Are you going to pay the household charge? [Part 1]

dvpower · 20-03-2012 12:29am

xflyer wrote: »

The weight of public opinion is against this.

The polls don't indicate this.

xflyer wrote: »

Furthermore the fiscal treaty referendum will be defeated.

The polls don't indicate this either.

tbh, I don't see them targetting pensioners for court enforcement. That would be a stupid tactic. Maybe start with people who live in the leafy burbs in large houses and good jobs.

Ghandee · 20-03-2012 12:30am

Izzy Skint wrote: »

while we are at it we should all refuse to pay tv licence....not a joke, i am serious, what will they do, take over 1 million householders to court?...
a number of years back rte went crying cap in hand to government claiming there had not been a rise in tv licenece for so many years...and the government slapped €40 approx. onto the cost (if my memory is correct)

the tv licence should be no more than €10 per year!!!....168 euro a year to rte....for what ?....time to cut the apron strings i think, let them sink or swim...
.....a TEN year driving licence costs €25, a ten year passport costs €80 / €110, BUT!!! a ten year tv licence costs €1,680 !!....but I can see why...it's obvious.... a driving licence only permits you to drive a 1 ton vehicle on public roads with all the responsibility that goes with that.... a passport is probably THE most important document an individual will ever posess so enough said....and finally a ten year €1,680 tv licence gives us peace of mind while sitting on our @rses, in our own homes, for as long we like watching a group of public servants on a box wasting our tv licence money!!!!!......makes perfect sense......what a great country we have!!!!!

Duly noted! ^

And, I think we should all be emailing our electricity (any other utility bill company) suppliers, and remind them, that they have competitors who would be glad of our business should they be foolish enough to pass on our personal details to the Govt, or anyone else who should come asking for them!

Wild Bill · 20-03-2012 12:34am

dvpower wrote: »

Maybe start with people who live in the leafy burbs in large houses and good jobs.

Bring it on!

The very folk who can afford to contest it, delay, challenge and thus contribute to the failure of the "pay the German bankers' debt" scam

leedslad · 20-03-2012 12:35am

paddy147 wrote: »

You know what a phone or google is?

Google it,or pick up a phone and ring them and ask them nicely,and they will tell you.

http://www.newbeginning.ie/who-should-contact-us/

"We encourage any homeowners coming before the Courts who face having their homes repossessed, yet have no legal representation, to contact us.

Our advocacy grouping are working around the clock on a voluntary basis, they will not be paid for their time or support in representing these individuals.

Have you been served with a writ claiming repossession of your home?

New Beginning is calling for members of the public who are facing repossession proceedings and have no current representation, to contact us".

Thanks for the link Paddy, That's kind of you,and very considerate of those solicitors to work for free

dvpower · 20-03-2012 12:37am

Wild Bill wrote: »

Bring it on!

The very folk who can afford to contest it, delay, challenge and thus contribute to the failure of the "pay the German bankers' debt" scam

And pay the state's large legal costs when they lose. That'll be the end of the campaign - when someone fights it and gets hit with a massive legal bill.

xflyer · 20-03-2012 12:43am

dvpower wrote: »

The polls don't indicate this.

The polls don't indicate this either.
tbh, I don't see them targetting pensioners for court enforcement. That would be a stupid tactic. Maybe start with people who live in the leafy burbs in large houses and good jobs.

You would say that, but of course you could be right. If the government scare tactics work as they did before we would all vote to have our balls cut off for the good of Germany! Because that's what this is about and we all know it.

Why not target pensioners, after all they've been targetted already while the people in leafy burbs get away with it. My Mother's pension has already been cut to the tune of three Euro, feisty woman that she is, she rang to complain but was fobbed off by the usual government apparachik whose fat pension has been barely touched.

Let's face it neither the people in the leafy burbs or the pensioners will be hit because it's glaringly obvious that the government has no guts whatsoever and they've completely misjudged the public mood.

twistyj · 20-03-2012 12:47am

If a pint was €20....

20 Benson and Hedges were €50...

Sure You'd complain about it,

but i bet everyone would still pay it.

Everyone incl. the nay sayers will pay the household charge.

We are the Irish, the doormat of Europe.

Wild Bill · 20-03-2012 12:52am

dvpower wrote: »

And pay the state's large legal costs when they lose. That'll be the end of the campaign - when someone fights it and gets hit with a massive legal bill.

Nah. This will end with those lampposts

xflyer · 20-03-2012 12:55am

but i bet everyone would still pay it.

Everyone incl. the nay sayers will pay the household charge.

We are the Irish, the doormat of Europe.

I'll take that bet, I won't pay it and neither will any of my family.

As for Ireland being the doormat of Europe, yes completely agree. We are. When we stand up up and say no more. We'll get more respect. The British and it pays me to say it would never have put with this.

Snake Plisken · 20-03-2012 12:56am

So if you don't pay before the 31st whats the late penalty?

xflyer · 20-03-2012 1:00am

Execution I think!

mikom · 20-03-2012 1:00am

Snake Plisken wrote: »

So if you don't pay before the 31st whats the late penalty?

A whole years worth of late penalties will stand you an extra 42 Euro.

Don't register.
Don't pay.

Wild Bill · 20-03-2012 1:00am

Snake Plisken wrote: »

So if you don't pay before the 31st whats the late penalty?

Whatever the Regime with no democratic mandate thinks it can get away with!

Snake Plisken · 20-03-2012 1:17am

mikom wrote: »

A whole years worth of late penalties will stand you an extra 42 Euro.

Don't register.
Don't pay.

Is that confirmed somewhere? Is there potential even remotely to be hauled in front of the courts for non-payment? If not then I'm not paying!

mikom · 20-03-2012 1:23am

Snake Plisken wrote: »

Is that confirmed somewhere? Is there potential even remotely to be hauled in front of the courts for non-payment? If not then I'm not paying!

See below.

The due date for the Household Charge 2012 is January 1st 2012 – but households have been given three months to pay before Late payment penalties apply . No penalty charges will apply if payments are made by 31st March 2012. (It is an offence not to have registered by 31st March)

What are the Penalties for late Payment ?

For payments made between 1st April 2012 and 30th June 2012 the penalty is 10% of the amount outstanding (i.e €10 )

For payments made between 1st July 2012 and 31st December 2012 – the penalty will be 20 % of the amount outstanding; ie. €20

For payments made on or after 1st January 2013 – the penalty will be 30 % of the amount outstanding. (ie €30)

There is also a Late payment interest of 1% per month that applies to any unpaid household charge amounts. (That is €1 per month)

So – if someone doesn’t pay the 2012 €100 household charge until January 2013 – they will owe €100 plus €30 penalty fee plus a €12 interest – a total of €142.
http://www.moneyguideireland.com/penalties-what-happens-if-i-am-late-paying-the-household-charge.html

if we stay united, no trawl for data, no courts or government can impose a tax which is not backed by between half to 80 per cent of the population. They cannot take fines from people and neither does an ESB bill prove you are a homeowner. One million people cannot be hauled through the courts.
http://nohouseholdtax.org/were-winning-weve-got-them-scared/

Radharc na Sleibhte · 20-03-2012 1:31am

I still havent got a leaflet or any info regarding this.
As far as i am aware, i dont have to pay it, unless someone corrects me.
Why would i pay a bill i dont even know i am due to pay?
Its like registering for a tv licence even if a dont have a tv, just in case.

Hootanany · 20-03-2012 1:34am

Why can't they just send us a bill for it.

Bruthal · 20-03-2012 1:38am

Hootanany wrote: »

Why can't they just send us a bill for it.

Because they dont know who to bill:), and they couldnt even manage to just deliver leaflets to everyone about it.

Wild Bill · 20-03-2012 1:39am

Hootanany wrote: »

Why can't they just send us a bill for it.

They thought it would be like taking candy from a baby

Were they ever wrong!

demanufactured · 20-03-2012 1:41am

http://nohouseholdtax.org/national-assembly-march-24th/

demanufactured · 20-03-2012 1:42am

DONT REGISTER, DONT PAY!

mconigol · 20-03-2012 7:27am

Wild Bill wrote: »

mconigol wrote: »

That kind of rhetoric does nothing for your cause btw. Totally un-necessary

My "cause" needs no enhancement - 1.5 million householders can't be wrong.

Usurping democracy is surely a crime?

As an external viewer it de-legitimizes and is counterproductive to your own goal.

You can't complain that the government is using bullyboy tactics and then advocate a mob shooting the taoiseach in the same manner as gadaffi. Makes you sound fanatical.

In my opinion the looney left are probably alienating a large number of potential dissenters. when I read the literature on the website and see references to Bono and his mansion I can't possibly take it seriously.

AND I'm against the charge!

It's a pity the anti charge campaigners couldn't keep the focus on the one issue instead of harping on about Bono and wealth taxes and such.

Also they need to cut the nonsensical arguments about not receiving leaflets or claiming that it's undemocratic etc.etc. it just sounds childish. Keep it simple and focus on the protest.

mconigol · 20-03-2012 7:41am

http://www.dataprotection.ie/ViewDoc.asp?fn=/documents/rights/RightsPlainEnglish.htm&CatID=16&m=r

6. Right to prevent use of your personal details

You can also ask a data controller not to use your personal details for purposes other than their main purpose – for example for marketing.

You can do this by simply writing to the organisation or person holding your details and outlining your views. Within 40 days, they must do as you ask or explain why they will not do so.

gurramok · 20-03-2012 8:04am

Any complaints about this? Guess not when its a windfall.
http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/summer-refund-of-up-to-500-for-homebuyers-at-height-of-boom-3054780.html

BOOM-buyer couples who bought homes at the height of the property bubble will receive tax refunds of up to €500 by the summer.

The payout will be given to the "negative equity generation" after the higher mortgage tax relief promised in the last Budget is paid.

The €52m in additional tax relief, which will be paid out each year, will provide some breathing space to the thousands of people who bought at the height of the market.

The Budget increase in mortgage interest relief was supposed to be applied from the start of January last for the 270,000 people who bought houses between 2004 and 2008.

Ghandee · 20-03-2012 8:46am

gurramok wrote: »

Any complaints about this? Guess not when its a windfall.
http://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/summer-refund-of-up-to-500-for-homebuyers-at-height-of-boom-3054780.html

Excuse me while I go get some party poppers and banners.

Five hundred euro?

While some of us have seen 58% wiped off the value of our homes, and what was seen as a start up home for some to raise a family in, now becomes a shoe box they're stuck in due to the mortgage hanging around their neck like the hang mans noose. (unfortunately no ones mortgage shrunk to match the current value of the home)

Five hundred euro to someone stuck in a fifteen hundred euro per month house in county Meath for the next twenty five years is far from a windfall my friend.
Its much the same as the 160m the govt hope to raise with this sham charge, against the billions we need to repay the banks debts, ie, a drop in a very large, extremely deep ocean. :rolleyes:

Jesus Wept · 20-03-2012 8:51am

Utility Bills? That's retarded. As stated above it doesn't imply ownership. Could they not have a look at stamp duty paid if they are going down that road.

Wild Bill · 20-03-2012 8:52am

mconigol wrote: »

As an external viewer it de-legitimizes and is counterproductive to your own goal.

My goal is the collapse of the German bankers' extortion policy; couldn't give a fiddlers about this tax bar opposing it may bring the collapse of that extortion closer.

But the collapse will happen; I'm only trying to help tweak the timing.

You can't complain that the government is using bullyboy tactics and then advocate a mob shooting the taoiseach in the same manner as gadaffi.

Clearly I can :rolleyes: (and of course I'm not advocating it - merely stating how enjoyable t'would be)

Makes you sound fanatical.

I prefer 'determined, steadfast and righteously but rightfully vengeful'

In my opinion the looney left are probably alienating a large number of potential dissenters.

I'm more looney centre than looney left tbh.

when I read the literature on the website and see references to Bono and his mansion I can't possibly take it seriously.

How did Bono get into this debate?

they need to cut the nonsensical arguments about not receiving leaflets or claiming that it's undemocratic etc.etc. it just sounds childish. Keep it simple and focus on the protest.

Well, they can do what they like; the lack of this Regimes democratic mandate is the issue for me; not this tax.

gurramok · 20-03-2012 9:00am

Ghandee wrote: »

Excuse me while I go get some party poppers and banners.

Five hundred euro?

Perhaps give the Mortgage Interest Relief back to this FG/Lab govt who are helping them out? Alot of take and not enough give.

Ghandee wrote: »

While some of us have seen 58% wiped off the value of our homes....

So? They bought at a price what they thought it was worth to them, they were not forced to live in Meath. If prices continued to rise at the time, they'd be bragging how much positive equity they have.

mconigol · 20-03-2012 9:09am

Wild Bill wrote: »

My goal is the collapse of the German bankers' extortion policy; couldn't give a fiddlers about this tax bar opposing it may bring the collapse of that extortion closer.

Fair enough. You're still going about it the wrong way imo

Wild Bill wrote: »

But the collapse will happen; I'm only trying to help tweak the timing.

Don't be so sure.

Wild Bill wrote: »

Clearly I can :rolleyes: (and of course I'm not advocating it - merely stating how enjoyable t'would be)

I prefer 'determined, steadfast and righteously but rightfully vengeful'

It's still dangerous and highly irresponsible talk. Likewise it doesn't make you sound any of those things. It makes you sound like someone shooting their mouth off and means people will lob you into the looney category which is not very useful for anyone trying to achieve something. I'm not having a go, just saying it how an objective 3rd party see it.

Wild Bill wrote: »

I'm more looney centre than looney left tbh.

I wasn't saying you were looney left but that's the impression somebody who suggests it would be enjoyable to see the Taoiseach get shot is not going to be considered centrist I'm afraid to tell you.

How did Bono get into this debate?

[/QUOTE]

http://nohouseholdtax.org/your-questions-answered/

The household tax is not a traditional property tax. We are in favour of taxing wealth not supporting a flat tax that will mean Bono pays the same every year for his mansion in Killiney as a former council tenant living in a working class estate. This tax is no better than Thatcher’s poll tax, it is not fair and does not make economic sense to be taking yet more money from ordinary people that spend their income. It will increase over time and just like the bin charges it will soon apply to every house across the country.

Ghandee · 20-03-2012 9:10am

gurramok wrote: »

Perhaps give the Mortgage Interest Relief back to this FG/Lab govt who are helping them out? Alot of take and not enough give.

I'll give mine towards the upkeep of my estates greenery and shrubbery yearly fee, that the council don't tend to thanks very much (if I ever get it back, its now almost April and I've yet to see this refund)

gurramok wrote: »

So? They bought at a price what they thought it was worth to them, they were not forced to live in Meath. If prices continued to rise at the time, they'd be bragging how much positive equity they have.

They bought at a price they could afford at the time your quite right though, no one forced them, but bar property speculators, most people bought with the intention of having a family home, not an investment, perhaps some now, give years down the line have a few kids, and have out grown their start up homes?

I made reference to Meath, simply because to buy in Dublin was simply out of the question to some, due to the over inflated prices in the capital at the time.

Are you going to pay the household charge? [Part 1]

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