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Racism - Mod Note on 1st Post - Read before posting.

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Comments

  • #4802
    daithijjj
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,588 ✭✭✭daithijjj


    Samich wrote: »
    Yes? What's the point you're making?

    Say that in europe and it's a racial slur. Also that was aimed at a player in support of him.

    What Suarez did was like an English person coming over here and calling by chance, a traveller, a tinker. I'm sure it has a different meaning in England but if an english person said it to a traveller than they wouldn't be saying "It means something else in England". They wouldn't be saying it in future fo sho.

    Its not though, GB & I does not encompass 'Europe'. You can find the word 'negro' (as descriptive) for example, used in daily newspapers in Spain. Some nicknames of players etc.

    People have seen what Collymore has received today. Collymore himself said live on radio not long ago about a holiday he had in Spain with his Spanish friends. They were effectively using the exact same words as seemingly Suarez has. He asked his friend about it but he then said he totally accepted that this is how they communicate with each other. He was surprised obviously but those words are used differently.

    Your second highlighted point is ridiculous by the way. We speak the same languages and are 'neighbours' and generally have the same values. Thats like saying if a Uruguayan came over here (Argentina). Language/neighbours/context/values, all similar. However, in the case of Suarez, it is, in my opinion an unfortunate clash of cultures.

    Someone mentioned earlier the word 'gringo', if anyone called you that in this part of the world you would assume they were joking about with a friend, i dunno, maybe having a laugh while out and about eating Mexican food or something. You say that word close to Mexico and its right up there with 'ni**er' in terms of offence caused. You could live in a place for quite a while and pick up on nuances like this.

    Ive lived in a 'foreign' country for 13 years, but even with 'neighbours' there are clashes. For example, i filled out a application form for a job while at University for a large company, on that form was ethnic origin, i clicked 'white european', i had to unclick it and click 'white irish' after i scrolled further. Thats one i look back on and laugh but trust me when i say, that England is a far more xenophobic culture than Ireland in my experience. I could right pages of worse stuff ive come across but its not really adding anything to this thread.

    And under FA rules, xenophobia comes under the same umbrella as racism. So, by FA rules, if im called a 'paddy' on a football pitch, that comes with the same punishment as if i refer to 'black' on a pitch.

    An important point as well here, is that the FA have previously and recently given a punishment to an Englishman born and bread, of 3 matches for admitting to a racial slur. The ban handed out to Suarez should at least be the same, considering the only evidence we know about so far is Suarez own addmission. So why has the English man been given 3 games and the Uruguayan 8?. We can posture on that one until the written reasons come out. Either there is a witness (other than Evra) and Suarez had no choice but admit it or, the punishment handed out is indeed Suarez being used as a posterboy for the rest of the world as to the standards in England. You can read quotes from campaigners, Gordon Taylor etc that this "a message to the world".

    Lastly, there is no argument with the guilty verdict here from me. It was wrong what he said. However, there is something else here that has me uneasy, and i havent felt like that since Eduardo got hung out to dry as the posterboy against diving. This punishment kinda stinks, in a fashion that the FA are making a point to the world, to Sepp Blatter, and basically anyone who might think of crossing the border into England in the future. And that is not right, if indeed the punishment was handed out based on Suarez own admission.

    FIFA and Blatter were not on 'trial' here and there are far too many comments being made that the 'world should take note' of this verdict. It like the time Eduardo took the first dive ever on a pitch and Suarez was the first man to make a racial slur. Neither were and the initial punishments handed out to both were well over the top considering what went before in the global village of football.

    Even today, you have people unconnected to LFC saying that the punishment could easily and perhaps should be reduced.

    People have suggested that LFC could have handled it better and should have displayed kick it out tee shirts, maybe they should have. And maybe the FA could have handled this better, given a verdict along with reasons at the same time instead of ridiculous delays fueling fires, and also used this opportunity to hammer home education on these issues to players who enter teams under their association.

    A better 'punishment' for Suarez would have maybe been an awareness programme instead of 40k fine (i think Cantona did something similar with kids programme for his punishment?), alongside the FA, where cultural difference and whats acceptable in England is headlined further, and educates, rather than the current shambles of delays, divisions of hatred growing wider, conclusions but no available evidence, a black man (Paul McGrath) criticising another black man (Glen Johnson) and a general clusterfu*k of nobody really knowing whats going on, and why these conclusions and punishment have been reached.

    The FA could have turned this into a 'positive' for the kick it out campaign, instead, it has escalated into something that should never have got this far.


  • #4803
    Iang87
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭Iang87


    YouTookMyName wrote: »
    "Suarez: Not a racist"

    36.jpg

    i'd swear suarez was wearing a ring seconds before this was taken....

    oh i made a racist funny :P


  • #4804
    RayCon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,940 ✭✭✭RayCon


    This is turning into an episode of South Park !!


  • #4805
    Iang87
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭Iang87


    RayCon wrote: »
    This is turning into an episode of South Park !!

    you're an episode of south park.

    Anyway i reckon this thread be dead til the half page about terry after he gets banned/not not banned and then explosion when the suarez evidence is out


  • #4806
    RayCon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,940 ✭✭✭RayCon


    Iang87 wrote: »
    you're an episode of south park.

    :confused:


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  • #4807
    Iang87
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,181 ✭✭✭Iang87


    RayCon wrote: »
    :confused:

    yep


  • #4808
    RayCon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,940 ✭✭✭RayCon


    Iang87 wrote: »
    yep
    Thanks for clearing that up.


  • #4809
    Crazy Horse 6
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,474 ✭✭✭Crazy Horse 6


    Argentina, clearly a team of racists.
    argentina_caceres-640x640x80.jpg


  • #4810
    Will I Amnt
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,222 ✭✭✭✭Will I Amnt


    Crazy Horse 6 wrote: »
    Argentina, clearly a team of racists.
    argentina_caceres-640x640x80.jpg
    Bit late with that one.
    Go back and check the reaction it got earlier.


  • #4811
    SantryRed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,224 ✭✭✭✭SantryRed


    mister men wrote: »
    Argentina, clearly a team of racists.
    argentina_caceres-640x640x80.jpg

    Not in there fcuking country. Do people not fcuking get that? This thread infuriates me greatly. it should be shut down until the report is released as both sides are arguing on hearsay. And people on both sides are leaving some idiotic posts and full of bias.


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  • #4812
    Crazy Horse 6
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,474 ✭✭✭Crazy Horse 6


    SantryRed wrote: »
    Not in there fcuking country. Do people not fcuking get that? This thread infuriates me greatly. it should be shut down until the report is released as both sides are arguing on hearsay. And people on both sides are leaving some idiotic posts and full of bias.
    Now now calm down dear it's only football not war.


  • #4813
    Blatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,832 ✭✭✭✭Blatter


    Here's an article about Liverpool's PR team and how badly they have handled the whole incident. I have to say I do agree with it and find it hard to believe that some of the stuff that has happened.

    The PR team really should be sacked tbh.

    http://www.thezimbabwean.co.uk/sport/55479/liverpool-sacks-pr-team.html
    Liverpool sacks PR team

    Well, that’s the headline I keep expecting (and hoping) to see every day.

    Liverpool Football Club has shown an astonishing naïvety and lack of common sense in their approach to handling the Luis Suarez/Patrice Evra incident. From the time that the initial complaint was made by Evra, the club has adopted an aggressive, belligerent and very public stance to dealing with the matter.

    Whoever is in charge of the Public Relations at Liverpool should be fired as the advice they are providing is counterproductive and hurting the brand.

    For those who have not followed the story between Liverpool’s Luis Suarez and Manchester United’s Patrice Evra, a brief recap.

    An incident occurred on 15 October 2011 during the Premier League fixture between Liverpool and Manchester United, following which Evra claimed that Suarez racially abused him “at least ten times”. The matter was reported to the Football Association (“FA”) who launched an investigation.

    Liverpool’s initial response was to deny, deny and deny again. An unnamed Liverpool spokesman was quoted as saying “The first thing we did, as you would expect, is ask the player and he has categorically denied using any language of that nature.” This approach does not tend to end well as Bill Clinton found out during the Lewinsky cigar debacle. I understand that the club feels an obligation to protect and support a highly prized asset, but PR101 should have steered the club clear of such a definitive statement until all the facts and the evidence had been presented.

    Following the decision to investigate the issue, the FA made it clear that both clubs were not to discuss the matter in the media. From this Guardian article on 16 November 2011 it was noted that “The FA is acutely aware of the sensitivities between the two clubs and asked them both at the outset not to risk inflaming the situation by discussing it in the media.” From a PR101 perspective, Liverpool have managed another epic fail in not respecting the wishes of the FA in this regard. Suarez and manager Kenny Dalglish, in particular, have made numerous media statements and comments which have not shown the club in a positive light.

    On 20 December 2011, the FA released a statement saying that Luis Suarez had been “banned for eight games and fined £40,000 after being found guilty of misconduct, regarding using insulting words towards Patrice Evra of Manchester United. Unfortunately, the FA did not (for reasons best known to themselves) release the detailed reasoning behind their decision which is to follow in due course.

    To call the reaction of Liverpool FC hysterical when they released this would be a huge understatement. Understandably, the club would be upset that the FA made a decision against their player, but from a PR perspective this is where cool heads are required to assess the situation and to come out with a level-headed response. Instead, it appears that the PR gurus were high on a combination of crack and heroin when they decided to run the statement on the club’s website.

    The statement contains inaccuracies, contradictions and an accusation of bias against the FA, which Liverpool FC have based entirely on the word of Luis Suarez without having studied all of the available evidence (because it hasn’t been released yet). As argued here by Andi Thomas, “Liverpool fans are being told by their club to reject a decision they have not seen the reasoning behind, simply on the basis that the club disagrees with it.”

    The club continues to dig its own grave by making statements about Suarez not being racist and how “some of his best mates are Tokyo Sexwale”. They point to Suarez being of mixed heritage, the work he does for charity and how he has black teammates. The matter decided on by the FA had nothing to do with whether or not Suarez was racist because it is still possible for a person to make racist remarks regardless of whether that person is racist or not.

    To make matters worse, the Liverpool PR team took another leave of absence prior to Liverpool’s game against Wigan on 21 December 2011 at the DW stadium. This time it was the Liverpool players who released a statement on the club’s website and warmed up wearing t-shirts in support of Suarez. Missing the point entirely, they stated that “We totally support Luis and we want the world to know that. We know he is not racist.” I don’t have a problem with the Liverpool players rallying around a friend in a time of need, but I have a problem when the comments made are misguided. To repeat once more, the FA made no mention of whether or not Suarez was racist and Evra also echoed the same sentiment. That has not, and is not, the issue here.

    Liverpool’s public handling of the Suarez matter has been extremely poor throughout. One can only hope that the current PR team is sacked and replaced with any person who has half a brain. Here’s hoping anyway.

    P.S. Somehow, that initial statement reacting to the FA’s findings is still up on the club’s website two days later.

    There's also a good article here by Paul Parker, who reserves definitive judgement until the report, but also gives his opinion on working on the assumption that Suarez has admitted to using a word and cultural differences have indeed played their part.

    He says that if that is the case, then the guilty verdict is correct but the severity of the punishment is harsh as he feels Suarez has been hung out to dry and made an example of by The FA.

    Both are good reads.


  • #4814
    Blatter
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,832 ✭✭✭✭Blatter


    And now Ferguson finally breaks his silence;

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/dec/23/alex-ferguson-luis-suarez-ban?newsfeed=true
    Sir Alex Ferguson says Luis Suárez ban was 'right decision'

    • United coach indicates Liverpool should accept ban
    • Kenny Dalglish concerned about crowd reaction to Suárez

    Sir Alex Ferguson has broken his silence on the Luis Suárez affair, describing the Liverpool striker's eight-match ban for racially abusing Patrice Evra as "the right decision" and indicating that the Anfield club should accept the guilty verdict.

    Liverpool's vigorous defence of the Uruguayan, including the controversial decision to warm up for their game at Wigan in Suárez T-shirts, has led to widespread criticism throughout the game. Ferguson was not willing to talk about Liverpool's protest statement, in which they described Evra as "not reliable" and called on the Football Association to issue a separate charge against the Manchester United defender, but he made clear that the Premier League champions felt vindicated.

    "Our support of Patrice was obvious right from the word go and that's still the same. The matter is over and I think we're satisfied that they [the FA's independent commission] found the right decision. This wasn't about Manchester United and Liverpool at all. It was nothing to do with that. This was an individual situation where one person was racially abused."

    Liverpool maintain that was not the case, despite Suárez reportedly admitting using the word "negro", and are now waiting for the commission chairman, Paul Goulding QC, to deliver his full written findings before deciding whether to lodge an appeal.

    That risks an even longer ban and Ferguson drew a parallel with the way United reacted when Evra was banned for four matches in 2008 for becoming embroiled in a post-match fight with Sam Bethell, a Chelsea groundsman. The club, he pointed out, had accepted the verdict.

    "Patrice got that suspension for the incident down at Chelsea when no one was there, just a groundsman and our fitness coach. He got a four-match ban and we had to wait two weeks for the evidence to come through. We were quite astounded at that. A four-match ban? We thought it was well over the top for a trivial incident. But it happened and there's nothing you can do about it, you know."

    The insinuation was that Liverpool should accept Suárez's guilt but there is no sign of that from Anfield, with Kenny Dalglish maintaining he had no regrets over the T-shirt protest and aggressive wording of their statement.

    "The club have issued a statement and the players have made their statement both visually and verbally," said Dalglish. "The statement couldn't have caused anybody any trouble. I don't think the players have caused any trouble with the FA either with their statement or by their support with the T-shirts. If we are not in any trouble, we will just leave it at that before we do get into any trouble."

    Dalglish said "it might be weeks" before the commission's findings are made public and believes the verdict and the reasons for it should have been released simultaneously. In the vacuum, the Liverpool manager fears opposition crowds will declare open season on Suárez, as was the case at the DW Stadium on Wednesday.

    He said: "I wouldn't think it is helpful to anybody that it [the verdict] is done before we have seen the written documents. If that's the way they have always done it then we cannot complain. I wouldn't know because I have never been involved in anything like this before.

    "They [the Football Association] run the game; we don't, do we? Whether you agree with it is another matter. In another walk of life, they would have walked away and waited until they had it ready. But this is what happened. I think where they have to be more supportive is the reaction from people – and the antagonism of the crowds – towards Luis. That is the great problem."

    The Liverpool manager believes the fallout from the complex case will be far-reaching for the FA. "It would be helpful to everyone if someone gave us some guidelines about what you can and cannot say," he argued. Yet despite his concerns over the hostility towards Suárez, who is also facing an improper conduct charge for allegedly making an offensive gesture towards Fulham supporters at Craven Cottage on 5 December, Dalglish is adamant the 24-year-old can handle the scrutiny.

    "Obviously he would be better off without it, but he is a strong enough character and he has handled it very well up to now so I wouldn't expect him to show anything other than total strength. If Luis is fit and well, he will be considered for the matches until such time that he is under sanction."

    Ferguson is clearly unimpressed with the lengths to which Liverpool have gone, including Dalglish's decision to wear a Suaárez T-shirt during a television interview on Wednesday. "I don't need to talk about it," he said, before adding pointedly: "I'm happy with how I run my club."

    The United manager was asked whether he fears it will worsen the rivalry between the two clubs. "This is the biggest derby game in the country," he replied. "It's never needed anything to light the powder keg; it's always there."


  • #4815
    Peyton Manning
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,658 ✭✭✭✭Peyton Manning


    Gerrard comes out in support of Evra. Obvious signs of a divide at Liverpool.

    260444_10150276773262780_688187779_9114357_4137562_n.jpg


  • #4816
    donalg1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,513 ✭✭✭donalg1


    Blatter wrote: »
    And now Ferguson finally breaks his silence;

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2011/dec/23/alex-ferguson-luis-suarez-ban?newsfeed=true
    Sir Alex Ferguson says Luis Suárez ban was 'right decision'

    • United coach indicates Liverpool should accept ban
    • Kenny Dalglish concerned about crowd reaction to Suárez

    Sir Alex Ferguson has broken his silence on the Luis Suárez affair, describing the Liverpool striker's eight-match ban for racially abusing Patrice Evra as "the right decision" and indicating that the Anfield club should accept the guilty verdict.

    Liverpool's vigorous defence of the Uruguayan, including the controversial decision to warm up for their game at Wigan in Suárez T-shirts, has led to widespread criticism throughout the game. Ferguson was not willing to talk about Liverpool's protest statement, in which they described Evra as "not reliable" and called on the Football Association to issue a separate charge against the Manchester United defender, but he made clear that the Premier League champions felt vindicated.

    "Our support of Patrice was obvious right from the word go and that's still the same. The matter is over and I think we're satisfied that they [the FA's independent commission] found the right decision. This wasn't about Manchester United and Liverpool at all. It was nothing to do with that. This was an individual situation where one person was racially abused."

    Liverpool maintain that was not the case, despite Suárez reportedly admitting using the word "negro", and are now waiting for the commission chairman, Paul Goulding QC, to deliver his full written findings before deciding whether to lodge an appeal.

    That risks an even longer ban and Ferguson drew a parallel with the way United reacted when Evra was banned for four matches in 2008 for becoming embroiled in a post-match fight with Sam Bethell, a Chelsea groundsman. The club, he pointed out, had accepted the verdict.

    "Patrice got that suspension for the incident down at Chelsea when no one was there, just a groundsman and our fitness coach. He got a four-match ban and we had to wait two weeks for the evidence to come through. We were quite astounded at that. A four-match ban? We thought it was well over the top for a trivial incident. But it happened and there's nothing you can do about it, you know."

    The insinuation was that Liverpool should accept Suárez's guilt but there is no sign of that from Anfield, with Kenny Dalglish maintaining he had no regrets over the T-shirt protest and aggressive wording of their statement.

    "The club have issued a statement and the players have made their statement both visually and verbally," said Dalglish. "The statement couldn't have caused anybody any trouble. I don't think the players have caused any trouble with the FA either with their statement or by their support with the T-shirts. If we are not in any trouble, we will just leave it at that before we do get into any trouble."

    Dalglish said "it might be weeks" before the commission's findings are made public and believes the verdict and the reasons for it should have been released simultaneously. In the vacuum, the Liverpool manager fears opposition crowds will declare open season on Suárez, as was the case at the DW Stadium on Wednesday.

    He said: "I wouldn't think it is helpful to anybody that it [the verdict] is done before we have seen the written documents. If that's the way they have always done it then we cannot complain. I wouldn't know because I have never been involved in anything like this before.

    "They [the Football Association] run the game; we don't, do we? Whether you agree with it is another matter. In another walk of life, they would have walked away and waited until they had it ready. But this is what happened. I think where they have to be more supportive is the reaction from people – and the antagonism of the crowds – towards Luis. That is the great problem."

    The Liverpool manager believes the fallout from the complex case will be far-reaching for the FA. "It would be helpful to everyone if someone gave us some guidelines about what you can and cannot say," he argued. Yet despite his concerns over the hostility towards Suárez, who is also facing an improper conduct charge for allegedly making an offensive gesture towards Fulham supporters at Craven Cottage on 5 December, Dalglish is adamant the 24-year-old can handle the scrutiny.

    "Obviously he would be better off without it, but he is a strong enough character and he has handled it very well up to now so I wouldn't expect him to show anything other than total strength. If Luis is fit and well, he will be considered for the matches until such time that he is under sanction."

    Ferguson is clearly unimpressed with the lengths to which Liverpool have gone, including Dalglish's decision to wear a Suaárez T-shirt during a television interview on Wednesday. "I don't need to talk about it," he said, before adding pointedly: "I'm happy with how I run my club."

    The United manager was asked whether he fears it will worsen the rivalry between the two clubs. "This is the biggest derby game in the country," he replied. "It's never needed anything to light the powder keg; it's always there."

    Whatever about the players wearing the t shirts but kenny doing it too was so ridiculous the man showed how out of touch and unprofessional he is by doing that bad day to be a lfc fan


  • #4817
    K-9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    It is slightly easier to keep quiet about things when things go your way.

    People who feel a case is wrong tend to make more noise!

    Pretty obvious I would have thought.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • #4818
    SoulTrader
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 850 ✭✭✭SoulTrader


    Manchester United & Ferguson have done a commendable job of keeping their counsel on all matters since Suarez was first charged, in light of Liverpool's mud-slinging and unfounded allegations against Evra.


  • #4819
    d22ontour
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,391 ✭✭✭d22ontour


    I was kinda disappointed with the verdict and was hoping it was more a cultural indifference which could have easily have been sorted weeks ago with a phone call or two if that was the case.
    Now we have a bizarre situation were we have a club saying negrito isn't a derogatory remark because it's socially accepted in a country give or take 10,000 km away.

    The Charge : was using language which could be seen as racially derogatory towards a certain person.

    The evidence : This is so puzzling, we await the release of the report which will clarify the incident so much more but yet there is something a phone-call or personal request to attend would have sorted this out one way or the other.

    All we have is apparently Evras word and Suarez admitting he used a word which can be used in a derogatory way or be used in a socially accepted way.

    If 'negrito' is that word and has been found to be socially accepted to be used everyday in Uruguay as a way to talk to your family,friends,random strangers in jest then the appeal has merit.
    If 'negrito' is that word which is used as a derogatory word in Uruguay when used in an argument against your family/friends/ random strangers then the verdict should be upheld and the appeal denied.

    It can easily be both not just the one that suits the argument/agenda.

    From the incident occurring to the verdict being given, i have just one question which would have sorted this before it became the clusterfúck it is now...

    If Suarez said this in the socially acceptable way to Evra, then surely in the last 12 months, he must have said it countless times to Glen Johnson in training,matches,match bus etc ?

    Has Glen Johnson contacted the FA to say he says it all the time to me in training,matches etc ?
    Has the FA contacted Glen Johnson to see if he is called it all the time ?

    Socially accepted or Derogatory ? Maybe Glen can answer that, eh ?


  • #4820
    K-9
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,313 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    I don't buy the Suarez should have apologised thing either. Evra was supposed to have been totally outraged after the match, in no mood for apologies. Then within a day or 2 the complaint went into the FA after a United press conference, that escalated the matter past apologies.

    I think Liverpool and Suarez are pissed of because it seems little of the context, yep that word, was taken into account. The FA from looking at it from their view have thrown the book at him because he said the word. Suarez believes Evra was abusive to him, by reference to "you South American" and he was being a bit smart back.

    Liverpool should have reported Evra for abuse to even everything up but that would have looked petty and tit for tat. The club and Suarez are snookered hence the frustration.

    As Kenny said, he isn't used to FA charges, United are well versed in them so there seems to be a certain naivety to play here.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • #4821
    d22ontour
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,391 ✭✭✭d22ontour


    K-9 wrote: »

    As Kenny said, he isn't used to FA charges, United are well versed in them so there seems to be a certain naivety to play here.

    According to Rafa, United had them in their pockets...Phacts, eh ? :D


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  • #4822
    J. Marston
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,349 ✭✭✭✭J. Marston


    K-9 wrote: »
    As Kenny said, he isn't used to FA charges, United are well versed in them so there seems to be a certain naivety to play here.

    :D Poor Kenny, he's been such a good boy. He doesn't know how to act when put in front of the school principal. Not like that messer, Ferguson. Sure he's always acting the maggot.


  • #4823
    SoulTrader
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 850 ✭✭✭SoulTrader


    K-9 wrote: »
    I don't buy the Suarez should have apologised thing either. Evra was supposed to have been totally outraged after the match, in no mood for apologies. Then within a day or 2 the complaint went into the FA after a United press conference, that escalated the matter past apologies.

    The complaint went to the FA because it was part of the referee's match report, not because United called a press conference. Ferguson accompanied Evra after the game and made the complaint to the referee.
    I think Liverpool and Suarez are pissed of because it seems little of the context, yep that word, was taken into account. The FA from looking at it from their view have thrown the book at him because he said the word. Suarez believes Evra was abusive to him, by reference to "you South American" and he was being a bit smart back.

    Alas, the context, I fear, will forever remain a matter of one man's word against another's; the findings of the panel will centre on the use of the word, and not the context in which it was used. In order to take a hardline stance against racism, the FA can't allow future (potentially more serious) cases to be challenged because a perpetrator is claiming ignorance, or usage of the word in a different context. This, I believe, is why they have gone to pains to say that they don't believe that Suarez is racist, but he did (it seems) use a word that can be used in a pejorative manner.
    Liverpool should have reported Evra for abuse to even everything up but that would have looked petty and tit for tat. The club and Suarez are snookered hence the frustration.

    As Kenny said, he isn't used to FA charges, United are well versed in them so there seems to be a certain naivety to play here.

    He shouldn't worry, with Suarez in the team, he'll start to get more practice!


  • #4824
    J. Marston
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,349 ✭✭✭✭J. Marston


    The picture that shows the caring side of John Terry as he poses in Hamleys with a black baby


    article-0-0F43D05500000578-712_634x475.jpg

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2078170/The-picture-shows-caring-John-Terry-poses-Hamleys-black-baby.html#ixzz1hPGVF8ey

    He looks frightened! :D (And yes, that is the actual headline)


  • #4825
    eigrod
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,988 ✭✭✭eigrod


    Amazingly, Man Utd didn't have any particular problem with their players singing "Build a Bonfire and put the Scousers on the top", while jeering and pointing at Wayne Rooney, on a boozy night out a number of years ago.

    Of course Liverpool, Everton, or Wayne Rooney didn't go crying to the FA about it either though.

    ...or with putting anti-scouse bile on their website http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=1927406&postcount=1


  • #4826
    SoulTrader
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 850 ✭✭✭SoulTrader


    eigrod wrote: »
    Amazingly, Man Utd didn't have any particular problem with their players singing "Build a Bonfire and put the Scousers on the top", while jeering and pointing at Wayne Rooney, on a boozy night out a number of years ago.

    Of course Liverpool, Everton, or Wayne Rooney didn't go crying to the FA about it either though.
    I thought this thread had moved on from that. Are you saying that Evra is a cry-baby for speaking out against racism?

    What jurisdiction would the FA have over men in a nightclub?


  • #4827
    Le King
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,092 ✭✭✭Le King


    eigrod wrote: »
    Amazingly, Man Utd didn't have any particular problem with their players singing "Build a Bonfire and put the Scousers on the top", while jeering and pointing at Wayne Rooney, on a boozy night out a number of years ago.

    Of course Liverpool, Everton, or Wayne Rooney didn't go crying to the FA about it either though.

    All the straws have now snapped.


  • #4828
    CSF
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,468 ✭✭✭✭CSF


    Still baffled by the fact that this has gone on over 300 pages. In the end you can't use racial terms at someone in an argument or in an aggressive manner. I certainly wouldn't classify Suarez as a cardcarrying racist based on this and it probably is just a case of doing something stupid in the heat of the moment. You still can't get away with it though and the ban is fairly justified.

    As for Liverpool, I think the behaviour has been a little bit inappropriate. You can't have the Kick It Out t-shirts 1 week, and then t-shirts supporting someone who has just been found guilty of racism the next. If they believe he is innocent or just believe it was out of character then they're right to support him, but to do so in such a public and controversial manner is highly inappropriate given the sensitivity of the topic and the fact that he has been found guilty.


  • #4829
    eigrod
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,988 ✭✭✭eigrod


    Le King wrote: »
    All the straws have now snapped.

    Care to elaborate ?


  • #4830
    dsmythy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,560 ✭✭✭✭dsmythy


    eigrod wrote: »
    Amazingly, Man Utd didn't have any particular problem with their players singing "Build a Bonfire and put the Scousers on the top", while jeering and pointing at Wayne Rooney, on a boozy night out a number of years ago.

    Of course Liverpool, Everton, or Wayne Rooney didn't go crying to the FA about it either though.

    ...or with putting anti-scouse bile on their website http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=1927406&postcount=1

    Scousers aren't an ethnic group.


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  • #4831
    d22ontour
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,391 ✭✭✭d22ontour


    eigrod wrote: »
    Care to elaborate ?

    All the straws that have been clutched have been broken, is possibly what he meant ?

    Let's wait till the evidence tomorrow were Suarez admits to using a word which has conflicting meanings which the FA have deemed his version to be untrustworthy and unreliable when he didn't offer any proof of it's friendly insignificant meaning regarding playing in England because Glen Johnson didn't admit to being his negrito nor ever been called it...

    We can all play this game... ;)


This discussion has been closed.
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