Children's Allowance

eyescreamcone · 18-04-2012 02:33PM

Hobbes wrote: »

"In 2012 Child Benefit is €140 per month for each of the first two children. From 1 Jaunary 2012 the rate for the third child is €148 and for the 4th and each subsequent child is €160."

So making over 1000 per month would require at least 7 children.

I take it you don't have children, because a 1,000 a month isn't worth the hassle of 7 kids.

Don't have that many kids so!

davet82 · 18-04-2012 02:36PM

eyescreamcone wrote: »

Don't have that many kids so!

eh i think that was the point

Abi · 18-04-2012 02:38PM

eyescreamcone wrote: »

Hobbes wrote: »

"In 2012 Child Benefit is €140 per month for each of the first two children. From 1 Jaunary 2012 the rate for the third child is €148 and for the 4th and each subsequent child is €160."

So making over 1000 per month would require at least 7 children.

I take it you don't have children, because a 1,000 a month isn't worth the hassle of 7 kids.

Don't have that many kids so!

You see, the more sensible sorts see the sense of that, and don't have that many kids. However we need to remove the incentive for the clowns that don't do their maths, and those having children in order to get social housing.

davet82 · 18-04-2012 02:39PM

Abi wrote: »

You see, the more sensible sorts see the sense of that, and don't have that many kids. However we need to remove the incentive for the clowns that don't do their maths, and those having children in order to get social housing.

one child will get you social housing, no?

smash · 18-04-2012 02:43PM

For some people complaining about CA, you need to realise that during the recession in the 80's, your parents might have needed it to help raise you. The same as a lot of people these days need it to help raise their children too.

Abi · 18-04-2012 02:50PM

davet82 wrote: »

Abi wrote: »

You see, the more sensible sorts see the sense of that, and don't have that many kids. However we need to remove the incentive for the clowns that don't do their maths, and those having children in order to get social housing.

one child will get you social housing, no?

Yes, it would. Probably a two bedroom apartment. But then there's the mentality of those that have subsequent children in order to get a 3 bedroomed house or more. Yet another incentive to have more children. Fcuking stupid if you ask me.

Kolido · 18-04-2012 02:53PM

biko wrote: »

I'm fairly sure that raising 11 kids costs a ****ing fortune.

Contraception is cheaper.

frag420 wrote: »

I think after you have your second child yer fanny should be stapled shut unless you can prove you can afford to rear them!!!

Not the most popular idea but I bet it would work. Although cost of staples in some estates will go through the roof!!

I'll take that job..The Fanny Stapler...sounds like a secure post

sunflower27 · 18-04-2012 03:00PM

Can't see it being changed, to be honest. Any government that starts cutting back on people's allowances (certainly if it is a substantial cut) can kiss the next term goodbye.

That it isn't means tested is absolutely ludicrous.

smash · 18-04-2012 03:05PM

frag420 wrote: »

I think after you have your second child yer fanny should be stapled shut unless you can prove you can afford to rear them!!!

And what about the father's then? did they have no part in it?

davet82 · 18-04-2012 03:07PM

smash wrote: »

And what about the father's then? did they have no part in it?

i blame the fcukin storks tbh

Chuck Stone · 18-04-2012 03:14PM

CA should be taxable income.

CA should only be paid on the first 2 children.

Council houses should be no bigger than three bed rooms.

Nodin · 18-04-2012 03:19PM

Bizarre that its not means tested. Makes far more sense than the mooted changes to single parent allowance coming in a year or two.

girl2 · 18-04-2012 03:44PM

eyescreamcone wrote: »

I think Children's Allowance should be means tested and abolished for fourth and subsequent children.

There are families collecting more than 1000 per month regardless of their income, just because they have large families. This to me is absolutely crazy!!!

Maybe there is a case for helping existing large families who grew up with this system, but we need to draw a line at this stage and tell people that if you want to have a big family - you will have to look after them yourself.

I think there was some family on the Late Late recently with 11 children and collecting around 1800 children's allowance per month.
This to me is just taking the piss.
Is there any logical justification for this???

I totally agree.

Plus.....could someone tell me the reasoning behind this - I know of 2 instances where the family is living in the North, the wife is working in the north and getting child benefit up here, and because the husband works in the south, they are claiming the benefits down there. Now, Im talking about 2 families, who DO NOT need this money. One of them the husband is self employed and there are 5 children in the house (so the amount he claims is probably plenty) and the wife works part time and in the other case, the husband works full time on approx €100,000 per year and the wife works full time up here on £40,000. How the hell can this be right?

It maddens me. A lot. And I would love to take them finance people and by the scruff of the neck and teach them a thing or two about running a country's finances.

Nuff said

smash · 18-04-2012 03:48PM

girl2 wrote: »

I know of 2 instances where the family is living in the North, the wife is working in the north and getting child benefit up here, and because the husband works in the south, they are claiming the benefits down there.

It's fraud. Report them.

girl2 · 18-04-2012 03:54PM

smash wrote: »

It's fraud. Report them.

I couldnt do that to be honest.

Plus the both of them claim that its totally legit, especially the one where him and her both work full time because apparently he looked into the whole thing (I work with the 2 wives, that's how I know that it's definitely true).

iguana · 18-04-2012 03:57PM

seamus wrote: »

Maybe try looking after two babies at the same time and see if it's two or three times the effort of looking after one

It's probably something to do with how much more of a restriction twins/triplets places on the parents everyday life above a single child. You will have more difficulty finding babysitters to take your children, you have to use the buggy to go everywhere rather than a sling, and so on and so forth, which can end up directly affecting that parent's ability to earn, above the normal restrictions created by a single child.

Just as an example, a neighbour has twins born nearly a year ago and he works for himself in an on-call capacity. He is quite literally twice as wrecked as a normal parent (the guy looks like **** every time I see him ), but still has to get up and out in the van whenever the phone rings. So I can see how having twins would make it more likely for him to ignore a call and stay in bed than just having the one child. So not only are his costs doubled, his earnings are also affected.

I'm not comparing having twins to just one child I said parents of children born after one after another. Is having twins really that different to any parent of more than one child? What about the parents of 'irish twins?' Or how exhausting it is for a mother of a toddler while pregnant with a second baby? Or introducing a newborn to an older sibling who gets clinging or acts up as their whole world has just been rocked on it's head? Or being pregnant with a third child while introducing a nervous 5 year old to schooling and dealing with a toddler at home? I can't honestly see any of those scenarios being any less exhausting than having twins, tbh.

Plazaman · 18-04-2012 04:07PM

frag420 wrote: »

I think after you have your second child yer fanny should be stapled shut unless you can prove you can afford to rear them!!!

Sweet zombie jesus, anal birth? Is there such a thing?

It would take an army of workers, similar to the census workers, to means test every house that has kids, then a further army to process these tests. Since there is a moratorium on hiring new public/civil service workers, even if it was the will of the people and the Government, one simply cannot just means test everyone...... well without massive costs anyway.

Hobbes · 18-04-2012 04:17PM

Abi wrote: »

However we need to remove the incentive for the clowns that don't do their maths, and those having children in order to get social housing.

There is no incentive for more children. Children are expensive! You don't get that 1,000 to magically spend on booze and fags. Nappies alone for the first couple of years is going to be drain on you.

Also this money isn't been given out of thin air. Anyone who works is basically getting their taxes back.

If you are not working and moaning about children allowance, how about not signing on as well.

Hobbes · 18-04-2012 04:18PM

girl2 wrote: »

I couldnt do that to be honest.

Then you are part of the problem.

Plus the both of them claim that its totally legit,

I am not sure about that. Around age 7 the social will send out a mail asking you to confirm your address and the school in Ireland your child is enrolled in so they can double check. We got one a few weeks back.

Assuming they filled that out correctly then they need not worry.

hondasam · 18-04-2012 04:25PM

It should be means tested and the same amount given for each child and it should be stopped once they finish primary school or say 13yrs.

hondasam · 18-04-2012 04:30PM

girl2 wrote: »

I couldnt do that to be honest.

Plus the both of them claim that its totally legit, especially the one where him and her both work full time because apparently he looked into the whole thing (I work with the 2 wives, that's how I know that it's definitely true).

http://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=claiming%20child%20benefit%20in%20northern%20ireland&source=web&cd=2&ved=0CEMQFjAB&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.borderpeople.info%2Findex%2Ffaqs%2Ffaqs-social-welfare.htm&ei=Jd2OT9maBI6yhAeBp4zoCg&usg=AFQjCNFCGd9c1CCczkbFLYJAQ3OhFjlpGw

Not sure if it is legit.

mackg · 18-04-2012 04:38PM

hondasam wrote: »

It should be means tested and the same amount given for each child and it should be stopped once they finish primary school or say 13yrs.

Jesus, secondary school is an expensive thing in these parts. I remember my parents really struggling when it came to uniforms and books and I was the only child left at home at that point, and given how oblivious I was as a teenager the fact that I noticed shows just how bad it was.

girl2 · 18-04-2012 04:41PM

Hobbes wrote: »

Then you are part of the problem.

I am not sure about that. Around age 7 the social will send out a mail asking you to confirm your address and the school in Ireland your child is enrolled in so they can double check. We got one a few weeks back.

Assuming they filled that out correctly then they need not worry.

I dont think its really all that fair that you say that I am part of the problem. I am just a person who isnt in the business of going about reporting people to the authorities, for a variety of reasons.

In relation to the second piece of advice, these children all attend school in the north, so I dont know how that would work.

Jesus Shaves · 18-04-2012 04:45PM

Why abolish CA, Just raise income tax, workers are getting away lightly enough as it is

hondasam · 18-04-2012 04:48PM

mackg wrote: »

Jesus, secondary school is an expensive thing in these parts. I remember my parents really struggling when it came to uniforms and books and I was the only child left at home at that point, and given how oblivious I was as a teen ager the fact that I noticed shows just how bad it was.

This is part of the problem, we want kids, we have them but we expect financial help along the way. I am not against C/B but does it continue longer here if they are in college? It has to stop somewhere. Parents have plenty of time to prepare for secondary school.

Edit @Darokane, I assume you are taking the piss with that comment.

mummymoo · 18-04-2012 04:51PM

i think birth control should be free weather you have a medical card or not instead, or atleast alot cheaper!

Dravokivich · 18-04-2012 04:52PM

hondasam wrote: »

This is part of the problem, we want kids, we have them but we expect financial help along the way. I am not against C/B but does it continue longer here if they are in college? It has to stop somewhere. Parents have plenty of time to prepare for secondary school.

Edit @Darokane, I assume you are taking the piss with that comment.

It stops once the child has finished Secondary school.

mackg · 18-04-2012 05:01PM

hondasam wrote: »

This is part of the problem, we want kids, we have them but we expect financial help along the way. I am not against C/B but does it continue longer here if they are in college? It has to stop somewhere. Parents have plenty of time to prepare for secondary school.

Edit @Darokane, I assume you are taking the piss with that comment.

I will accept that it it has to stop somewhere obviously but means tested CB is a much better solution than a primary school cut off. When I was born both of my parents were working full time in what would have been seen as secure jobs, by the time I started secondary school my mother was occasionally working part time and that was it. I would have no problem with a system where in a situation like that the couple would not have been eligible for payment when they did not need it but if circumstances changed the support would be there. Given a system of CB for all up to 13 my parents would have received it while they were working and would have been cut off when they needed help.

Gmol · 18-04-2012 05:04PM

rainbowdash wrote: »

I think they should reduce the allowance for 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th kids etc.

Say €160 for the first then €20 each less for each subsequent child.

This is on the basis that 1 car will bring 3 kids to school for the same cost of having 1 kid in it, if they are in bunk beds then 2 or more can share a room that costs the same to build, heat and light as for 1 kid, clothes, schoolbooks, bikes etc. can be passed down from child to child etc. etc.

After the 8th kid family pay you

Abi · 18-04-2012 05:20PM

Hobbes wrote: »

Abi wrote: »

However we need to remove the incentive for the clowns that don't do their maths, and those having children in order to get social housing.

There is no incentive for more children. Children are expensive! You don't get that 1,000 to magically spend on booze and fags. Nappies alone for the first couple of years is going to be drain on you.

Oh I quite agree with you. However it doesn't mean it is all being spent on the children. This subject had come up before, and I mentioned a family I know, both parents working, house paid off and living comfortably with 2 children. They have no need for CA and have told me so. What the mother has done is opened two bank accounts for the kids and putting it in there for their future. Nice idea and all that, but with a country in shambles I don't think we can afford to give hand outs to those not in need.

I used to live beside a girl who was on a rent allowance, receiving lone parents, had him living there on the sly- and he was working. She already had a little girl, and she remarked to me that she hoped the next one would be a boy so she could get a three bedroom place, otherwise she would have to have another. I stood there catching flies after she said that to me. I wouldn't have had anything to say to her before that, and I certainly didn't after that.

It's quite easy with that mentality to drag a child up on budget nappies, chips and nuggets most meals and smoke and drink the rest. She always seemed to have a fag lit coming to and from the house, and while gossiping to anyone on the road that would listen to her. And we know those aren't cheap. I saw her a while back, and at the last count she had 5 girls. I fear for the country she will just keep going till she gets a boy, or indeed a council mansion to bring these much thought over offspring of hers :rolleyes:

I don't see how either of these cases should be getting a cent off the state. The latter never worked a day in her life to even attempt to equate what she is milking out of the country.

Children's Allowance

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