Hey guys, please don't destroy civil society

super_furry · 06-02-2012 03:01PM #1

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0206/media.html

Because Alan Crosbie reckons that you will if you don't continue to buy his newspapers and ignore the internet. This, coming a week after the so called 'new media' made absolute ****e of the Irish Independent's 'Magda' article, is particularly delicious.

Edit - Indo type error ammended, with a full and heart felt apology.

lividduck · 06-02-2012 03:04PM

super_furry wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0206/media.html

Because Alan Crosbie reckons that you will if you don't continue to buy his newspapers and ignore the internet. This, coming a week after the so called 'new media' made absolute ****e of his Irish Independent's 'Magda' article, is particularly delicious.

Alan Crosbie is not with the Indo, he is with the Examiner , he is Chairman of Thomas Crosbie Holdings, who publish the Examiner.
Maybe the OP could check his facts or if he prefers unchecked facts he could get a job with the Indo!

smash · 06-02-2012 03:05PM

I can 100% guarantee that most of their news stories come from online sources.

chin_grin · 06-02-2012 03:06PM

lividduck wrote: »

Alan Crosbie is not with the Indo, he is with the Examiner , he is Chairman of Thomas Crosbie Holdings, who publish the Examiner.
Maybe the OP could check his facts or if he prefers unchecked facts he could get a job with the Indo!

Got you there OP.

Just one more question.....

Duggy747 · 06-02-2012 03:06PM

2012: The year of the war on the internet.

seamus · 06-02-2012 03:06PM

He said "new media can sometimes give credibility to news that maybe should not have that credibility."

Oh wow. If only it weren't for all these damn trees, I might be able to find some wood...

foxyboxer · 06-02-2012 03:06PM

When you can buy the excellent i newspaper for 30cent (though mainly UK focused), it really put's the Irish daily papers prices into perspective.

Liam Byrne · 06-02-2012 03:16PM

foxyboxer wrote: »

When you can buy the excellent i newspaper for 30cent (though mainly UK focused), it really put's the Irish daily papers prices into perspective.

When you can convince people in the UK market to inexplicably buy a paper that is (mainly Ireland focussed) then come back to us.

Why anyone would buy a UK focussed paper is beyond me - if an Irish paper has 5 times the relevant content then the 30c becomes a false economy.

foxyboxer · 06-02-2012 03:18PM

The point is that a quality daily paper is produced at a fraction of the price.

Why can't that be done in Ireland?

seamus · 06-02-2012 03:22PM

foxyboxer wrote: »

The point is that a quality daily paper is produced at a fraction of the price.

Why can't that be done in Ireland?

Economies of scale. The UK has 15 times the possible readership.

foxyboxer · 06-02-2012 03:23PM

I say it's UK focused in terms of the Internal Politics. However, it's World News, Entertainment and Sport is generic to any English language newspaper.

Logical Fallacy · 06-02-2012 03:25PM

seamus wrote: »

Economies of scale. The UK has 15 times the possible readership.

Plus a higher circulation = bigger ad money = being able to sell for less.

AnonoBoy · 06-02-2012 03:27PM

Personally I ignore all media outlets except the oldest.... that lad at the end of the bar that everyone calls Jimmy and smells kinda like onions most of the time. If he doesn't confirm a story then as far as I'm concerned it hasn't happened.

Chuck Stone · 06-02-2012 03:36PM

Speaking at a conference on media diversity in Dublin, Alan Crosbie said that the public service remit of newspapers like the Irish Examiner, the Irish Independent and the Irish Times should be recognised.

Fuck off with you 'public $€rvic€ r€mit' bull$hit. If your business model is failing then adapt like everyone else.

Doc Ruby · 06-02-2012 03:50PM

foxyboxer wrote: »

The point is that a quality daily paper is produced at a fraction of the price.

Why can't that be done in Ireland?

I get two completely free newspapers delivered to my door every week.

The biggest problem I think facing newspapers is they are having a hard time charging as much for ads online as in print. Advertisers are getting a lot more shrewd about how much bang they get for their advertising buck when it comes to the internet, and the competition is huge.

mikom · 06-02-2012 03:52PM

Speaking at a conference on media diversity in Dublin, Alan Crosbie said that the public service remit of newspapers like the Irish Examiner, the Irish Independent and the Irish Times should be recognised.

Ah, shur give them a crutch like the TV licence.
They are offering a "public service" after all.
Minister, see to it that a section of the broadcast charge goes to them......

Fucking luddites when it suits them.

ArmaniJeanss · 06-02-2012 04:13PM

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Why anyone would buy a UK focussed paper is beyond me - if an Irish paper has 5 times the relevant content then the 30c becomes a false economy.

I'd often purchase a newspaper specifically because it's UK focused.
We get an Irish Times in work so if I was going to buy a newspaper myself during the week it would be one of the UK broadsheets.

I also gave up buying some of the UK broadsheets on a Sunday because they over Irish-ified their editions.
The Sunday Times in particular seemed to develop a rule that there must be 2 pages of GAA even if its the middle of December, Irish rugby must have a page even if nothing of note has happened, the Northern Ireland politics editor had to have a full page, at least 33% of all the previewed TV programmes must be on Irish TV etc.

Nodin · 06-02-2012 04:20PM

...the indo has a "public service remit"?......I feel all weak all of a sudden....Now I now why Pippa O'Connor falling off a horse was on the front page those two to three days...why did I not see this before? I suppose its because I'm a thick and menace to civil society.

Mr Crosbie said information from traditional media such as newspapers, radio and TV has a provenance. "We should value organisations that produce good information."

Ahaha. Ahahahahaha. Yeah.....Brendan O'Connor's property advice, Myers borderline hatemongering, various articles that were not only wrong, but never properly corrected......Fuck off.

Liam Byrne · 06-02-2012 04:29PM

foxyboxer wrote: »

I say it's UK focused in terms of the Internal Politics. However, it's World News, Entertainment and Sport is generic to any English language newspaper.

Sport ? Really ? How would they cover an Ireland v England rugby match ? Do they have coverage of Irish GAA games ? Irish boxers ?

mikom · 06-02-2012 04:31PM

Mr Crosbie said information from traditional media such as newspapers, radio and TV has a provenance. "We should value organisations that produce good information."

Good information?
Lies, more like.
Case in point.... http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s720x720/314491_185342624876395_182354901841834_390458_1736182_n.jpg

Sonics2k · 06-02-2012 04:32PM

foxyboxer wrote: »

The point is that a quality daily paper is produced at a fraction of the price.

Why can't that be done in Ireland?

Because our population is tiny compared to the U.K. and they'd obviously have a higher circulation over there, so they can reduce the price but still make a profit.

How is this complicated

thebigbiffo · 06-02-2012 04:46PM

Last time I defended newspapers I got meself a 2 month ban...best thread carefully...

It’s laughable how the holier than thous on here love to indulge themselves in great little rant every time a newspaper is proven to have made a mistake – like the shagging internet is the last bastion of ‘the truth’. Unverifiable news from unaccountable organisations and individuals means that t’internet is the basis for a huge amount of false or misleading information, propaganda, scaremongering, scurrilous rumours and whatever else you’re having yourself. Newspapers have been the cornerstone of democracy and society for hundreds of years and you know what – they’re accountable. If mistakes have been made or there are inaccuracies then the least you can expect is a correction and a named individual can be held accountable. Fair enough, angles are taken and details or stories can be spinned but this will happen in any type of media from radio to TV to press to – dare I say it – even…OMG…the internet. As bad as some of the phone hacking ‘revelations’ were – I sort of view that hunger for a story that lead to that culture as not 100% a bad thing…just bad in that it was sensationalist celeb stories that particular rag was after. A good journo needs to get down with the filth and do some damn dirty work and if even 5% of the time he comes up with a story of real importance (and there are ‘000’s of example down through the years) then all the BS will have been worth it. I have never seen one stand-alone online entity (possibly barring wikileaks…but that’s not exactly day to day, locally focused journalism) that works every single day to dig out stories that the public need to hear to make our society better.

Ok ok, some papers are mindless s’hite. But this unbridled glee every time a newspaper gets it wrong is annoying

Nodin · 06-02-2012 04:51PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

Last time I defended newspapers I got meself a 2 month ban...best thread carefully...

It’s laughable how the holier than thous on here love to indulge themselves in great little rant every time a newspaper is proven to have made a mistake –

'mistakes'? Mistakes are a small part of the problem. It's the deliberate nonsense that causes most of the trouble.

thebigbiffo wrote: »

like the shagging internet is the last bastion of ‘the truth’. Unverifiable news from unaccountable organisations and individuals means that t’internet is the basis for a huge amount of false or misleading information, propaganda, scaremongering, scurrilous rumours and whatever else you’re having yourself.

As are the papers, funny enough.

woodoo · 06-02-2012 04:56PM

Imagine some of your taxes going to pay for the likes of the Sunday Independent so they can present the average public service worker like some sort of alien monster. At the same time never ever mention how useful some of the rich Irish peoples taxes would be to this country right now ... including the owners of Independent newspapers.

Nodin · 06-02-2012 05:02PM

woodoo wrote: »

Imagine some of your taxes going to pay for the likes of the Sunday Independent so they can present the average public service worker like some sort of alien monster. At the same time never ever mention how useful some of the rich Irish peoples taxes would be to this country right now ... including the owners of Independent newspapers.

.....near on 25% of the indo being owned by the noted citizen and measure of probity Denis O'Brien. Surely with the likes of he and Tony O'Reilly about, the decent thing is give them financial support.

thebigbiffo · 06-02-2012 05:03PM

Nodin wrote: »

[/COLOR]

'mistakes'? Mistakes are a small part of the problem. It's the deliberate nonsense that causes most of the trouble.
[/COLOR]

and there's no deliberate nonsense on the internet (and I'm actually taking 'deliberate' to mean in this case: 10% deliberatly misleading/outright lies and 90% an opinion Nodin doesn't agree with)? but again my point is that in the vast majority of cases someone within a newspaper group must defend what/how they've written a piece. This accountability is not present with a huge amount of information on the internet.

mikom · 06-02-2012 05:04PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

and there's no deliberate nonsense on the internet

Have you seen the fucking size of it?

thebigbiffo · 06-02-2012 05:12PM

mikom wrote: »

Have you seen the fucking size of it?

not the point. it's all relative. it's the keyboard warriors undermining the importance of accountable media organisations i've a problem with. it's quantifiable how many inaccuracies are printed in papers every day - it's infinite the amount of rubbish posted online every day. society does in fact need a free press so what Crosbie said is true...in broad terms.

the same people on here who would take to the streets in support of a free internet get on their high horses over a couple of innaccurate newspaper articles. it's laughable is all.

Nodin · 06-02-2012 05:13PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

....... but again my point is that in the vast majority of cases someone within a newspaper group must defend what/how they've written a piece. ..........

...Really? And if the agenda of that piece is a product of the managment/editorial staff?

You'll also find that there's infinetly more weight attached to what appears in 'traditional' broadsheets and printed media than what flys around on the net. Theres damn few times you see stories originating with worldnet daily and the like floating around for years.

Nodin · 06-02-2012 05:16PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

not the point. it's all relative. it's the keyboard warriors undermining the importance of accountable media organisations i've a problem with. it's quantifiable how many inaccuracies are printed in papers every day - it's infinite the amount of rubbish posted online every day. society does in fact need a free press so what Crosbie said is true...in broad terms.

,,,,,,,,.

....we don't have a fuck knows how many pages thread on some woman in donegal because of a comment on a message board.

mikom · 06-02-2012 05:20PM

thebigbiffo wrote: »

it's the keyboard warriors undermining the importance of accountable media organisations i've a problem with..

http://translate.google.com/#pl|en|

Hey guys, please don't destroy civil society

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