Pump wont stop running (Stuart Turner Monsoon negative 2.0)

Tomtata · 28-09-2012 10:49PM #1

Hi,

I have a Stuart Turner Monsoon negative 2.0 pump in my apartment.
It is behaving very strangely the last couple of days,

1st it was losing pressure for a couple of seconds and them back to full - This happened about 10 time over the course of 20min
Left it for a few hours and now the pump just wont stop - It runs non stop even though there is no taps / heating / shower on etc...
I have it switch off at the moment as it was clearly overheating.

Anyone see this before, the water pressure is grand & the pump does maintain pressure when using the taps etc... it just doesn't switch off.

Would you know what could be causing it and how I would go about repairing.

Thanks, Tom

Joey the lips · 28-09-2012 10:54PM

Have you a washer dryer combined?

Look at your toilets and see are the leaking into the pan. Do you know what i mean by this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rOA06GCJeo

Tomtata · 28-09-2012 11:05PM

Yep, make sense

I have a washer / dryer combined. (Sitting right next to it as I type)
No leaks, check both toilets and all looks ok

I read some where the Air capsule onto of the pump might be causing it

Here is the pump im using NEG%202BAR%20TWIN%20LINK.jpg

Joey the lips · 29-09-2012 12:19AM

Modern plant the agents for stuart turner certain models tell me that washer dryers have a feature where they drain a slight amount of water from the system all the time. This causes the pump to kick in. I will see if i can find an article.

Yip its written there but i cant attach a link. The pump must not be connected to the same water supply line as a washer dryer.

A simple way to test this is pull the washer dryer out and turn off its water taps at the back and see if the pump is kicking in after a day.

Tomtata · 29-09-2012 08:38AM

The pump has been working fine for 3+ years with the Washer / Dryer plumbed in.

Joey the lips · 29-09-2012 08:46AM

Tomtata wrote: »

The pump has been working fine for 3+ years with the Washer / Dryer plumbed in.

Oh. I dont understand. We are working on a process of elimination at the moment.

Your pump is incorrectly installed when its connected to the washer dryer.

I could tell you its a capacitor or it prob needs re charging but before you start paying out money i want to check the other possibilities first.

If you dont think the washer dryer is worth a short the google "recharging a stuart turner negative head pump" if this fails then look at the capacitors or the circuit board.

Tomtata · 29-09-2012 09:00AM

I should of said - I switched off the water inlets to the washer dryer but didn't have any effect. I appreciate the help

K.Flyer · 29-09-2012 09:23AM

A number of things can cause your pump to stay running.
What is important right now is to not allow it to stay running, plug it out or remove the fuse.
If the pump is running with no water passing through it for a long period of time you will do damage to the seals which becomes a more serious problem.

Check you have no leaks by shutting off the valves on the outlet side of the pumps (the outlets are where the pipes are connected to the higher sections of the pump heads).
If the pump is still running it is more than likely the relay on the pcb is gone and the pcb needs replacing, or the low pressure switch may be faulty and would have to be replaced.
A faulty capacitor would prevent it from starting.
And lack of air in the vessel would not cause it to keep running either.
The non return valves can cause similar problems but they are usually associated to very regular on / off patterns.
My money is on the pcb from what you describe.

Tomtata · 29-09-2012 08:50PM

Thanks for that - I think you are correct, I followed this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzVrMz0tzZA and tested the unit by bridging each sensor which had no effect.

The pump does have a dry run cut off sensor but this also doesn't seem to be working, I disabled the hot and cold inlets.
Must be the pcb - here's hoping - I will replace myself and if it doesn't work call in the pros.

greg_james · 30-09-2012 06:18PM

check the pressure switch unlike the positive head it does not work off flow switches but pressure switches

greg_james · 30-09-2012 06:24PM

Remove the small arrow clips at the outlets and the pump should stop if it does its probably that the small magnet inside the outlat has become jammed. If not check the pcb

LIFFY FISHING · 30-09-2012 10:27PM

Check you have .9 bar pressure in the air vessell, you can test this with a tyre gauge, and if its down in pressure you can pump it with a bicycle pump, if that isnt your problem it is the flow switches, this type of pump operates on flow and pressure switches.

Tomtata · 30-09-2012 10:40PM

I removed the arrow clips and pump is still running full blast.
Will check the Air Pressure tomorrow when I get a tyre gauge.

I suspect its the PCB after doing all the sensor tests. Anyone know were in Dublin I can get one? I emailed Stuart Turner in the UK so should hear something back tomorrow.

pm1977x · 30-09-2012 10:45PM

Tomtata wrote: »

I removed the arrow clips and pump is still running full blast.
Will check the Air Pressure tomorrow when I get a tyre gauge.

I suspect its the PCB after doing all the sensor tests. Anyone know were in Dublin I can get one? I emailed Stuart Turner in the UK so should hear something back tomorrow.

these guys fixed our Stuart Turner pump (capicator) but carry spares too

http://www.theshowerdoctors.ie/spares

K.Flyer · 30-09-2012 11:08PM

Tomtata wrote: »

I removed the arrow clips and pump is still running full blast.
Will check the Air Pressure tomorrow when I get a tyre gauge.

I suspect its the PCB after doing all the sensor tests. Anyone know were in Dublin I can get one? I emailed Stuart Turner in the UK so should hear something back tomorrow.

Tomtata,
You can get a new pcb for your pump from the main dealers Modern Plant who are located on the Naas Rd, Dublin 12, ph. 01-4591344 (on the left between the Long Mile Rd junction and The Red Cow Inn). Some plumbing supply shops carry them as well but tend to be dearer.
If you are changing the pcb then while you are at it fit a new capacitor, its due to go soon enough.
I reckoned it being the pcb alright.

LIFFY FISHING · 01-10-2012 07:05AM

Try the air pressure before you replace any parts, it costs nothing, you cant return spare parts if they are opened, and its unlikley to be the pcb, if it was your pump would be dead, your issue is the pump wont cut out, thats flow related, like I said thats flow switches or pressure switch if its not the air issue in the vessell, btw if it wont hold pressure it can be replaced.

Joey the lips · 01-10-2012 08:53AM

Just be aware that modern plant are stubborn to supply parts when its not there pump you bought. Stuart turner make loads of pumps and modern plant only buy a couple of models.

Tomtata · 01-10-2012 08:39PM

Thanks for all the help - I got the pressure gauge today and it was quite low so pumped it up using a standard bike pump but still no joy.
Still running full blast - get a response from Stuart Tuner in the UK with the steps to test the sensors so I’m fairly confident now it’s the PCB.

Will order tomorrow and hopefully get this sorted

Tomtata · 01-10-2012 10:13PM

I bite the bullet and removed the PCB - the module that looks to regulate the voltage (large black box) on the PCB is blown - Melted down both sides.

When I put it all together again (The exact same way I took it apart) there is no power to the pump.

Tomtata · 02-10-2012 08:11PM

Good news, Got the new PCB from Modern Plant today fitted it this evening and its working perfect, Thanks again for the help.

K.Flyer · 02-10-2012 08:47PM

Tomtata wrote: »

Good news, Got the new PCB from Modern Plant today fitted it this evening and its working perfect, Thanks again for the help.

Your Welcome!:)

pm1977x · 02-10-2012 11:22PM

how much was the PCB do you mind me asking?

LIFFY FISHING · 03-10-2012 05:54PM

about 40 euro plus vat

Tomtata · 03-10-2012 10:11PM

PCB was €53 inc VAT - fitted it in 5 mins

nicolac · 24-06-2013 04:23PM

pm1977x wrote: »

these guys fixed our Stuart Turner pump (capicator) but carry spares too

http://www.theshowerdoctors.ie/spares

Hi,

I have the same problem with my Stuart Turner pump. Do you remember how much they charged to replace the capactior? Interesting that they did that, a lot of plumbers seem to go straight to replacing the pump from what I hear.

K.Flyer · 24-06-2013 08:53PM

nicolac wrote: »

Hi,

I have the same problem with my Stuart Turner...
... a lot of plumbers seem to go straight to replacing the pump from what I hear.

A lot of plumbers have no idea how to troubleshoot pumps, especially negative heads.
Out of 100 pump callouts we would only have to replace approx 6 -7 pumps, so everyone should be very cautious about the often too quick "you need a new pump" diagnosis.

spireland32 · 24-06-2013 09:00PM

K.Flyer wrote: »

A lot of plumbers have no idea how to troubleshoot pumps, especially negative heads.
Out of 100 pump callouts we would only have to replace approx 6 -7 pumps, so everyone should be very cautious about the often too quick "you need a new pump" diagnosis.

Agree with you. A lot of plumbers (and other trades) dont know when to say its not my area of expertise or im not familiar with x y or z. However I can recommend someone who will have a look at it for you.

nicolac · 25-06-2013 12:58PM

K.Flyer wrote: »

A lot of plumbers have no idea how to troubleshoot pumps, especially negative heads.
Out of 100 pump callouts we would only have to replace approx 6 -7 pumps, so everyone should be very cautious about the often too quick "you need a new pump" diagnosis.

I completely agree. Unfortunately it casts a bad light on the profession when customers are told by so many of them that its straight to the e600 cost for a new pump instead of just changing the capacitor and it sends most people to troubleshoot themselves. Especially when the troubleshooting information is readily available on the internet.

Ok, I formally request your contact details so I can have them on file if it ever goes completely belly up!

The capacitor is being looked after at the moment.

pavelpro · 19-12-2014 09:04PM

Maybe someone can help me with my problem.
Have a 2 bar Stuart Turner negative pump which was working on-off while no taps running, i disassemble it and clean filters as well checked both Non return Valves, one looks little bit faulty with rubber perished which i slightly cleaned.
On my view valves need to be replaced.
Anyway, after assemble everything back the old problem disappear and on-off pattern while nothing running gone but the same patter appear when its under pressure, so while opening tap its not running constantly but on-off.
Do you think it could be the same fault with valves or it might be smth else?

K.Flyer · 19-12-2014 10:02PM

On - Off running while a tap is fully open can be one of a couple of things.
Usually it is either the float in the outlet chamber (above the non-return valves)is stuck in the down position or the pick-up that is strapped to the outside of the tube needs replacing.
Check and see if the problem is only on the hot or the cold taps or both.

pavelpro · 19-12-2014 10:18PM

K.Flyer wrote: »

On - Off running while a tap is fully open can be one of a couple of things.
Usually it is either the float in the outlet chamber (above the non-return valves)is stuck in the down position or the pick-up that is strapped to the outside of the tube needs replacing.
Check and see if the problem is only on the hot or the cold taps or both.

I just test this theory by putting magnet to the sensor and its running ok so most likely they stuck, will be checking this tomorrow morning.
Thanx for Reply!

Pump wont stop running (Stuart Turner Monsoon negative 2.0)

Comments