Brolly on a funny kind of Irishness? - Free State Unionists

slapbangwallop · 02-04-2012 11:59AM #1

A northern friend said to me this morning that northern Unionists' partitionism is one thing, but southern partitionism is so odious, so distasteful, begrudging, irrational, lacking in depth or historical validity, so petty, spiteful, smug, lame, so anti-human that it stings his nose with it's repugnance.

Has he got a point or just another moaning Nordie?

http://www.derryjournal.com/community/columnists/brolly-s-bites-north-men-south-men-comrades-all-my-arse-1-3674549#.T3i4yHibTlY.facebook

AeoNGriM · 02-04-2012 12:15PM

Dey tuk ar six counties!!!!!

forfuxsake · 02-04-2012 12:19PM

AeoNGriM wrote: »

Dey tuk ar six counties!!!!!

So what will we do? fight and win them back?
No, we'll never win, pretend they're welcome to them.:eek:

02-04-2012 12:20PM

They have a silly accent.

Their argument is invalid.

Skid · 02-04-2012 12:20PM

slapbangwallop wrote: »

A northern friend said to me this morning that northern Unionists' partitionism is one thing, but southern partitionism is so odious, so distasteful, begrudging, irrational, lacking in depth or historical validity, so petty, spiteful, smug, lame, so anti-human that it stings his nose with it's repugnance.

Has he got a point or just another moaning Nordie?

http://www.derryjournal.com/community/columnists/brolly-s-bites-north-men-south-men-comrades-all-my-arse-1-3674549#.T3i4yHibTlY.facebook

He should look in the mirror - the reason many people in the Republic have no interest in a United Ireland is because the prospect of dealing with judgemental, backward thinking, self-obsessed drones like himself is not an appealing one.

dr.bollocko · 02-04-2012 12:23PM

Strikes me he's looking for a fight.

benway · 02-04-2012 12:25PM

An ex's ould lad is a southern orange man, tbh he was grand, but politics was studiously avoided as a topic of conversation.

I think Brolly is more talking about Free Staters, a certain breed of respectable blueshirt who finds the whole northern question to be distasteful at best, and would rather brush the whole thing under the carpet ... he's definitely got a point there, imho.

Granted, it's not like our nordie brethren don't have a chip on their shoulders about it or anything. Then again, I don't really blame them.

mikemac1 · 02-04-2012 12:28PM

Is the GAA in Ulster run by lawyers?

Crying racism over a bit of abuse and starting discrimination proceedings to get more funding

Has he got a point or just another moaning Nordie?

Both realy.
A more toned down article would have gotten the points across

Born to Die · 02-04-2012 12:30PM

Is this Joe Brolly that is on the Sunday Game chewing his tongue during the Summer?

Phill Ewinn · 02-04-2012 12:32PM

Members of the Orange cult me thinks........

Dyr · 02-04-2012 12:36PM

Never attribute to patitionism that which you can attribute to just winding up nordies...mainly because its so easy.

forfuxsake · 02-04-2012 12:42PM

Bambi wrote: »

Never attribute to patitionism that which you can attribute to just winding up nordies...mainly because its so easy.

Patitionism - because of st patrick? I likes it

AngryBollix · 02-04-2012 12:45PM

Nice to see his bullsh1t extends to subjects beyond gaelic football

xflyer · 02-04-2012 12:48PM

I don't find it surprising that the GAA figures largely in this situation and that's exactly where the blame lies. The whole ethos of the GAA is supporting my team, my village, my town, my county. Abusive comments and brawls on and off the pitch are commonplace. The whole disciplinary issue in the GAA is the subject of constant debate.

So naturally any opportunity is taken to needle people is taken. One of the best ways is to have a go at any insecurities they have. Calling them Brit B*****ds or Orangemen will absolutely infuriate them given their history.

In the article he says

Culturally, we are no doubt slightly different. In a way, northern Gaels are more ferocious about our Irishness because we had to fight harder for it.

Which I presume in his eyes maked him more Irish than us southern softies.

The racist suggestions are ridiculous. We're the same people. How can you be racist against your own race?

His mistake is to take an attitude within the GAA and extrapolate it to the wider community. Well it doesn't happen in other sports and in general most people 'down south' see the Northerners simply as Irish, even the Unionists (whether they like it or not).

The real problem is the GAA and their unwillingness or inability to deal with disciplinary issues within the organisation.

Personally I detest the GAA because because they've had a detrimental effect on sport in general in this country and also because they encourage parochialism rather than nationalism. People are often more proud of being from Kerry or Cork than being Irish. I would think that this is where much of the problem lies. The Northerners see themselves as Irish first and foremost because "we had to fight harder for it". The Laois guy is a Laoisman first and Irish a distant second.

That's your problem.

forfuxsake · 02-04-2012 12:52PM

xflyer wrote: »

I don't find it surprising that the GAA figures largely in this situation and that's exactly where the blame lies. The whole ethos of the GAA is supporting my team, my village, my town, my county. Abusive comments and brawls on and off the pitch are commonplace. The whole disciplinary issue in the GAA is the subject of constant debate.

So naturally any opportunity is taken to needle people is taken. One of the best ways is to have a go at any insecurities they have. Calling them Brit B*****ds or Orangemen will absolutely infuriate them given their history.

In the article he says Which I presume in his eyes maked him more Irish than us southern softies.

The racist suggestions are ridiculous. We're the same people. How can you be racist against your own race?

His mistake is to take an attitude within the GAA and extrapolate it to the wider community. Well it doesn't happen in other sports and in general most people 'down south' see the Northerners simply as Irish, even the Unionists (whether they like it or not).

The real problem is the GAA and their unwillingness or inability to deal with disciplinary issues within the organisation.

Personally I detest the GAA because because they've had a detrimental effect on sport in general in this country and also because they encourage parochialism rather than nationalism. People are often more proud of being from Kerry or Cork than being Irish. I would think that this is where much of the problem lies. The Northerners see themselves as Irish first and foremost because "we had to fight harder for it". The Laois guy is a Laoisman first and Irish a distant second.

That's your problem.

I find it absurd that loyalty to a county,in essence a British administrative division, is taken so seriously.

Dyr · 02-04-2012 12:55PM

xflyer wrote: »

The Northerners see themselves as Irish first and foremost because "we had to fight harder for it".

They didn't fight harder though? And never got the result

xflyer · 02-04-2012 12:57PM

forfuxsake wrote: »

I find it absurd that loyalty to a county,in essence a British administrative division, is taken so seriously.

So do I, as a Dubliner. I could care less is someone has a go at me for being from Dublin. Do the same for my Irishness and I lose it.

But really it's tribalism, a throwback to the times when people here were loyal to their local chief or king and were constantly fighting each. It took the English, ironically, to unite us as Irish. They didn't finish the job though. Another reason to complain about their administration.:rolleyes:

guitarzero · 02-04-2012 01:01PM

It's interesting the superiority mind set people have the further down the republic you go. "Them nordies" followed by rolling eyes and smug chuckling. Easy to wind up, they're different to us, they're not Irish, etc etc this my personal experience.

What's also interesting is that these people have only spent a weekend at best up north. A friend of mine had actually said "they're very different to us". I asked him who are "they" what do you define as "us"? It's so riddled with small minded nonsense and contradiction, as one of the posters mentioned above, "its pretty backward".

The_Kew_Tour · 02-04-2012 01:02PM

lol if he thinks that "All Ulster counties" shout for each other.

They do in their ass. I remember when Cork played Down in AI in 2010 and every bloody person from Ulster was shouting for Cork bar of course Down people.

Jimoslimos · 02-04-2012 01:05PM

forfuxsake wrote: »

I find it absurd that loyalty to a county,in essence a British administrative division, is taken so seriously.

This is very true

xflyer wrote: »

Personally I detest the GAA because because they've had a detrimental effect on sport in general in this country

What do you mean "detrimental effect"?

xflyer wrote: »

and also because they encourage parochialism rather than nationalism. People are often more proud of being from Kerry or Cork than being Irish. I would think that this is where much of the problem lies. The Northerners see themselves as Irish first and foremost because "we had to fight harder for it". The Laois guy is a Laoisman first and Irish a distant second.

That's your problem.

Not making much sense. Parochialism isn't unique to the GAA or even Ireland. There's plenty of Liverpool/Man Utd fans who would prefer their team win the league over the national side doing well. In fact most people in the North of England have a stronger sense of identity linked to their local area rather than any nationalistic English/British pride.

But any excuse for a general GAA bashing thread.......

johngalway · 02-04-2012 01:15PM

Skid wrote: »

He should look in the mirror - the reason many people in the Republic have no interest in a United Ireland is because the prospect of dealing with judgemental, backward thinking, self-obsessed drones like himself is not an appealing one.

+1.

Show Time · 02-04-2012 01:19PM

As a proud Corkman i could not possibly take serious Joe Brolly on any matter he writes about.

Iwasfrozen · 02-04-2012 01:19PM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

They do in their ass. I remember when Cork played Down in AI in 2010 and every bloody person from Ulster was shouting for Cork bar of course Down people.

Nope. I was shouting for Down. Even put twenty euro on them.

El Siglo · 02-04-2012 01:20PM

I can see what he means from reading that. I've been living in Belfast nearly two years now and you always get the story of the southerner giving stick to the northerner over not being Irish etc...

I wouldn't have much love for my county as I've lived in a couple of them and they're all the same except the accent changes. Nationality on the other hand is much more serious and I would get pretty angry if someone lambasted me over my nationality. Having a bit of banter is one thing, downright abuse is a completely different situation.

El Siglo · 02-04-2012 01:23PM

Skid wrote: »

He should look in the mirror - the reason many people in the Republic have no interest in a United Ireland is because the prospect of dealing with judgemental, backward thinking, self-obsessed drones like himself is not an appealing one.

I suppose versions of that type of individual don't exist down south, like; Pat Spillane, George Hook or Eamon Dunphy?

xflyer · 02-04-2012 01:26PM

Jimoslimos wrote: »

What do you mean "detrimental effect"?

Well there was the famous ban on foreign games. While that's gone. It had it's effect particularly away from the bigger towns and cities. This made sure that sports minded kids were funneled into GAA and that remains the case. Our record in international sports is poor compared to countries of comparable. If the local GAA club expanded it's activities to include other sports like athletics or whatever. That could improve. Whatever you think of GAA sports they don't travel well and there is little scope for even the best GAA player to move onto the international stage.

Parochialism isn't unique to the GAA or even Ireland. There's plenty of Liverpool/Man Utd fans who would prefer their team win the league over the national side doing well. In fact most people in the North of England have a stronger sense of identity linked to their local area rather than any nationalistic English/British pride.

Other people's parochialism is no excuse for ours. In any case there is much less county pride in England than here. It being more regional. Even that would be better for us.

Doc Ruby · 02-04-2012 01:30PM

xflyer wrote: »

Our record in international sports is poor compared to countries of comparable.

If you mean international football, maybe it is and who cares. In international sports I'm not aware of any particular shortcomings.

Jimoslimos · 02-04-2012 01:41PM

xflyer wrote: »

Well there was the famous ban on foreign games. While that's gone. It had it's effect particularly away from the bigger towns and cities. This made sure that sports minded kids were funneled into GAA and that remains the case. Our record in international sports is poor compared to countries of comparable.

Oh the ban was close-minded alright but it's gone now. Anyway again it's not a unique trait for a sporting organisation to try maximise playing numbers.

Our record is poor not because of the GAA, it's because we are a tiny country (population-wise) without the physical attributes for most pure athletic disciplines - speed (Afro-Caribbeans), endurance (East-Africans) or strength (Eastern Europeans).

Also, is a measure of a sport's worth whether it is played internationally or not? Plenty of Aussies play Aussie Rules or Rugby League - doesn't seem to affect their nation's standing in international sport.

Feeona · 02-04-2012 01:56PM

slapbangwallop wrote: »

but southern partitionism is so odious, so distasteful, begrudging, irrational, lacking in depth or historical validity, so petty, spiteful, smug, lame, so anti-human that it stings his nose with it's repugnance.

Are you sure that's what he said?

benway · 02-04-2012 02:00PM

Domo230 wrote: »

They take Irish culture (the language and things like sean nos etc ..) very seriously up there.

They certainly do, was at a pipe recital off the Ormeau Road a couple of weekends back, there's definitely an edge of pride and seriousness to it that I haven't seen at equivalent events down Mexico way.

On the other hand, there's a strain of southern opinion that regards these same cultural signifiers - trad, gaeilge, "gah" - as something to be ashamed of, backwards, tribalistic, incompatible with the modern world.

Two things going on, I think - we all know Brolly's a wind-up merchant of the highest order, and the "racism" point is pretty ridiculous. But, by the same token, there is a real issue here.

Dudess · 02-04-2012 02:05PM

Well I don't think you're necessarily a unionist if you feel a united Ireland is unachievable. It doesn't mean you wouldn't like a united Ireland, you just can't see it happening.

Eoghan Harris/CCOB types are nauseating though - and others who ridicule non violent republicanism and bow before rigid unionism.

Brolly on a funny kind of Irishness? - Free State Unionists

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