invoice book for plumber

hsan · 08-03-2012 06:41PM #1

hey lads hows the goin.im starting up my own plumbing business soon.i want to get invoice books as soon as possible.i am doing a back to work scheme so i have been advised not to register for vat and just register with the revenue.im just wondering what i should have written on each page.obviously my name and number on the top.do i need anything else?also on the bottom of the page is 'total' the only line i need down there?thanks lads

JohnnieK · 08-03-2012 08:04PM

Why not register for VAT? I done it when I started and it's the best thing I ever did.

Most print shops would organise invoice books, just give them your company name and contact details. SNAP, Reads to name a few. Plenty of local independents as well.

esox28 · 08-03-2012 08:34PM

dont spent too much money on invoice books to start off with get things going and concentrate on that, what I did was got local printer to make up a rubber stamp with company name , address, phone no, and vat no all you need is a cheep duplacate book one with the carbon copy page should do.

best of luck with the start up.

ps the figure at the bottom of invoice book is all people look at.

pss keep the pencil sharpe

Jedstaff · 08-03-2012 10:17PM

Get triplicate invoice books if u can. One copy for customer,accountant and your records.

mathepac · 08-03-2012 10:54PM

Well done OP and the best of luck to you.

Don't register for VAT in the short-term, it's one less piece of unprofitable admin work you can ignore (calculating the VAT, keeping track of it and doing returns) until you pass the threshold. Concentrate on getting your new business running profitably, then in time, the VAT will roll around.

You can buy triplicate invoice books in any good office stationers or bookseller like EASONS, etc. The books have (or had) red covers and they used to have order-books (for buying from wholesalers etc.) and delivery dockets in matching sets.

To personalise the book(s), get a stamp made up with name address and phone no, no need at this stage for pre-printed books. Again EASONS, Viking Direct for on-line stuff or other office stationers are your best bet. Get a big one-page per day appointment book, keep receipts for EVERY thing and make sense of them and file them at the end of each day - at the end of a week or month they'll probably just be gibberish.

Keep us posted and good luck again.

hsan · 08-03-2012 11:43PM

thanks a lot for all the replies.i was told that i shouldnt register for vat unless i was earning over 37500 euro a year.i was also told that if i dont register for vat that i wouldnt need an accountant because i would be able to manage my books myself.do ye think this sounds right?

shane0007 · 08-03-2012 11:58PM

Do register for VAT immediately. It will make it cheaper for you and your clients overall. You can claim back the VAT on all your diesel, expenses, etc.
For the client, you only have to charge 13.5% on labour & materials whereas if you don't charge VAT you are charging 23% on materials as you cannot claim it back.
Example, materials cost €1,000.00 & labour cost is €300.00, you will be charge at suppliers €1,000 + 23% = €1,230 + your labour of €300 = €1,530.00. If you are VAT registered, you claim back the 23% you have been charged by supplier and not your cost to client = €1,000.00 + €300.00 + 13.5% = €1,475.50 inclusive of VAT. It is cheaper for the client and you as you will also be able to get back VAT on fuel, tools, etc. & of course the vat on letter head invoice paper!

hsan · 09-03-2012 12:02AM

but the only thing is that if ive to get an accountant it will set me back about 2000 euro and to be honest thats a lot of money before i even earn a euro!

shane0007 · 09-03-2012 12:11AM

You will need an accoutant anyhow. There are many unemployed/part-time accountants that should do your returns for about €800 per annum. If you keep your accounts in order, do your vat returns on-line with ROS and accountant will finalize accounts at year end. His/her costs are also tax deductable. My accountant charges me €1,600 + VAT but he is doing my employees wages every week, prsi, vat returns, etc. I get his vat back.

hsan · 09-03-2012 12:27AM

well to be fair shane i was hoping to register for vat aswell but the advice i got was that it wouldnt be worth my while.they also said that i would be able to do my own accounts because all i would have to deal with was my takings and out goings and income tax.

shane0007 · 09-03-2012 12:42AM

But what about all your other expenses:

Public Liability Insurance
Training
Van Insurance
Van Tax
Health Insurance
Refuse
PRSI
Levy's (Health Levy also)
Diesel
RGII & OFTEC costs
Stationary
VAT

I could keep going with this list but that is what an accountant is for. Believe me, a good accountant will earn their fee and some... They will also keep all your records in good order should you ever get an audit. Start as you mean to go on. I worked for a company for nine years and have been self employed since 1996. It is tough but I would not have it any other way. Expand only when you need to and be able to adjust quickly to new markets. Stay up to date with new technologies and never stop learning.

Take everything in and have a goal to complete every job as "this one will be my best". If you do one bad job, the client will tell twenty people. If you do one good job, they will tell one person, so always cherish every job to get that one referral.

I take my hat off to you for trying to start a business in this market and I am sure, should you need it, you will receive a lot help along the way by the more than willing contributors here on boards.

shane0007 · 09-03-2012 12:45AM

Btw your accountant should be charging you at year end. Alternatively, you can pay them monthly or bi-monthly or whatever you can afford now and again.

Rafloution · 09-03-2012 12:47AM

Have a look at some easy and cheap accounts software instead of manual... Google Sage One

hsan · 09-03-2012 12:49AM

thanks a million for the advice shane.ive one last question.ive done a few jobs over the past 3 weeks which i will be writing invoices for.i have paid cash for all the diesel i have bought over this period<about 500 euro>.do u think i will get the vat back on this or am i wasting my time keeping the receipts?thanks again for the help

shane0007 · 09-03-2012 01:01AM

You can back-date your vat certainly but to what period, I am not sure. Keep all receipts anyhow as even if you cannot claim the vat back, they are a ligitimate expenses and can be written off against income tax liablities.
Every receipt should be kept and your accountant will advice as to what you can claim and what you cannot. For example, when I work away, I claim my travel costs, hotel bills, but I cannot claim my food bill.
If you have a home office, then you can claim a small percentage of your home heating & electricity bills against your business. The same percentage of the VAT can be claimed back also if you are registered. Your home office can be your computer and some shelves to store your business files. Just don't go mad claiming everything. Be reasonable and you won't have any problems.
The other advantage of being vat registered is when you see a diesel pump with €1.50 per litre, then it is really costing you €1.22 as you are able to claim the vat back @ 23% or you see that "to die for must have" tool, well now it just became nearly a quarter cheaper.

shane0007 · 09-03-2012 01:11AM

hsan wrote: »

ive one last question.ive done a few jobs over the past 3 weeks which i will be writing invoices for.

I forgot to mention, you won't be charging your clients VAT on your invoices until you are registered to do so and then you must display on your invoices a valid IE vat number.

Also on your invoice, your trading name, address, contact number, vat number, invoice number, date of invoice, whom the invoice is to and normally their address should all appear on your invoice.

Finally, get yourself a website. It will bring in business but don't be fooled by all these companies that guarantee to get you number one on google. Nobody can guarantee that. I created my own website that costs €120 per annum (www.letshost.ie) and google sends me my analytics every Monday on who has visited my site, what pages they looked at and where in the country they based in. They also show you through Google Analytics how to get your website ranking high with them. Easy step by step guides.

hsan · 09-03-2012 05:49PM

thanks a million for all the help lads

slavetothegrind · 09-03-2012 05:55PM

shane is spot on, i will add that it is not hard at all to keep your own books if you do it weekly.

Open a seperate business bank account and pay yourself out of this, saves a lot of messiness if you were to use family account and will save bookkeeping aswell as easier to reconcile at period end.

if you have iphone or android there is a great little app called redoaksnap, you take a picture of every reciept with it and it stores them for you, think it's free.

Diesel reciepts and such types fade FAST so photocopy them and file them stapled to the photocopy WEEKLY. ( or use above)

Also best of luck to you!!!

slavetothegrind · 09-03-2012 05:56PM

shane0007 wrote: »

Yor you see that "to die for must have" tool,

got that disease too have you

gone_fishing · 09-03-2012 10:15PM

I did the same myself, got a short term enterprise allowance off the social welfare and started working for myself as an rgi just over a year ago. best thing i ever did. registered for vat and in the first two months i got nearly 350 euro back. That nearly paid for a quater of my accountants fees. In my opinion register for vat , get an accountant and try and keep things simple when you start off. then just build things up as you go.keep good records and files from the start and you'll make life easier on yourself further down the road. hope this helps

pache · 09-03-2012 11:11PM

Fair play to you and best of luck,do you have a paticular area of the plumbing business that you will specialize in or is it general plumbing&heating.

shane0007 · 09-03-2012 11:29PM

slavetothegrind wrote: »

got that disease too have you

Oh yes. Have most of them. But I know a one person here on boards that is worse than me....lol

JohnnieK · 09-03-2012 11:43PM

hsan wrote: »

thanks a million for the advice shane.ive one last question.ive done a few jobs over the past 3 weeks which i will be writing invoices for.i have paid cash for all the diesel i have bought over this period<about 500 euro>.do u think i will get the vat back on this or am i wasting my time keeping the receipts?thanks again for the help

€500 do you drive a truck or a van

.
I have no regrets getting VAT registered. In fact I think I've only had two returns to them in two years.

Also learn the two thirds/one third rule.
If the cost of your materials is two thirds or more of the sub-total you have to charge 23% VAT.

F**k i'm still getting used to things.

shane0007 · 09-03-2012 11:50PM

JohnnieK wrote: »

Also learn the two thirds/one third rule.
If the cost of your materials is two thirds or more of the sub-total you have to charge 23% VAT.

That rule does not apply. It only applies when items are moveable, for example, a cabinet maker supplying & fitting a new kitchen, he charges 13.5% on labour & materials, but it he supplies & fits a kitchen table, then his labour is @13.5% but the materials are @23%.

All plumbing installations are non-moveable, except for certain clients who love copper!!!!

JohnnieK · 09-03-2012 11:57PM

It does i'm afraid.
If your materials are over two thirds and your only charging 13.5% then revenue will loose out because you will be claiming back the 23% from your materials but they will only be receiving 13.5%, and revenue dont like loosing out.

I have gone through this over and over again with my accountant.

shane0007 · 10-03-2012 12:21AM

Revenue themselves have confirmed this with my accountant. Secondly, we do the installations for Electric Ireland and all their invoices & quotations to clients are also in this manner. Their accountants I am sure would also not get this wrong. The ruling as per Revenue is as per I previously outlined.

JohnnieK · 10-03-2012 12:39AM

That's because the labour for upgrades would be more than a third so 13.5% would apply.

If revenue have stated this it must be only recently. And it was my accountant who has clarified this for me. So who am i to argue in his profession.

Board gas always charge 23% on there invoices.

shane0007 · 10-03-2012 12:46AM

Boiler replacements are still always 13.5% with EI.

Doctors differ, patients die!

I am sticking to the confirmation received from Revenue. All companies I know that are friends and competitors charge identically to me also, i.e. 13.5% on everything.

To be honest in this market, revenue should zero vat all energy saving upgrades to kick start the labour market. They would then recoup their losses in vat returns by increases in tax receipts and less outgoings for dole payments.

JohnnieK · 10-03-2012 12:50AM

Excellent idea regarding the kick start.

Once again I have become confused regarding the 2/3rds 1/3rd rule. Just when I thought I have got to grips:rolleyes:

JohnnieK · 10-03-2012 12:51AM

shane0007 wrote: »

Boiler replacements are still always 13.5% with EI.

I hope you get more of EI than the guys doing the upgrades for BG

shane0007 · 10-03-2012 12:57AM

They are not too bad actually. I know it hard to say but there are too many leads at the moment with all their advertising. We cover a vast area for them and we have to do all the quote work in addition to the installs. On top of that, they snow you under with paperwork, paperwork and then some more paperwork. And if that is not enough, they will even give you a bit more paperwork.

Having said that, they are very good to work with and deal with everything professionally.

invoice book for plumber

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