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Back Boiler Stove new build is the hot press two far away from stove

  • 05-06-2011 11:41AM
    #1
    Katz83
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 91 ✭✭


    We are building a 2000 square foot house bungalow.

    Thinking of putting in back boiler stove in kitchen dinning area. It is a big enough room 9m by about 4.5m.

    There is also 14 rads in the house but this will be zoned to hot water, living zone and bedroom zone.

    The back boiler is around 5.5m from hotpress or say 18 or 20 feet away. The stove will be heating the room, water and the living areas say at most seven rads.

    I am just wondering is the hot press two far from the stove and would we be better off going with just a room heating stove. Is there any stoves that you would recommend. Any advise appreciated


Comments

  • #2
    heinbloed
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,632 ✭✭✭heinbloed


    Contact an energy advisor, a civil engineer or a heating engineer.
    The numbers of radiators, the distance between thermal source and heatexchanger or the room's floor surface are important but only small points in an overall calculation.


  • #3
    Stove Fan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,081 ✭✭✭Stove Fan


    Katz83 wrote: »
    We are building a 2000 square foot house bungalow.

    Thinking of putting in back boiler stove in kitchen dinning area. It is a big enough room 9m by about 4.5m.

    There is also 14 rads in the house but this will be zoned to hot water, living zone and bedroom zone.

    The back boiler is around 5.5m from hotpress or say 18 or 20 feet away. The stove will be heating the room, water and the living areas say at most seven rads.

    I am just wondering is the hot press two far from the stove and would we be better off going with just a room heating stove. Is there any stoves that you would recommend. Any advise appreciated

    Ideally you would need the stove as near the hotpress or vice versa. Your cylinder would need to be as near to the ceiling as possible for gravity circulation and the cold feed tank as high in the loft as possible. It could be possible to install 20 feet away providing the plumber can install 2 1inch pipes across the walls constantly rising to the cylinder. This would be ok if you could bury or cover in a fake stud wall or hide by running behind thick insulated plasterboard. Alternatively you could put the cylinder in the loft above the stove, although you need sufficient headroom for the tank above to get a decent pressure from the hot taps.
    I would see if the latter was possible, as it would be the easier option and most efficient. The further away the cylinder the less efficient it becomes. Ask your architect what headroom would be available in the loft. Very good stoves are Clearview, Woodwarm, Charnwood, dunsley. Morso are very good but don't do big boiler models. Medium quality Villager, Hunter and Arrow. We have a villager and are very happy. See www.whatstove.co.uk for different stove reviews by owners.
    Good luck. Stove Fan:)


  • #4
    Katz83
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 91 ✭✭Katz83


    Stove Fan wrote: »
    Ideally you would need the stove as near the hotpress or vice versa. Your cylinder would need to be as near to the ceiling as possible for gravity circulation and the cold feed tank as high in the loft as possible. It could be possible to install 20 feet away providing the plumber can install 2 1inch pipes across the walls constantly rising to the cylinder. This would be ok if you could bury or cover in a fake stud wall or hide by running behind thick insulated plasterboard. Alternatively you could put the cylinder in the loft above the stove, although you need sufficient headroom for the tank above to get a decent pressure from the hot taps.
    I would see if the latter was possible, as it would be the easier option and most efficient. The further away the cylinder the less efficient it becomes. Ask your architect what headroom would be available in the loft. Very good stoves are Clearview, Woodwarm, Charnwood, dunsley. Morso are very good but don't do big boiler models. Medium quality Villager, Hunter and Arrow. We have a villager and are very happy. See www.whatstove.co.uk for different stove reviews by owners.
    Good luck. Stove Fan:)

    Thanks for the advise. I could talk to him about this. i just dont want to put in a back boiler and realise that the rads arent heating and not alot of heat going to room stove is in. if this was the case we would be better off going with room heating stove. As we are gonna have solar panels. We were thinking hunter alright. Yes def dont want a huge stove


  • #5
    Stove Fan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,081 ✭✭✭Stove Fan


    Katz83 wrote: »
    Thanks for the advise. I could talk to him about this. i just dont want to put in a back boiler and realise that the rads arent heating and not alot of heat going to room stove is in. if this was the case we would be better off going with room heating stove. As we are gonna have solar panels. We were thinking hunter alright. Yes def dont want a huge stove

    The stoves boiler needs to match the heat load of the rads and hot water. Your plumber would be able to advice you which stove was suitable. On most 14kw boiler stoves like the hunter herald 14 is that they seem to output around 3-5kw of direct heat to the room. Depending on insulation you may need a radiator in the same room as the stove with a thermostatic rad valve fitted. We have a 6m by 6m living room with cavity wall insulation and the stove is enough on its own to heat it. Its a small villager berkley integral boiler and it runs 5 rads and hot water.

    If you can afford the extra expense of a boiler stove installation you will love your real fire heating your house:D

    Stove Fan:)


  • #6
    Katz83
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 91 ✭✭Katz83


    Stove Fan wrote: »
    The stoves boiler needs to match the heat load of the rads and hot water. Your plumber would be able to advice you which stove was suitable. On most 14kw boiler stoves like the hunter herald 14 is that they seem to output around 3-5kw of direct heat to the room. Depending on insulation you may need a radiator in the same room as the stove with a thermostatic rad valve fitted. We have a 6m by 6m living room with cavity wall insulation and the stove is enough on its own to heat it. Its a small villager berkley integral boiler and it runs 5 rads and hot water.

    If you can afford the extra expense of a boiler stove installation you will love your real fire heating your house:D

    Stove Fan:)

    Yes if the back boiler is ok that far away from the hot press we definately putting one in. They will be two rads in the room with the stove as it is a very big kitchen dinning area. We also are going to pump 150mm cavity with bead. No plasterborad. Little bit off the topic now but is your house very warm with the pump cavity and how big is your caivty and did you just pump the cavity. Great getting advise.

    Now back to the stove My worry is that if we put the back boiler stove in. Room is as i said very big and to bring up the heat needed to the room you have a rad in there and say the stove dosnt heat the rads sufficently. Will this room still be cold even with the stove on as say you need 5kw of ouptut to the room and say the stove does 3kw and you have your rads in the room compenstating for the rest of the heat but say these arent heating then you wont get your 5kw. Sorry if this dosnt make sense


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  • #7
    Stove Fan
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,081 ✭✭✭Stove Fan


    Katz83 wrote: »
    Yes if the back boiler is ok that far away from the hot press we definately putting one in. They will be two rads in the room with the stove as it is a very big kitchen dinning area. We also are going to pump 150mm cavity with bead. No plasterborad. Little bit off the topic now but is your house very warm with the pump cavity and how big is your caivty and did you just pump the cavity. Great getting advise.

    Now back to the stove My worry is that if we put the back boiler stove in. Room is as i said very big and to bring up the heat needed to the room you have a rad in there and say the stove dosnt heat the rads sufficently. Will this room still be cold even with the stove on as say you need 5kw of ouptut to the room and say the stove does 3kw and you have your rads in the room compenstating for the rest of the heat but say these arent heating then you wont get your 5kw. Sorry if this dosnt make sense
    Your insulation levels and cavity size are going to be superior:D. We just went for a 4 inch cavity with aeroboard platinum insulation fitted as the blocklayer built the wall. I then fitted 50mm kingspan insulated plasterboard on the inside. I dont know what U value it achieves but it was very warm in that cold spell with just the stove. Our 6m by 6m room would be around 70F in the cold spell and up to 75F in the current weather today.

    With regards to the stove yes the rads would need at least an hour to warm up to get your total heat required for the room. I would imagine though once the fabric of the building has warmed up then it would keep the heat in. It may only be a problem if you went away, the initial delay in getting the room warm between stove and rads. You could always use your oil/gas to initially warm the house up and then light the fire and switch the oil off.

    Stove Fan.:)


  • #8
    Katz83
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 91 ✭✭Katz83


    Stove Fan wrote: »
    Your insulation levels and cavity size are going to be superior:D. We just went for a 4 inch cavity with aeroboard platinum insulation fitted as the blocklayer built the wall. I then fitted 50mm kingspan insulated plasterboard on the inside. I dont know what U value it achieves but it was very warm in that cold spell with just the stove. Our 6m by 6m room would be around 70F in the cold spell and up to 75F in the current weather today.

    With regards to the stove yes the rads would need at least an hour to warm up to get your total heat required for the room. I would imagine though once the fabric of the building has warmed up then it would keep the heat in. It may only be a problem if you went away, the initial delay in getting the room warm between stove and rads. You could always use your oil/gas to initially warm the house up and then light the fire and switch the oil off.

    Stove Fan.:)

    I will talk to our plumber and see what he thinks. If it is more economical to just go with room heating stove i will do that. Alot of people say if the stove is just heating the room they get so warm that if you open a door it heats alot more of the house. And as i said we have the solar panels for hot water but we wil see. The pipe work is done underground anyways so it can always be done in the future. Thanks for all your advise. So many decisions to be made.


  • #9
    Summer sun
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1 ✭Summer sun


    Hi Stove Fan, just wondering if you can help me. We are in a dormer. We want to put in a back boiler stove. We will need to run 45 inches of pipe to the water cylinder which is upstairs. There will be a constant rise but there will be nine bends. Our plumber thinks it will work but I am having my doubts! What do you think?

    Thanks


  • #10
    TPM
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 871 ✭✭✭TPM


    Katz83 wrote: »
    We are building a 2000 square foot house bungalow.

    Thinking of putting in back boiler stove in kitchen dinning area. It is a big enough room 9m by about 4.5m.

    There is also 14 rads in the house but this will be zoned to hot water, living zone and bedroom zone.

    The back boiler is around 5.5m from hotpress or say 18 or 20 feet away. The stove will be heating the room, water and the living areas say at most seven rads.

    I am just wondering is the hot press two far from the stove and would we be better off going with just a room heating stove. Is there any stoves that you would recommend. Any advise appreciated

    Katz83 wrote: »
    We are building a 2000 square foot house bungalow.

    Thinking of putting in back boiler stove in kitchen dinning area. It is a big enough room 9m by about 4.5m.

    There is also 14 rads in the house but this will be zoned to hot water, living zone and bedroom zone.
    Katz83 wrote: »
    Now back to the stove My worry is that if we put the back boiler stove in. Room is as i said very big and to bring up the heat needed to the room you have a rad in there and say the stove dosnt heat the rads sufficently. Will this room still be cold even with the stove on as say you need 5kw of output to the room and say the stove does 3kw and you have your rads in the room compenstating for the rest of the heat but say these arent heating then you wont get your 5kw. Sorry if this dosnt make sense
    Your situation is similar in ways to mine.
    My house is about 2100sq ft. I got my stove up and running a week ago, it is a 30 kw stove in a room 10m x 5m.
    But I have underfloor heating not rads.

    In stoves the heat ratio between the boiler and the room is fixed this means the harder the stove works to heat the water (the more fuel you burn) the more heat that the stove puts into the room so the hotter the room gets.
    In my case there is no issue with the stove being able to heat the room, infact I found If I got carried away fuelling the fire the room could get too hot.


  • #11
    fiestaman
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,198 ✭✭✭fiestaman


    Hi i have the same set up as youself, 3zones and i have a stanley erin with back boiler. i can switch my stove between zone1 and zone2 by opening one valve and closing the other one. i have the stove in my sitting room 17ftx16ft and there is a double door opening into the kitchen 22ftx14.5ft. my stove can heat this area nicely. i usually leave the bedroom zone on all the time with the stove so only the stove itself heats the living area. Now i have 100mm of pumped bead and 38mm insulated slab on inside so insulation is a big factor. just as a reference if i switch it to the living area there is 3x1600mm 1x1000mm 1x700mm 2x800mm radiatiors and it can heat these no problem. i had an issue up until last week where it wasnt doing it and the solution was my pump was running to fast. turned it down and now its perfect. i think 7mtrs is the max distance form stove to hotpress.


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