Is City Centre living vastly underrated in Ireland?

Miss Olenska · 17-11-2011 02:12PM

summerskin wrote: »

But it has to be a real city. Not Dublin.

Dublin has a larger population (both city proper and metro) than New Orleans.

Don't think anyone would consider Orleans to be anything other than a real city. London and New York are alpha cities, there's probably only about 20 of those in the world.

Latchy · 17-11-2011 02:13PM

City Centre living is grand if the city in question is moving , has a pulse and a beat about it and you can get in and out quickly enough on public or private transports , which is essential and part of the mix for good quality living there .

summerskin · 17-11-2011 02:14PM

Miss Olenska wrote: »

Dublin has a larger population (both city proper and metro) than New Orleans. Don't think anyone would consider Orleans to be anything other than a real city. London and New York are alpha cities, there's probably only about 20 of those in the world.

and new orleans also is more like a large town.

starbelgrade · 17-11-2011 02:17PM

Latchy wrote: »

City Centre living is grand if the city in question is moving , has a pulse and a beat about it and you can get in and out quickly enough on public or private transports , which is essential and part of the mix for good quality living there .

Belfast is the best city in Ireland for getting in & out of by car or bus - the connections to the motorway are savage.. you get none of the tailbacks that you do in Dublin where everything gets clogged up along the quays.

Miss Olenska · 17-11-2011 02:18PM

summerskin wrote: »

and new orleans also is more like a large town.

I like London in many ways, I do! But it's not THAT great, larger population doesn't automatically mean better.

Eoin · 17-11-2011 02:19PM

TheZohan wrote: »

I used to commute to Contarf daily, by leaving 20min earlier I could shave 1hr off my commute. My daily commute was 200km, took 1hr 20min each way. Had I used public transport I probably would have gotten there quicker too.

That doesn't contradict anything I said though.

jester77 · 17-11-2011 02:23PM

Can't beat city life.

It's great to be able to stay out partying to 4 or 5 in the morning, and be able to walk home without worrying about transport.
Feel like pigging out at 22:00, just pop across the street and get a bag of munchies.
Wake up on a Sunday morning, pop downstairs to the cafe's, sit outside, enjoy the weather, read your newspaper and enjoy a coffee.
Don't have to worry about commuting to work or being stuck in traffic.
Lot's of options for restaurants, bars, cinemas, theaters, etc
In the Summer can walk around the corner to the park or down to the beach and have a BBQ

TheZohanS · 17-11-2011 02:23PM

Eoin wrote: »

That doesn't contradict anything I said though.

Get up earlier!

Sykk · 17-11-2011 02:25PM

summerskin wrote: »

having grown up in the countryside in the UK, lived in the mountains in France and also spent 1 year in Geneva, 10 years living in London (a real city, not an oversized town like Dublin), 2 in New York before moving to Clare I can tell you that country life and a commute is far better than city life, at this time in my life.

However, if you're young and have no responsibilities, city life can't be beaten. But it has to be a real city. Not Dublin.

Yes because size of the location matters. Instead of three cinemas, I could be in a city with 40 cinemas.. You know seen as though I can be in multiple places at once...

Latchy · 17-11-2011 02:26PM

starbelgrade wrote: »

Belfast is the best city in Ireland for getting in & out of by car or bus - the connections to the motorway are savage.. you get none of the tailbacks that you do in Dublin where everything gets clogged up along the quays.

Dublins quays are the motrorists nightmare and it's always been like this .The connections from any major british city onto the motorway with ease is the norm but Dublin as a city just isin't designed to take up and 'free' the amount of traffic it holds .

mal1 · 17-11-2011 02:28PM

summerskin wrote: »

having grown up in the countryside in the UK, lived in the mountains in France and also spent 1 year in Geneva, 10 years living in London (a real city, not an oversized town like Dublin), 2 in New York before moving to Clare I can tell you that country life and a commute is far better than city life, at this time in my life.

However, if you're young and have no responsibilities, city life can't be beaten. But it has to be a real city. Not Dublin.

That makes you a a real city connoisseur. But tell me, what is wrong with these towns you mention?

summerskin · 17-11-2011 02:34PM

mal1 wrote: »

That makes you a a real city connoisseur. But tell me, what is wrong with these towns you mention?

Absolutely nothing. Towns can be great places to live.

I've been lucky enough to live in everything from a village with 90 people, a town with 150,000 and cities with 8m+, and I'm just expressing an opinion on what is my favoured option at this time.

However, if I had the chance to go back and do it all again as a single person, i would always choose a big city over a smaller one that feels like an oversized town. the dynamic and atmospheres are very different. There is a buzz in the big cities that can't be matched by Dublin, Cardiff, Edinburgh as they feel too parochial, almost.

Eoin · 17-11-2011 02:35PM

TheZohan wrote: »

Get up earlier!

I'm not sure if you're being serious or not. Do you really think that people are choosing to be stuck in traffic because they can't be arsed getting out of bed a bit earlier?

Loads of people:

1) Have fixed working hours. By getting up earlier; they might get into work quicker, but not be able to leave any earlier.

2) Live on shìtty bus routes that are irregular / don't have bus lanes - time of day isn't always the only problem.

I remember having to wait up to 45 minutes on a pretty regular basis for a bus that was supposed to run every 10 minutes - and that was from a suburb that was - on paper - well served by public transport.

Latchy · 17-11-2011 02:46PM

Miss Olenska wrote: »

I like London in many ways, I do! But it's not THAT great, larger population doesn't automatically mean better.

That's true ...you might get around much quicker with all the tube connections with plenty to see and do but you can still feel disconnected in London and some quiter suburbs aside , it's a city with people constantly on the move .

Miss Olenska · 17-11-2011 02:48PM

Latchy wrote: »

That's true ...you might get around much quicker with all the tube connections with plenty to see and do but you can still feel disconnected in London and some quiter suburbs aside , it's a city with people constantly on the move .

Exactly.

bnt · 17-11-2011 02:48PM

To squeeze more people in to the centre of Dublin, comfortably, there would be only one solution: build up. As I understand the situation, there are two locations in Dublin where skyscrapers would be likely to receive approval today: Docklands, and the area around Heuston Station. This is the "La Défense strategy", named after the area of Paris, where skyscrapers and modern architecture are permitted without much argument, while the rest of Paris remains low-rise "heritage".

To build a high-rise anywhere else in Dublin, you'd be at risk of wiping out "heritage" and compromising the tourist appeal. On top of that, there's the problem of space. To stop skyscrapers creating "concrete canyons" and blotting out the sunlight too much, you'd need rules requiring setbacks from the street. There are now such rules in New York, where they limit the number of stories next to a street: higher floors must be further from the street. There have also been rules requiring the whole building to be set back, creating a plaza on front of it, as in e.g. the Rockefeller Center. In short: skyscrapers now need a bigger footprint than in the early days in Chicago, where they could blot out the sun over whole districts.

Jess16 · 17-11-2011 02:52PM

I think the real question is why so many people insist on doing the Townie/Culchie debate ad nauseam -we already know the answers and I doubt they've changed since the last 5,000 times this has been discussed

df1985 · 17-11-2011 02:56PM

Country living is vastly OVERRATED in my opinion. Id top myself if i lived where my cousins live (clare, galway, roscommon)

(I live in Kildare-not city living but close enough-I can be in conolly station in half an hour, have nights out in Dublin, but still be outside the city)

Galtee · 17-11-2011 03:01PM

dilbert2 wrote: »

Now before I begin, I concede that I grew up in a suburb in North County Dublin. However, I have always had the desire to live in the City Centre, if not now, at least one day. Why? Well because of a few factors such as

(a) Been so central first and foremost,

(b) Never having to own a car given all the buses and trains

(c) More variety of shops of all kind

(d) Attractive parks such as St. Stephens Green, the Phoenix Park etc.

(e) Countless cinemas, theatres, libraries and of course museums, mostly free of entry.

(f) Much closer to work, and not only that, more employment in general.

(g) General culture and great architecture.

Could list countless other positive aspects of city centre living, and I include all city centres around Ireland including Cork, Galway etc. However, whenever you mention the words "city centre living" to a lot of Irish people, even to those who grew up the cities themselves, there is a lot of negative association with them, particularly from people who use the old "move to a bigger house in the suburbs to raise a family" bunch.

But I don't think we give City Centres enough of a chance in this country, and think too positively of (at least during the boom years) buying a semi-d in the suburbs, particularly if we want to raise a family. But consider the numerous disadvantages,

(a) The huge distance from work and the long commute.

(b) Car ownership, usually in newer 90s and 00s developments necessary in nearly every instance. Thinly spread public transport system.

(c) Dead green spaces left over after development, usually for the kids to kick the ball around on during the summer. In comparison to a city park such as the Phoenix Park, they appear dead and sometimes depressing.

(d) Very limited choice of shops and cultural venues - maybe a spar and a pub, with a shopping centre if you’re lucky. Nothing is free or educational such as museums etc.

(e) Dull architecture and poorly built houses that cost a lot more to heat and maintain.

(f) Gardens that hardly anybody uses (the front in particular), unlike a city park.

And countless other examples. What does everybody think? I personally think that we underrate and even demean City Centre living despite it been a wonderful living arrangement (there are obviously some danger areas in every city, but that’s another story), and vastly overrate buying a home in the semi-d suburbs, particularly during the boom years.

You had me at "Now before I begin, I concede that I grew up in a suburb in North County Dublin"

pajunior · 17-11-2011 03:07PM

This topic is always way to personal to ever have a proper debate about it. Deciding where to live is one of the most important choices we consciously make in our lives that is so easily debated.
No-one wants the decision they made on that to be brought into question.
In my opinion I plan on living in the city center in the future. It's not perfect but as someone in their early twenties it has most things i want.

Also comparing London to Dublin is ridiculous, London is a huge primate city similar to New York or Tokyo. We're talking nearly about 1.5 times the size of the population of this Island. Compare Dublin to Cardiff or Edinburgh for a better comparison.

desertcircus · 17-11-2011 03:10PM

Commuting time when living in city: 15 minute walk.

Commuting time when living in suburbs: 30 minute cycle or 1-hour bus journey.

Notice required for impromptu pint when living in city: fifteen minutes.

Notice required for impromptu pint when living in suburbs: 60 to 90 minutes.

Additional cost of staying out past 11.30 when living in city: zero.

Additional cost of staying out past 11.30 when living in suburbs: 25-30 quid.

dilbert2 · 17-11-2011 03:15PM

pajunior wrote: »

This topic is always way to personal to ever have a proper debate about it. Deciding where to live is one of the most important choices we consciously make in our lives that is so easily debated.
No-one wants the decision they made on that to be brought into question.
In my opinion I plan on living in the city center in the future. It's not perfect but as someone in their early twenties it has most things i want.

Also comparing London to Dublin is ridiculous, London is a huge primate city similar to New York or Tokyo. We're talking nearly about 1.5 times the size of the population of this Island. Compare Dublin to Cardiff or Edinburgh for a better comparison.

I don't really know if focusing on London and New York is to the point either myself. To be honest, both countries they are situated in have a strong history of suburbanisation and bad urbanism. As a result both America, and to a lesser extent England have burnt out and hollowed city centres, not to mention a slight anti-urban bias given the development of many cities through the industrialisation process in those countires. Yes London and New York are great, but look at the amount of cities in parts of the US Northeast or Northern England that are lifeless and hollowed out.

I think it might be better to focus to similiar size cities, or indeed any cities from elsewhere in the world, including continental Europe. France, Spain, Germany etc. all have many fine examples of small to medium sized cities that are attractive places to live.

Another thing, this was in no way meant to be only about Dublin City Centre, I meant all cities in Ireland including Cork, Galway etc.

dilbert2 · 17-11-2011 03:19PM

starbelgrade wrote: »

It's not the City Centre.

It's called "town".

Can be called either, don't see a reason to kick up a fuss about it.

ScumLord · 17-11-2011 03:22PM

Commuting time when living in a country town: 2 minute walk.

Commuting time when living in the countryside: 10 minute drive

Notice required for impromptu pint when living in a country town: Zero

Notice required for impromptu pint when living in the countryside: 15 minutes

Additional cost of staying out past 11.30 when living in a country town: zero.

Additional cost of staying out past 11.30 when living in the countryside: 5 -8 quid.

ScumLord · 17-11-2011 03:31PM

dilbert2 wrote: »

Uhh for the last time this has nothing to do with the countryside or country towns, its suburbs-vs- city centres. What part of this is too hard for you too grasp?

That's discrimination! And, you can't really have a proper discussion without all the facts It's like comparing the best alcoholic beverages and excluding everything but Guinness and Bulmers.

floorpie · 17-11-2011 03:33PM

I thought i'd gotten bored of Dublin until i lived for a few years in various places around the city centre. I appreciate the place all the more now. Paradoxically (i would have thought, before), the sense of community seems to be far greater in town. I'd highly recommend it!

Dudess · 17-11-2011 03:39PM

I couldn't live right in the city centre because of the noise, or really built-up suburbs that are miles out - e.g. Blanchardstown in Dublin, or the middle of nowhere.

My preference would be somewhere that's between city centre and suburb (e.g. Drumcondra in Dublin - most people here are from Dublin, don't whinge) or somewhere that's between suburb and countryside - e.g. Blarney in Cork.

Unfortunately those are the kinds of places that lots of people want to live, and are pricey.

I currently live in an area that's not quite city centre (Cork) not quite suburb (Mayfield) so it's central and walking distance from town without being noisy. Ideal for me.

desertcircus · 17-11-2011 04:47PM

ScumLord wrote: »

Commuting time when living in a country town: 2 minute walk.

Commuting time when living in the countryside: 10 minute drive

Notice required for impromptu pint when living in a country town: Zero

Notice required for impromptu pint when living in the countryside: 15 minutes

Additional cost of staying out past 11.30 when living in a country town: zero.

Additional cost of staying out past 11.30 when living in the countryside: 5 -8 quid.

Location of job and friends: city...

parker kent · 17-11-2011 04:58PM

desertcircus wrote: »

Location of job and friends: city...

Well this sums up a key point. It is completely personal. I would hate to live in the city centre as I don't work there and know 1 person that lives there. Whereas in the area I do live, I work within walking distance and know plenty of people that live nearby. So I have no reason to live in the city centre. It would just create a needless commute through the busiest part of Dublin.

Different people have different situations. Not everybody works in the city centre.

stovelid · 17-11-2011 05:04PM

WindSock wrote: »

I'd love to live in a city for a spell, suburbs are for zombies.

Only people brought up in the suburbs ever say that.

Is City Centre living vastly underrated in Ireland?

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