Assault on Washington St - Gardai did not care

grenache · 27-06-2012 02:29AM #1

I was in town less than an hour ago, when walking up Washington St, i see two druggie type scumbags set upon on two young guys outside the Daybreak shop. For no apparent reason. They really took a pasting too. One of the scumbags had a guy pinned down to the side of the kerb, and was continually kicking him in the head. And i mean really hard, i thought he would kill him. The other scummer was throwing punches at the second young guy, they looked like students.

The scummers soon stopped and wandered down the street towards Grand Parade. Before they reached it, a paddywagon arrived on the scene, and this is were it becomes farcical. A bangarda starts to question the two druggies while the students, who had chased after them, are very animated and extremely pi$$ed off. Another guard is dealing with them. So i stepped in, decided to give a statement since i was one of a few people who saw the whole incident.

I've never seen a group of guards less interested in taking a bunch of thugs to task over an assault. Now to be fair, the victims were pretty upset, but all the guards seemed more interested in telling them to shut up and sticking their heads in their faces. I gave my statement, telling them exactly what happened. They let the two scummers go free, probably to assault some other poor misfortune, and continue to tell the two poor lads to shut up, that they need to make a complaint if they want anything to be done about it! As if two battered students and witness statement was not enough to lock those two thugs up for the night.

I've heard many stories about guards not doing their jobs and not caring, but this one took the biscuit. When i asked why were they letting them walk off after assaulting people i was told by one garda that "evidently you don't know anything about the law". If that's what "law and order" is in 2012, i absolutely give up on this state. After this incident i now have zero faith in our policing force. When they cannot be trusted to protect people from being beaten up in the street, what's the point in having them there at all? There's one rule for the scum of society and a very different rule for upstanding citizens. It was a disgrace. An utter disgrace.

"Guardians of the Peace" - you're having a laugh.

Chris.Buckley · 27-06-2012 04:14AM

They're an utter joke to be fair! Today I saw a pair of them (beangarda driving) cruising around with the radio on, barely looking where she was going. and a few weeks ago, I was walking home at about 11, the street was relatively empty and a garda drove passed me. I gave a polite kindof half wave because I saw he was looking at me as he passed. about 20 seconds later he pulls up beside me and asks do I require assistance? I said no, I was just waving, and he tells me that I shouldn't be wasting police time..

RoverZT · 27-06-2012 04:23AM

Only good for driving around and catching people with no road tax.

I have no respect for them.

Let me down so many times in the past.

zenno · 27-06-2012 04:29AM

It sounds like it was the two scumbag Gardai that need to be interviewed in this case (if this is all correct) an assault happened and the two Gardai let the attackers go free, strange alright.

Chris.Buckley · 27-06-2012 05:10AM

you didn't by any chance get their names? or badge numbers?

mikemac1 · 27-06-2012 05:25AM

Go above their heads, write a letter to the super

If you don't have their badge number that's ok, dates and locations and the sergeant will know whose these two lazy sods are

Though I don't know if the super will ever reply to you

You might meet the blue wall of silence

Worth a try

zenno · 27-06-2012 06:01AM

Their badge number and area location is on their right and left shoulder pad, as in (example Dublin: RB which is romeo bravo and is the location of swords) CA 1 or 2 or higher which would be charlie alpha 1 and so on. If you ever have a problem, the first thing to focus your eye in on is the badge number and write down the time as that will save you hastle and time. In cork it's no different. badge number always, and you have the time of said crime so all easily traced to the garda that was on duty at the time.

ButtersSuki · 27-06-2012 06:17AM

zenno wrote: »

Their badge number and area location is on their right and left shoulder pad, as in (example Dublin: RB which is romeo bravo and is the location of swords) CA 1 or 2 or higher which would be charlie alpha 1 and so on. If you ever have a problem, the first thing to focus your eye in on is the badge number and write down the time as that will save you hastle and time. In cork it's no different. badge number always, and you have the time of said crime so all easily traced to the garda that was on duty at the time.

A woman I know went out with a Garda a few years ago for a while. If she went out with her friends while he was on duty she would ring him as the pub/club closed and he would bring her home using the Squad car as a taxi. His area was the city centre, she lived in Portmarmock!!!! Good use of police time and resources at a potentially troublesome time of the night! This was not a once off, this happened quite regularly. She thought it was hilarious, I didn't.

Marquis de carabas · 27-06-2012 08:21AM

There is no power of arrest for section 2 assault and they're not going to arrest for section 3 until there is a written statement of complaint. Nearly always for an assault this is the following day as often alcohol is involved.

Their job, as they didn't witness it, is to verify who everyone is and gather evidence not decide who was right and who was wrong. That's for the court to decide.

Amazingly, despite all the outrage here, this is for peoples protection. You wouldn't like it if someone could just turn around and accuse you of committing a crime and the guards would just arrest you. There are set procedures.

Yes two lads were assaulted and yes the two lads accused looked like scumbags and yes we could all make up our own minds about who did what and who was right and wrong. But we expect better then that from guards.

But not to worry. If they had acted as the op wished there'd be another thread in place instead of this one about Guards arresting two disadvantaged young lads for no reason.

grenache · 27-06-2012 08:42AM

Marquis de carabas wrote: »

There is no power of arrest for section 2 assault and they're not going to arrest for section 3 until there is a written statement of complaint. Nearly always for an assault this is the following day as often alcohol is involved.

Their job, as they didn't witness it, is to verify who everyone is and gather evidence not decide who was right and who was wrong. That's for the court to decide.

Amazingly, despite all the outrage here, this is for peoples protection. You wouldn't like it if someone could just turn around and accuse you of committing a crime and the guards would just arrest you. There are set procedures.

Yes two lads were assaulted and yes the two lads accused looked like scumbags and yes we could all make up our own minds about who did what and who was right and wrong. But we expect better then that from guards.

But not to worry. If they had acted as the op wished there'd be another thread in place instead of this one about Guards arresting two disadvantaged young lads for no reason.

The law is an ass in that case. I say this because one of the male gardai said that they knew the scumbags well. They obviously have previous. That means they should have been arrested. Full stop. I wonder how the guards would have reacted if the victims were girls or an old couple. Young males seem to be afforded no protection by our wonderful police force.

I noticed that one of the cop's badge shoulder was 'DA', didn't get the number though. I did also obtain the reg plate of the paddywagon.

leahyl · 27-06-2012 08:49AM

I'm actually not at all suprised by this - the guards are a waste of ****ing space most of the time. Was listening to Joe Duffy's radio show there the other day and seriously, Dublin, by all accounts, is like a jungle. One girl had part of her nostril bitten off by another 'girl' in an attack last Saturday a night (same night that Eugene Moloney was set upon and killed by those mindless thugs). The guards are meant to be patrolling the streets looking out for this sort of thing. Then you get the "oh they don't have the manpower" - if they don't why aren't they up in arms (no pun intended) about it! At least make some noise about it if ye don't have the resources.:mad:

Instead, all they do is drive around in their 2012 cars and watch as everything kicks off! Absolute disgrace!

Now there are obviously some guards who are an exception to the rule and are trying their best but by and large....

It seems to be the case now that the victims of these assaults are the ones to blame while the actual assailant(s) gets off scot free:rolleyes:

trixie_belle12 · 27-06-2012 08:56AM

Chris.Buckley wrote: »

They're an utter joke to be fair! Today I saw a pair of them (beangarda driving) cruising around with the radio on, barely looking where she was going. and a few weeks ago, I was walking home at about 11, the street was relatively empty and a garda drove passed me. I gave a polite kindof half wave because I saw he was looking at me as he passed. about 20 seconds later he pulls up beside me and asks do I require assistance? I said no, I was just waving, and he tells me that I shouldn't be wasting police time..

wasting police time? seriously...

Marquis de carabas · 27-06-2012 08:57AM

grenache wrote: »

The law is an ass in that case. I say this because one of the male gardai said that they knew the scumbags well. They obviously have previous. That means they should have been arrested. Full stop. I wonder how the guards would have reacted if the victims were girls or an old couple. Young males seem to be afforded no protection by our wonderful police force.

I noticed that one of the cop's badge shoulder was 'DA', didn't get the number though. I did also obtain the reg plate of the paddywagon.

The law is the way it is. There's no point blaming the Guard just because he follows it. If you don't agree with it its your local TD you need to talk to.

Yes the Guards could have made up a reason to arrest them but they'd have been wrong to do so. Of course they know what happened, just as they know who deals drugs and who breaks in to houses. But ten years of reform means that few Guards are going to risk their jobs just to placate your moral outrage at the state of society.

If you have the reg of the van and the date you'll find the Guards easy enough. There'll be an incident recorded anyway. So if you feel they really did wrong then you should make a complaint to the Garda Ombudsman.

davetherave · 27-06-2012 09:04AM

If the two guys didn't want to press charges or go back to the station to give statements then there is not a whole lot that the Gardai could have done, as marquis said.

grenache · 27-06-2012 09:10AM

davetherave wrote: »

If the two guys didn't want to press charges or go back to the station to give statements then there is not a whole lot that the Gardai could have done, as marquis said.

I'm pretty sure they did want to press charges. From what they said i think they also intend on making a complaint about the Guards handling of the situation. In fairness they showed them little empathy which was the most galling thing.

Judes · 27-06-2012 09:12AM

There are more and more areas of this City becoming "no go zones" and yet no Gardai are ever on view in these areas.

I have never seen so much graffiti on the walls - gangs hanging around - beer cans on the pavements - prostitues hanging around street corners (especially near colleges) - yet, no Gardai. Why are they not patrolling such areas. I reckon if Gardai Patrol Cars or Vans were parked on more dangerous streets - then those committing the crimes would soon leave the area. I know they would move somewhere else - but just keep following them to make their lives difficult - instead of ours!

We need to reclaim our city and our streets before we become as bad as Dublin. Maybe "we" the people of Ireland need to voice our concerns more than just in Boards. Yes, it's a great place to start - but write into the newspapers, write to TD's and Councillors.

We need to feel safe and Gardai visibility may help and I don't mean 1 or 2 walking "the beat" I mean gangs of Gardai vs. gangs of Thugs!

FTA69 · 27-06-2012 09:19AM

Unfortunately all this is a very common occurrence and often the response of the cops towards street violence in the city centre is lacklustre to say the least. I remember while doing the doors in town my colleagues had to restrain a drugged-up Lithuanian and his buddies after he proceeded to assault a member of staff in the venue. While the lads were holding this fella down I legged it 100 yards up the road to where a police van was parked on Washington St. Upon explaining that there was a mass brawl in progress I was told someone will be along to deal with it; despite me repeatedly protesting that it was 20 seconds away from where they were now. They then kept stating "someone'll be along shortly" before winding up the window and driving off.

In another occasion I was working security at an event at the old Beamish brewery directly opposite Bishop Lucey Park. A fight broke out between a group of scumbags in the park whereupon one fella got severely battered before his assailant tried to drown him in the fountain. Midway through this an Eastern European group of two women and a man were walking by when some of the scum set upon them and began to savagely assault one of the women, with one man kicking her in the face as she was bent over knocking out a tooth. I called the cops repeatedly and all they sent literally a half hour later was one shade on a bike, the scum were actually still sat in the park whereupon the guard spoke to him through the railings, (didn't get off the bike or take off his helmet) before speeding off.

Ridiculous to say the least.

chainsawman · 27-06-2012 09:22AM

There were four Gardai and two detectives living in my area... Two next doors of Detectives houses was broken in and burgled and the other two near one Gardai House was also broken in... The thieves knows they will get away with it. I will give you another example. I know a guy who was charged with attempted murder awaiting trial, he broke into few house and got arrested, I asked him why he do that for, when his trial is coming soon, he said to me, that charge will be only be sentenced concurrently on top of his previous offence, At the trial, he got away from everything .. Seems they know the law more than the good lawabiding people . You cant blame the Gardai, their hands is tied by the law...It is the politicians responsible to amend the law to protect innocent lawabiding people.

leahyl · 27-06-2012 09:30AM

chainsawman wrote: »

There were four Gardai and two detectives living in my area... Two next doors of Detectives houses was broken in and burgled and the other two near one Gardai House was also broken in... The thieves knows they will get away with it. I will give you another example. I know a guy who was charged with attempted murder awaiting trial, he broke into few house and got arrested, I asked him why he do that for, when his trial is coming soon, he said to me, that charge will be only be sentenced concurrently on top of his previous offence, At the trial, he got away from everything .. Seems they know the law more than the good lawabiding people . You cant blame the Gardai, their hands is tied by the law...It is the politicians responsible to amend the law to protect innocent lawabiding people.

Absolutely - these thugs know exactly what their 'rights' are and what they can get away with. Absolute disgrace.

Remember a few years back - that 'Minister for Justice' banging on about zero tolerance - lol:rolleyes:

27-06-2012 09:42AM

grenache wrote: »

I was in town less than an hour ago, when walking up Washington St, i see two druggie type scumbags set upon on two young guys outside the Daybreak shop. For no apparent reason. They really took a pasting too. One of the scumbags had a guy pinned down to the side of the kerb, and was continually kicking him in the head. And i mean really hard, i thought he would kill him. The other scummer was throwing punches at the second young guy, they looked like students.

..........

Considering the students were fully mobile seconds after the incident it can't be as bad as you describe. YOu weren't at all inclined to intervine... ?

FTA69 · 27-06-2012 09:46AM

RoverJames wrote: »

Considering the students were fully mobile seconds after the incident it can't be as bad as you describe. YOu weren't at all inclined to intervine... ?

That's nonsense. I've seen scores of serious assaults over the years, it's possible to take a horrific beating and still be capable of walking or running immediately after. Secondly I've also heard a lot of hard talk about intervening in street assaults but when confronted with the reality of it the vast, vast majoirty of people sit on their holes and do nothing about it. Fact.

Nobody can be blamed for not diving into the middle of a scrap involving a pair of scumbags.

27-06-2012 10:18AM

.... multiple hard kicks to the head that had the OP thinking the lad would be killed. I asked a question, that's not hard talk btw.

Judes · 27-06-2012 11:02AM

I learned a very valuable lesson years ago - when it comes to assisting - Don't - unless you have back up.

I was standing at Parnell Place Bus Station - on a bright sunny afternoon - when I saw a man screaming at a woman and punching her continually - I looked around me at all the men/women of different ages standing there doing nothing - at the time I was about 22. So I approached this man roaring at him to stop that I was contacting the gardai (this is pre-mobile phone time). I thought to myself well I'm surrounded by people so somebody may just back me up, or call the gardai from the phone in bus station if it looks worse (how gullible was I ?!*).

So there was I feeling stupidly brave and would have jumped in to help that woman - not thinking of the danger to myself at the time - but what happens, as I got closer - she turned on me and started screaming abuse at me to F..k Off etc. etc. and then she went off with him. I stood there stunned.

In those days I wouldn't have thought of knives/guns etc. but unfortunately these days we do. We are living in a crime ridden society where life does't seem to be worth much to some - and they will stab you at a blink. So while it is admirable to want to assist and protect somebody - I really think that you have to protect yourself first. The OP did go for Gardai assistance - he himself could have been assaulted if he had intervened.

But if the Gardai aren't going to do anything then maybe it's time to copy the Americans - I can't remember what they were called - but that group in berets who walked around - not quite vigilante - but like "big brothers" watching out for you.

Steoob · 27-06-2012 11:24AM

Marquis de carabas is the only person talking sense about this situation in this thread. You have absolutely no idea why the scumbags were beating up those lads. I work on washington street and finish work between 11 and 1am every night, and the entire street is full of kids who behave worse than the scumbags do. Its a fairly generalising statement, but the two lads could easily just have come from pissing on one of the scumbags or throwing a burger in their faces. Ive seen both of these things, one almost happened to me but I threatened the kid fairly sternly while he had his langer in my face while I was sitting down smoking out the back. Had he actually gone through with it then I would have been the scumbag who was beating the **** out of him and I certainly wouldnt expect to be arrested. So while that may be quick to generalise, so are your thoughts about the scumbags.

And also I'm sure the lads went up to the gardai showing not a shred of respect and thats why they were being told to shut up. They were probably roaring drunkenly in their faces. See it every weekend.

seachto7 · 27-06-2012 11:34AM

prob got their hollister tops ripped and their bieber quiffs ruffled..

Seriously though, who knows why it kicked off. I would be slow to intervene, but the gardai are as much use as chocolate fireguards sometimes. Saying that I have seen a good few of them in Limk rough up some scumbags.... They're not all bad...

charlemont · 27-06-2012 05:22PM

Yea I was walking past by the Grand Parade around that time and heard a lot of shouting from Washington Street, Didn't realise there was an assault going on.

grenache · 27-06-2012 06:28PM

RoverJames wrote: »

Considering the students were fully mobile seconds after the incident it can't be as bad as you describe. YOu weren't at all inclined to intervine... ?

No they were not mobile and up again seconds after the assault. It was a minute or more. They were taking quite a beating. The smaller of the two was curled up in a ball like a hedgehog, trying his best to protect his head while a junkie was kicking him in the head and chest areas. I saw it from across the road, he was helped up by a few other witnesses. After a pause of about a minute, the lads tore down the road after the two assailants. You would be suprised what andrenalin can do to the body.

I was not prepared to step in, as it was quite obvious that the perpretraitors were junkies and i didn't particularly wish to engage with these types as they could easily pull a syringe or worse on me. I have stepped in previously to stop fights between students. But with drugged up scumbags, no thanks.

I rang Mayfield station when i couldn't get through to Anglesea St. I did my civic duty. Just a pity our gardai can't do theirs.

MultiUmm · 27-06-2012 06:54PM

Regardless of whether both parties knew each other or not or if they came into contact previously, if OP's description is accurate two guys were viciously beaten by a pair of thugs and nothing was actually done about it. Even if the Gardaí were only acting in the confines of the law by not arresting the accused party, it still seems like a pretty big failing of the law to me if someone can go out, violently assault someone else and then walk off scot-free possibly to attack someone else.

Does the same attitude apply to European countries? I.e, the police having a seemingly laissez-faire attitude to assault? Somehow I imagine this is another example of Ireland and it's soft-touch attitude to criminals.

I'm going to be far more wary and uneasy walking down Washington St. at night now I think.

Also, is it any wonder that there's such a high level of assaults in this country if the guards can't even detain the people perpetrating these acts?

charlemont · 27-06-2012 07:15PM

And if as the OP say's they were junkies then those Gardaí would have been well aware of who they were dealing with...

Junkie's are getting away with far too much.

castie · 27-06-2012 11:05PM

Stick to the OP's incident. This thread isnt for everyone to come in garda bashing.

Steba · 28-06-2012 12:45AM

That is absolutely ridiculous, and no doubt it gives gardai a terrible name. But you can't judge an entire organisation on the action of a few of its members.

I'm a potential gardai candidate so I'm gona take a slight defensive stance on this. Let's face it, the public don't see the gardai for what they are, they seem them ( and I'm talking about the majority here ) as an obstacle to their daily routines. You hear 90% of the negative aspects of the gardai, but only a minuscule amount of their positive attributes!

Again, that's disgraceful and the gardai in question shouldn't be on the force. It annoys me because they are so many people trying to join the gardai for the reason that its a stable state run job. But the one's that want to make it a career do actually make a difference.

Assault on Washington St - Gardai did not care

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