Liverpool FC Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2012/13

K-9 · 30-08-2012 12:02PM

Dickerty wrote: »

I think if he was worried about being without Lucas, Spearing would stay as cover. But it looks like he's gonna live without.

Dempsey for sure, and either Carroll stays, or he's replaced. But still no closer to knowing who he might replace him with...

Maybe why there's talk of Spearing on loan, probably have a call back option.

Dickerty · 30-08-2012 12:06PM

Steven81 wrote: »

Thats why he wants Carroll out

Talk of Agger to City, signs Assaidi, talks of why Gerrard needs to stay yesterday...

Adam is odd one out - maybe it's the double chin??

30-08-2012 12:07PM

whatawaster wrote: »

Really unlikely we will have the money for all that

Two of our main problems from last season imo were:

1) Our strikers not scoring goals, no proper goalscorer

2) Not getting adequate backup for Lucas. Spearing is fine short term but not signing a proper backup last Jan was crazy.

So have we addressed this problems?

I don't we have addressed no 1 and No 2 we haven't either. We signed Joe Allen to play the "Alonso" role, playmaker with both defensive and offensive duties. He can cover Lucas short term but there's no way he will cover the ground or tackles Lucas covers.

If Allen gets injured we are fúcked as we have no-one able to play that role.

30-08-2012 12:09PM

whatawaster wrote: »

Shelvey or Henderson will be more effective at DM than Spearing. His use of the ball is not good enough and imo he is only average at the defensive side of things

Based on what?

budgemook · 30-08-2012 12:10PM

I'm not sure we need the out and out defensive midfielder anymore. It's now the job of everyone, especially the 3 CM's to press and press until ball is won back as soon as it's lost. We should also have a lot more of the ball this season reducing the need to win it back. Lucas is certainly the best player we have at winning the ball back but the effort should be shared around more now and with Allen, Gerrard, Sahin and Shelvey + Hendo as backup we should be fine. We need a goal scorer. Numero Uno priority. Carroll isn't that person.

amiable · 30-08-2012 12:11PM

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osnola ibax · 30-08-2012 12:12PM

Tactically, it doesn't seem astute to me the way we have handled the Carroll situation. Was there another way other than alerting everyone to the fact we REALLY want him sold, putting us in the position of receiving bids that completely undervalue the player.

Pretend you don't want to sell him, play him a bit and get him in the shop window (too late now obviously). it should be obvious to others that he doesn't fit into the system and let clubs approach us based on that view of the situation. Could you command a higher fee that way.

The way it is now, I feel we will either get too low a fee, or he won't be sold, or played, and his value could decrease further.

Kess73 · 30-08-2012 12:13PM

amiable wrote: »

Shame there is not a match on today to talk about.

Gerty · 30-08-2012 12:13PM

Dickerty wrote: »

Leiva wrote: »

Morgan starts tonight

God, imagine the mania on here if he scored a couple?

"Who needs Llorente or Huntelaar or Walcott, or any player with a double letter in their name..."

He's actually the type of striker that I think we need. If only he was a few years older and kept him his finishing of not so long ago.

whatawaster · 30-08-2012 12:13PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

whatawaster wrote: »

Shelvey or Henderson will be more effective at DM than Spearing. His use of the ball is not good enough and imo he is only average at the defensive side of things

Based on what?

The fact that Spearing is a poor player. I think Shelvey is better than him in pretty much every aspect of the game. Neither are defensive giants, but Shelvey will use the ball much better

Sappy404 · 30-08-2012 12:14PM

How do the rest of ye see the window going? Looking at the more likely outgoings I reckon we'd have fair chance of improving the squad:

Out:

Adam 5m
Speo 3m
Carroll 14m
Pacheco 1m

In:

Dempsey 6m
Walcott 15m

Less realistically, if we can get Huntelaar for around £15m (he's 29 and in the last year of his current deal) we'd have around £8mil for a winger, preferably one who could do a full-back's job too. I very much doubt we'll be signing Llorente, as Bilbao appear to want to keep him, though the various circumstances are in favour of him moving.

I can also see us adding a couple of hither-to undiscussed players. The squad at present is a lot lighter in numbers than last year. Some more swift, astute additions a la Assaidi wouldn't be too surprising.

Dickerty · 30-08-2012 12:15PM

So hints at a strong line up, and talk of players who were away during the summer...

I'd like to see starts for Kelly, Coates, Carra, Enrique (assuming 100%, play 60/70 mins) at the back.
Henderson with Allen and Shelvey again. Allen to come off if all going well.
Morgan, Downing and Borini up front - Morgan central of the 3. Downing can drop back to LB on the hour, get Sterling on to get at them...

RustySpoon · 30-08-2012 12:16PM

-Ade- wrote: »

In fairness to Cole, if this was your missus, you'd be agreeing with her too :pac:

I too have the problem of the top button of my jeans having to be undone after a feed of beer, Joke Hole is probably similar.

30-08-2012 12:19PM

whatawaster wrote: »

The fact that Spearing is a poor player. I think Shelvey is better than him in pretty much every aspect of the game. Neither are defensive giants, but Shelvey will use the ball much better

You obviously missed the Hearts game last week.

SlickRic · 30-08-2012 12:20PM

being quite so public about wanting rid of Carroll is a bit dim in all fairness.

Chucky the tree · 30-08-2012 12:20PM

rarnes1 wrote: »

Two of our main problems from last season imo were:

1) Our strikers not scoring goals, no proper goalscorer

2) Not getting adequate backup for Lucas. Spearing is fine short term but not signing a proper backup last Jan was crazy.

So have we addressed this problems?

I don't we have addressed no 1 and No 2 we haven't either. We signed Joe Allen to play the "Alonso" role, playmaker with both defensive and offensive duties. He can cover Lucas short term but there's no way he will cover the ground or tackles Lucas covers.

If Allen gets injured we are fúcked as we have no-one able to play that role.

Very few players in the world can do that. Expecting to find one cheaply who'll sit on the bench for most of the season who can do all those things is ridiculous.

tok9 · 30-08-2012 12:21PM

I'd be genuinely surprised if we signed Walcott in this window even with all the reports.

If Adam, Spearing and cole leave I imagine we'll sign Dempsey which imo would be a good window, our best in about 3 or 4 seasons in fact.

The only other thing that could happen is we get 15 million for Carroll and we buy a striker but I can't see anyone paying that either right now.

Leiva · 30-08-2012 12:21PM

SlickRic wrote: »

being quite so public about wanting rid of Carroll is a bit dim in all fairness.

True but I think he either has a definite target in place and is turning the screw, or the screw is getting turned on him to get back some money.

LuckyLloyd · 30-08-2012 12:24PM

It's like we have a car that we spent a few quid on a couple of years ago but need to offload now because another kid is on the way and our needs have changed. We know one of the neighbours up the road would be interested in this car and will make an offer for it.

To maximise the offer he'll make we really should keep the car clean, drive it on a semi regular basis and maybe mention it to the neighbour's mate that you're thinking (just thinking mind) about changing to something else.

Not us though. We put a "FOR SALE CALL 08X" sign in the window and park the car on the grass leaving it obviously unused for an extended period.

Consequently, when the neighbour takes it off us he makes us a much lower offer and we have less leverage to up his bid.

We just haven't been very smart on this one let's be honest.

Sappy404 · 30-08-2012 12:24PM

SlickRic wrote: »

being quite so public about wanting rid of Carroll is a bit dim in all fairness.

We want him sold. Short of actively calling clubs up to sell him on, using the press to state that he's a 3rd choice striker and is available is a good idea.

I'd rather he be a 3rd choice striker than sell him to Spurs or Newcastle though. Just because he won't fit our system doesn't mean he won't excel in theirs.

Francie Barrett · 30-08-2012 12:24PM

tok9 wrote: »

If Adam, Spearing and cole leave

Let's hope no one gets injured in the stampede for Cole

whatawaster · 30-08-2012 12:29PM

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

It's like we have a car that we spent a few quid on a couple of years ago but need to offload now because another kid is on the way and our needs have changed. We know one of the neighbours up the road would be interested in this car and will make an offer for it.

To maximise the offer he'll make we really should keep the car clean, drive it on a semi regular basis and maybe mention it to the neighbour's mate that you're thinking (just thinking mind) about changing to something else.

Not us though. We put a "FOR SALE CALL 08X" sign in the window and park the car on the grass leaving it obviously unused for an extended period.

Consequently, when the neighbour takes it off us he makes us a much lower offer and we have less leverage to up his bid.

We just haven't been very smart on this one let's be honest.

There doesn't appear to.be a very active market for Carroll and it looks like he is digging his heels In. Rodgers is trying to put pressure on him in public.

While it is the case that he seems only willing to go to Newcastle our hands are tied anyway.

DrumSteve · 30-08-2012 12:30PM

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Let's hope no one gets injured in the stampede for Cole

Cole probably will.

Jason Todd · 30-08-2012 12:30PM

Everyone knows Rodgers doesn't fancy Carroll, it's practically the first thing people mentioned when Rodgers was confirmed as boss. We all knew he wouldn't fit "the system", the fact Rodgers is talking about it publicly makes no odds to me. He would have spoke to Carroll first which is fair enough. If the manager is trying to gain anything from this it's a quick sale, not a recouping wasted cash sale.

SlickRic · 30-08-2012 12:32PM

Leiva wrote: »

True but I think he either has a definite target in place and is turning the screw, or the screw is getting turned on him to get back some money.

indeed. the screw is definitely being turned, as it should be if he's not in the plans.

i still think it's dim to do it in front of the media.

turn the screw behind closed doors; why make it public? it only serves to maybe embarrass the player further, and perhaps make him dig his heels in more than he already has.

plus it potentially makes Rodgers look foolish if he can't get a buyer. the whole world now definitively knows that he doesn't fancy Andy. it's a tricky situation to get yourself into IMO.

plus, we won't get the money we could.

Kess73 · 30-08-2012 12:33PM

Sappy404 wrote: »

We want him sold. Short of actively calling clubs up to sell him on, using the press to state that he's a 3rd choice striker and is available is a good idea.

I'd rather he be a 3rd choice striker than sell him to Spurs or Newcastle though. Just because he won't fit our system doesn't mean he won't excel in theirs.

At the end of the day all that matters is how he does for us. If he is not in the manager's plans then get rid of him. But the lack of interest in him save for Newcastle and West Ham shows exactly how "rated" Carroll is.

The scary thing is that the price that Newcastle are meant to have offered is probably more than the player is worth, but the crazy figure we paid for him is skewing many a pov.

wonderfullife · 30-08-2012 12:35PM

whatawaster wrote: »

There doesn't appear to.be a very active market for Carroll and it looks like he is digging his heels In. Rodgers is trying to put pressure on him in public.

While it is the case that he seems only willing to go to Newcastle our hands are tied anyway.

true but Newcastle seem to have Liverpool by the balls on this one!! What happens tomorrow if he can't be shifted on a permanent deal? Keep him for the season, use him sparsely and his transfer value plummets? Or let him back to Toon on loan, let them pay his wages for a season and take him for £15 million at the end of the season. Only winners here can be Newcastle. Mike Cashley will come out of this smelling of roses - player back for £20 million less plus delays the transfer fee until next summer thereby earning more interest on his cash that could be sitting in Liverpools accounts now.

I just can't see a 3rd option - i.e. he stays and forces his way into BR plans going forward.

Kess73 · 30-08-2012 12:36PM

SlickRic wrote: »

indeed. the screw is definitely being turned, as it should be if he's not in the plans.

i still think it's dim to do it in front of the media.

turn the screw behind closed doors; why make it public? it only serves to maybe embarrass the player further, and perhaps make him dig his heels in more than he already has.

plus it potentially makes Rodgers look foolish if he can't get a buyer. the whole world now definitively knows that he doesn't fancy Andy. it's a tricky situation to get yourself into IMO.

plus, we won't get the money we could.

Could be simply a case that there is so little interest in the player from other clubs that we are now so desperate to be shot of him that saying so in public has become the last resort.

No matter how it plays out he is going to turn out to be one of the biggest wastes of money in the club's history, if not the biggest, when sold.

Gmol · 30-08-2012 12:38PM

Anyone know what channels the match is on later?

Jason Todd · 30-08-2012 12:39PM

I think we should forget the fact Newcastle sold him to us in the first place. The fact is, if he's not in the managers plans then he needs to go, because we obviously need funds for other signings... We're not going to be winners in any scenario involving Carroll unless he does a Llorente, works his way into the managers plans and becomes a 35mill player... and how likely is that tbf. In any case, he might only want to go back to Newcastle, therefore eliminating any other buyers, and there is nothing we can do about that, only take our medicine.

Liverpool FC Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2012/13

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