Interesting letter from the Irish Times letters page

Temaz · 02-07-2012 11:24AM #1

Am I alone in sensing a sense of entitlement?!?!?!

Sir, – I write to you out of frustration and sadness. Like so many other Irish graduates, it appears that I am destined for the shores of some other land, rather than the place which I call home.

I did all the right things. Having studied Law at UCC, I graduated with a 2.1. Believing that this three-year degree might not suffice, I decided to complete a Masters degree in my chosen discipline. I am now left in the unfortunate position of not wanting to be either a solicitor or barrister. Rejection letters from past, alternative job applications have oft-stated my lack of “real-life” experience. My struggle is against the idea that one must now work for free in order to gain the experience necessary for meaningful employment.

Letters after your name, though they don’t come cheap, won’t earn you a living, it seems.

So, to my family and friends, who supported me through years of schooling and third-level education, it is with a heavy heart that I contemplate leaving. It feels like I have let you down. And to a Government that allowed my home, my country, exhaust itself of opportunities for young graduates such as myself – I have no problem in bidding you adieu. – Yours, etc,

AVRIL MCDOWELL,

Montenotte,

Cork.

tenandtracer · 02-07-2012 11:25AM

where is she from?

Cookie_Monster · 02-07-2012 11:27AM

Don't be upset, just do it already, see how much better anywhere else is.

Temaz · 02-07-2012 11:27AM

tenandtracer wrote: »

where is she from?

I hail from the same county:cool:

Red_Wake · 02-07-2012 11:28AM

It's a sad day when you read about a young girl like this having to leave the country and doesn't even include a pic of herself.

Jaxxy · 02-07-2012 11:28AM

Bye bye!

FatherLen · 02-07-2012 11:29AM

so what is the issue op? do you sympathize with this girl or are you claiming she has a undeserved sense of entitlement?

JohnMarston · 02-07-2012 11:32AM

FatherLen wrote: »

so what is the issue op? do you sympathize with this girl or are you claiming she has a undeserved sense of entitlement?

Read the first line before the article

And no, i dont think her expectations were unreasonable

nibtrix · 02-07-2012 11:32AM

She went to college for 3-5 years and now doesn't WANT to work in that discipline - and she's complaining that no-one else will hire her because she doesn't have any experience?!?

She's not willing to do an intership, instead assuming that because of her qualifications she will walk into a paying job in a completely different area.

:pac:

chin_grin · 02-07-2012 11:33AM

One sounds like one should get one.

Red_Wake · 02-07-2012 11:33AM

JohnMarston wrote: »

Read the first line before the article

And no, i dont think her expectations were unreasonable

I'd have a lot more sympathy if she wasn't intent on being a barrister/solicitor - closed professions if ever there were any.

noddyone2 · 02-07-2012 11:34AM

Awww.

Temaz · 02-07-2012 11:34AM

nibtrix wrote: »

She went to college for 3-5 years and now doesn't WANT to work in that discipline - and she's complaining that no-one else will hire her because she doesn't have any experience?!?

She's not willing to do an intership, instead assuming that because of her qualifications she will walk into a paying job in a completely different area.

:pac:

NAIL HEAD

nibtrix · 02-07-2012 11:35AM

Red_Wake wrote: »

I'd have a lot more sympathy if she wasn't intent on being a barrister/solicitor - closed professions if ever there were any.

From the article - she doesn't want to be a solicitor or barrister - she wants to do something else but has no experience (and presumably no relevant qualifications).

FatherLen · 02-07-2012 11:35AM

JohnMarston wrote: »

Read the first line before the article

And no, i dont think her expectations were unreasonable

i read the entire post

if you had of read my post more carefully you would have noticed i used the word undeserved. my question was if the op felt this girl was undeserving of entitlement.

Morlar · 02-07-2012 11:36AM

She should understand that there is a long line of Irish people who have been forced, due to economic circumstances, to do the very same thing going back generation after generation. Unfortunately this country has always had other priorities. It's ironic that this country is so accomodating to non eu immigrants while simultaneously forcing our own to leave.

Merkin · 02-07-2012 11:39AM

Eh, I'm not sure what she expects exactly. She did a Law undergraduate degree, then a post-grad in a law-related discipline and then decides after depriving two students who may have their heart set on these courses of places on said courses that she is not interested in law after all. Then she is wondering why the various corporate entities and institutions she applied to aren't jumping up and down with enthusiasm that she joins them in a paid job simply because she chose to do a law degree she doesn't want.

The mind boggles. Let's also hope her grammar is margianally better in her application letters than it is in the letter to the Times....

Pedant · 02-07-2012 11:40AM

Well from what I know, the law profession in Ireland is ten-a-penny at the moment. There are just too many law graduates and there aren't enough apprenticeship positions available. The only people who get in the door seem to be those who have family or other contacts in the business. It's not about what you know but who you know in the legal profession.

Saying that, a law degree is very good is you want to transfer over into the business world.

A friend of mine has a law degree from Trinity, as well as a masters, and got 580 in her Leaving Cert and she still hasn't been able to get an apprenticeship. She said she know people who just did the DIT conversion course with a primary degree in Arts and were able to get apprenticeship but it turned out their parents were solicitors so they had connections.

If you want to get into these professions and have no contacts, it wouldn't be a bad idea to join a political party just to get contacts or be involved in lots of societies ... joining the Freemasons wouldn't be a bad idea either.

Red_Wake · 02-07-2012 11:40AM

nibtrix wrote: »

From the article - she doesn't want to be a solicitor or barrister - she wants to do something else but has no experience (and presumably no relevant qualifications).

They should respect her qualifications mate.

They didn't come cheap y'know.:pac:

Dravokivich · 02-07-2012 11:44AM

I think what she is so over-eloquently trying to put across is that she can't get a job without previously having a job.

The jobs rejecting her could have been very low entry jobs. But with the way the unemployment is now, they know there are experienced people available in the same pool to fish from.

Would you rather her scrounge on the dole?

Jester252 · 02-07-2012 11:47AM

I kinda like her little pop at the government. Its not like they help pay for the third level education that she now doesn't want

Penn · 02-07-2012 11:47AM

So she's complaining about not being able to get a job she doesn't want anyway?

opinion guy · 02-07-2012 11:47AM

Red_Wake wrote: »

I'd have a lot more sympathy if she wasn't intent on being a barrister/solicitor - closed professions if ever there were any.

Well how do you konw she is not from a poor background ? I've heard it said by fellow cynics that the reason solicitors and barristers have to work for almost nothing for their first few years is to keep out those who don't have family means.
Perhaps she is a victim of this ?

nibtrix wrote: »

She went to college for 3-5 years and now doesn't WANT to work in that discipline - and she's complaining that no-one else will hire her because she doesn't have any experience?!?

She's not willing to do an intership, instead assuming that because of her qualifications she will walk into a paying job in a completely different area.

:pac:

This whole internship thing has become a dark stain on the Irish nation. Imported from America by Fine Gael and Labour.
People doing and honest days work for large corporations should be getting paid, even if they are learning and even if its only minimum wage.
This unpaid internship lark is little more than coerced bondage.

Pedant · 02-07-2012 11:48AM

nibtrix wrote: »

She went to college for 3-5 years and now doesn't WANT to work in that discipline - and she's complaining that no-one else will hire her because she doesn't have any experience?!?

She's not willing to do an intership, instead assuming that because of her qualifications she will walk into a paying job in a completely different area.

:pac:

The thing is, you have do to an internship to become a solicitor/barrister - but they're extremely hard to come by. You don't just get hired as a solicitor/barrister. You have to pass the professional exams then an apprenticeship to qualify as a solicitor/barrister. If you can't find an apprenticeship, you're fucked. A law degree isn't good enough, in fact you don't even need a law degree to become a solicitor/barrister just a primary degree.

I think it's the case that the girl wasn't able to get an internship/apprenticeship position and now is considering changing to do something else. Unfortunately this is a position many law graduates have to face.

Temaz · 02-07-2012 11:50AM

opinion guy wrote: »

Well how do you konw she is not from a poor background ?

Montenotte is a very affluent area in Cork, I doubt she's on the breadline.

Red_Wake · 02-07-2012 11:51AM

opinion guy wrote: »

Well how do you konw she is not from a poor background ? I've heard it said by fellow cynics that the reason solicitors and barristers have to work for almost nothing for their first few years is to keep out those who don't have family means.
Perhaps she is a victim of this ?

Montenotte's a posh area in Cork.

She doesn't cite financial issues, so I'd assume there are none.

I'd say she's Alison O' Riordan part deux, tbh.

smash · 02-07-2012 11:52AM

Pedant wrote: »

I think it's the case that the girl wasn't able to get an internship/apprenticeship position and now is considering changing to do something else. Unfortunately this is a position many law graduates have to face.

That's all well and good, but she doesn't have to move out of the country to change her career path. With qualifications like that she'd get a job no problem in the business end of a large multinational like google etc.

HoggyRS · 02-07-2012 11:52AM

It's hard to feel bad for law students when they are such absolute benders in college.

El Tarangu · 02-07-2012 11:53AM

Temaz wrote: »

Am I alone in sensing a sense of entitlement?!?!?!

Nope, I thought the same thing myself.

Pedant · 02-07-2012 11:57AM

smash wrote: »

That's all well and good, but she doesn't have to move out of the country to change her career path. With qualifications like that she'd get a job no problem in the business end of a large multinational like google etc.

Maybe she can't find a job here in Ireland. Maybe jobs are so scarce that HR are allowed to be very picky with their applicants and choose only people with business backgrounds.

smash · 02-07-2012 11:59AM

Pedant wrote: »

Maybe she can't find a job here in Ireland. Maybe jobs are so scarce that HR are allowed to be very picky with their applicants and choose only people with business backgrounds.

I doubt it. I'd say the sense of entitlement is getting in the way again... "Oh I'm too good for that job" kind of attitude.

Interesting letter from the Irish Times letters page

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