Diesel 1.6 or 1.8 Ford Focus - What should I buy?

nicewine · 10-01-2012 12:38AM

mullingar wrote: »

+1
I found the power band is too small on the 1.8.
The 1.6 has a very wide power band so you are not changing gear as often

I have '08 Ghia, very happy with it, but I wonder what the differance in fuel economy between mine and a 1.6.

emmetmurphy · 10-01-2012 12:40AM

nicewine wrote: »

I have '08 Ghia, very happy with it, but I wonder what the differance in fuel economy between mine and a 1.6.

Hi niceswine, what mpg were you getting ?

maidhc · 10-01-2012 01:12AM

I much prefer the 1.6, much more drivable engine.

I had a 1.8 Mk1 TDCI, which is the exact same engine as in the Mk2 bar slightly less torque. It was good, but needed a flywheel at 85k, and EGR (I think) was gone when I let it go (due to a crash!).

MPG was between 45 and 50, maybe a little more on occasions, sometimes less. It struggled to make 500 miles until the fuel light came on with a tank of 52L or so.

The 1.6 will do 60mpg if you drive like a granny, or 54mpg if you act normal.

Lex Luthor · 10-01-2012 11:40AM

cant comment on the 1.8 but I ran a 1.6 TDCi as a rental for 2 weeks in Spain. Not sure what the bhp was but I was very impressed with the car. Quality was excellent and decent boot. Lots of motorway driving and it barely used any diesel. Power delivery was very smooth aswell so full of praise
Had a Golf then last yr as a rental, think it was a 1.4 or 1.6 diesel, cant be sure. Hated it from the first min I got into it. No power, bog standard spec. Swapped it after a day for a Galaxy Diesel which was much better to drive.

MrWenger1982 · 10-01-2012 03:08PM

Thanks guys for all the input. I'm still leaning towards a 1.6 based on what I've read. I'm usually pretty good at keeping the car serviced and the cheaper tax and fuel efficiency along with the newer engine is winning me over

Mycroft H · 10-01-2012 03:42PM

1.6 is a grand engine. Once its serviced with the right spec oil its fine.

Go with the 1.6. Better MPG and lower Co2 emissions

rhonin · 10-01-2012 04:06PM

I have the 1.6 TDCi. Its a great car but I've run into problems with the DPF. Two months ago I had to get the fuel additive filled which cost €300. Yesterday the engine light came on. I got it cheeked out by my mechanic and he said I need to get the DPF replaced which is going to set me back about €800. I always get it serviced at the required intervals.
Beside all this it's a solid car but be prepared for the DPF!

MrWenger1982 · 10-01-2012 05:48PM

Thanks guys. Opinion seems to be pretty consistent that the 1.6 is the way to go and good to hear from an actual owner of a 1.6 TCDI

Leonard Hofstadter · 10-01-2012 06:05PM

The DPF problem can be cured by removing it, the DPF is not required for the car to pass the emissions aspect of the NCT. I'd leave it in there until it fails, but as soon as it does I'd be getting the car remapped so it can run without one.

Tea 1000 · 10-01-2012 06:34PM

Mossess wrote: »

Tea 1000 at the end of the day you get what you pay for.

You're deluded by the VW myth I see. What do you get in a Golf that you don't get in a Focus? Please give a detailed reply, not some generic "golf is better" type crap.

Mossess · 10-01-2012 07:12PM

Tea 1000 wrote: »

You're deluded by the VW myth I see. What do you get in a Golf that you don't get in a Focus? Please give a detailed reply, not some generic "golf is better" type crap.

okay. Honestly it's a few things. My father and brother both love Fords. I don't understand it. One of my brothers Focus's (he has 2) is now parked up, something wrong with the engine. My father’s last focus died of an engine problem too. Yes, he has another. I have one of each, both are 06, both are fully serviced. The Focus seems to cost more to run. The Golf seems to be of stronger build too. The focus seems a little like driving around in a sardine can.

mullingar · 10-01-2012 07:22PM

Mossess wrote: »

The Focus seems to cost more to run. The Golf seems to be of stronger build too. The focus seems a little like driving around in a sardine can.

Great evidence based arguments there.:pac:

Mossess · 10-01-2012 08:37PM

Lol, I'm not arguing, just telling you what I think.

But yes, the Golf is better. But seriously how can anyone answer which is better? Quality? Sure there are lots of cars with better quality records. Resale value? Sales? Customer reports? Surely whichever is better is whichever is better for you yourself.

mullingar · 10-01-2012 09:20PM

http://www.reliabilityindex.com/top-100

According to that link, the Ford Focus is a lot more reliable than a Golf.

Just looking at the results, there are a lot of Fords in the top half compared to VW's.

dr.fuzzenstein · 10-01-2012 09:21PM

I have an '06 Focus Cmax Zetec 1.8 TDCI.
Bought it with 130k km on it and now (year and a half later) has 205k km on it.
In that time I serviced it every 20k km (with correct spec oil), new filters, and that's about it.
It had a slight electrical fault which caused the engine light to come on at some stage last year (November or so) and another fault due to a chafed wire a few weeks later. Both faults could have been related. Was sorted for E180 by a very friendly Indy garage.
Other than that it has never gone wrong even in the slightest, I find the engine nice, it pulls willingly from low revs all the way to the red line (if I wanted to, but no need to).
The radio is very decent, the speakers loud enough to deafen you and drown out the wife and it can be fitted with an Aux cable very easily.
I really don't think it has a narrow power band.
Some of the old TDDI's would be completely gutless below 2000 rpm, explode above that and run out of steam at 4000, maybe that's what some people are referring to.
It burns almost zero oil and is very comfy, fuel economy can be had at around 50 mpg without having to drive like a Granny and it is quite torque-y. I.e. you can change gears like a taxi driver, i.e. never bother the revcounter above 2000 rpm.

As for "DMF guaranteed to fail at 100k"? Well, 205k km and counting.
It's a lot of scaremongering. I'm sure plenty of these will go forever without fallig apart every few km's.

Leonard Hofstadter · 10-01-2012 09:32PM

To be fair the 1.8 TDCi does have a reputation for failing DMFs:)! Doesn't mean they're all going to do it obviously. And if the car is mostly driven out of town then it will get a lot further before the DMF fails.

In relation to Fords and reliability, due to the sheer number of them sold you're going to hear of horror stories from time to time. For the most part they are as reliable as anything the Japs make. Usually when a Ford gives trouble it is down to a neglectful owner who doesn't treat the car with the mechanical sympathy it deserves. They rarely give trouble when they're looked after. They're a great car to drive and cost peanuts to run. Even when they do go wrong parts are dirt cheap for them as well.

The only thing against a Ford is that the interior is ever so slightly less classy feeling than a VW (but not by much, and they have a much better feelgood factor than any Toyota has) and snobbery by German car fans, who think a Ford is an inferior made car despite the fact that Fords are on the whole far more reliable than anything ze Germans make.

dr.fuzzenstein · 10-01-2012 09:51PM

captainspeed wrote: »

and snobbery by German car fans, who think a Ford is an inferior made car despite the fact that Fords are on the whole far more reliable than anything ze Germans make.

Oh man, you got that one right!
Was over in the Heimat and saw very few Fords, in fact in a whole week I saw ONE CMax, we just love home made cars over there.
And it's just misguided, a lot of Fords are made near Cologne.
And to make matters worse, they still think Opel is a German car, they're about as German as Ford, which is yes and no.

George Dalton · 10-01-2012 11:26PM

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

I find the engine nice, it pulls willingly from low revs all the way to the red line (if I wanted to, but no need to).

I find the same. I actually prefer the power delivery of the 1.8 to the 1.6. The 1.8 in a Mondeo is a bit overwhelmed but it suits the Focus just fine IMO.

maidhc · 11-01-2012 01:03AM

captainspeed wrote: »

To be fair the 1.8 TDCi does have a reputation for failing DMFs:)! Doesn't mean they're all going to do it obviously. And if the car is mostly driven out of town then it will get a lot further before the DMF fails.

I think they improved the DMFs a lot by 06/07.

jimmad · 11-01-2012 03:24AM

I've had the 1.6 90ps forcus since June and love it, has plenty of poke and comfortable to drive.

On the remapping, would there be any benefit in putting one of the tuning boxes in or are they a placebo as apposed to a proper ecu remap, I assume both would effect your insurance?

spedygirl · 03-02-2013 11:46AM

hi lads, just a question for mullingar, is there a dpf in all focus 1.6tdci or is it just the 110bhp ones?? was looking to buy am 09 zetec model with 97000 miles on it,would i be better to get a 90bhp instead?? thanks, carol.

mullingar · 03-02-2013 11:50AM

spedygirl wrote: »

hi lads, just a question for mullingar, is there a dpf in all focus 1.6tdci or is it just the 110bhp ones?? was looking to buy am 09 zetec model with 97000 miles on it,would i be better to get a 90bhp instead?? thanks, carol.

Only the 110hp has the dpf.

An 09 with 97k miles!?....

JohnBoy26 · 03-02-2013 12:52PM

spedygirl wrote: »

hi lads, just a question for mullingar, is there a dpf in all focus 1.6tdci or is it just the 110bhp ones?? was looking to buy am 09 zetec model with 97000 miles on it,would i be better to get a 90bhp instead?? thanks, carol.

Get the 1.8 and save yourself the hassle of them 1.6 disastrus engines.

dr.fuzzenstein · 03-02-2013 02:22PM

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

Get the 1.8 and save yourself the hassle of them 1.6 disastrus engines.

If you do get the 1.8, listen very carefully for vibration and knocking from the clutch when the engine is running in idle.
If you hear rumbling and clunking when the clutch is out, which goes away once you press the clutch, the DMF is on it's way out.
How much does it cost to fix?
I don't know yet, but someone quoted me E700 for the clutch and flywheel kit plus E300 for fitting it. I'm trying to get both figures down somewhat, I think E700 for a clutch kit is a bit much, I've seen a clutch and flywheel kit on onlineautomotive for £230.
I cannot even begin to know how there can be such a yawning chasm in price, but one was an Irish motorfactors and the other a UK online shop, I will have to do some more research before shouting "Ripoff!"

edit:
It was only the DMF without the clutch, add them up and you're looking at £480.
edit II:
And the clutch and flywheel have lasted 7 years and 235k km so far, so it's not too bad.
And I'm sure the 1.6 engine is only disasterous with "Irish" servicing, i.e. change the oil every 50k km and use sunflower oil.

JohnBoy26 · 03-02-2013 02:26PM

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

If you do get the 1.8, listen very carefully for vibration and knocking from the clutch when the engine is running in idle.
If you hear rumbling and clunking when the clutch is out, which goes away once you press the clutch, the DMF is on it's way out.
How much does it cost to fix?
I don't know yet, but someone quoted me E700 for the clutch and flywheel kit plus E300 for fitting it. I'm trying to get both figures down somewhat, I think E700 for a clutch kit is a bit much, I've seen a clutch and flywheel kit on onlineautomotive for £230.
I cannot even begin to know how there can be such a yawning chasm in price, but one was an Irish motorfactors and the other a UK online shop, I will have to do some more research before shouting "Ripoff!"

The 1.6 also gives clutch and flywheel trouble though amongst many other issues.

spedygirl · 03-02-2013 02:29PM

im guessing that you think 97k is too high,,,? it is after all an english import,like everything else in this country. Im kinda sold on the 1.6 after reading all the info here, and as i have a vw transporter with dmf judder, i think a 1.6 is a good choice,jsut not 110bhp. any idea how much for a remap?

JohnBoy26 · 04-02-2013 12:45AM

spedygirl wrote: »

im guessing that you think 97k is too high,,,? it is after all an english import,like everything else in this country. Im kinda sold on the 1.6 after reading all the info here, and as i have a vw transporter with dmf judder, i think a 1.6 is a good choice,jsut not 110bhp. any idea how much for a remap?

No it's not the mileage, it's those awful 1.6 hdi engines that's in them. Turbo failure is very common in them and is expensive to put right. They have a design flaw which causes the engine oil to turn into sludge which then blocks the turbo oil feed pipe which then starves the turbo of oil causing it to fail.

If your looking for a 1.6 diesel car id go for a hyundai i30 or kia cee'd. Both have a much nicer engine than the ford and are more reliable.

olewy · 04-02-2013 01:40AM

JohnBoy26 wrote: »

No it's not the mileage, it's those awful 1.6 hdi engines that's in them. Turbo failure is very common in them and is expensive to put right. They have a design flaw which causes the engine oil to turn into sludge which then blocks the turbo oil feed pipe which then starves the turbo of oil causing it to fail.

If your looking for a 1.6 diesel car id go for a hyundai i30 or kia cee'd. Both have a much nicer engine than the ford and are more reliable.

Looking to buy a 2nd diesel myself & currently having a similar dilemna.

I've also read that the kia/hyundai 1.6 crdi is more reliable but they're rarer, pricier & less roomy (bootwise anyway) compared to the Focus.

How does the Focus 2.0 Tdci compare to the 1.6 & 1.8 Tdci in terms of reliability? Obviously its more to tax & less efficient than either. I've test driven all 3 of them & while I liked the 1.6 (smooth, relatively quiet, flexible power delivery) it seemed under powered compared to the rougher older 1.8 (noticeably more torque).
I think the 2.0 i tested may have been a lemon so I think I need to test another one but just curious on their reliability.

I'd go for a Mondeo 2.0 tdci titanium if they weren't so big (v. wide & long = awkward moving in & out of tight spots & parking). If the 2.0 is reasonably reliable & if the same unit is in the Volvo S40 i'd be veering towards an s40 2.0d SE but then again they have owner reports of poor consumption. Argh decisions. As someone said earlier & which I've found through research myself; there are no perfect modern diesels available these days.

mullingar · 04-02-2013 09:44AM

The reliability of the 1.6 and 1.8 are similar.

The main fault with the 1.6 is poor servicing tolerance. If the engine is serviced on time with the correct oil you wont kill your turbo. Turbos mainly fail due to oil starvation as the are a very simple device and need oil to avoid self destruction. The good point of the 1.6, is a refined engine with a very wide power band so a much better drive.

The main fault with the 1.8 is ghe DMF, these are near guaranteed to fail around 75k miles. This is a very old engine dating back to the Sierra and has a narrower power band.

DPFs from any manufacturer will fail.

corkgsxr · 04-02-2013 10:01AM

Its not poor service tolerance. The oil amount is too small and the interval is too long.

If your daily commute is too close to the motorway the turbo wont last. Drive in citys too much and you get egr and dpf trouble.

I figure unless your quite lucky youll get bother with the 1.6hdi

Diesel 1.6 or 1.8 Ford Focus - What should I buy?

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