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Is Sean Gallagher telling lies

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,787 ✭✭✭KELTICKNIGHTT


    raymon wrote: »
    The thread is about whether or not Sean Gallagher lied. It has not moved on

    You have tried to change the discussion away from Sean Gallagher many times .

    Please stop the whataboutery

    is mcguinness lying ??


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,578 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    raymon wrote: »
    The thread is about whether or not Sean Gallagher lied. It has not moved on

    You have tried to change the discussion away from Sean Gallagher many times .

    Please stop the whataboutery

    No harm but continually repeating this type of criticism of discussion does nothing for the argument. Rather it corners you as being narrow minded. I don't think anyone posting here is particularly a fan of Gallagher but it is interesting to consider the subject in a wider narrative other than a series of posts that say the same thing as the previous.

    So which of the candidates would you put above SG other than Higgins (the point being SG is second in the polls so which of the candidates below him would you rate as better or more suitable)? There is no perfect candidate and you assert that SG is dishonest, where is the perfect candidate with perfect integrity?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,771 ✭✭✭raymon


    is mcguinness lying ??

    He is , yes


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,771 ✭✭✭raymon


    No harm but continually repeating this type of criticism of discussion does nothing for the argument. Rather it corners you as being narrow minded. I don't think anyone posting here is particularly a fan of Gallagher but it is interesting to consider the subject in a wider narrative other than a series of posts that say the same thing as the previous.

    So which of the candidates would you put above SG other than Higgins (the point being SG is second in the polls so which of the candidates below him would you rate as better or more suitable)? There is no perfect candidate and you assert that SG is dishonest, where is the perfect candidate with perfect integrity?

    I have a different way of looking at things .

    Anyone who has helped or was associated with murder is off my list.
    Anyone who has repeatedly lied is off my list.
    That puts Gallagher and MMG completely off my list


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    raymon wrote: »
    I have a different way of looking at things .

    Anyone who has helped or was associated with murder is off my list.

    I think Alan Shatter supports that view
    Crisis in the Middle East

    July 27th, 2006
    Response to Michael D. Higgins’s letter to Irish Times of 27 July 2006
    Dear Madam,
    It is interesting to note that Michael D. Higgins (Irish Times, July 27th) states that “parties of the left have consistently rejected terrorist actions not only because of their impact on civilians but also because of the response they call forth from the powerful.” It seems that in his world, such actions would be open to a lesser form of condemnation if those attacked did not respond and defend themselves. This is a distinctly odd view of the fundamental principles of International Law to which he proclaims himself to be committed. At the very centre of international law is the right of a State to defend itself and its citizens when attacked.
    It is particularly depressing that some of those who proclaim themselves to be speaking on behalf of “the left” such as Michael D are attached to an analysis of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict and of the current conflict in Lebanon which largely coincides with that of the most extreme fundamentalist elements in the Middle East who have rejected every reasonable attempt to bring about a permanent and peaceful resolution to the Israeli/Palestinian conflict.
    The “refusal” Michael D writes “of the US to agree to talks with Syria, or to an immediate ceasefire, is reprehensible.” No mention is made by him of Iran in his article. What is truly reprehensible has been Iran’s consistent opposition over the past fifteen years to every attempt at developing a viable peace process in the Middle East and its sponsoring of annual conferences of the Rejectionist Front attended by both Hezbollah and Hamas in which those present proclaim their mutual commitment to the total destruction of the Israeli State or to, in the words of the Iranian President “wiping Israel off the map”. The current tragic conflagration in Lebanon is essentially Syria and Iran’s proxy war against Israel.
    The fundamentalist Hezbollah movement has been armed and financed by Iran and has with Syrian complicity established a State within a State in southern Lebanon. It is a sad reflection on Deputy Higgins’s lack of objectivity that he reserves his wrath for the European Union and the United States whilst having nothing to say about the responsibility of both Iran and Syria for current events.
    He also seems blissfully unaware that many Arab leaders, commentators, and political analysists are convinced that the leaders of Tehran and Damascus are using Hizbollah to divert attention from Iran’s nuclear programme and from Syria’s involvement in the assassination of former Lebanese Prime Minister Rafik Hariri. These two countries have grossly violated the sovereignty of Lebanon; used Hizbollah as a proxy army to prevent the Lebanese government and army assuming control over southern Lebanon and are responsible for the accumulation by Hizbollah of thousands of rockets, over 1,200 of which have in recent days hit Haifa and other Israeli towns and cities.
    Hamas, like Hizbollah, is of course financed and sponsored by Iran. Whilst acknowledging Michael D. is right when stating that Hamas formed a government after free elections, he fails to explain how the regular firing of Kassim rockets by terrorists from Gaza into the Israeli towns of Sderot and Ashkelon in the weeks preceding Hamas’ kidnapping of an Israeli soldier contributed to the Israeli/Palestinian peace process.
    The sad reality of the Middle East is whenever Israel disengages from territory and attempts to advance a peace process, such behaviour is not viewed as building block to peace but as a sign of weakness and confirmation that terror works. Whilst the leadership of Hizbollah and Hamas are happy to join their sponsors in Tehran for the annual Holocaust Denial Conference, it remains their objective to perpetuate a second Holocaust. It is time that Michael D. Higgins woke up to the type of world in which we live and the threat posed not only to the Israeli State but to all of us in Europe by Islamic fundamentalism.
    ALAN SHATTER
    4 Upper Ely Place
    Dublin 2


    http://www.alanshatter.ie/?p=279

    Are you still crossing names off the list .


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,771 ✭✭✭raymon


    CDfm wrote: »
    I think Alan Shatter supports that view


    Are you still crossing names off the list .

    What has this 2006 letter have to do with Gallagher lying ?
    I don't see him mentioned at all .


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,578 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    raymon wrote: »
    I have a different way of looking at things .

    Anyone who has helped or was associated with murder is off my list.
    Anyone who has repeatedly lied is off my list.
    That puts Gallagher and MMG completely off my list
    It was a simple question but if they are off your list I will rephrase is and ask are all the other candidates apart from MMG on your list?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    raymon wrote: »
    What has this 2006 letter have to do with Gallagher lying ?
    I don't see him mentioned at all .

    I addressed a specific point on the criteria you use to cross people off your list.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,771 ✭✭✭raymon


    I haven't decided who else is on my list yet.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    raymon wrote: »
    I haven't decided who else is on my list yet.

    Is Dana on your list ?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,658 ✭✭✭swampgas


    [...]

    So which of the candidates would you put above SG other than Higgins (the point being SG is second in the polls so which of the candidates below him would you rate as better or more suitable)? There is no perfect candidate and you assert that SG is dishonest, where is the perfect candidate with perfect integrity?

    This is the key point, as it is with most elections - few candidates are squeaky clean, and it can be difficult to weigh the apparent misdemeanors of one against another.

    In this case, SG seems reasonably clean (IMO). I imagine there has been a strategic decision by his team to distance him from FF as far as possible, which is back-firing on him now. Whether that's enough to sway voters, its hard to say. Pretending not to be FF might seem like an acceptable electoral ploy to some (judging by some of the comments here anyway), and unforgiveable underhanded sneakiness by others (ditto).

    Personally, I would rather someone with a strong track record in politics (by which I mean as a government minister or senior EU role) as I think that's a better fit for the job. Beggars can't be choosers though ...


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,578 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    raymon wrote: »
    I haven't decided who else is on my list yet.

    That is fair enough. I have to say Gallagher would certainly not be in my first 2 to exclude based on some of the other charachters. As you have excluded only McGuinness and Gallagher it does'nt take Sherlock holmes to work out that you rate the other 5 higher than SG.
    That means you would prefer Dana as President over him!!! Have you heard her interviews. She sounds like a mother in law that has been bit by a rattle snake. I feel her ideas and views would be a serious problem should she represent us abroad.
    It also means you would prefer Mary '€150,000 from a charity' Davis as a president. She is a serial member of boards pocketing large amounts of money including taking massive sums from charitable organisations. SG may have tried to hide links with FF (wouldnt most) but at least he was democratic (unlike Mary) in his request to the councils to consider others once he got the required 4.
    Gay Mitchell is also up on your list which I would have little to argue with although he is having problems. And I won't get into Norris either but we are all aware of peoples questioning of him on a very serious issue. Imagine this being highlighted as he visits the deep south of America for example.

    The point I am making is that your opinion of SG is that he is dishonest. I may differ, but there are actually things that are more important at this stage like the ability to be a benefit to the country as opposed to some of the candidates who would not be.

    Now a direct question: Do you feel that honesty is the single most important charachter trait that our next president should have?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,771 ✭✭✭raymon


    That is fair enough. I have to say Gallagher would certainly not be in my first 2 to exclude based on some of the other charachters. As you have excluded only McGuinness and Gallagher it does'nt take Sherlock holmes to work out that you rate the other 5 higher than SG.
    That means you would prefer Dana as President over him!!! Have you heard her interviews. She sounds like a mother in law that has been bit by a rattle snake. I feel her ideas and views would be a serious problem should she represent us abroad.
    It also means you would prefer Mary '€150,000 from a charity' Davis as a president. She is a serial member of boards pocketing large amounts of money including taking massive sums from charitable organisations. SG may have tried to hide links with FF (wouldnt most) but at least he was democratic (unlike Mary) in his request to the councils to consider others once he got the required 4.
    Gay Mitchell is also up on your list which I would have little to argue with although he is having problems. And I won't get into Norris either but we are all aware of peoples questioning of him on a very serious issue. Imagine this being highlighted as he visits the deep south of America for example.

    The point I am making is that your opinion of SG is that he is dishonest. I may differ, but there are actually things that are more important at this stage like the ability to be a benefit to the country as opposed to some of the candidates who would not be.

    Now a direct question: Do you feel that honesty is the single most important charachter trait that our next president should have?

    Not being a murderer would be my top priority.

    Then honesty .

    I think that the pool of candidates is very poor. Dana , Mitchell , Davis, even Norris now don't inspire me. None of them are high up on my list

    Although I like Michael d , I don't think he is a great statesman.
    He will probably get my #1 nonetheless.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    The idea that this thread has been about the rehabilitation of Sean Gallagher has crossed my mind a few times.

    It has proved the man is not as bad as the proposition.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11 BlackrockBeach


    1. As a former "CEO" of Louth CEB he would be initimate in what a repayable grant / equity is to a company - he implies he didnt understand he had to repay and is dragged to the steps of Courts and then pays!!
    2. He set up Smart Homes immediately with shared Directors - change the name and dont pay your obligations - a great value system for someone seeking the highest office
    3. Issuing legal threats to avoid futher probing of this issue - what is there to hide if all above board ?
    4. FF to the core - discard that coat when it gets tarnished and be reborn as an independent "entrepreneur"
    5. Drives a 2011 merc and indicates on his public income at a tiny fraction of his takehome which is over €1000 day in speaking fees..real honest guy in touch with the people
    6. Dont even start on the issue of Divorce

    = just the values we need in the highes office in the land


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 444 ✭✭Ernest


    Not to be personal about it but do we want a President who grooms himself like a Polish security worker.....


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,787 ✭✭✭KELTICKNIGHTT


    Ernest wrote: »
    Not to be personal about it but do we want a President who grooms himself like a Polish security worker.....

    not a nice comment i must say,but to each there own


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,305 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    1. As a former "CEO" of Louth CEB he would be initimate in what a repayable grant / equity is to a company - he implies he didnt understand he had to repay and is dragged to the steps of Courts and then pays!!
    2. He set up Smart Homes immediately with shared Directors - change the name and dont pay your obligations - a great value system for someone seeking the highest office
    3. Issuing legal threats to avoid futher probing of this issue - what is there to hide if all above board ?
    4. FF to the core - discard that coat when it gets tarnished and be reborn as an independent "entrepreneur"
    5. Drives a 2011 merc and indicates on his public income at a tiny fraction of his takehome which is over €1000 day in speaking fees..real honest guy in touch with the people
    6. Dont even start on the issue of Divorce

    = just the values we need in the highes office in the land

    Fair enough, but why the comment about Divorce?

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,787 ✭✭✭KELTICKNIGHTT


    1. As a former "CEO" of Louth CEB he would be initimate in what a repayable grant / equity is to a company - he implies he didnt understand he had to repay and is dragged to the steps of Courts and then pays!!
    2. He set up Smart Homes immediately with shared Directors - change the name and dont pay your obligations - a great value system for someone seeking the highest office
    3. Issuing legal threats to avoid futher probing of this issue - what is there to hide if all above board ?
    4. FF to the core - discard that coat when it gets tarnished and be reborn as an independent "entrepreneur"
    5. Drives a 2011 merc and indicates on his public income at a tiny fraction of his takehome which is over €1000 day in speaking fees..real honest guy in touch with the people
    6. Dont even start on the issue of Divorce

    = just the values we need in the highes office in the land

    don't you think what ever you taking about on no6 is a personal matter and nothing to do with election ?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,771 ✭✭✭raymon


    The fact that he lies in interviews is a major concern , specifically the lie about his activity in FF.

    His whole campaign is about jobs and enterprise ...... for himself


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,649 ✭✭✭✭CDfm


    raymon wrote: »
    The fact that he lies in interviews is a major concern , specifically the lie about his activity in FF.

    His whole campaign is about jobs and enterprise ...... for himself

    And the SG website says
    Gallagher ‘abhors’ many of the decisions of Fianna Fáil Governments

    Independent Presidential candidate Seán Gallagher today said that he ‘abhorred’ the decisions made by the last Fianna Fáil Governments.
    Speaking during an interview on the Neil Prenderville Show on Cork 96fm during a visit to the county, Mr. Gallagher said,
    “I have never made any secret of the fact that I was in Fianna Fáil and I have always encouraged people to get involved in youth and community and indeed political parties.”
    “I have huge respect for the grass roots of any organisations, Fianna Fáil, Fine Gael, Labour, Sinn Féin and those who are out there trying to improve our communities.”
    “But what is important to point out is that I have never been a politician, I have never stood for elected office, I have been a voluntary member of an organisation. But sadly many people in grass roots are being demonised for being a voluntary member of a political party.”
    “I was asked last night on the Prime Time programme if I would condemn Fianna Fáil.”
    “I couldn’t condemn the ordinary grass roots members of the party throughout the country, ordinary decent people, who were not in Government who were not in cabinet, who did not make decisions.”
    “I did try to get the opportunity, but didn’t get back in to say that of course I abhor many of the decisions of the last Government and the mismanagement of our economy that has taken us to where we are and the last Government were responsible.”
    “I have never used the word condemnation in my life. It is not in my vocabulary.”
    “The last Government badly mismanaged the economy. It overheated. We are now left with the issues of businesses struggling and unemployment. I think that there were appalling decisions made.”
    “Of course there was mismanagement at senior level and Michéal Martin has accepted that.”
    “I was not at the cabinet table. I was a grassroots member working on a voluntary capacity. I do not feel like I need to be answerable, neither do any of the grassroots members need to be answerable for what was happening at cabinet.”
    “We can’t change the past. I’m not responsible for what happened in Government. But I can be responsible for what I contribute to the country now. I want to move the debate on.”
    “I don’t believe in negative campaigning.”
    “I have never believed that I will grow an inch taller by knocking anyone down.”


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 14,670 ✭✭✭✭Wolfe Tone


    Damage control.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,996 ✭✭✭10green bottles


    Gallagher will not even mention FF in his denials about the failure of the last goverment.
    What was the last successful biz that he was involved with that made him a euro ?? and a biz guru ??
    SG is broke and i hope that he wont make the 12.5% . :p


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,771 ✭✭✭raymon


    This statement tells me nothing .

    He needs a job badly and will say anything at this stage .

    I believe nothing this man says .


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,578 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    Now that he has clearly given his opinion on the decision makers in the previous government I think SG will continue to push forward. I think this thread shows very clearly that in comparison with the other candidates SG has very little to be queried on. Probably second to Higgins and Mitchell only in this regard.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,771 ✭✭✭raymon


    Now that he has clearly given his opinion on the decision makers in the previous government I think SG will continue to push forward. I think this thread shows very clearly that in comparison with the other candidates SG has very little to be queried on. Probably second to Higgins and Mitchell only in this regard.

    This statement is in typical FF double speak style .

    It says nothing , while it contains many words, spin spin spin.

    Please see this

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/presidential-election/gallagher-refuses-to-name-and-blame-ff-for-woes-2906347.html

    In any case , his repeated lies to the media have been hard to stomach


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,578 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    raymon wrote: »
    This statement is in typical FF double speak style .

    It says nothing , while it contains many words, spin spin spin.

    Please see this

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/presidential-election/gallagher-refuses-to-name-and-blame-ff-for-woes-2906347.html

    In any case , his repeated lies to the media have been hard to stomach

    He should be praised for calling it as he sees it in the same way as his hesitation to criticise FF should be questioned.

    The article that YOU linked said
    yesterday morning, Mr Gallagher was finally criticising governments led by Fianna Fail as he said the previous government "badly mismanaged" the economy.

    "It overheated. We are now left with the issues of businesses struggling and unemployment. I think that there were appalling decisions made."
    If you think he is lying you should prove this. If you cannot do this then your argument has no weight or justification. To be able to put his hands up and say that he got it wrong in the debate as SG did yesterday shows a quality that I have never seen in the main FF protagonists.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,644 ✭✭✭✭Zubeneschamali


    To be able to put his hands up and say that he got it wrong in the debate as SG did yesterday shows a quality that I have never seen in the main FF protagonists.

    You mean the other FF protagonists.

    Gallagher is the main FF protagonist right now, as Martin and the whole Parliamentary Party are sitting this election out, on the sidelines.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,578 ✭✭✭jonniebgood1


    You mean the other FF protagonists.

    Gallagher is the main FF protagonist right now, as Martin and the whole Parliamentary Party are sitting this election out, on the sidelines.

    FF are sitting out this election (wisely). If they had got Gay Byrne on board as Martin wanted the view of Gallagher would be different. We should not forget that they were going to run a candidate which indicates SG's independence.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,771 ✭✭✭raymon


    He should be praised for calling it as he sees it in the same way as his hesitation to criticise FF should be questioned.

    The article that YOU linked said
    If you think he is lying you should prove this. If you cannot do this then your argument has no weight or justification. To be able to put his hands up and say that he got it wrong in the debate as SG did yesterday shows a quality that I have never seen in the main FF protagonists.

    He should be praised ??? He praised Michael Martin ! What the hell ?

    Let's all praise bertie and Biffo and Callely too. Willie o Dea could also be praised

    It has been proved that his " no involvement in FF since 2009" is a lie.

    Praise be to FF !


This discussion has been closed.
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