Alternative therapies

eilo1 · 19-04-2011 10:59PM #1

A friend of mine is studying herbal medicine. She is very into alternative therapies and only eats organic food and generally goes against medical advice (she has a chronic illness and will not follow gp advice).

Anyway's unfortunately her dad now has prostate cancer and is delaying treatment because he wants to fly abroad and have an alternative treatment instead. The practitioner promises a 50/50 chance of success this is not only not evidence based but also below the survival rate of traditional treatment.

So please discuss, personally I think this kind of quakary should be banned but then Im biased. What do the witty AH's peeps have to say on the matter?

AnonoBoy · 19-04-2011 11:03PM

Your friend is a f*cking moron.

mickydoomsux · 19-04-2011 11:15PM

Get her to read the book "Bad Science" by Ben Goldacre.

Shows a lot of the science (or lack thereof) behind alternative therapy. If that doesn't sway her then **** her.

diddlybit · 19-04-2011 11:15PM

I have no problem with alternative medecine for minor complaints, but do find the treatment of terminal illneses with it problematic. There are no studies or evidence of its effects in these cases. Use it as a supplement by all means, but no also the only way to cure it.

As my grandfather was dying of cancer, he got fixated on a potion that some guy he knew from his church used to sell to him out of the boot of his car at an exordinate price. Guy was just trying to make a quick buck out of a sick, dying man. It was disgusting.

I don't think they should be banned, but they should be regulated and proper research conducted.

easyeason3 · 19-04-2011 11:20PM

Alternative medicine has it's uses. I usually try to avoid painkillers or antibiotics as much as I can because I personally think GPs are too quick to write out a prescription that I may not need. When my GP sees me going into his surgery he knows I'm genuinely sick instead of looking for a prescription & sympathy.

In the case of a serious or long term illness then I feel you are insane if you rely soley on alternative medicines to cure you.

'New' medical treatments & alternative therapies can actually be used in harmony if used properly.

Oh_Noes · 19-04-2011 11:23PM

eilo1 wrote: »

So please discuss, personally I think this kind of quakary should be banned but then Im biased.

If your friend has a chronic illness herself and has been treating it successfully then why do you think it's quackery?

A lot of people in that position get frustrated with how Western medicine concentrates specifically on the manifestation of the illness rather than the whole. If her dad has confidence in her then I don't know why you would have a problem with it.

What is the success rate of traditional treatment for the type of cancer he has?

Krusader · 19-04-2011 11:23PM

Isn't there suppose to be a doctor in Italy that cures cancer with Baking Soda (Sodium Bi-Carbonate), it occurs naturally in nature so drug companies can't patent it

tony 2 tone · 19-04-2011 11:25PM

mickydoomsux wrote: »

Get her to read the book "Bad Science" by Ben Goldacre.

Shows a lot of the science (or lack thereof) behind alternative therapy. If that doesn't sway her then **** her.

Also have a look at "Trick or Treatment" by Simon Singh and Edzard Ernst, goes over various alternative treatments and shows if they are worth while or not.

mikemac · 19-04-2011 11:25PM

I am a fan of alternative therapy. There realy is a lot there and a lot to learn.

Yeah there is some quackery but there are terrible GP's and doctors in Ireland also

If your dad has confidence in this they give it a go

eilo1 · 19-04-2011 11:27PM

Oh_Noes wrote: »

If your friend has a chronic illness herself and has been treating it successfully then why do you think it's quackery?

A lot of people in that position get frustrated with how Western medicine concentrates specifically on the manifestation of the illness rather than the whole. If her dad has confidence in her then I don't know why you would have a problem with it.

What is the success rate of traditional treatment for the type of cancer he has?

She has isn't treating it successfully, she has been trying to treat it for the last 18 months with purely alternative therapies and has had no success. She will admit that herself, that isn't just my observation.

The cancer is early diagnosed prostate so about 80% survival after 5 years. Although they have said it is aggressive therefore early treatment should be vital.

EverEvolving · 19-04-2011 11:28PM

As Dara O'Briain put it so well "Herbal medicine has been around for years and we tested it and the stuff that works became medicine"

dar4 · 19-04-2011 11:28PM

Crosáidí wrote: »

Isn't there suppose to be a doctor in Italy that cures cancer with Baking Soda (Sodium Bi-Carbonate), it occurs naturally in nature so drug companies can't patent it

is this so id like/hope for sum more info on this please

easyeason3 · 19-04-2011 11:30PM

eilo1 wrote: »

She has isn't treating it successfully, she has been trying to treat it for the last 18 months with purely alternative therapies and has had no success. She will admit that herself, that isn't just my observation.

The cancer is early diagnosed prostate so about 80% survival after 5 years. Although they have said it is aggressive therefore early treatment should be vital.

So can he not use medical & alternative treatments at the same time to optimise his chances?

dar4 · 19-04-2011 11:31PM

EverEvolving wrote: »

As Dara O'Briain put it so well "Herbal medicine has been around for years and we tested it and the stuff that works became medicine"

the chinise were cureing things with herbs while we were stuck in the dark ages

epgc3fyqirnbsx · 19-04-2011 11:32PM

This clip says it all for me

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMGIbOGu8q0

eilo1 · 19-04-2011 11:35PM

he needs to go to Germany for 5 weeks to start the alternative treatment. He is also refusing to begin hormone therapy. I dont know why, but she has hinted that they are worried about the long term toxicity of these treatments.

To me this sounds like risking your life on a 2 horse race, when one horse has never run before!

Im studying to be a physio so this is really upsetting and stressful to me. I just cant understand the mentality.

Fluorescence · 19-04-2011 11:36PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHVVKAKWXcg

Crock of shit. If it was a valid treatment it would be adopted by western medicine.

Biologic · 19-04-2011 11:36PM

Crosáidí wrote: »

Isn't there suppose to be a doctor in Italy that cures cancer with Baking Soda (Sodium Bi-Carbonate), it occurs naturally in nature so drug companies can't patent it

Don't come out with crap like that please. There's almost sure to be someone with cancer reading this thread, they dont deserve to have their desperation taken advantage of by uninformed posts like yours.
Re: your friend OP. She's an idiot. If you're talking to her, tell her I've got some magic beans for sale. Good price for her.

19-04-2011 11:37PM

Non AH response: Many, if not most traditional herbal remedies do in fact have viability as a solution or aid to medical problems. Most medicines were discovered in plants. The reason a doctor will not hand out the plant is because synthesising the active chemicals in a lab is more economical and easier to regulate in terms of dosage, administration etc. In other words, it's safer. While I would always go to the doctor for serious health problems, I do use herbal remedies (mainly teas, because I like drinking them anyway) to help stuff like sleep, energy levels, digestion. Stuff that I figure what the hell.

Your friend isn't being unwise by seeking herbal remedies, but she is being unwise to seek them not only in favour of but instead of conventional western medicine. Her actions are probably dangerous to her health. But it's her choice and it could well turn out that she's a lot smarter than any of us.

AH response: em... something about blasting with piss? I hear it's good for the skin...

eilo1 · 19-04-2011 11:38PM

Biologic wrote: »

Don't come out with crap like that please. There's almost sure to be someone with cancer reading this thread, they dont deserve to have their desperation taken advantage of by uninformed posts like yours.
Re: your friend OP. She's an idiot. If you're talking to her, tell her I've got some magic beans for sale. Good price for her.

I dont really want to make this too serious, but I do find it really hard to hold my tongue around her!

Im just trying to be supportive and objective at the same time, which basically means saying "okay, sure, well if thats what he wants............."

easyeason3 · 19-04-2011 11:39PM

eilo1 wrote: »

he needs to go to Germany for 5 weeks to start the alternative treatment. He is also refusing to begin hormone therapy. I dont know why, but she has hinted that they are worried about the long term toxicity of these treatments.

To me this sounds like risking your life on a 2 horse race, when one horse has never run before!

Im studying to be a physio so this is really upsetting and stressful to me. I just cant understand the mentality.

I don't want to sound harsh but if he doesn't take every option of treatment available to him the he won't have to worry about long term toxicity affecting him.

dvpower · 19-04-2011 11:39PM

dar4 wrote: »

the chinise were cureing things with herbs while we were stuck in the dark ages

But that was, well, back in the dark ages.
Much of modern medicine has its origens in plants etc. We've isolated the active ingredients, tested them, and made medicines from them.

El Weirdo · 19-04-2011 11:39PM

Ah. Darwinism at work.

doctor evil · 19-04-2011 11:39PM

In todays Irish Times health supplement there are one or two articles on herbs in medicine.

IMO the stuff that works becomes medicine and the rest is hogwash. If water has memory would it not remember all the cr*p it has been through? (homeopathy)

dar4 · 19-04-2011 11:40PM

Biologic wrote: »

Don't come out with crap like that please. There's almost sure to be someone with cancer reading this thread, they dont deserve to have their desperation taken advantage of by uninformed posts like yours.
Re: your friend OP. She's an idiot. If you're talking to her, tell her I've got some magic beans for sale. Good price for her.

jim stynes ? is still alive why?

Krusader · 19-04-2011 11:43PM

dar4 wrote: »

is this so id like/hope for sum more info on this please

Coriolanus · 19-04-2011 11:44PM

mickydoomsux wrote: »

Get her to read the book "Bad Science" by Ben Goldacre.

Shows a lot of the science (or lack thereof) behind alternative therapy. If that doesn't sway her then **** her.

I'd suggest fúcking her regardless.

Anyway, yeah, get the the book. Few euros on amazon will get it for you. It could very well save her life.

Miguel_Sanchez · 19-04-2011 11:44PM

Crosáidí wrote: »

Isn't there suppose to be a doctor in Italy that cures cancer with Baking Soda (Sodium Bi-Carbonate), it occurs naturally in nature so drug companies can't patent it

Ah that's handy. I'll just go get some now. I wonder will it raise all the family members I've lost to cancer from the dead as well?

They're going to feel fairly silly when they find out they died when the cure was in the press beside the salt and behind the raisins the whole time.

Krusader · 19-04-2011 11:45PM

Biologic wrote: »

Don't come out with crap like that please. There's almost sure to be someone with cancer reading this thread, they dont deserve to have their desperation taken advantage of by uninformed posts like yours.
Re: your friend OP. She's an idiot. If you're talking to her, tell her I've got some magic beans for sale. Good price for her.

It's not unimformed, there is a Dr. in Italy that believes he can cure it with Baking Soda

dvpower · 19-04-2011 11:48PM

doctor evil wrote: »

In todays Irish Times health supplement there are one or two articles on herbs in medicine.

IMO the stuff that works becomes medicine and the rest is hogwash. If water has memory would it not remember all the cr*p it has been through?

Homeopathy != Herbal medicine.

Homeopathy is pure hogwash mind.

doctor evil · 19-04-2011 11:48PM

OP do you think the daughter is pushing these ideas on him or is he in some kind of denial? Elder abuse can come in many forms...

Alternative therapies

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