If Ireland only got independence now, what would it be like?

lazygal · 28-07-2012 08:33PM #1

Would we have let the Church have such a sway over us? Would we have the same anthem? Would the Irish language brigade succeed in making children learn Irish in school? Would we keep the same British legal system?

Allyall · 28-07-2012 08:35PM

We'd probably have corrupt politicians, be supporting English Football, and be speaking English.

Seanchai · 28-07-2012 08:35PM

lazygal wrote: »

Would the Irish language brigade succeed in making children learn Irish in school?

:rolleyes: The ignorance. Jesus wept.

mikemac1 · 28-07-2012 08:36PM

Dublin had its chance at being capital

Time for somewhere new

I say Cashel as used by Brian Boru :cool:

lazygal · 28-07-2012 08:38PM

Seanchai wrote: »

:rolleyes: The ignorance. Jesus wept.

No. I liked Irish in school, I would have chosen to study it. But it would have been a far greater use of time to teach a modern European or Asian language. How many fluent Irish speakers are there, outside Gaeltacht areas, who speak it on a daily basis because they learned it in school?

And Jesus would be cool with me not being into compulsory Irish I think.

Orizio · 28-07-2012 08:38PM

Things would be far far far superior. The culchie brigade that took over, with their silly 'sports', their hordes of fascist priests, their loathing of sex and massive guilt complexes, their anti-intellectualism and their determination to stomp the Irish 'language' down urban Ireland's throat, would have been powerless and further assimilated into proper society. Imagine an Ireland without parochialism, without gombeenism, without culchie subversiveness...

Fuinseog · 28-07-2012 08:39PM

lazygal wrote: »

Would we have let the Church have such a sway over us? Would we have the same anthem? Would the Irish language brigade succeed in making children learn Irish in school? Would we keep the same British legal system?

we would still be paying a tithe to the the church of ireland.

we did keep the british legal system. barristers wear black cos they are still in mourning for queen Anne.

as regards the Irish language, it would probably be like the welsh language brigade. bloody celts just refuse to be english

Sindri · 28-07-2012 08:39PM

We'd be poorer and insecure about our nationality. We'd probably go to war with some neutral country to show we aren't to be messed with or stage a mock invasion of ourselves and fight those Irish bastards out of here.

Fuinseog · 28-07-2012 08:42PM

Orizio wrote: »

Things would be far far far superior. The culchie brigade that took over, with their silly 'sports', their hordes of fascist priests, their loathing of sex and massive guilt complexes, their anti-intellectualism and their determination to stomp the Irish 'language' down urban Ireland's throat, would have been powerless and further assimilated into proper society. Imagine an Ireland without parochialism, without gombeenism, without culchie subversiveness...

the Godless sasannaigh are as much afraid of sex as the irish.

mikemac1 · 28-07-2012 08:42PM

Orizio wrote: »

The culchie brigade that took over,

WT Cosgrave was a Dub

Chuck Stone · 28-07-2012 08:43PM

We'd be akin to an impoverished Scotland.

Ms.M · 28-07-2012 08:44PM

I doubt we'd have the same anthem if 1916 never happened. Would we have taken the non-violent root to independence so? All brought about by John Hume and Michael D.Higgins I'd say.

I don't think we'd bother getting independence without some kind of Gaelic revival though, it would just be delayed by a hundred years and by then it might have been too late for the language anyway. If the Gaelic revival happened just as it did when it did but we still remained part of the UK until now, I'd guess more people would support the language than do now. Like the Nationalist community in the North do. The church wouldn't have such an influence on the state but people would possibly be more likely to go to Mass if they feel they're discriminated against or need to keep their identity or whatever.
So it depends on how the British treated us in the hypothetical interim I suppose!

Fuinseog · 28-07-2012 08:46PM

mikemac1 wrote: »

WT Cosgrave was a Dub

as indeed was bertie

kowloon · 28-07-2012 08:48PM

Spice Burgers might not exist.

I wouldn't want to live in such a world.

Seanchai · 28-07-2012 08:48PM

Orizio wrote: »

Things would be far far far superior. The culchie brigade that took over, with their silly 'sports', their hordes of fascist priests...[blah,blah,blah]

Oh that would be the Freestaters/Fine Gaelers/Blueshirts and their hordes of pro-British Roman Catholic shopkeepers, wigged English lawyers, TCD and UCD graduates, urban dwellers, pro-British big farmers and counter-revolutionary rightwingers generally who wanted to get back to business and play ball with the Brits asap in 1921/22 and once they had done that, through executing Irish revolutionaries and genuine radicals, they proceeded to bring the fight to Spain and, with funding form the same uber conservative pro-British RC shopkeepers and big farmers, fight the democratically-elected revolutionaries in Spain.

But typical of a West Brit to blame "culchies" for the sins of, well, counter-revolutionary Jackeens/Blueshirts/Big farmers/shopkeepers.

Orizio wrote: »

Imagine an Ireland without parochialism, without gombeenism, without culchie subversiveness...

Better still, imagine Ireland without people who still think as you do.

Fuinseog · 28-07-2012 08:48PM

Ms.M wrote: »

I doubt we'd have the same anthem if 1916 never happened. Would we have taken the non-violent root to independence so? All brought about by John Hume and Michael D.Higgins I'd say. I don't think we'd bother getting independence without some kind of Gaelic revival though, it would just be delayed by a hundred years and by then it might have been too late for the language anyway. If the Gaelic revival happened just as it did when it did but we still remained part of the UK until now, I'd guess more people would support the language than do now. Like the Nationalist community in the North do. The church wouldn't have such an influence on the state but people would possibly be more likely to go to Mass if they feel they're discriminated against or need to keep their identity or whatever.
So it depends on how the British treated us in the hypothetical interim I suppose!

scots Gaelic is permitted in Scotland. the welsh have their own culture and language. what makes you think we would be less Gaelic under british rule?

Notorious97 · 28-07-2012 08:49PM

I can safely say if we were still occupied to this day, we would still be occupied tomorrow. Who in our government would actually stand up and fight for us? There is so much anti irish sentiment in this country lately, largely reflected on this site also, nobody would give a rats in standing up and fighting.

I am glad there was brave men and women years ago who done something about it.

God fuc*ing knows this shower today wouldnt.

Fuinseog · 28-07-2012 08:53PM

Notorious97 wrote: »

I can safely say if we were still occupied to this day, we would still be occupied tomorrow. Who in our government would actually stand up and fight for us? There is so much anti irish sentiment in this country lately, largely reflected on this site also, nobody would give a rats in standing up and fighting.

I am glad there was brave men and women years ago who done something about it.

God fuc*ing knows this shower today wouldnt.

there are still people willing to fight for Irish freedom. Take Marian Price for example. her heroic shooting of an evil Brit collecting a pizza in 2009 won our hearts and minds.

Notorious97 · 28-07-2012 08:54PM

Fuinseog wrote: »

there are still people willing to fight for Irish freedom. Take Marian Price for example. her heroic shooting of an evil Brit collecting a pizza in 2009 won our hearts and minds.

Since when does that act have support from me? Im republican but not an idiot.

ChunkyLover_53 · 28-07-2012 08:55PM

I saw a documentary before about this, the British Govt. at the time had drafted plans to build a big ass avenue from O'Connell St. all the way up to the Phoenix Park, effectively wiping out the Smithfield/Stoneybatter area with a grand Champs-Elysees style parade.

We on the other hand ripped up all the tram lines in Dublin only to put them back down again years later.

We somehow made cycling to work socially unacceptable, then changed our minds & made a b*ll*x of the cycle lanes

Ms.M · 28-07-2012 08:57PM

Fuinseog wrote: »

scots Gaelic is permitted in Scotland. the welsh have their own culture and language. what makes you think we would be less Gaelic under british rule?

I don't. I said it depends on whether the Gaelic revival happened. If it hadn't happened, we'd probably consider ourselves British by now. We're so similar in culture anyway (providing the British treated us well and of course, political leaders gave us grounds why it would be better for us). Whereas if it did happen, but we remained part of the UK, more people would possibly want to differ themselves culturally from the British; like the Nationalist community does in the North. So we might indeed be more Gaelic under British rule. I don't know? :pac:

Fuinseog · 28-07-2012 08:57PM

Notorious97 wrote: »

Since when does that act have support from me? Im republican but not an idiot.

so is she, and she is fighting for your freedom.

Fuinseog · 28-07-2012 09:01PM

Ms.M wrote: »

I don't. I said it depends on whether the Gaelic revival happened. If it hadn't happened, we'd probably consider ourselves British by now. We're so similar in culture anyway (providing the British treated us well and of course, political leaders gave us grounds why it would be better for us). Whereas if it did happen, but we remained part of the UK, more people would possibly want to differ themselves culturally from the British; like the Nationalist community does in the North. So we might indeed be more Gaelic under British rule. I don't know? :pac:

when the banquet was held for the queen in Dublin castle I think a lot of our native betters considered themselves british.

the Gaelic revival took place under British rule. If we were still under british rule it would change little. wales is British yet they have welsh school and signage.

Seanchai · 28-07-2012 09:08PM

Fuinseog wrote: »

when the banquet was held for the queen in Dublin castle I think a lot of our native betters considered themselves british.

Names? (Brian Hayes and John Bruton excepted)

"the queen", as if you're talking about Ireland's head of state rather than about a foreign monarch, the British queen.

Sappa · 28-07-2012 09:15PM

Would there be as Many naggers claiming nagger rights.

Sappa · 28-07-2012 09:19PM

Sappa wrote: »

Would there be as Many naggers claiming nagger rights.

Meant knackers

Ms.M · 28-07-2012 09:27PM

Settled folk and Travellers used to get on better, bring them in to sing a few tunes and give them a bit of grub and all that. I might be wrong. Maybe that was only some rural communities.
So it depends how the British being around and Ireland gaining independence influenced these relations.

Ms.M · 28-07-2012 09:29PM

Sappa wrote: »

Would there be as Many "travellers" claiming "human/civil" rights.

might be more acceptable for the Mods.

mikemac1 · 28-07-2012 09:30PM

The Corkonians would still be moaning :rolleyes:

Riddle101 · 28-07-2012 09:45PM

Ireland would be a lot more screwed up today if we had not gotten our Independence when we did. Assuming of course that the 1916 Rising still occurred and the War for Independence didn't get Ireland the boost we need. There would still be a lot of fighting going on. I mean the IRA are still active in Northern Ireland, so I can only imagine the IRA would still be around but a much larger organisation that extends across the entire island.

LightningBolt · 28-07-2012 09:53PM

Seanchai wrote: »

Names? (Brian Hayes and John Bruton excepted)

"the queen", as if you're talking about Ireland's head of state rather than about a foreign monarch, the British queen.

Given the thread title nybody with half a brain would know that the queen the poster was referring to was the British queen.

:rolleyes:

If Ireland only got independence now, what would it be like?

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