Transition Year - Waste of time, space and money?

partyatmygaff · 27-07-2011 11:03PM #1

Am I the only one who thinks that TY in secondary schools is an unnecessary strain on our stretched education budget? What benefit is there to spending an entire year in school achieving nothing of any particular importance and needlessly using up teacher's time and using school resources in the process?

Nearly everyone I know who did TY (I skipped TY personally) regret it now and wish they went straight on to fifth year.

I can't count the amount of times i've heard of people complaining about secondary schools being oversubscribed but here we are with secondary schools using up an entire year group's worth of resources on a pointless year. IMO, it seems like a complete waste of time, money and school capacity.

7sr2z3fely84g5 · 27-07-2011 11:04PM

Free labour,shhh....

Poor Uncle Tom · 27-07-2011 11:05PM

In fairness that could be said for any year in secondary school.....

MsJenjers · 27-07-2011 11:08PM

Well all I really got out of it was more pals but I suppose you could get that anywhere :P So yeah...waste of time and money!

AnneElizabeth · 27-07-2011 11:08PM

It was great! Made new friends, had a break, went on trips, got so much experience for my CV, had more time to decide on LC subjects. No reason not to do it!

Herb Powell · 27-07-2011 11:11PM

Well what would you see as so useful about the other years at school?

partyatmygaff · 27-07-2011 11:12PM

Herb Powell wrote: »

Well what would you see as so useful about the other years at school?

I dunno...

Actually learning for example?

Herb Powell · 27-07-2011 11:17PM

.........aaaaaaaand what would you count as "actually learning"?

Jess16 · 27-07-2011 11:18PM

I think that living in such a capitalist society, people tend to focus on education as a profit-making enterprise, and fail to acknowledge the value that comes with growing as people as opposed to profit margins.

Life experience is never a waste. Neither is education. This is both. Do it.

Namlub · 27-07-2011 11:18PM

sugarman wrote: »

Its after been changed over the last 2yrs where as its now part of the leaving cert struture afaik..

I was in TY last year, it's definitely not. Where did you get that from?

starlit · 27-07-2011 11:19PM

I think its a very good idea and worthwhile, I did it and never regret doing it. It gave me a proper chance to prepare for my leaving and chose my leaving cert subjects. I was better informed when it came to choosing my subjects and what career path I wanted. I made new friends. All the better for it. I got a chance to take a break, a break for my brain from heavy study but also got to learn other things without having it so focused on study all the time. A lot more group activities and educational trips. It was a bit like first year but we were treated more maturely. You get to do work experience which is great. You learn more than just the academic side!

I learnt a lot about myself and other's as well as being on an equal level with teachers, they were like our friends really and treated us more like adults. It was an even key with them. There were fun aspects too it wasn't what you call a doss you still had to do most subjects at honours leaving cert level maybe some at pass say for maths maybe. You do a variety of subjects and gives you a better idea of what areas you like, good at and what you'd like to pursue whether or not you studied for the junior cert or not. If I could I would do it again, it saved the hassle of having to take a break in between secondary school and college or later on while still in college, I just kept going with college until I started working, went back to college again and now just taking time out in searching for work and might go back to college again next year. Think now is a better time to take time out of education than doing so too soon but TY is different you are still in mainstream education!

Depends what you want out of it really, what you put in you get out of it.
Its worth doing it if you feel you need a break from studying you be ready then to do the leaving cert and start college when the time comes and you be more mature for college too!

Wetai · 27-07-2011 11:19PM

We never had the option

. But some teachers would call the year after the Junior Cert 5th year, even though it was (and we called it) our 4th year.

MsJenjers · 27-07-2011 11:21PM

Herb Powell wrote: »

Well what would you see as so useful about the other years at school?

Well at least you spend the other years preparing for the LC instead of shamelessly promoting your "mini company" in the middle of the local shopping centre by handing out fliers you made by hand. I guess TY's different in every school but it wasn't much of an unforgetable experience in my school!

Good craic was had every now and again but just not worth the money!

partyatmygaff · 27-07-2011 11:23PM

Jess16 wrote: »

I think that living in such a capitalist society, people tend to focus on education as a profit-making enterprise, and fail to acknowledge the value that comes with growing as people as opposed to profit margins.

Life experience is never a waste. Neither is education. This is both. Do it.

Growing as people should not have its own special year dedicated to it. It should be a continuous process throughout secondary school.

Witcher · 27-07-2011 11:24PM

The only people that seem to have a problem are those who didn't do it.

amacca · 27-07-2011 11:28PM

I suppose like anything...some people genuinely find it useful and some think its a load of ..... eh horse stuff.

Your point about the resources is a valid one though...there is probably very little point running a severely under-resourced TY and that looks to be the way TY is heading.

TY can also if its not monitored/controlled properly become a cosy little home for those that dont/wont do any academic work...wont really get involved in teamwork/projects (what its supposed to be about).....but its hard to actually refuse students from entering if their parents kick up enough of a stink when they are refused etc

overall I suppose...its worthwhile if its done properly and the school is given the ability to let the correct cohort of students into it (those that would benefit) without interference etc + are allowed maintain discipline without being beholden to the fear of section 29 etc (all rights no responsibilities these days I tells ya)

I personally think the extra year is very valuable for students who are immature but show potential to grow up (mentally speaking) in that year + decide they want to make a proper stab at their exams etc - but thats more of an opinion looking at it from the outside - perhaps the students themselves would not agree

One final thing....given the current climate wouldn't one more year in the education system be beneficial at this stage?..perhaps someone going into TY this year would benefit simply by coming out into an economy with one more years worth of "recovery" behind it (and one more year of maturity behind them) 6-7 odd years down the line (presuming they do a 4 year undergrad)

I didnt do it btw...went to college @ 17 (there was no such thing as TY when I were a nipper:D)----not sure the extra year would have done me any good as tbh I'm probably still quite immature and may remain so until I depart this reality

Herb Powell · 27-07-2011 11:29PM

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Growing as people should not have its own special year dedicated to it. It should be a continuous process throughout secondary school.

Well that's a whole different kettle of fish, and it currently isn't

Jess16 · 27-07-2011 11:33PM

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Growing as people should not have its own special year dedicated to it. It should be a continuous process throughout secondary school.

And it is to the extent that teachers can allow it to be whilst operating within curriculum restraints. There are no time/curriculum constraints in TY so personal growth is at a premium

phasers · 27-07-2011 11:38PM

It all depends on the individual school. Mine was shockingly bad and we did absolutely nothing for a year, but some schools set up all kinds of courses, trips, guest speakers and interesting classes for students to experience.

Thing is though, this shouldn't all be shoehorned into one optional year, it should be a continuous thing. The Irish education system sucks, it's only role is to encourage students to regurgitate facts a lot of the time they don't even understand.

adamski8 · 27-07-2011 11:39PM

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Growing as people should not have its own special year dedicated to it. It should be a continuous process throughout secondary school.

your right it should, the important word there is SHOULD but usually is not, while obviously the other regular years teach you alot of essential and worthwhile things, in most cases growing as people is not what is done in the class room.

sitting in a class room 9-4 and then sitting at home doing homework for another 3 hours doesnt particularly make you grow as a person.

TY your free from homework, you do activities outside the classroom, get involved in things like charity, learning things like first aid, how to swim or play a guitar, try to run a small business, take field trip, discover things about nature, alot more PE and art classes and also a few weeks work experience.

as far as costing money, all i know is my class had to pay for nearly everything and we had only about 3 classes a day which most teachers didnt show up for so about zero money spent there.

AG2R · 27-07-2011 11:40PM

I done it and found it rather pointless

Daisy03 · 27-07-2011 11:41PM

I did TY and I think it was well worth it. I got the chance to go on a German exchange which really helped me get a good result in the LC. We also did things like the Young Scientist which helped bulk up my CV. (At 16 and wanting a part time job it's kind of helpful!)

I also did charity work and still volunteer for them 7 years later. There was loads if other stuff aswell.

There is also actual academic work during the year. We started the basic stuff in subjects like maths and Irish to help give us a solid base in 5th year.

I don't see how it could be a waste if the student makes an effort to make the most of the year.

Our principal tried to encourage students to do it, claiming that in his experience students who do it tend to do better in the LC.

sky88 · 27-07-2011 11:41PM

didnt do it my school didnt waste there time time with it

4zn76tysfajdxp · 27-07-2011 11:44PM

adamski8 wrote: »

sitting in a class room 9-4 and then sitting at home doing homework for another 3 hours doesnt particularly make you grow as a person.

That's just silly. Why can't these people learn to "grow as a person" in their spare time? Seven hours of lessons a day followed by a couple of hours of homework a night isn't very repressive.

Caraville · 27-07-2011 11:44PM

I did it and it was one of the best decisions I've ever made in my life. Made loads of new friends, became far more confident and tried lots of different things. Having said that, it was particularly well run in my school so that definitely makes a difference.

Thing is though, something I've always said about TY (as both a student and teacher) is that you get out of it what you put in to it. The moany teenagers who say it's a waste of time and boring are generally the ones who just sit on their arses all year doing nothing instead of trying new hobbies, getting a part time job (I know there's not a lot out there now, but even volunteering in something), mixing with new classmates etc. Yet they're the same ones that when you suggest an activity to, will say "aw but we're in TY, we're not supposed to be doing stuff".

Do me a favour and stay at home so if you're going to sit with that pus on ya all day.

amacca · 27-07-2011 11:45PM

phasers wrote: »

It all depends on the individual school. Mine was shockingly bad and we did absolutely nothing for a year, but some schools set up all kinds of courses, trips, guest speakers and interesting classes for students to experience.

Interestingly I was reading today somewhere that guest speakers seem to have very little effect on students and I sometimes wonder about the effectiveness of some of the above too....then again break from the norm, mental stimulation...cant hurt I suppose

paper article was in relation to correlations between a persons health and their educational attainment....writer cited a study on the effectiveness of various different methods of trying to reduce peoples likelihood of taking up smoking

telling people about the rules etc (no effect) ..... telling people about the dangers (very little effect) ...... guest speaker (little or no effect) was the general gist of it I think

cocoshovel · 27-07-2011 11:48PM

No! NO! NO!!! I meant to pick it was pointless!! Eh oh well.

Biggest pile of ****e ever, we just sat in the same classroom from 9am-4pm and chatted, we rarely did any activities and we didn't do a single bit of learning, everybody went into 5th year with 0 motivation to do work and 100 times stupider. Im sure its much better in other schools but I went to a joke of a school filled with inbreds and bog folk.

Shane L · 27-07-2011 11:49PM

I helped create a school magazine, did 3 work experiences and discovered I didn't want to do architecture anymore and there was many other sport activities and trips throughout the year. TY was well worth it and 1 year older doing the Leaving cert has its advantage. The school I went to used to keep tabs on how everyone did in their LC and compared the results with the crowds who did and didn't do TY . Guess who came out on top every year statistically ?:)

amacca · 27-07-2011 11:50PM

Daisy03 wrote: »

I don't see how it could be a waste if the student makes an effort to make the most of the year.

true...its like almost any experience in that respect.....in my experience a lot of the students complaining about it seemed not to want to roll up their sleeves and take part.....get involved

thats where selecting / being allowed to select suitable students to take part comes in imo

Daisy03 wrote: »

Our principal tried to encourage students to do it, claiming that in his experience students who do it tend to do better in the LC.

On average - the vast majority of students who completed the programme in my former school done significantly better than those that went straight from JC ...so that to me was the best advertisement for it

amacca · 27-07-2011 11:52PM

cocoshovel wrote: »

Im sure its much better in other schools but I went to a joke of a school filled with inbreds and bog folk.

I'm sure they liked you too!

Shane L · 27-07-2011 11:55PM

@amacca I agree totally with guest speakers not having an influence had so many come in and warn us about the dangers of drugs especially and alcoholism and I really don't think its made a blind bit of difference mainly because they always bring in people who are the extreme cases.

Transition Year - Waste of time, space and money?

Did you do Transition Year/How did you find it? 187 votes

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