Should James Holmes, Colorado Shooter, Get The Death Penalty??

the mer wrote: »

a lethal injection doesnt cost the same as life in prison, if he killed your family would you pay for his prison stay

It isn't the lethal injection that rises the cost. It is the special housing in death row, the special security provided to individuals on death row, the number of appeals, the number of hours of manpower to convict a capital offense, and any other special considerations involved with a capital case.

California:

“The additional cost of confining an inmate to death row, as compared to the maximum security prisons where those sentenced to life without possibility of parole ordinarily serve their sentences, is $90,000 per year per inmate. With California’s current death row population of 670, that accounts for $63.3 million annually.”

Maryland

"A new study released by the Urban Institute on March 6, 2008 forecast that the lifetime cost to taxpayers for the capitally-prosecuted cases in Maryland since 1978 will be $186 million. That translates to $37.2 million for each of the state’s five executions since the state reenacted the death penalty. The study estimates that the average cost to Maryland taxpayers for reaching a single death sentence is $3 million - $1.9 million more than the cost of a non-death penalty case. (This includes investigation, trial, appeals, and incarceration costs.) --- Those cases cost the state an additional $71 million compared to the cost non-death penalty cases. Those costs were incurred simply to seek the death penalty where the ultimate outcome was a life or long-term prison sentence."

Nevada

"A recent study of the death penalty in Nevada compared the costs of defending capital and non-capital murder cases. The study, conducted by Dr. Terance Miethe of the Department of Criminal Justice at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas, looked at the time spent by defense attorneys at various stages of a case. The study’s findings included:
- Clark County public defense attorneys spent an average of 2,298 hours on a capital murder case compared to an average of 1,087 hours on a non-capital murder case--a difference of 1,211 hours, or 112%.
- Defending the average capital murder case in Clark County cost $229,800 for a Public Defender or $287,250 for appointed counsel. The additional cost of capital murder cases was $170,000 to $212,000 per case compared to the cost of a non-capital murder case in the same county.
- The 80 pending capital murder cases in Clark County will cost approximately $15 million more than if they were prosecuted without seeking the death penalty."

The Federal System

"The average cost of defending a trial in a federal death case is $620,932, about 8 times that of a federal murder case in which the death penalty is not sought. A study found that those defendants whose representation was the least expensive, and thus who received the least amount of attorney and expert time, had an increased probability of receiving a death sentence. Defendants with less than $320,000 in terms of representation costs (the bottom 1/3 of federal capital trials) had a 44% chance of receiving a death sentence at trial. On the other hand, those defendants whose representation costs were higher than $320,000 (the remaining 2/3 of federal capital trials) had only a 19% chance of being sentenced to death. Thus, the study concluded that defendants with low representation costs were more than twice as likely to receive a death sentence. The complete report can be found here."

New Jersey

"A New Jersey Policy Perspectives report concluded that the state's death penalty has cost taxpayers $253 million since 1983, a figure that is over and above the costs that would have been incurred had the state utilized a sentence of life without parole instead of death. The study examined the costs of death penalty cases to prosecutor offices, public defender offices, courts, and correctional facilities."

Tennessee

"Death penalty trials cost an average of 48% more than the average cost of trials in which prosecutors seek life imprisonment."

Kansas

"In its review of death penalty expenses, the State of Kansas concluded that capital cases are 70% more expensive than comparable non-death penalty cases. The study counted death penalty case costs through to execution and found that the median death penalty case costs $1.26 million. Non-death penalty cases were counted through to the end of incarceration and were found to have a median cost of $740,000. For death penalty cases, the pre-trial and trial level expenses were the most expensive part, 49% of the total cost. The costs of appeals were 29% of the total expense, and the incarceration and execution costs accounted for the remaining 22%. In comparison to non-death penalty cases, the following findings were revealed:

The investigation costs for death-sentence cases were about 3 times greater than for non-death cases.
The trial costs for death cases were about 16 times greater than for non-death cases ($508,000 for death case; $32,000 for non-death case).
The appeal costs for death cases were 21 times greater.
The costs of carrying out (i.e. incarceration and/or execution) a death sentence were about half the costs of carrying out a non-death sentence in a comparable case.
Trials involving a death sentence averaged 34 days, including jury selection; non-death trials averaged about 9 days."

Indiana

"A recent state analysis of the costs of the death penalty in Indiana found the average cost to a county for a trial and direct appeal in a capital case was over ten times more than a life-without-parole case. The average capital case resulting in a death sentence cost $449,887, while the average cost of case in which a life-without-parole sentence was sought and achieved was only $42,658. The study was prepared by the Legislative Services Agency for the General Assembly, Jan. 2010, as a cost assessment for a bill that would make more cases eligible for the death penalty. Read the assessment."

North Carolina

"A recent study published by a Duke University economist revealed North Carolina could save $11 million annually if it dropped the death penalty. Philip J. Cook, a professor at Duke University's Sanford School of Public Policy, calculated the extra state costs of the death penalty during fiscal years 2005 and 2006. He calculated over $21 million worth of expenses that would have been saved if the death penalty had been repealed. The total included extra defense costs for capital cases in the trial phase, extra payments to jurors, post-conviction costs, resentencing hearings, and the extra costs to the prison system. This conservative estimate did not include resources that would have been freed up in the Office of the Appellate Defender and the North Carolina Supreme Court, the extra time spent by prosecutors in capital cases, and the costs to taxpayers for federal appeals."

Florida

"Florida would save $51 million each year by punishing all first-degree murderers with life in prison without parole, according to estimates by the Palm Beach Post. Based on the 44 executions Florida has carried out since 1976, that amounts to an approximate cost of $24 million for each execution. This finding takes into account the relatively few inmates who are actually executed, as well as the time and effort expended on capital defendants who are tried but convicted of a lesser murder charge, and those whose death sentences are overturned on appeal. ("The High Price of Killing Killers," Palm Beach Post, January 4, 2000)"

California


"California spends $90 Million dollars annually above and beyond the ordinary costs of the justice system on capital cases. $78 million of that total is incurred at the trial level (Sacramento Bee, March 18, 1988). In January 2003, despite a budge deficit, California Governor Gray Davis proposed building a new $220 million state of the art death row. ("San Quentin Debate: Death Row vs. Bay Views, New York Times, December 18, 2004)."

Texas

"Each death penalty case in Texas costs taxpayers about $2.3 million. That is about three times the cost of imprisoning someone in a single cell at the highest security level for 40 years. ("Executions Cost Texas Millions," Dallas Morning News, March 8, 1992)."

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/costs-death-penalty

Can we finally lay to rest the false assumption that it would be cheaper to execute someone than it would to give them a life sentence? That is not a valid argument. It is an ignorant belief and if you are someone who supports the death penalty, and you have not done your due diligence in researching the costs of this program - at both the state and federal level - you are being irresponsible. The state is killing individuals in our name and you inaccurately believe it is saving the state money by doing so; this is false.

fearcruach wrote: »

Yes it does. Read the article again. It's not the actual method of death that racks up the costs, it's the appeals process which can take up to 20 years (California).

No matter what your thoughts on Capital Punishment, it has been shown to be far more expensive than imprisonment, so economics should not be an argument.

Also as previously mentioned, my thoughts on paying for him to be imprisoned etc if he killed my family are never going to bring my family back. You can't change the past, only what you feel about it. Killing him won't change that.

Is that not more a case of doing the Death Penalty "wrong"?

If someone is given the DP, there should be a limited alotted time to appeal. If that appeal fails, then the sentence should be carried out forthwith.

Keeping someone locked up on Death Row for decades is silly. Just imprison them normally.

However, I am for the DP for first degree murder. I just believe that as it's practiced at the moment, in some areas, is the wrong (and more expensive) way to do it.

AFAISI, if you have murdered in a pre-meditated manner, especially in the way under discussion, then you have given up your right to exist.

Killer Wench wrote: »

It isn't the lethal injection that rises the cost. It is the special housing in death row, the special security provided to individuals on death row, the number of appeals, the number of hours of manpower to convict a capital offense, and any other special considerations involved with a capital case.

California:

“The additional cost of confining an inmate to death row, as compared to the maximum security prisons where those sentenced to life without possibility of parole ordinarily serve their sentences, is $90,000 per year per inmate. With California’s current death row population of 670, that accounts for $63.3 million annually.”

Maryland

"A new study released by the Urban Institute on March 6, 2008 forecast that the lifetime cost to taxpayers for the capitally-prosecuted cases in Maryland since 1978 will be $186 million. That translates to $37.2 million for each of the state’s five executions since the state reenacted the death penalty. The study estimates that the average cost to Maryland taxpayers for reaching a single death sentence is $3 million - $1.9 million more than the cost of a non-death penalty case. (This includes investigation, trial, appeals, and incarceration costs.) --- Those cases cost the state an additional $71 million compared to the cost non-death penalty cases. Those costs were incurred simply to seek the death penalty where the ultimate outcome was a life or long-term prison sentence."

Nevada

"A recent study of the death penalty in Nevada compared the costs of defending capital and non-capital murder cases. The study, conducted by Dr. Terance Miethe of the Department of Criminal Justice at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas, looked at the time spent by defense attorneys at various stages of a case. The study’s findings included:
- Clark County public defense attorneys spent an average of 2,298 hours on a capital murder case compared to an average of 1,087 hours on a non-capital murder case--a difference of 1,211 hours, or 112%.
- Defending the average capital murder case in Clark County cost $229,800 for a Public Defender or $287,250 for appointed counsel. The additional cost of capital murder cases was $170,000 to $212,000 per case compared to the cost of a non-capital murder case in the same county.
- The 80 pending capital murder cases in Clark County will cost approximately $15 million more than if they were prosecuted without seeking the death penalty."

The Federal System

"The average cost of defending a trial in a federal death case is $620,932, about 8 times that of a federal murder case in which the death penalty is not sought. A study found that those defendants whose representation was the least expensive, and thus who received the least amount of attorney and expert time, had an increased probability of receiving a death sentence. Defendants with less than $320,000 in terms of representation costs (the bottom 1/3 of federal capital trials) had a 44% chance of receiving a death sentence at trial. On the other hand, those defendants whose representation costs were higher than $320,000 (the remaining 2/3 of federal capital trials) had only a 19% chance of being sentenced to death. Thus, the study concluded that defendants with low representation costs were more than twice as likely to receive a death sentence. The complete report can be found here."

New Jersey

"A New Jersey Policy Perspectives report concluded that the state's death penalty has cost taxpayers $253 million since 1983, a figure that is over and above the costs that would have been incurred had the state utilized a sentence of life without parole instead of death. The study examined the costs of death penalty cases to prosecutor offices, public defender offices, courts, and correctional facilities."

Tennessee

"Death penalty trials cost an average of 48% more than the average cost of trials in which prosecutors seek life imprisonment."

Kansas

"In its review of death penalty expenses, the State of Kansas concluded that capital cases are 70% more expensive than comparable non-death penalty cases. The study counted death penalty case costs through to execution and found that the median death penalty case costs $1.26 million. Non-death penalty cases were counted through to the end of incarceration and were found to have a median cost of $740,000. For death penalty cases, the pre-trial and trial level expenses were the most expensive part, 49% of the total cost. The costs of appeals were 29% of the total expense, and the incarceration and execution costs accounted for the remaining 22%. In comparison to non-death penalty cases, the following findings were revealed:

The investigation costs for death-sentence cases were about 3 times greater than for non-death cases.
The trial costs for death cases were about 16 times greater than for non-death cases ($508,000 for death case; $32,000 for non-death case).
The appeal costs for death cases were 21 times greater.
The costs of carrying out (i.e. incarceration and/or execution) a death sentence were about half the costs of carrying out a non-death sentence in a comparable case.
Trials involving a death sentence averaged 34 days, including jury selection; non-death trials averaged about 9 days."

Indiana

"A recent state analysis of the costs of the death penalty in Indiana found the average cost to a county for a trial and direct appeal in a capital case was over ten times more than a life-without-parole case. The average capital case resulting in a death sentence cost $449,887, while the average cost of case in which a life-without-parole sentence was sought and achieved was only $42,658. The study was prepared by the Legislative Services Agency for the General Assembly, Jan. 2010, as a cost assessment for a bill that would make more cases eligible for the death penalty. Read the assessment."

North Carolina

"A recent study published by a Duke University economist revealed North Carolina could save $11 million annually if it dropped the death penalty. Philip J. Cook, a professor at Duke University's Sanford School of Public Policy, calculated the extra state costs of the death penalty during fiscal years 2005 and 2006. He calculated over $21 million worth of expenses that would have been saved if the death penalty had been repealed. The total included extra defense costs for capital cases in the trial phase, extra payments to jurors, post-conviction costs, resentencing hearings, and the extra costs to the prison system. This conservative estimate did not include resources that would have been freed up in the Office of the Appellate Defender and the North Carolina Supreme Court, the extra time spent by prosecutors in capital cases, and the costs to taxpayers for federal appeals."

Florida

"Florida would save $51 million each year by punishing all first-degree murderers with life in prison without parole, according to estimates by the Palm Beach Post. Based on the 44 executions Florida has carried out since 1976, that amounts to an approximate cost of $24 million for each execution. This finding takes into account the relatively few inmates who are actually executed, as well as the time and effort expended on capital defendants who are tried but convicted of a lesser murder charge, and those whose death sentences are overturned on appeal. ("The High Price of Killing Killers," Palm Beach Post, January 4, 2000)"

California


"California spends $90 Million dollars annually above and beyond the ordinary costs of the justice system on capital cases. $78 million of that total is incurred at the trial level (Sacramento Bee, March 18, 1988). In January 2003, despite a budge deficit, California Governor Gray Davis proposed building a new $220 million state of the art death row. ("San Quentin Debate: Death Row vs. Bay Views, New York Times, December 18, 2004)."

Texas

"Each death penalty case in Texas costs taxpayers about $2.3 million. That is about three times the cost of imprisoning someone in a single cell at the highest security level for 40 years. ("Executions Cost Texas Millions," Dallas Morning News, March 8, 1992)."

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/costs-death-penalty

Can we finally lay to rest the false assumption that it would be cheaper to execute someone than it would to give them a life sentence? That is not a valid argument. It is an ignorant belief and if you are someone who supports the death penalty, and you have not done your due diligence in researching the costs of this program - at both the state and federal level - you are being irresponsible. The state is killing individuals in our name and you inaccurately believe it is saving the state money by doing so; this is false.

waste him quick

Lethal injection would be to quick and easy for him. Life without parole and maybe a recording of the victims and their families impact statements to come on over a speaker in his cell on every few hours for the rest of of his life. Then we he breaks we can learn what makes people snap like this

It might be giving him what he wants by putting him on death row.
Lock him up for good and let that be it.

If it actually stopped people from doing these murders i would be all for putting him down but it will not stop people who have strong beliefs or have serious mental issues.

My main issue with cases like this is the media naming the shooter, Why give them what they want ? The recent Manchester case being a example of someone looking for all the attention good or bad he could get.

SocSocPol wrote:

What has executing anybody ever accomplished?
I'll tell you what it accomplished, the feckers have never committed another crime after they were executed.
For preferance I would bring back hanging.

asherbassad wrote: »

Neither have those who have been locked up for life.

Wrong.

A prisoner locked up for life can still commit crimes IN PRISON. People are murdered and raped in prisons around the world on a daily basis. A lot of the time it's Prison Officers, Doctors treating prisoners, Visitors, or just simply non-violent criminals who are the victims.

Prisoners also have access to phones, and even the internet and can get others to carry out dirty deeds for them from the inside.

There is also the chance that a prisoner can escape.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-18621232

The ONLY 100% guaranteed way to ensure a criminal does not reoffend is the death penalty.

I ask this genuinely cos I dont know ... when undergoing psychiatric evaluation - is it considered that these **** ups have already factored in the "he's insane" defence to avoid being tried as "normal" ...

MagicMarker wrote: »

So you think we should execute all prisoners?

Clearly.

I was simply pointing out the fact that the only was to guarantee a 0% reoffence rate was by execution. I didn't proffer any stance for or against the death penalty. I thought that was quite obvious from my post, and I'm not sure how you jumped to the conclusion that you did.

regardless of mental illness or no,life without parole plus hard labor.

much more preferably stick him in tent city- http://www.mcso.org/JailInformation/TentCity.aspx its one hell of an amazing jail,its featured on the 'americas toughest prisons' series [or whatever its called], its extreme living outdoors in the blistering sun and heat, on crummy bunks where people hide shanks all the time and beat each other up,no mod cons like our jails,and they have to go work whilst chained to each other-so if one makes a bid for freedom they all fall on their tits-not to mention theirs some hefty dudes with big shotguns stood next to them all the time if remember the doc correctly.

ireland and england need something like that,our weather may be freezing in comparison to arizona but that can easily be accomodated for,our prisoners werent sissy enough to commit crimes so they shoudnt be sissy enough to live in a tent city doing hard labour.

i voted no cause i honestly dont know enough about this case and this person.
has he all his facultys about him im not sure, so i reserve judgement until i know all the facts

Tommy87 wrote: »

Octavarian- so do u think the families of the murdered people should pay for him to live in jail for the rest of his life???

I generally don't agree with the death penalty, because innocent people have been executed, but in this case he is definatly a mass murderer of innocent women and children. Cold blooded murder. IMO he deserves to die.

Whether or not he gets the death penalty will make no difference to the amount of taxes that the families pay.

Somehow I doubt he'd even care if he was sentenced to the death penalty. On the other hand, life in solitary confinement would be pointless. Both solutions would ultimately achieve nothing, so in the end I go with the side that doesn't involve more murder.

Piriz wrote: »

Having worked in a forensic mental hospital in the US and been involved in the rehabilitation of murders and the mentally ill who have committed lesser crimes; this man if deemed mentally ill (with psychosis) during this killing spree should not receive the death penalty.

Individuals who commit murders during a psychotic episode and end up in forensic rehabilitation hospitals do have the ability to become rehabilitated, express remorse, be understood and be treated with respect. However such individuals are treated ultra conservatively, with medication and therapy regimes and constant supervision in inpatient locked units in hospitals for a long time.
After years to decades of this they may be deemed eligible to be reintegrated to the community although continually monitored by psychiatric healthcare professionals.
In the case of James Holmes and those like him he would have very little freedom ever again in a forensic healthcare setting. This is the most positive outcome for him if he was indeed psychotic... which i suspect he was/is.

Psychotic illness can occur in any of us particularly at James Holmes age...It is devastating for all concerned...

Not half as devastating as having your 6 year old shot in the back at a film though.