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Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 11/12 (End of March 2012 onwards)

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  • #4382
    El Inho
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,655 ✭✭✭El Inho


    amiable wrote: »
    ArfkNLoCQAAfOUs.jpg

    kid'll love that photo in the future!

    keeper in the making!


  • #4383
    El Inho
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,655 ✭✭✭El Inho


    Daemonic wrote: »
    Thinking back to the video of them arguing in a hotel reception that was posted around the web at the start of the season, I wonder if Aquilani going out on loan was another blot on Comolli's copybook. Maybe some falling out between the 2 that resulted in Aquilani going from looking content in pre-season to being loaned out again.

    Before anyone asks, absolutely nothing other than a boring Friday afternoon in work has led to the ramblings above.

    fair point...

    but...............

    very possibly Aqua may be willing to return, but I doubt Comolli has much in the day to day running of the squad, and so his departure has little bearing on Aquas return.


  • #4384
    daithijjj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭daithijjj


    Jayob10 wrote: »
    whats the title of that podcast?

    I don't think there will be any dirty laundry aired publicly though, id imagine there'd be some sort of no disclosure clause as part of his "mutual consent" termination.

    Its not online yet but will put up a link asap or you can follow @BobbySoccerRep

    I want to hear it before i make comment but apparently (and its no surprise to me) he talks about 'moneyball' not being right for soccer. Its basically a bit like what stats dont tell you. Motivation of players, their mentality etc. Apparently he says he made a mistake with one player. But will have to hear what is said first.


  • #4385
    Sappy404
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,244 ✭✭✭Sappy404


    eldwaro wrote: »
    heard today carroll is being shipped out on loan as part of a massive team overhaul...that coates rumour is what reminded me...

    heard from a guy who likes his gossip, but often wrong.

    anyone heard anything?

    Makes zero sense to loan him out.


  • #4386
    Jayob10
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,787 ✭✭✭Jayob10


    Daemonic wrote: »
    Thinking back to the video of them arguing in a hotel reception that was posted around the web at the start of the season, I wonder if Aquilani going out on loan was another blot on Comolli's copybook. Maybe some falling out between the 2 that resulted in Aquilani going from looking content in pre-season to being loaned out again.

    Before anyone asks, absolutely nothing other than a boring Friday afternoon in work has led to the ramblings above.

    If anything i'd imagine it was Aquilani pushing for a move home, rather than being unhappy at being told he wasn't wanted.

    I'd imagine he felt unwanted after his first loan move to Juventus. I think I remember reading stories about his family being very reluctant to move back to Liverpool last summer, his wife had given birth in Italy too.

    The club needed to be firm though, hes our player. No point letting him go on a pointless (both financially and in a football sense) loan move where its win win for the recipient club, and lose lose for us.


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  • #4387
    El Inho
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,655 ✭✭✭El Inho


    Sappy404 wrote: »
    Makes zero sense to loan him out.


    id be against it, but just saying ive heard it....

    and if we were bringing a new striker, it would make sense really...

    then try get some old fogie on free or cheap who can be back up.


  • #4388
    Kess73
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,560 ✭✭✭✭Kess73


    djPSB wrote: »
    I would hope that in three years time, when Carroll is 26 that he would be at a similar level to what Dzeko is at now.



    If Carroll was even close to the player that Dzeko was when he was 21,22, or 23 then we would be laughing

    At those ages Dzeko was getting 36 goals in 42 games and 29 goals in 48 games in the Bundesliga.

    Dzeko showed great potential along with being able to consistently score goals against any opposition from a young age, and as he went up against better defences his goal getting seemed to step up a level as well.

    Carroll by 23 has not shown anything like the potential Dzeko had by the time he turned 23. Hell in the Bundesliga season where Dzeko was 21 when he started it and 22 when he finished it he scored almost as many goals as Carroll has scored for Newcastle, Preston and Liverpool in the EPL and Championship.

    No comparison between the two players age for age or in terms of potential they have shown in their careers to date.

    Dzeko has been a genuinely sought talent, whereas Carroll has been an example of the hype given to English players if they have a decent run in the EPL. The 11 goals he scored for Newcastle in the 10/11 season is pretty much what has made his name. Those 11 goals seems to be what qualified him to be called premiership proven.

    His only other career highlight is scoring 19 goals in all comps in the Championship. But if people here write off the French league or the Portoguese league as being a marker of player quality, then the same can be done for the Championship as it is certainly a few levels below the second tier of European leagues.

    I have to admit I was guilty of buying into the Carroll hype and before this season started I went as far as to say that I thought he would outscore Suarez this season and that the disinterested headless chicken player that I saw in the final months of the 10/11 season was one created by time out injured and lack of fitness. I think this season the real Andy Carroll stood up. One that is better suited to a team that will put players around him to do his running and his donkey work for him, as Newcastle were set up at one point.

    But as we have seen with Newcastle, a team that sets itself up around Carroll is a team that scraps to get by and to survive, whereas a team that gets rid of Carroll and those that do his donkey work becomes a team that works together in the true sense of the word team, and that can play clever neat football and attack with pace.


  • #4389
    Leiva
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Leiva


    Comolli FOX Interview.

    From another forum ..
    "Just listened to the Comolli interview on Fox Soccer

    1) Thinks that DoF role is still useful in England

    2) Made a mistake on a player that was "mentally" not strong enough. Any guesses?

    3) Every transfer, no matter how much effort is put in, can be a failure.

    That's the interview in a nutshell

    ...it has to be Carroll, but IMO there is more than just lack of the proper mentality .


  • #4390
    Kess73
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,560 ✭✭✭✭Kess73


    Sappy404 wrote: »
    Makes zero sense to loan him out.

    Agreed. Just like Aquilani I would say either play him or sell him. We gain nothiong by loaning him and no doubt picking uchunk of his wage bill at the same time should he be loaned out.p a


  • #4391
    redzerdrog
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,776 ✭✭✭redzerdrog


    iirc comolli came out with some strange comments after aquilani was loaned something along the lines that aqua is a good player but unfortunetly he plays in the same position as steven gerrard so we had to let him leave.

    Cany remember the exact comment but that was the gist of it. Then Gerrard misses half the season with injury:mad::mad::mad:


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  • #4392
    Kess73
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,560 ✭✭✭✭Kess73


    Leiva wrote: »
    Comolli FOX Interview.

    From another forum ..



    ...it has to be Carroll, but IMO there is more than just lack of the proper mentality .



    You could guess that he means Carroll, but in fairness the same could be said for the other pair of big money English signings as well.


    Would tend to agree that he means Carroll, but Downing would run him a close second imho.


  • #4393
    Leiva
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Leiva


    Kess73 wrote: »

    But as we have seen with Newcastle, a team that sets itself up around Carroll is a team that scraps to get by and to survive, whereas a team that gets rid of Carroll and those that do his donkey work becomes a team that works together in the true sense of the word team, and that can play clever neat football and attack with pace.

    ^^this, this, and this again . with cherries on top, dipped in chocolate, rolled in sugar and finger fed to a pack of hungry lesbians .


  • #4394
    El Inho
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,655 ✭✭✭El Inho


    just going to go ahead and ask...

    but does anyone else feel this overhaul is actually just a little bit likely?


  • #4395
    Handsome Bob
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,905 ✭✭✭✭Handsome Bob


    Kess73 wrote: »
    You could guess that he means Carroll, but in fairness the same could be said for the other pair of big money English signings as well.


    Would tend to agree that he means Carroll, but Downing would run him a close second imho.

    From what I've heard, it is surely Carroll. He wouldn't be the first to insinuate that Carroll's head is all over the place.


  • #4396
    Kess73
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,560 ✭✭✭✭Kess73


    eldwaro wrote: »
    just going to go ahead and ask...

    but does anyone else feel this overhaul is actually just a little bit likely?


    Depends on what you mean by overhaul.

    If you mean that we still need to fill the exact same positions in the first team as we did going into last summer, and that we have to buy for those positions again. Then yes I think there will be another attempt at an overhaul of the first team, with maybe three players bought to step straight into the first team.


    If you mean overhaul in terms of a new manager, backroom staff etc., then I still believe that is going to happen and I think that it might be interesting to watch Kenny when the final whistle goes after the final home game of the season (against Chelsea).

    I'm not in the Kenny out camp, and would be happy to see him stay and and see if he can learn from some of this seasons mistakes, and also to see if he can be ruthless with the current squad. But for some months now I have been singing from only one sheet with regards to this summer, and it is still the same rumour/gossip that I brought up in here last Febuary or so.


  • #4397
    Leiva
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Leiva


    eldwaro wrote: »
    just going to go ahead and ask...

    but does anyone else feel this overhaul is actually just a little bit likely?

    That is the biggest thing that hurts out of all the crap flying around . When I look at the squad and compare it to any team currently above us I get a little pang of concern in my chest, as it obvious to see that we are static and have the potential to slip further backwards unless there is wholesale changes to our squad . which includes moving some players that got bought in the last two windows .

    But its not only changes of personnel as I would like to see players like Gerrard , Carra (obviously) and others weaned out of the squad quickly.
    Then I think of Gerrards performance against Everton and it makes me rethink, but those performances are too few and far between to rely on him to any extent, and I also think we play better without him .

    So to summarise - I think there is massive changes required !


  • #4398
    Nuri Sahin
    Site Banned Posts: 26,456 ✭✭✭✭Nuri Sahin


    I'm a Dzeko fan as anyone who knows me can testify to. Was delighted but not surprised seeing him do well when given a run of games at the start of the season for Man City, but just looking back at his time at Wolfsburg. He was a very good goalscorer for a couple of seasons but he also had a strike partner in Grafite who was an absolute machine in front of goal as well. At the time, they were up there with the best strike partnerships in world football IMO for the games to goals ratio.

    They also had the very underrated Misimovic and Hasebe at the time providing assist after assist. Would have been hard not to be scoring in that team.

    Would I have Dzeko at Liverpool though? Damn right I would. If he started regularly for City he'd be scoring goals again, and with the amount of chances we've created this season and given a run of games I say he could easily do the same for us.


  • #4399
    Kess73
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,560 ✭✭✭✭Kess73


    Handsome Bob wrote: »
    From what I've heard, it is surely Carroll. He wouldn't be the first to insinuate that Carroll's head is all over the place.

    He certainly would not. Pundits and locals have been saying this for quite some time about the guy.


  • #4400
    daithijjj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭daithijjj


    I think people are a little harsh on Downing, ultimately, he was bought to provide chances, he has 'provided' quite well. The price we paid is not his problem, its Comolli's, or was. Comolli's remit, which came from the owners, was, "we have to be smart in the market". We were not, and he lost his job.

    In recent enough times Downing has done quite well, you can put it on Carroll's head all day, its he who has to score or not miss sitters like the start of the second half of the semi final. Downing was great at home to city in the semi, got motm in the final, arguably our best player at QPR. He has done better than some, but he will never win people over if the price is brought into it. He would have a dozen assists minimum imho if we had a Fowler up front, we dont.


  • #4401
    Kess73
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,560 ✭✭✭✭Kess73


    -Ade- wrote: »
    I'm a Dzeko fan as anyone who knows me can testify to. Was delighted but not surprised seeing him do well when given a run of games at the start of the season for Man City, but just looking back at his time at Wolfsburg. He was a very good goalscorer for a couple of seasons but he also had a strike partner in Grafite who was an absolute machine in front of goal as well. At the time, they were up there with the best strike partnerships in world football IMO for the games to goals ratio.

    They also had the very underrated Misimovic and Hasebe at the time providing assist after assist. Would have been hard not to be scoring in that team.

    Would I have Dzeko at Liverpool though? Damn right I would. If he started regularly for City he'd be scoring goals again, and with the amount of chances we've created this season and given a run of games I say he could easily do the same for us.


    The simplest way I can describe the difference between Dzeko and Carroll is something you just touched on in this post.

    Dzeko in a team that creates chances means goals

    Carroll in a team that creates chances does not mean goals.

    I have no doubt that if Carroll was at City this season and Dzeko was at Liverpool that Dzeko would have hoovered up a hell of a lot of the chances that were created and would be ahead of Carroll in terms of goals.


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  • #4402
    Turtyturd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,404 ✭✭✭✭Turtyturd


    amiable wrote: »
    ArfkNLoCQAAfOUs.jpg

    That's a Jay Spearing photoshop waiting to happen if ever I seen one.


  • #4403
    amiable
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,206 ✭✭✭✭amiable


    I've seen some of the players endorsing products on Twitter today

    @FabioAurelio : I tell you what guys, the people at @BUPA are really helping me recover from my injuries


  • #4404
    Turtyturd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,404 ✭✭✭✭Turtyturd


    amiable wrote: »
    I've seen some of the players endorsing products on Twitter today

    @FabioAurelio : I tell you what guys, the people at @BUPA are really helping me recover from my injuries

    The American owner influence?

    Although that's kinda anti-endorsment.


  • #4405
    Kess73
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,560 ✭✭✭✭Kess73


    daithijjj wrote: »
    I think people are a little harsh on Downing, ultimately, he was bought to provide chances, he has 'provided' quite well. The price we paid is not his problem, its Comolli's, or was. Comolli's remit, which came from the owners, was, "we have to be smart in the market". We were not, and he lost his job.

    In recent enough times Downing has done quite well, you can put it on Carroll's head all day, its he who has to score or not miss sitters like the start of the second half of the semi final. Downing was great at home to city in the semi, got motm in the final, arguably our best player at QPR. He has done better than some, but he will never win people over if the price is brought into it. He would have a dozen assists minimum imho if we had a Fowler up front, we dont.


    I agree that the price is not the player's fault, but it is the club's problem. I do think that he has been somewhat unlucky at times because he has put in a good number of balls into the box this season that a proper finisher may have put away. But then again the club spent 35m on a player who is not a proper finisher and 20m on a player who does not seen to be able to link up very well with the more clever players when he sees his crosses not being met by the not finishing striker.


    Comolli it would seem has already paid the price for his involvement in buying players for big money that simply have not done what they were got for. I suppose the question is what do the owners think has to happen this summer in order to get players to do what last summer's crop was meant to do.

    Same manager and new players or new manager and new players?

    Either way we won't have to wait too long now to get some kind of idea as to what the owners think on that given how close we are to the end of the season.


  • #4406
    El Inho
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,655 ✭✭✭El Inho


    Turtyturd wrote: »
    That's a Jay Spearing photoshop waiting to happen if ever I seen one.

    babyjay.jpg

    thank god...

    it's just not study week without getting a photoshop in...just at the death :P


  • #4407
    djPSB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,299 ✭✭✭djPSB


    Kess73 wrote: »
    If Carroll was even close to the player that Dzeko was when he was 21,22, or 23 then we would be laughing

    At those ages Dzeko was getting 36 goals in 42 games and 29 goals in 48 games in the Bundesliga.

    Dzeko showed great potential along with being able to consistently score goals against any opposition from a young age, and as he went up against better defences his goal getting seemed to step up a level as well.

    Carroll by 23 has not shown anything like the potential Dzeko had by the time he turned 23. Hell in the Bundesliga season where Dzeko was 21 when he started it and 22 when he finished it he scored almost as many goals as Carroll has scored for Newcastle, Preston and Liverpool in the EPL and Championship.

    No comparison between the two players age for age or in terms of potential they have shown in their careers to date.

    Dzeko has been a genuinely sought talent, whereas Carroll has been an example of the hype given to English players if they have a decent run in the EPL. The 11 goals he scored for Newcastle in the 10/11 season is pretty much what has made his name. Those 11 goals seems to be what qualified him to be called premiership proven.

    His only other career highlight is scoring 19 goals in all comps in the Championship. But if people here write off the French league or the Portoguese league as being a marker of player quality, then the same can be done for the Championship as it is certainly a few levels below the second tier of European leagues.

    I have to admit I was guilty of buying into the Carroll hype and before this season started I went as far as to say that I thought he would outscore Suarez this season and that the disinterested headless chicken player that I saw in the final months of the 10/11 season was one created by time out injured and lack of fitness. I think this season the real Andy Carroll stood up. One that is better suited to a team that will put players around him to do his running and his donkey work for him, as Newcastle were set up at one point.

    But as we have seen with Newcastle, a team that sets itself up around Carroll is a team that scraps to get by and to survive, whereas a team that gets rid of Carroll and those that do his donkey work becomes a team that works together in the true sense of the word team, and that can play clever neat football and attack with pace.

    I am saying that when Carroll is 26, I would expect him to have a similar goals ratio to what Dzeko has in the PL in his two seasons to date (2 goals last season from January to end of season and 13 this season). I am not comparing his goals ratio from the Bundesliga. This is in one of the best attacking teams in the league surrounded by players like Aguero, Nasri, Silva, Toure etc.

    I think Carroll gets a bit too much stick some times and is made out to be the route cause of our problems when we have average players like Kuyt, Maxi, Spearing etc. in the team each week.


  • #4408
    missingtime
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,942 ✭✭✭missingtime


    I'm all for giving players time but I think we bought a bunch of mediocre players who were stuck in their comfort zones and expected them to gel straight away.


  • #4409
    djPSB
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,299 ✭✭✭djPSB


    missingtime wrote: »
    I'm all for giving players time but I think we bought a bunch of mediocre players who were stuck in their comfort zones and expected them to gel straight away.

    This summers transfer window should be much more productive. Alot of last summer was spent cleaning up the mess that Hodgson left behind.


  • #4410
    opr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,267 ✭✭✭opr


    The loan thing for Coates has come from Duncan Jenkins.

    duncan jenkins ‏ @duncanjenkinsFC
    #lfc are considering loaning out sebastian coats next season, they are concerned about him. i think he has looked good tbh honest mates.

    I guess Kenny/Clarke see him in training every day so they know more but I let out a huge sigh when reading it.

    Opr


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  • #4411
    Leiva
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭✭Leiva


    opr wrote: »
    The loan thing for Coates has come from Duncan Jenkins.

    duncan jenkins ‏ @duncanjenkinsFC
    #lfc are considering loaning out sebastian coats next season, they are concerned about him. i think he has looked good tbh honest mates.

    I guess Kenny/Clarke see him in training every day so they know more but I let out a huge sigh when reading it.

    Opr

    What could they be concerned about ? ..is he maybe getting frustrated ?


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