Would you wear clothing with the British Flag on it?

Fratton Fred · 19-01-2012 01:46AM

Auvers wrote: »

what a thread, I was posting my arguments today while waiting in the hospital for my wife to be induced

now my second child has been born a healthy baby girl, I couldn't actually give a flying fcuk about the union flag as all this sh1t pales in comparison to the miracle I just witnessed

but this thread was fun thanks lads and ladies

Well, on behalf of the red, white and blue parts of boards, I'd like to offer my heartfelt congratulations.

A union jack romper suit is in the post:D

Now get off and wet that baby's head!

19-01-2012 01:46AM

Auvers wrote: »

what a thread, I was posting my arguments today while waiting in the hospital for my wife to be induced

now my second child has been born a healthy baby girl, I couldn't actually give a flying fcuk about the union flag as all this sh1t pales in comparison to the miracle I just witnessed

but this thread was fun thanks lads and ladies

Get off Boards and go be a Dad!!!!:p

woodoo · 19-01-2012 01:47AM

bwatson wrote: »

Yeah ok. Its already become fairly clear something is deeply wrong with your personality. It seems your parents might very well be to blame. Very unfortunate. And my favourite film is Elf.

Are you a psychiatrist?

bwatson · 19-01-2012 01:49AM

Auvers wrote: »

what a thread, I was posting my arguments today while waiting in the hospital for my wife to be induced

now my second child has been born a healthy baby girl, I couldn't actually give a flying fcuk about the union flag as all this sh1t pales in comparison to the miracle I just witnessed

but this thread was fun thanks lads and ladies

Many congratulations. What are you calling her? I really like Lizzie

All the best to your family.

Auvers · 19-01-2012 01:50AM

Omackeral wrote: »

Get off Boards and go be a Dad!!!!:p

ah well what can I do

the auld head is buzzing cant sleep, so what else can I do?

I have to wet the babies head

bwatson · 19-01-2012 01:50AM

woodoo wrote: »

Are you a psychiatrist?

Obviously not. Its a combination of guesswork and confidence. :pac:

I don't think its normal as a thirty-five year old man to come out with such strange and crude statements though.

Johnny Foreigner · 19-01-2012 01:51AM

bwatson wrote: »

Yeah ok. Its already become fairly clear something is deeply wrong with your personality. It seems your parents might very well be to blame. Very unfortunate. And my favourite film is Elf.

You should not speak ill of the dead.
My parents were both tragically killed by a drunk driver 7 years ago.
You weren't to know that so I will forgive you.
My parents were wrong to disown me for dating a Protestant girl. However they made their choice, and I made mine. I respect them for standing by their beliefs to the end.
There is nothing wrong with my personality. I just have beliefs which are different to yours. It doesn't make me right and you wrong.
I base my opinions on personal experiences. I am fortunate that I have had the opportunity to have lived and worked in both England and Ireland, so I am in a position to make up my mind about which I prefer.
I respect that if I had been brought up in Northern Ireland in a Protestant community, then I would have your views about the British; and wearing an item of clothing with the Union Jack flag on it.
The main reason I don't like the Union Jack flag is that in modern times it represents sectarianism. You see I hate to see it used at Rangers matches at Ibrox, the same way I hate to see the tricolour used at Celtic matches.
I hate British culture, and British people. I have never felt that British culture or people are something I identify with.
Culturally I feel Irish, and I identify with Irish people.

Chuck Stone · 19-01-2012 01:51AM

Fratton Fred wrote: »

Not quite benign, it was akin to rounding up all the nationalists in Northern Ireland so that the IRA didn't have any safe houses. It got pretty messy though when a Cholera epidemis swept through the camps killing 20,000 people.

They also slaughtered their livestock, poisoned their wells, salted their feilds and burnt down their farm houses. The Boers consider it their holocaust.

2. Background

The Second War of Independence was fought from 1899 to 1902 when England laid her hands on the mineral riches of the Zuid-Afrikaansche Republiek (Transvaal) under the false pretence of protecting the rights of the foreigners who swarmed to the Transvaal gold fields.

On the battlefield England failed to get the better of the Boers, and decided to stoop to a full-scale war against the Boer women and children, employing a holocaust to force the burghers to surrender.

http://www.boer.co.za/boerwar/hellkamp.htm

Still, it is somewhat different to rounding up and gassing 8,000,000 Jews, Romas, Communists, disabled people

The Nazi Barbarism was on a greater and crueler scale but that doesn't make what was done in the name of Britain any less barbaric - especially from the point of view of it's victims.

19-01-2012 01:51AM

Auvers wrote: »

ah well what can I do

the auld head is buzzing cant sleep so what else can I do, have to wet the babies head

Just kidding Papa bear, congrats!!!

woodoo · 19-01-2012 01:54AM

bwatson wrote: »

Obviously not. Its a combination of guesswork and confidence. :pac:

I don't think its rational as a thirty-five year old man to come out with such strange statements though.

I diagnose good old fashioned ANGER

Chuck Stone · 19-01-2012 01:55AM

Auvers wrote: »

what a thread, I was posting my arguments today while waiting in the hospital for my wife to be induced

Baby Jack?

Auvers · 19-01-2012 01:56AM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

Baby Jack?

hhmm maybe Jacqueline

battries not included · 19-01-2012 01:58AM

I can not visit my parents home wearing any top or clothing with red/white/blue pattern, my dad would ask me to change it!

He is a republican and still believes that wearing any clothing that may represent
'the butchers apron' as he calls it, does not go down well....

personally I don't like any items with national flags on them apart from sportswear when a country is representing at the olympics etc..

http://www.know-britain.com/general/union_jack.html

Johnny Foreigner · 19-01-2012 02:01AM

woodoo wrote: »

Thats very interesting and i think more Irish could do with understanding that. But its hard to tell the difference because nobody plastered themselves in the union jack more than the Gallagher brothers from Oasis. Both their parents were 1st generation Irish.

In the Brit pop era of the 1990's it was Blur who plastered themselves with Union Jack's, not Oasis.
Liam and Noel are proud of the fact they are Manchester-Irish.
When they were asked to write and perform an new England Football song for the World Cup, they refused to do so; publicly declaring they were Irish not English.
I suppose you will bring up John Lydon (Johnny Rotten) for using the Union Jack on Sex Pistols artwork like God Save the Queen, even though he was London-Irish?
For the record Shane McGowan also used to wear a Union Jack shirt to Sex Pistols gigs, before he formed The Pogues. John Lydon always used to berate him for doing this as he was Irish.

bwatson · 19-01-2012 02:01AM

Johnny Foreigner wrote: »

You should not speak ill of the dead.
My parents were both tragically killed by a drunk driver 7 years ago.
You weren't to know that so I will forgive you.
My parents were wrong to disown me for dating a Protestant girl. However they made their choice, and I made mine. I respect them for standing by their beliefs to the end.
There is nothing wrong with my personality. I just have beliefs which are different to yours. It doesn't make me right and you wrong.
I base my opinions on personal experiences. I am fortunate that I have had the opportunity to have lived and worked in both England and Ireland, so I am in a position to make up my mind about which I prefer.
I respect that if I had been brought up in Northern Ireland in a Protestant community, then I would have your views about the British; and wearing an item of clothing with the Union Jack flag on it.
The main reason I don't like the Union Jack flag is that in modern times it represents sectarianism. You see I hate to see it used at Rangers matches at Ibrox, the same way I hate to see the tricolour used at Celtic matches.
I hate British culture, and British people. I have never felt that British culture or people are something I identify with.
Culturally I feel Irish, and I identify with Irish people.

Do you hate me? Do you hate David Mitchell? Do you hate Huw Edwards? Do you hate Jermain Defoe? Do you hate Ian Bell? etc, etc.

I just cannot get my head around the whole "I hate British people" thing. I don't understand why simply not identifying with a culture or relating to a people would suddenly cause such a feeling. I could possibly understand if you said you hated the way of life or something similar although I wouldn't necessarily agree. Its the hating of the people which I don't get. There are 62 million individuals there. Do you hate those Islamic extremists who are British but say they hate Britain? It is really quite confusing. Do you hate the baby of the Polish immigrants who has a British passport?

Seanchai · 19-01-2012 02:03AM

KeithAFC wrote: »

The UK actually fought Nazi Germany too.

Yes, after the British state collaborated with them for six years in a very popular British policy known as appeasement.

Dudess · 19-01-2012 02:03AM

Johnny Foreigner wrote: »

bwatson wrote: »

Yeah ok. Its already become fairly clear something is deeply wrong with your personality. It seems your parents might very well be to blame. Very unfortunate. And my favourite film is Elf.

You should not speak ill of the dead.
My parents were both tragically killed by a drunk driver 7 years ago.
You weren't to know that so I will forgive you.
My parents were wrong to disown me for dating a Protestant girl. However they made their choice, and I made mine. I respect them for standing by their beliefs to the end.
There is nothing wrong with my personality. I just have beliefs which are different to yours. It doesn't make me right and you wrong.
I base my opinions on personal experiences. I am fortunate that I have had the opportunity to have lived and worked in both England and Ireland, so I am in a position to make up my mind about which I prefer.
I respect that if I had been brought up in Northern Ireland in a Protestant community, then I would have your views about the British; and wearing an item of clothing with the Union Jack flag on it.
The main reason I don't like the Union Jack flag is that in modern times it represents sectarianism. You see I hate to see it used at Rangers matches at Ibrox, the same way I hate to see the tricolour used at Celtic matches.
I hate British culture, and British people. I have never felt that British culture or people are something I identify with.
Culturally I feel Irish, and I identify with Irish people.

For the love of god, how can you just hate British people?
And British culture is massive!

Seanchai · 19-01-2012 02:04AM

LordSutch wrote: »

90 years ago we had just finished fighting ze Germans!

90 years ago would have been January 1922 and you had just finished fighting the Irish. Ooops.

Seanchai · 19-01-2012 02:06AM

KeithAFC wrote: »

Battle of Britain?

A joke, compared to the Russian sacrifice. 43,000 British died in Operation Sealion/Battle of Britain v. 20,000,000 Russians who died during Operation Barbarossa/Nazi invasion of Russia.

Only in British nationalist post-War propaganda - you know, the same propaganda which likes to overlook 6 years of British state collaboration with the Nazis and demonisation of communists that is politely termed the policy of appeasement - are the two comparable.

Typically, the British poppy doesn't commemorate this massive Russian sacrifice. Only the dead of the British Empire's forces are worthy of commemoration to the rabidly British nationalist types who wear poppies.

starbelgrade · 19-01-2012 02:09AM

Auvers wrote: »

what a thread, I was posting my arguments today while waiting in the hospital for my wife to be induced

now my second child has been born a healthy baby girl, I couldn't actually give a flying fcuk about the union flag as all this sh1t pales in comparison to the miracle I just witnessed

but this thread was fun thanks lads and ladies

Congratulations dude! I got you a present for your new born. Just PM me your address & I'll post it on... http://www.babyonce.com/images/products/babylegs/union-jack_l.jpg

woodoo · 19-01-2012 02:09AM

Johnny Foreigner wrote: »

In the Brit pop era of the 1990's it was Blur who plastered themselves with Union Jack's, not Oasis.
Liam and Noel are proud of the fact they are Manchester-Irish.
When they were asked to write and perform an new England Football song for the World Cup, they refused to do so; publicly declaring they were Irish not English.
I suppose you will bring up John Lydon (Johnny Rotten) for using the Union Jack on Sex Pistols artwork like God Save the Queen, even though he was London-Irish?
For the record Shane McGowan also used to wear a Union Jack shirt to Sex Pistols gigs, before he formed The Pogues. John Lydon always used to berate him for doing this as he was Irish.

Maybe i was just mortally offended that they wore a union jack at all.

woodoo · 19-01-2012 02:11AM

Seanchai wrote: »

A joke, compared to the Russian sacrifice. 43,000 British died in Operation Sealion/Battle of Britain v. 20,000,000 Russians who died during Operation Barbarossa/Nazi invasion of Russia.

Only in British nationalist post-War propaganda - you know, the same propaganda which likes to overlook 6 years of British state collaboration with the Nazis and demonisation of communists that is politely termed the policy of appeasement - are the two comparable.

Typically, the British poppy doesn't commemorate this massive Russian sacrifice. Only the dead of the British Empire's forces are worthy of commemoration to the rabidly British nationalist types who wear poppies.

Yeah and the British would have you believe defeating Hitler was all down to them.

Auvers · 19-01-2012 02:11AM

starbelgrade wrote: »

Congratulations dude! I got you a present for your new born. Just PM me your address & I'll post it on... http://www.babyonce.com/images/products/babylegs/union-jack_l.jpg

love it, thanks

I suppose I need somewhere to put the soiled nappies

bwatson · 19-01-2012 02:13AM

Seanchai wrote: »

A joke, compared to the Russian sacrifice. 43,000 British died in Operation Sealion/Battle of Britain v. 20,000,000 Russians who died during Operation Barbarossa/Nazi invasion of Russia.

Only in British nationalist post-War propaganda - you know, the same propaganda which likes to overlook 6 years of British state collaboration with the Nazis and demonisation of communists that is politely termed the policy of appeasement - are the two comparable.

Typically, the British poppy doesn't commemorate this massive Russian sacrifice. Only the dead of the British Empire's forces are worthy of commemoration to the rabidly British nationalist types who wear poppies.

Oh good lord.

The point of the remembrance period is to: "commemorate the contribution of British and Commonwealth military and civilian servicemen and women in the two World Wars and later conflicts".

Every nation on earth pays its respect for those from their own towns, cities and families who have paid the ultimate sacrifice. Do you boycott the easter lily on account of it not paying sufficient respect to those Russians killed by the Wehrmacht?

Johnny Foreigner · 19-01-2012 02:15AM

bwatson wrote: »

Do you hate me? Do you hate David Mitchell? Do you hate Huw Edwards? Do you hate Jermain Defoe? Do you hate Ian Bell? etc, etc.

I just cannot get my head around the whole "I hate British people" thing. I don't understand why simply not identifying with a culture or relating to a people would suddenly cause such a feeling. I could possibly understand if you said you hated the way of life or something similar although I wouldn't necessarily agree. Its the hating of the people which I don't get. There are 62 million individuals there. Do you hate those Islamic extremists who are British but say they hate Britain? Ires really quite confusing. Do you hate the baby of the Polish immigrants who has a British passport?

I lived in London for 28 years. I lived in Oxford for 4 years when I attended University there. I moved to Ireland 3 years ago.
I am well educated, and well travelled; having visited over 20 countries.
I have dated both English and Irish girls.
I was not racist until I came to Ireland. Now I am racist. When I left Britain 3 years ago, I hated what it had become. Multiculturalism in Britain has not worked. I think Britain, like Ireland; has been too lax on immigration. There are now too many immigrants in both countries. My parents were immigrants, part of the Irish diaspora that left Ireland in 1960 and went to work in London.
I decided that 50 years later, I would do the same thing in reverse; and leave London to live in Ireland. I hate what Britain has become, and British peoples attitudes. Yes, that includes British born children of immigrants.
I feel I would be a hypocrite saying there are too many immigrants living in Britain, when my parents were immigrants and lived there too. I have no more right to live in Britain than anyone else born there. Rather than say they don't belong, I have no problem returning to Ireland; where I belong, as I am Irish.
There is a cultural difference between Irish people and British people. It is not just about race, or religion. It is cultural, that is something different.
I feel that Irish culture fits me, and my identity. British culture does not.
I have lived with, worked with, and dated British people; so I know the difference. I do not like multiculturalism, and think that people should mix with their own cultures and ethnic groups.
Personally I am Irish, and I like living in Ireland; and mixing with my own people. If I felt the same in Britain, then I would do so.
It is partly nature, and partly nurture. Some of our parents values, morals, and beliefs influence us as adults, but not all.
For example, my parents were Roman Catholics. I am an Atheist.
My parents were Republicans. I vote Labour.
It is personal preference at the end of the day. We are all different.

bwatson · 19-01-2012 02:17AM

woodoo wrote: »

Yeah and the British would have you believe defeating Hitler was all down to them.

No, they really wouldn't.

What you don't like is that the British are proud of the role their military played - first in fending off the Luftwaffe and saving the nation from invasion, and then the contribution made on the western front.

Britain may not have won the war - I don't believe you think that is actually a commonly accepted notion in the UK - however Britain certainly contributed to the defeat of Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy and the Japanese Empire. This cost us half a million men. We have every right to honour and respect them.

Celly Smunt · 19-01-2012 02:22AM

woodoo wrote: »

Yeah and the British would have you believe defeating Hitler was all down to them.

ridiculous statement,The British are proud of their service men,the sacrifices they have made over the past 100 years or so.They're one of the most,if not the most progressive Military outfits in the world today and are led by a great chain of command unlike the one's whole actually won the war.

Johnny Foreigner · 19-01-2012 02:23AM

Dudess wrote: »

For the love of god, how can you just hate British people?
And British culture is massive!

I don't just hate British people.
I also hate Africans, Roma Gypsies, and Asylum Seekers that have been refused entry to the UK, then come to Ireland instead of returning to their country of origin.
Yes, British culture is massive, so is American culture. But I am not a fan of globalisation. Ireland has lost its sovereignty and identity. We are no longer Irish, we are European. I think the Irish have lost their identity, and Ireland has too many immigrants.
I prefer Irish culture to British culture. That's my personal choice, and I respect that not all Irish feel the same. Maybe its because I was born in London and lived there for a long time, so British culture reached saturation pint for me.

starbelgrade · 19-01-2012 02:26AM

Johnny Foreigner wrote: »

I am well educated, and well travelled; having visited over 20 countries.
I have dated both English and Irish girls.
I was not racist until I came to Ireland. Now I am racist.

As I said before, what a waste of an education & experience if all it has taught you is to be a racist & to hate.

Your parents drove you away with their hatred based on religion & now you're all set up to carry on the tradition, albeit based on other beliefs.

I think you need counselling - it's not good to be so angry all the time, especially at groups of people as it is not only absurd, but unhealthy. You have some serious issues, that if they are not addressed, then you are likely to pass them on to your kids, which would be very unfair on them.

What your parents did to you was terrible, but there's no reason why you can't break that cycle if you put your mind & some effort into it.

And I say that with all sincerity - I'm not having a go at you here, you sound like someone who's in a world of pain & probably doesn't even realise it. But standing from the outside, it'd pretty clear for most people to see that from your posts.

Doc Ruby · 19-01-2012 02:26AM

Johnny Foreigner wrote: »

I don't just hate British people.
I also hate Africans

Would you ever fuck off.

Would you wear clothing with the British Flag on it?

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