payments to him and in terms of protecting him from criticism.

    I don't have to respect him for anything.

    Do you have details on payments to him ?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,969 ✭✭✭hardCopy


    Do you have details on payments to him ?

    I do as it happens.

    I was reluctant to post this article earlier as I feel it muddies the waters. Criticism of Armstrong and criticism of Livestrong should be two separate topics, but people keep bringing it up.
    IN ONE CASE, ARMSTRONG himself stood to profit from the sale of a major Livestrong asset: its name. Most people are unaware that there are two Livestrong websites. Livestrong.org is the site for the nonprofit Lance Armstrong Foundation, while Livestrong.com is a somewhat similar-looking page that features the same Livestrong logo and design but is actually a for-profit content farm owned by Demand Media.

    In 2008, the foundation licensed the Livestrong brand name to Demand, the online media company behind eHow and Cracked.com, among other properties. Livestrong.com was positioned as a “health, fitness, and wellness community,” offering an online calorie counter, exercise and yoga videos, and articles about such topics as “What Are the Signs and Symptoms of Rejecting Belly Button Rings?”

    As compensation for the use of its name, the foundation received about 183,000 shares of stock, which it sold for $3.1 million when the company went public in January 2011. Armstrong also received 156,000 shares of his own as part of a spokesperson agreement. (His agents, Bill Stapleton and Bart Knaggs, also received shares.) After the deal was criticized in the media, Armstrong donated his initial sale proceeds—roughly $1.2 million—to the foundation and said he planned to donate the rest, too.

    http://www.outsideonline.com/outdoor-adventure/athletes/lance-armstrong/Its-Not-About-the-Lab-Rats.html?page=all


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,332 ✭✭✭Guill



    Eleven of Lance Armstrong's former teammates testified against
    him in the US Anti-Doping Agency's investigation of the cyclist, it has been
    revealed.


    The agency said the evidence had exposed "the most sophisticated,
    professionalised and successful doping program that sport has ever seen".

    Seems like lance had a good operation going. It'll be very interesting to see how he got away with it for so,long.
    Link


  • Posts: 25,909 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I just love the whole way this is being spun and reported. I don't believe for a second that Armstrong orchestrated everything for his whole team, smacks of pinning everything on a scapegoat to me.

    By far my favorite thing though is when they describe the operation as being amazingly "sophisticated". They just had a lad on a motorbike follow them around with some drugs. :pac: I mean if Armstrong of all people could get away with that what does it say about the rest?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 36,064 ✭✭✭✭The_Kew_Tour


    I just love the whole way this is being spun and reported. I don't believe for a second that Armstrong orchestrated everything for his whole team, smacks of pinning everything on a scapegoat to me.

    By far my favorite thing though is when they describe the operation as being amazingly "sophisticated". They just had a lad on a motorbike follow them around with some drugs. :pac: I mean if Armstrong of all people could get away with that what does it say about the rest?

    What????:confused:

    Either he was one of greatest cheats of all time or you saying its witch hunt?

    EVENFLOW



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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,000 ✭✭✭✭opinion guy


    What????:confused:

    Either he was one of greatest cheats of all time or you saying its witch hunt?

    Its possible he was merely a regular cheat and it's still a witch hunt.

    Seems a bit incredulous for him to be the Kingpin, no ?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,969 ✭✭✭hardCopy


    What????:confused:

    Either he was one of greatest cheats of all time or you saying its witch hunt?

    Its possible he was merely a regular cheat and it's still a witch hunt.

    Seems a bit incredulous for him to be the Kingpin, no ?

    No, you would expect the kingpin to be at the top.

    I can't believe people are still defending this dirty, cheating, lying, amoral prick.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,000 ✭✭✭✭opinion guy


    hardCopy wrote: »
    No, you would expect the kingpin to be at the top.

    I can't believe people are still defending this dirty, cheating, lying, amoral prick.

    I'm not defending him. I'm just finding it hard to believe that someone who spent hours and hours every day on a bike and doesn't have a medical education would have the time and knowledge to mastermind, by himself, the most "sophisticated doping program in recent sports history" for an entire team of cyclists

    That is simply not credible to me (edit:.....well lets say difficult to find credible)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 27,833 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    I'm not defending him. I'm just finding it hard to believe that someone who spent hours and hours every day on a bike and doesn't have a medical education would have the time and knowledge to mastermind, by himself, the most "sophisticated doping program in recent sports history" for an entire team of cyclists

    That is simply not credible to me


    You really need to read up on this. It's in black and white in yesterdays report. Before that it was well known that he worked alongside one of the most foremost doctors in EPO use, Michele Ferrari, for years, and the two of them worked on the various doping programs they used. Armstrong was the driving force behind this.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,000 ✭✭✭✭opinion guy


    ThisRegard wrote: »
    You really need to read up on this

    No I don't.
    Honestly internet randomer, what makes you think I am compelled to do as you order? I do have other things to be doing


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,746 ✭✭✭taidghbaby


    hardCopy wrote: »
    No, you would expect the kingpin to be at the top.

    I can't believe people are still defending this dirty, cheating, lying, amoral prick.

    I'm not defending him. I'm just finding it hard to believe that someone who spent hours and hours every day on a bike and doesn't have a medical education would have the time and knowledge to mastermind, by himself, the most "sophisticated doping program in recent sports history" for an entire team of cyclists

    That is simply not credible to me (edit:.....well lets say difficult to find credible)
    Yeah but he wouldn't have to have any medical knowledge! If he was a good organiser/leader he could simply bring in the people he needed to run the programme!! Good management skills really!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 27,833 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    No I don't.
    Honestly internet randomer, what makes you think I am compelled to do as you order? I do have other things to be doing

    Because it'll stop you making silly posts like the one you did and save you looking stupid to all the other internet randomers.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,000 ✭✭✭✭opinion guy


    ThisRegard wrote: »
    Because it'll stop you making silly posts like the one you did and save you looking stupid to all the other internet randomers.

    Some of us aren't here to impress you and your randomer gang (if you must know I'm mainly here for procrastination :) )


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,933 ✭✭✭Logical Fallacy


    ThisRegard wrote: »
    You really need to read up on this. It's in black and white in yesterdays report. Before that it was well known that he worked alongside one of the most foremost doctors in EPO use, Michele Ferrari, for years, and the two of them worked on the various doping programs they used. Armstrong was the driving force behind this.

    lol, do you really think that?

    Armstrong and his success was the product, as such he is now the target. How many other members of the US Postal Team have been stripped of titles and wins? None, because despite being guilty of exactly the same thing as Armstrong they all offered him up to save their hides.

    Typical cheater behaviour.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,760 ✭✭✭summerskin


    lol, do you really think that?

    Armstrong and his success was the product, as such he is now the target. How many other members of the US Postal Team have been stripped of titles and wins? None, because despite being guilty of exactly the same thing as Armstrong they all offered him up to save their hides.

    Typical cheater behaviour.

    Most of the US Postal team were only there to help Armstrong win, that's the way cycling teams work.

    Do you ignore the sample hen provided from 1999 that tested positive for EPO after the fact?

    he was a cheat, and pretty much every cycling fan knew it.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 27,833 ✭✭✭✭ThisRegard


    How many other members of the US Postal Team have been stripped of titles and wins? None, because despite being guilty of exactly the same thing as Armstrong they all offered him up to save their hides.

    Typical cheater behaviour.

    http://www.cyclismas.com/2012/10/us-postal-tour-de-france-squads-1999-2006/


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,933 ✭✭✭Logical Fallacy


    summerskin wrote: »
    Most of the US Postal team were only there to help Armstrong win, that's the way cycling teams work.

    Do you ignore the sample hen provided from 1999 that tested positive for EPO after the fact?

    he was a cheat, and pretty much every cycling fan knew it.

    I'm not saying he wasn't a cheat, you are doing some hard work with the mental acrobatics on that one.

    It's cycling, everyone cheats lol.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,969 ✭✭✭hardCopy


    lol, do you really think that?

    Armstrong and his success was the product, as such he is now the target. How many other members of the US Postal Team have been stripped of titles and wins? None, because despite being guilty of exactly the same thing as Armstrong they all offered him up to save their hides.

    Typical cheater behaviour.

    They didn't save their hides though, those still racing will be banned and those retired will have their records stripped. Levi Leipheimer has had all of his results from '99 to '07 stripped.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,625 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    As each organization has to decide for itself what to do about findings against professional cyclists, I'm waiting to see what decision the UCI will come to on the Armstrong debacle. The court case taken in Switzerland by the UCI against Paul Kimmage about the alleged cover-up of an Armstrong positive drug test result is troubling.

    Paul reported in the papers he work's for on the testimonies of two of Armstrong's former team mates. The UCI hasn't taken a case against the papers. Paul has been a thorn in the side of the cycling authorities for over two decades now, so maybe it's just performance as usual from them. When his "hard ride" book was published in Ireland, he was criticized for it by some of his fellow Irish cyclists because it mentioned drug abuse within the professional cycling world. They thought it was wrong to blow the whistle openly about the abuse, that it should have been kept "in-house". The proof has been truly revealed in the eating.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,969 ✭✭✭hardCopy


    aloyisious wrote: »
    As each organization has to decide for itself what to do about findings against professional cyclists, I'm waiting to see what decision the UCI will come to on the Armstrong debacle. The court case taken in Switzerland by the UCI against Paul Kimmage about the alleged cover-up of an Armstrong positive drug test result is troubling.

    Paul reported in the papers he work's for on the testimonies of two of Armstrong's former team mates. The UCI hasn't taken a case against the papers. Paul has been a thorn in the side of the cycling authorities for over two decades now, so maybe it's just performance as usual from them. When his "hard ride" book was published in Ireland, he was criticized for it by some of his fellow Irish cyclists because it mentioned drug abuse within the professional cycling world. They thought it was wrong to blow the whistle openly about the abuse, that it should have been kept "in-house". The proof has been truly revealed in the eating.

    The other Irish cyclists fell out with him because they themselves doped. Kelly has already come out this week in support of McQuaid.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,625 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    hardCopy wrote: »
    The other Irish cyclists fell out with him because they themselves doped. Kelly has already come out this week in support of McQuaid.

    I'd heard Sean Kelly talking on radio about the matter, hadn't realised he'd aligned himself with Pat. I remember the original hoohah here about Paul's book and Sean had sounded non-committal then about it, compared to the other big-name FIC cyclists of the time, who didn't like it one little bit and made that plain.

    That might have been due to the "hints" from other European countries about Stephen Roche and how he managed appear out of the mist on La Plagne, along with how he won the TDF, the Giro and the World championship all in one year.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,625 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    There was an article in yesterday's Irish Times on this woman's involvement with lance's team and Irish Customs. This address is on an article in today's Sunday Indo'......

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/blowing-whistle-on-lance-nearly-destroyed-my-life-3258556.html


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,625 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    From today's Irish Examiner and Irish Times:


    UCI to respond to Armstrong doping report on Monday
    Friday, October 19, 2012 - 04:23 PM

    International Cycling Union president Pat McQuaid will on Monday reveal the world governing body’s response to the United States Anti-doping Agency’s scathing Lance Armstrong report.

    Armstrong refused to cooperate with USADA, who last week published a 1000-page report which concluded the Texan and his United States Postal Service team ran “the most sophisticated, professionalised and successful doping programme that sport has ever seen”.

    In accordance with the World Anti-doping Code, the UCI had 21 days to respond, until October 31, but now McQuaid will address the issue in Geneva, Switzerland on Monday.

    “UCI President Mr Pat McQuaid will inform on the UCI position concerning the USADA decision on the Armstrong case,” said a UCI statement to announce the media conference.

    .....................................................................................................................

    Rabobank pulls out of cycling

    Bert Bruggink, chief financial officer of Rabobank, addresses a news conference in Utrecht announcing that the bank would stop sponsoring professional cycling teams at the end of this year. Photograph: Robin van Lonkhuijsen/Reuters
    Cycling: Dutch lender Rabobank has ended its 17-year sponsorship of professional cycling, saying it had lost faith in the sport's leaders to clean up following the Lance Armstrong doping scandal.

    Rabobank is the biggest backer of Dutch professional cycling, with total sponsorship worth €15 million a year in a nation with as many bikes as people.

    Its decision shows the damage being done to cycling after the US Anti-Doping Agency (Usada) said seven times Tour de France winner Armstrong took part in and organised a sophisticated doping scheme on his way to success.

    “We are no longer convinced that the international professional world of cycling can make this a clean and fair sport. We are not confident that this will change for the better in the foreseeable future,” said Rabobank board member Bert Bruggink in a statement.

    “The Usada report was the final straw,” he added later in a press conference televised live in the Netherlands.

    “The international sport of cycling is not only sick, the sickness goes up to the highest levels,” he said.

    Sportswear company Nike and brewer Anheuser-Busch

    dropped their sponsorship of Armstrong this week, and the sport must show it can tackle doping effectively to prevent more of its backers from quitting.

    The International Cycling Union (UCI), the sport’s governing body, has yet to rule on the Usada’s report into Armstrong and has been criticised for dragging its feet.

    “Despite inevitable and sometimes painful consequences, the UCI reaffirms its commitment to the fight against doping and full transparency about potential anti-doping rule violations,” the Paris-based UCI said on Friday.

    Armstrong, a 41-year-old cancer survivor, has always denied taking banned substances but has decided not to challenge the Usada charges.

    American rider Levi Leipheimer, who rode for Rabobank between 2002 and 2004, was sacked this week by the Quick-Step Cycling Team after admitting to the Usada investigation that he took banned substances.

    Leipheimer, 38, was one of 11 former team-mates to testify against Armstrong.

    Another sponsor, SKINS, which is a partner of the Rabobank team, said on Thursday it would reconsider its association with the sport if its UCI governing body failed to act on doping.

    Its Chief Executive Jaimie Fuller warned the commercial fall-out could be worse than the damage suffered by a doping scandal centred on the Festina team that hit the Tour de France in 1998.

    Cycling has attracted a new generation of sponsors in recent years who stress their commitment to clean competition.

    The sport increasingly appeals to affluent fortysomethings who want to stay active for longer

    earning it the nickname “the new golf” and boosting its commercial appeal.

    British team Sky said this week it would sack team members unless they signed a document saying they had never doped. Sky rider Bradley Wiggins this year became the first Briton to win the Tour.

    The Rabobank cycling team, which has taken part in every single Tour de France since 1984, said in a statement it regretted but understood the bank's decision.

    “We’ve been cycling for 17 years now with the name Rabobank proudly on our shirts, and it hurts that going forward we’ll have to do without that name,” it said.

    Its top riders are Dutchman Robert Gesink, this year’s Tour of California winner, and Spaniard Luis Leon Sanchez, winner of four Tour de France stages.


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