Are china going to take over the world?

Bannasidhe · 13-09-2011 04:37PM

Not if they listen to Bertie they won't - http://www.markgodfrey.eu/publications/update%20290708/Village%20magazine,Bertie%20in%20China,1-05.pdf

Lanaier · 13-09-2011 04:39PM

gargleblaster wrote: »

No.

China has a monster of a real estate bubble.

When that thing goes, it will be interesting to see the fallout.

Yeah, combined with the increasing political strain and the uneven ratio of men to women there is going to be a large(r) class of extremely unhappy people soon.

I would imagine one of the consequences would be that it's going to get a bit rapey.

Celly Smunt · 13-09-2011 04:40PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4HIyAk_k6Y

at least we're good at software

13-09-2011 04:42PM

Lanaier wrote: »

Yeah, combined with the increasing political strain and the uneven ratio of men to women there is going to be a large(r) class of extremely unhappy people soon.

I would imagine one of the consequences would be that it's going to get a bit rapey.

Or a lot of trafficking of women from other countires to meet this demand.

Lanaier · 13-09-2011 04:44PM

pmcmahon wrote: »

however,militarily....wow.

If you mean they have a lot of soldiers, you are right.
There are more formidable forces in the world though.

Celly Smunt · 13-09-2011 04:45PM

Lanaier wrote: »

If you mean they have a lot of soldiers, you are right.
There are more formidable forces in the world though.

they have a much higher production rate of artillery and birds.

13-09-2011 04:47PM

Lanaier wrote: »

If you mean they have a lot of soldiers, you are right.
There are more formidable forces in the world though.

Mainly the USA, China spends about €80 billion a year on military spending and Ameica spends approx €800 billion in the same time.

Celly Smunt · 13-09-2011 04:48PM

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Mainly the USA, China spends about €80 billion a year on military spending and Ameica spends approx €800 billion in the same time.

the majority of which is spent on upkeep,higher wages,operations and not as much personnel turn over.

13-09-2011 04:50PM

pmcmahon wrote: »

the majority of which is spent on upkeep,higher wages,operations and not as much personnel turn over.

How much were they paying pakistan?

Quite a lot goes on research the department of defence in the usa is the biggest awardee of SBIR grants imho

Lanaier · 13-09-2011 04:50PM

pmcmahon wrote: »

they have a much higher production rate of artillery and birds.

Well I'm a total amateur on this subject but wouldn't 1 modern US plane be superior to several older models employed by other countries?
I could be very wrong there

I also assume the US would have far more experienced pilots.

13-09-2011 04:53PM

Lanaier wrote: »

Well I'm a total amateur on this subject but wouldn't 1 modern US plane be superior to several older models employed by other countries?
I could be very wrong there

I also assume the US would have far more experienced pilots.

Yes american technology would be superior to Chinas, is their carrier not a refurbed russian one???

I think i read an article a while back suppossedly from some US defence source who reckons China are 20 years behind and so not militarily a threat to the USA anyway.

Iomega Man · 13-09-2011 04:59PM

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Yes american technology would be superior to Chinas, is their carrier not a refurbed russian one???

American military technology was Waaay ahead of VC technology too....

13-09-2011 05:01PM

Iomega Man wrote: »

American military technology was Waaay ahead of VC technology too....

I dont think the person in the article i was reading was assumming america would invade china.

Lanaier · 13-09-2011 05:02PM

Iomega Man wrote: »

American military technology was Waaay ahead of VC technology too....

Indeed and that's one of the reasons the Americans were victorious in pretty much every single encounter with the VC.
The only battle they lost there was political.

Wibbs · 13-09-2011 07:06PM

4leto wrote: »

Yes they will, they probably have already.

If the Euro goes pear shaped, they will be our new masters.

They are the ones with the funds and n0-one repeat n0-one can compete with them.

Nope. Who do they sell the vast majority of their stuff to? Us and the USA. We go down, they go down. Plus as was noted earlier in the thread they have a well dodgy business model and a very vulnerable one to boot. Culturally they've a race to the bottom mentality and appear to have no word for intellectual copyright. They don't seem to "get" trademarks either. During the "made in Japan" era nearly everyone could name off 5 Japanese companies. Name just one Chinese one of renown. Exclusively "Chinese made" is not a great selling point.

The heavily centralised government and concomitant localised corruption is not too healthy either. China isn't so much a country as an empire. It's terribly monolithic. People sometimes wonder what would have happened in Europe if Rome had never fallen. I say look at China as the example. Brief bursts of innovation followed by long long periods of stasis. When the western powers made inroads into China it was stuck in medieval times. The average Chinese peasant of the 10th century would not be out of place to the average Chinese peasant of the 19th and even today beyond the newly built dreaming spires of the cities, they wouldn't be that far out of place now. Again culturally they've gone from one distant centralised government to another since the foundation of China itself.

Competition? Yea if they keep costs low. That's unsustainable. If their costs go up and they will then they'll look a lot less competitive if Europe and the states start to get more wage realistic. Then look at what they're selling to the world. Yea it may say made in china on the bottom, but the vast majority is designed in the west and most of the money flows back westward too. Then you have the vast hinterlands of peasant farmers who are already causing local trouble. If that reaches critical mass they're in real trouble. They might get through it this time around but I wouldnt be so sure.

pmcmahon wrote: »

however,militarily....wow.

The yanks would rip them a new one. The Russians ditto.

Fromthetrees · 13-09-2011 07:27PM

Lanaier wrote: »

http://www.boards.ie/search/?q=%22welcome+our+new%22+chinese

Grats, you're a meme-parrot.
When you develop a personality let us know if you think the Chinese are taking over the world.

Also:

http://www.boards.ie/search/?q=%22great+bunch+of+lads%22+chinese

Hnnngggggghhh

That joke is still hilarious and inventive after 15 years guys, stay classy.

Jeepers creepers,
it's a Frankie Boyle joke from tv,
a bit like the one on Father Ted from tv,;)
no need to get your knickers in a twist.:rolleyes:
I've also not been on boards that long so wouldn't have spotted it's already been said, it ain't no thing.

cosanostra · 13-09-2011 08:27PM

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Mainly the USA, China spends about €80 billion a year on military spending and Ameica spends approx €800 billion in the same time.

And that 800billion comes from china who have already told the USA to cut military spending and decrease their deficit!

13-09-2011 08:33PM

4leto wrote: »

Yes they will, they probably have already.

If the Euro goes pear shaped, they will be our new masters.

If they give me an Asimo robot, one of their funny robot pets (of which they have many) and super speed broadband to "sweeten the deal" then I for one welcome our new masters

k.p.h · 13-09-2011 08:42PM

hellboy99 wrote: »

If they give me an Asimo robot, one of their funny robot pets (of which they have many) and super speed broadband to "sweeten the deal" then I for one welcome our new masters

Asimo is Honda and they are Japanese. Actually all of things you mention are Japanese. China is the place with the wall and where all you Christmas decorations are made ..!!

Buceph · 13-09-2011 08:53PM

Is china going to take over the world.

markesmith · 13-09-2011 09:12PM

Buceph wrote: »

Is china going to take over the world.

If you don't get your question mark placement sorted out, then I'd say maybe.

jugger0 · 13-09-2011 09:15PM

Nobody will be taking over anyone with all the nukes in the world, China tries anything and the Americans/Russians would annihilate them, doesn't matter how many soldiers or tanks they have its all about the nukes.

Logical Fallacy · 13-09-2011 09:17PM

I wouldn't mind if China took over the world.

Assume cinema, not wheat reliant which would make my gluten intolerant life a lot easier.

I know there is something about Human Rights in there...but who gives a **** about Tibet?

13-09-2011 09:17PM

k.p.h wrote: »

Asimo is Honda and they are Japanese. Actually all of things you mention are Japanese. China is the place with the wall and where all you Christmas decorations are made ..!!

Ah, bugger that then

4leto · 13-09-2011 09:39PM

Wibbs wrote: »

Nope. Who do they sell the vast majority of their stuff to? Us and the USA. We go down, they go down. Plus as was noted earlier in the thread they have a well dodgy business model and a very vulnerable one to boot. Culturally they've a race to the bottom mentality and appear to have no word for intellectual copyright. They don't seem to "get" trademarks either. During the "made in Japan" era nearly everyone could name off 5 Japanese companies. Name just one Chinese one of renown. Exclusively "Chinese made" is not a great selling point.

The heavily centralised government and concomitant localised corruption is not too healthy either. China isn't so much a country as an empire. It's terribly monolithic. People sometimes wonder what would have happened in Europe if Rome had never fallen. I say look at China as the example. Brief bursts of innovation followed by long long periods of stasis. When the western powers made inroads into China it was stuck in medieval times. The average Chinese peasant of the 10th century would not be out of place to the average Chinese peasant of the 19th and even today beyond the newly built dreaming spires of the cities, they wouldn't be that far out of place now. Again culturally they've gone from one distant centralised government to another since the foundation of China itself.

Competition? Yea if they keep costs low. That's unsustainable. If their costs go up and they will then they'll look a lot less competitive if Europe and the states start to get more wage realistic. Then look at what they're selling to the world. Yea it may say made in china on the bottom, but the vast majority is designed in the west and most of the money flows back westward too. Then you have the vast hinterlands of peasant farmers who are already causing local trouble. If that reaches critical mass they're in real trouble. They might get through it this time around but I wouldnt be so sure.

The yanks would rip them a new one. The Russians ditto.

An excellent and interesting post China does have nationalism problems but there is a pan Chinese feeling so perhaps some regions may push for independence but not the Cantonese and the mandarin speaking regions which are the main industrial areas also the vast majority of Chinese so it would still be a very populace nation.

Also I keep hearing this which I think is a kind or racism. Chinese may not have the big companies, brands or trade marks now. But they will, they are people just like us westerners they can be equally as creative and they can certainly learn from our business models. Incidently I am tapping this out on an Acer which is a piece of crap but a Chinese company also my runners are also a Chinese brand again crap but very cheap.

They recently built a stealth fighter from parts they back engineered from the downed bomber that was shot down in the old Yugoslavia. They sent up there own rocket for a pittance The US new moon rocket Ares 1 cost 350 million Chinas Chang'e 1 cost 120 million They are targeting Mars by 2050.

And we can't compete with them they have no environmental costs or social costs, that can't go on but it doesn't look like its changing soon. Also they are turning out 1000s of graduates a year. These by western standard are not great graduates but its as Stalin said there is quality in quantity.

I do fear them.

4leto · 13-09-2011 09:52PM

gargleblaster wrote: »

What is there to fear?

Fear itself

I just don't think they have a tradition of individual rights, their non existing environmental policy and property rights shows that. Also it will be a superpower but how they use that power is the question.

I just don't think they will use it morally. Maybe that is the nature of to much power, I don't know,

gargleblaster · 13-09-2011 09:54PM

4leto wrote: »

Fear itself

I just don't think they have a tradition of individual rights, their non existing environmental policy and property rights shows that. Also it will be a superpower but how they use that power is the question.

I just don't think they will use it morally. Maybe that is the nature of to much power, I don't know,

I get your point yes, I guess what I was thinking when I typed that is that if there's anything to fear it's this building currency war. China's just one player in that and that is what seems to me to have the biggest possibility of making things significantly worse. China wouldn't want to do anything drastic to make anything worse for anyone else, as they're dependent on foreign markets to buy their goods.

4leto · 13-09-2011 10:03PM

gargleblaster wrote: »

I get your point yes, I guess what I was thinking when I typed that is that if there's anything to fear it's this building currency war. China's just one player in that and that is what seems to me to have the biggest possibility of making things significantly worse. China wouldn't want to do anything drastic to make anything worse for anyone else, as they're dependent on foreign markets to buy their goods.

They are also building up a massive internal market they at the moment have the biggest middle class population in the world. Although that class is built up from the exports but just watch their service sector grow. Watch their banking and stock exchange grow.

Also they are no longer content to just import raw materials from mainly western mining companies they are scooping up mining and power companies from Africa to Australia.

gargleblaster · 13-09-2011 10:14PM

Yes it all sounds lovely but their real estate bubble is a serious concern. Their economy is not as robust as many would seem to want to believe.

Solnskaya · 13-09-2011 10:22PM

I can't see China taking over the world, everything they make is shoite of the highest order and the quarrity just aint there. What I can see is the axis of influence shifting away from Europe and the west in general towards an emergent East. Simply due to population densities and economies of scale the Eastern nations including the Middle East and India will be the economic center of the world in the next few decades and the west will decline in influence. Already this shift is happening-there are more commercial airline flights in the east than the west and stock exchanges are starting to shift their focus away from the west to become eastern-centric.
Theres more of the feckers than us, is basically what I'm saying. Actually, I think we in Ireland will see that it is the Indians that take over, not the chinese. In five years, you will struggle to find a non-Indian grocery/convenience store or fuel station. Britain is saturated, the flow is towards the fresh meat in Ireland, and if you look around, it's already happening.

Are china going to take over the world?

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