Do you consider Ireland a Banana Republic?

Duggys Housemate · 05-06-2012 03:03PM

The whole "things work better abroad" is always toted out by people who don't live abroad. I am stuck on trains out of Paddington on a weekly basis. Someday, in the year 3000 we will work out how to fix the signalling problems in the Reading area. Until then - although redundancy could fix it - it won't be fixed.

Living somewhere is not the same as visiting, and moving around in rush hour is not the same as moving around at other times.

That said, there is - as always in these debates - the same old tired chorus.

1) We cant run ourselves, and
2) WHY ARE THE GERMANS RUNNING US!

If you believe 1) you would opt for 2) . Germany is more efficient than Ireland, the UK seems to be about the same, but people are apparently trying to forget Berlusconi, and Sarcozy, the non-tax paying Greeks, the bribe taking police in most of the world, the bribe taking civil servants in most of the world, the Russian oligarchy, the Mexican drug state etc. etc. etc.

The points made against the Irish government, are generally of incompetence not corruption - Bertie's corruption is minor by world standards - and that they are hand in glove with bankers, but you could say that about allAmerican administrations since the eightie's.

Ireland, top 10 percent.

dvpower · 05-06-2012 03:07PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

Well he was formerly a high ranking individual in the Irish army. How many of the people in Ireland actually found out in massive corruption faced jail?

Why would an army officer have any special knowledge of corruption in Ireland? That's not part of their role at all. This is an arguement from authority that doesn't fly at all.

steddyeddy · 05-06-2012 03:11PM

dvpower wrote: »

Why would an army officer have any special knowledge of corruption in Ireland? That's not part of their role at all. This is an arguement from authority that doesn't fly at all.

Well the facts do fly unfortunatly. How much jail time did haughey, ben dunne, Lowry or any of the others recieve. One of my favouraite articles in I read was an american article about Irish corruption which had the line "Haughey illegally obtained over ten million pounds while in power, he recieved no jail time". The article also questioned how his children and family are in benifit of his criminal assets.

Duggys Housemate · 05-06-2012 03:13PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

Well the facts do fly unfortunatly. How much jail time did haughey, ben dunne, Lowry or any of the others recieve. One of my favouraite articles in I read was an american article about Irish corruption which had the line "Haughey illegally obtained over ten million pounds while in power, he recieved no jail time". The article also questioned how his children and family are in benifit of his criminal assets.

The facts don't fly. These are non flying facts. Unfacts. Here's my link again.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index

Seriously, visit the world. In many countries you have to bribe every official in the land.

steddyeddy · 05-06-2012 03:15PM

Duggys Housemate wrote: »

The facts don't fly. These are non flying facts. Unfacts. Here's my link again.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corruption_Perceptions_Index

Seriously, visit the world. In many countries you have to bribe every official in the land.

Well thats ok then!

05-06-2012 03:16PM

Definately not a banana republic when compared to many third world countries where the leaders are quite happy to allow their people starve while they have private jets, multiple patatial houses and yachts etc, plus of course a whole business community that is on the make with the leaders consent and a private army to keep it that way!

edit: and this

The facts don't fly. These are non flying facts. Unfacts. Here's my link again.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corrupt...ceptions_Index

Seriously, visit the world. In many countries you have to bribe every official in the land.

dvpower · 05-06-2012 03:18PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

Well thats ok then!

Its not OK - we should be aiming to be higher than 19th place, but the idea that we are a banana republic is laughable.

steddyeddy · 05-06-2012 03:19PM

dvpower wrote: »

Its not OK - we should be aiming to be higher than 19th place, but the idea that we are a banana republic is laughable.

I dont think we are a banana republic I never said we were. I think Ireland is a lot more corrupt than people think though.

flutterflye · 05-06-2012 03:20PM

Bananas are quite an interesting fruit really.
Very different to any other fruit.
Most fruits are juicy.
None have the same kind of texture as a banana.
You rarely get banana flavoured sweets either.

Ellis Dee · 05-06-2012 03:22PM

Ireland is not a banana republic. If only it were, at least we'd have some decent sunshine. :rolleyes:

Many moons ago, I was a schoolboy listening to our local TD Oliver J. Flanagan (Charlie's dad) addressing a crowd from the back of a lorry during an election campaign. He was really going on about Eamon De Valera, who was Taoiseach at the time.

He said: "De Valera reminds me of a banana!":D

Someone planted in the crowd dutifully shouted: "How's that, Oliver?":)

"Well, he started off green, and then he turned yella, but he's still crooked." :rolleyes:

The only real connection between today's Ireland and a banana is the sheer crookedness of the place.:(

granturismo · 05-06-2012 03:22PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

.... I think Ireland is a lot more corrupt than people think though.

Yes, but nowhere near as corrupt as Greece, Spain and Italy.

dvpower · 05-06-2012 03:23PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

I dont think we are a banana republic I never said we were. I think Ireland is a lot more corrupt than people think though.

I dunno - the Corruption Perceptions Index is based on what people think.

Since 1995, Transparency International (TI) publishes the Corruption Perceptions Index (CPI) annually ranking countries "by their perceived levels of corruption, as determined by expert assessments and opinion surveys.

Markcheese · 05-06-2012 03:30PM

christmas2012 wrote: »

I still think its a a banana republic because,in the 80's there were no jobs,the 90's was a fake boom,the 00's were back in the depression,so what have our governments done for us is what i am left thinking with regard to the economic state of our country.No job creation as of yet,but they said if you vote lisbon youre voting yes to jobs?!if you vote yes on this current referendum you are voting yes for jobs?!Look at the roads in ireland,gay burn talks about getting roads safer what about all the potholes and bumps on the road if a car hits that at 60 mph??Its all bull****..Which leads me to believe our government is nothing short of a farce,i mean look at all the quangos,as you rightly pointed out jobbridge,a job blocker which sucks what could have been a paid job out of the community,yet our banana government tout this as a positive thing,creating more unemployment?And as for the tax dodgers their good business associates on board this slavery scheme it makes a complete mockery of every irish voter,it shows what our government really think of us..

Ok my few point the 90's wasn't a fake boom it wasn't even a boom till the mid 90's ... The 00's was a fake boom. Every one buying property from each other with borrowed money... It happened cos our politicians are just like their electorate (ie us) ... Road safetywise if the road is ****e SLOW THE F DOWN.. novel I know ....
Job bridge ain't perfect but it ain't all bad, know of a company that's gone through 8 "slaves". All thought it crap work.. 6 of them now have jobs through contacts they got in the job ... What I'm saying is it's better than just rotting on welfare....
Yup the countries full of tax dodgers, and everyone justifies their bit and bitches about everyone else....
It's easy to be a politician and give out... It ain't easy to make changes in this country , in 4 years time we'll get to replace this shower with the previous shower who really shagged us..

bb1234567 · 05-06-2012 03:58PM

Whats a banana republic??

05-06-2012 04:00PM

bb1234567 wrote: »

Whats a banana republic??

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banana_republic

A banana republic is a politically unstable country that economically depends upon the exports of a limited resource (fruits, minerals), and usually features a classed society — a large, impoverished working class and a ruling plutocracy, the rich élites of business, politics, and the military

Doc Ruby · 05-06-2012 04:11PM

Show Time wrote: »

What the f**k are you blabbering on about.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKJRPPA6NBQ

christmas2012 · 05-06-2012 04:50PM

''Yup the countries full of tax dodgers, and everyone justifies their bit and bitches about everyone else....''

I dont feel its good enough to have that attitude of 'yup the countries full of taxdodgers'',so whatdyado attitude..Its just not good enough we should expect better from a government that should be servicing us the public with tax back revenue going into bocked up roads,and whatever else is a danger to the public..

We would be better off without jobbridge as it sucks what could be a paid job right out of the community..

''It's easy to be a politician and give out... It ain't easy to make changes in this country , in 4 years time we'll get to replace this shower with the previous shower who really shagged u''

I agree the original fianna fail crowd were the problem,bertie and crew,but this shower of klepocrats are no different,you dont see the recent petrol scam?the cost of an oil barrel has gone down 40 dollars,yet the price of petrol has gone up,and you dont hear FG complaining as they got their cut and all..
What about the selling of our natural resources when a lot better could have been made of it,there could have been enterprise but no we just sold them for **** all..

And what makes you think the next government will be any different?Were not exactly spoiled for choice..The whole dail is corrupted as bent as a 9 bob note..

Biggins · 05-06-2012 04:59PM

Well we do have a lot of monkey's in the Dail, just ape-ing around likely just playing with their nuts and doing little else!

paddyandy · 05-06-2012 05:12PM

We put 'em there ....because they are ourselves .Mirrors of people we have known and mirrors of ourselves........and there is no other way they would succeed in politics .

christmas2012 · 05-06-2012 06:08PM

It is easy to say we put em there etc,but what choices in politics do we have its an oligarchic klepocracy not a democracy as they claim..

these are the choices:((and NOBODY votes for anybody other than these main parties)

Fianna Fail

Labour

Fine Gael

The odd independant(probably a business shark with his her own greedy-selfish interests)

dvpower · 05-06-2012 06:10PM

christmas2012 wrote: »

It is easy to say we put em there etc,but what choices in politics do we have its an oligarchic klepocracy not a democracy as they claim..

these are the choices:((and NOBODY votes for anybody other than these main parties)

Fianna Fail

Labour

Fine Gael

The odd independant(probably a business shark with his her own greedy-selfish interests)

Why don't you run?

christmas2012 · 05-06-2012 06:24PM

im not a dishonest conniving money grubbing double speak merchant i dont have all the smooth tricks(or not so smooth tricks) they have..

I think it takes a certain type of person to enter a kleptocracy,someone devoid of conscience,who can easily tell bare faced lies to the public and not give one damn about the consequences to the public..

fryup · 05-06-2012 06:25PM

well, when this song was released it most certainly was

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfMwWLnpgGw

dvpower · 05-06-2012 06:30PM

christmas2012 wrote: »

im not a dishonest conniving money grubbing double speak merchant i dont have all the smooth tricks(or not so smooth tricks) they have..

I think it takes a certain type of person to enter a kleptocracy,someone devoid of conscience,who can easily tell bare faced lies to the public and not give one damn about the consequences to the public..

Ok
Carry on whinging from the sidelines so.

christmas2012 · 05-06-2012 06:40PM

Yeah a better idea join and become one of them scuffling for half a seat while you watch the bigwig near the top of the foodchain of that political party have all the say..politics at its best in ireland..Unless you are a relative of jackie healey rae you have no hope here its all nepotism..trust me on that

PinkFly · 05-06-2012 06:42PM

Can Banana man be our leader of I vote yes??

jmayo · 05-06-2012 07:00PM

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

Are we still the largest manufacturers of bananas in the EU ?

I'm not joking it was an amazing tax-dodge

No not tax dodgy, but due to fact that Fyffes, one of the oldest fruit brands in the world, handles almost the entire banana production of Belize, as well as production from Costa Rica, Brazil, Honduras, etc.

Deleted User wrote: »

Didn't Fyyfes shares drop from about 4500 to about 44 cents each a couple of years ago, so probably not anymore.

That could have something to do with EU claiming theyt had a banana cartel.
Oh and they won case against DCC for insider trading, ooops did I say that.

And just to show we are a banana republic the people involved had to be forced to resign, rather than go to jail such as Martha Stewart or Milikan in the US.
Also company share support schemes in the Uk mean you go to jail like Ernest Saunders, whereas in Ireland people like seanie fitzpatrick get to play golf.

flutterflye wrote: »

Bananas are quite an interesting fruit really.
Very different to any other fruit.
Most fruits are juicy.
None have the same kind of texture as a banana.
You rarely get banana flavoured sweets either.

The bananas that we eat is the Cavendish and there is a likelihood that they will become extinct unavailable from disease ?
Thus the EU will have to start all over again with their banana debate. :rolleyes:

steddyeddy · 05-06-2012 07:21PM

dvpower wrote: »

I dunno - the Corruption Perceptions Index is based on what people think.

How prevalent did the Irish think child abuse was until the last decade?

dvpower · 05-06-2012 07:25PM

steddyeddy wrote: »

How prevalent did the Irish think child abuse was until the last decade?

I'm sorry, are you saying that you are aware of massive corruption that isn't recognised by the general population?

Wanna share?

steddyeddy · 05-06-2012 07:28PM

dvpower wrote: »

I'm sorry, are you saying that you aware of massive corruption that isn't recognised by the general population?

Wanna share?

You were saying the people dont think Ireland is corrupt. I was pointing out the flaw in your arguement. Perception and reality dont go hand in hand.

Do you consider Ireland a Banana Republic?

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