Govt Yes Leaflet

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 05:14PM #1

Did anyone else get the govt yes vote leaflet today? Its an info leaflet full of yes arguments but it doesnt say from whom.

Very underhanded, it looks like it was published by the referendum commission and as far as I can see doesn't say who published it. It tells people to go to stabilitytreaty.ie hence I'm assuming its from the govt.

I don't have a camera or a scanner, if anyone does and got this leaflet could they upload it?

PopeBuckfastXVI · 23-05-2012 05:17PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

Did anyone else get the govt yes vote leaflet today? Its an info leaflet full of yes arguments but it doesnt say from whom.

Very underhanded, it looks like it was published by the referendum commission and as far as I can see doesn't say who published it. It tells people to go to stabilitytreaty.ie hence I'm assuming its from the govt.

I don't have a camera or a scanner, if anyone does and got this leaflet could they upload it?

Are any of the arguments in it unfounded, incorrect or misleading?

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 05:20PM

PopeBuckfastXVI wrote: »

Are any of the arguments in it unfounded, incorrect or misleading?

I'm voting No so I don't agree with the arguments but the issue is that it looks like it is independent advice, say from the referendum commission, because it doesn't say who published it.

Its presented as an information leaflet and as far as I remember it doesn't tell you to vote yes or no directly but the arguments are all yes ones if you follow...

The Waltzing Consumer · 23-05-2012 05:22PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

Did anyone else get the govt yes vote leaflet today? Its an info leaflet full of yes arguments but it doesnt say from whom.
?

Is that not a clue? :rolleyes:

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 05:24PM

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

Is that not a clue? :rolleyes:

Help if you read the thread instead of jumping in with smart comments... I said its a govt publication because it links to the govt site... people unfamiliar with things wouldnt know it was a govt leaflet.

The Waltzing Consumer · 23-05-2012 05:27PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

Help if you read the thread instead of jumping in with smart comments... I said its a govt publication because it links to the govt site... people unfamiliar with things wouldnt know it was a govt leaflet.

Does the word Government not help in all this? Are you presuming someone who see's a government leaflet with government links can't understand?

I worry sometimes...

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 05:28PM

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

Does the word Government not help in all this? Are you presuming someone who see's a government leaflet with government links can't understand?

I worry sometimes...

It doesnt say govt.... thats the whole point. But it is a govt one, I'm assuming, because it tells you to go to the govt site.

The Waltzing Consumer · 23-05-2012 05:30PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

It doesnt say govt.... thats the whole point. But it is a govt one, I'm assuming, because it tells you to go to the govt site.

will we call the Gardai or something?

How many front groups does the SWP have? How many front groups have SF also had?

This was widely announced across the media and it has links to the Government site.

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 05:34PM

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

will we call the Gardai or something?

How many front groups does the SWP have? How many front groups have SF also had?

This was widely announced across the media and it has links to the Government site.

http://politico.ie/irish-politics/8506-is-the-governments-referendum-information-campaign-constitutional.html

I take it you havent got one, and dont have a scanner and/or a camera to upload it.
Thanks for all the help.

The Waltzing Consumer · 23-05-2012 05:37PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

http://politico.ie/irish-politics/8506-is-the-governments-referendum-information-campaign-constitutional.html

I take it you havent got one, and dont have a scanner and/or a camera to upload it.
Thanks for all the help.

You're welcome

Notice how you said zero about the actual content of the leaflet, only try to cause some stir about who made it despite being well publicised it was government made and the fact you knew it was the government and the fact it has links to the government websites.

Funny that.

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 05:50PM

The Waltzing Consumer wrote: »

You're welcome

Notice how you said zero about the actual content of the leaflet, only try to cause some stir about who made it despite being well publicised it was government made and the fact you knew it was the government and the fact it has links to the government websites.

Funny that.

Yeah, asking people to upload it had nothing whatsoever to do with people being able to take a look at said content...

The Waltzing Consumer · 23-05-2012 05:52PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

Yeah, asking people to upload it had nothing whatsoever to do with people being able to take a look at said content...

what about a link to the website? or is the leaflet radically different? Does it mention the referendum commission if you think it is trying to mimic it? Where are the similarities? Can you not post a few of them?

K-9 · 23-05-2012 06:13PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

Did anyone else get the govt yes vote leaflet today? Its an info leaflet full of yes arguments but it doesnt say from whom.

Very underhanded, it looks like it was published by the referendum commission and as far as I can see doesn't say who published it. It tells people to go to stabilitytreaty.ie hence I'm assuming its from the govt.

I don't have a camera or a scanner, if anyone does and got this leaflet could they upload it?

Is it the one that can be downloaded on the website?

http://www.stabilitytreaty.ie/index.php/en/media/article/governments_stability_treaty_guide_delivery_underway_to_every_home/

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 06:40PM

K-9 wrote: »

Is it the one that can be downloaded on the website?

http://www.stabilitytreaty.ie/index.php/en/media/article/governments_stability_treaty_guide_delivery_underway_to_every_home/

Nope, its a new one

meglome · 23-05-2012 06:45PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

Did anyone else get the govt yes vote leaflet today? Its an info leaflet full of yes arguments but it doesnt say from whom.

Very underhanded, it looks like it was published by the referendum commission and as far as I can see doesn't say who published it. It tells people to go to stabilitytreaty.ie hence I'm assuming its from the govt.

I don't have a camera or a scanner, if anyone does and got this leaflet could they upload it?

I genuinely hate to get into this who was worst talk but there are posters all over town from groups I have never heard of before and all looking for a no. And there isn't a statement on one of them that isn't a lie or a misdirection.

What we should be really concerned about is whether the contents are factual or not. Are they factual?

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 06:48PM

meglome wrote: »

I genuinely hate to get into this who was worst talk but there are posters all over town from groups I have never heard of before and all looking for a no. And there isn't a statement on one of them that isn't a lie or a misdirection.

What we should be really concerned about is whether the contents are factual or not. Are they factual?

See the link I posted earlier, Eoin Daly explains it rather well...

The Waltzing Consumer · 23-05-2012 06:53PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

See the link I posted earlier, Eoin Daly explains it rather well...

That's from the 25th of April. You said this is a new leaflet and not the one on their website.

Have to say, it is extremely disappointing that you are not actually telling us how it is mimicking the referendum commission or what the content is. We are two pages in and you are trying to make a big deal of something and not disclosing any info about this leaflet.

later12 · 23-05-2012 06:53PM

K-9 wrote: »

Is it the one that can be downloaded on the website?

http://www.stabilitytreaty.ie/index.php/en/media/article/governments_stability_treaty_guide_delivery_underway_to_every_home/

Presumably this was printed by the Oireachtas as opposed to one of the parties?

Is it appropriate to have official insignia on documents which use terms like "good housekeeping" and "renewed confidence" to describe the Treaty - descriptions which are likely to be quite contentious - during a Referendum campaign?

meglome · 23-05-2012 07:04PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

See the link I posted earlier, Eoin Daly explains it rather well...

Didn't read it all but it appears he's complaining that the money was spent and that's it's biased but I can't actually see where it's biased. What is the bias he's concerned about?

And of course that ignores his piece is about the last leaflet and not any new one. Not to mention Sinn Fien complaining about bias I take with large a pinch of salt.

the groutch · 23-05-2012 07:08PM

was it the one delivered along with your polling card?
if so then there might be grounds for complaint.

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 07:08PM

later12 wrote: »

Presumably this was printed by the Oireachtas as opposed to one of the parties?

Is it appropriate to have official insignia on documents which use terms like "good housekeeping" and "renewed confidence" to describe the Treaty - descriptions which are likely to be quite contentious - during a Referendum campaign?

add in, among others, "responsible budgeting".

At least that document says its from the govt, this leaflet doesn't and presents itself as impartial, independent advice when it is anything but.

meglome · 23-05-2012 07:11PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

add in, among others, "responsible budgeting".

At least that document says its from the govt, this leaflet doesn't and presents itself as impartial, independent advice when it is anything but.

We still don't know what's on the fluppin leaflet.

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 07:17PM

meglome wrote: »

We still don't know what's on the fluppin leaflet.

Hopefully someone will upload it, I'm not typing the whole thing out and dont want to be accused of taking things out of context.

Basically it says it will bring investment and jobs, it will ensure responsible budgeting and "good house keeping" leading to reduced debt thus having more to spend on hospitals etc and goes on about the ESM also.

djh2009 · 23-05-2012 07:37PM

meglome wrote: »

We still don't know what's on the fluppin leaflet.

Now you do.

Treatyjpg.jpg

djh2009 · 23-05-2012 07:43PM

While we're at it, can anyone explain why, in the preamble to the main treaty are we referred to as Ireland rather than The Republic Of Ireland. Did we get a united Ireland as part of the deal too ?That might help swing it.lol

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 07:48PM

djh2009 wrote: »

Now you do.

Treatyjpg.jpg

The other side is the same but in Irish

djh2009 · 23-05-2012 07:52PM

Fenian Army wrote: »

The other side is the same but in Irish

I can scan and post that also if anyone wants it.

later12 · 23-05-2012 07:59PM

djh2009 wrote: »

While we're at it, can anyone explain why, in the preamble to the main treaty are we referred to as Ireland rather than The Republic Of Ireland.

The Republic of Ireland is not the name of the country; Ireland is its constitutional name.

djh2009 · 23-05-2012 08:08PM

later12 wrote: »

The Republic of Ireland is not the name of the country; Ireland is its constitutional name.

Thanks for that. The reason I asked is that all the other countries mentioned are listed like "The Republic Of Bulgaria", The Kingdom Of Belgium", etc.

PS : Love your location in your profile.lol

djh2009 · 23-05-2012 08:30PM

When phrases like “Stability for the Euro “, “Good Housekeeping “, “Job creators need currency stability …….to create jobs “(where have we heard that one before, remember Lisbon 2), “ This would provide a safety net against future economic problems” and on , and on are used it’s hardly rocket science to work out what the intention of this “information” leaflet is. And I for one would like to know , who has paid for the production and distribution of this.

Fenian Army · 23-05-2012 08:32PM

djh2009 wrote: »

When phrases like “Stability for the Euro “, “Good Housekeeping “, “Job creators need currency stability …….to create jobs “(where have we heard that one before, remember Lisbon 2), “ This would provide a safety net against future economic problems” and on , and on are used it’s hardly rocket science to work out what the intention of this “information” leaflet is. And I for one would like to know , who has paid for the production and distribution of this.

You have. Its produced by the govt.

Govt Yes Leaflet

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