Should the US just pack their bags and let the world burn?

RichieC wrote: »

Your argument is a fail, Sir. Just because the yanks won the propaganda war does not take away from the sacrifice that the russian people made in WW2. which was orders of magnitude more than the Americans made.

Stalingrad FTW!

The problem is what the Pro Western propaganda media slant people are bombarded with..

It does not make people aware of the history of the shaping of the middle east and the barbaric explotation, utter contempt for other nationalties,religions, cultures etc

It bamboozles people into genuinely believe that the Iraqi people are better off since the American invasion because that is what they are shown...They are unaware that over a Million Iraqi civilian are corpses, over 5 million are refugees...They are NOT told that this country has no economic hope for a century to come due to the sanctions enforced, all the educated population,doctors, nurses, teachers have fled! ...A country in ruins beyond contemplation..

An Irish times report from a few days ago for instance paints a slightly different picture of what you would see on other news channels


http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/world/2011/0412/1224294477760.html

IRAQIS PROTESTING at the lack of electricity, services, jobs and rampant corruption have been targeted by US-backed and trained security forces since demonstrations erupted following the uprisings in Tunisia and Egypt.

In Days of Rage: Protests and Repression in Iraq , a 22-page report published today, Amnesty International points out that Iraqis began protests in Basra last June, well before people power emerged in North Africa.

Although the Iraqi constitution guarantees citizens the right to peaceful protest, the authorities clamped down and adopted restrictive measures. However, the success of the Tunisian and Egyptian democracy movements “encouraged Iraqis to defy . . . restrictions and resume demonstrations”, Amnesty writes.

“Many protesters widened their calls to demand the resignation of local and central government representatives, or to protest against restrictions on civil and political rights.”

On February 25th, Iraq’s “Day of Rage”, tens of thousands marched in cities throughout the country, including Kurdistan where demonstrators have protested domination by two ethnic parties. At least six protesters have died there.

The authorities and ruling political parties have responded by deploying guards, troops and internal security forces that have replied “from the start with excessive force, killing and injuring protesters and with frequent arrests”. The ferocity of this reaction has led to a decline in the number and strength of protests although they have continued, Amnesty observes.

Demonstrators have also used violence, throwing stones at members of the security forces – some of whom were injured – or setting fire to public buildings. Amnesty says, however: “On most such occasions, it appears that demonstrators only resorted to violence after security forces had used force against them, including sound bombs and live ammunition.”

Amnesty interviewed protest organisers who have been arrested, beaten and tortured. Hadi al-Mehdi, a journalist who joined the “Day of Rage” protest in Baghdad, was detained, threatened with rape, beaten and had electric shocks applied to his feet.

Journalists covering protests have been attacked and arrested and their film or equipment has been confiscated. (Iraqis say at least 50 people have been killed.)

Amnesty calls on the authorities in Baghdad and the Kurdish region to “uphold the right of peaceful protest”, investigate attacks and killings, ban torture, and compensate victims of rights violations.

Colm O’Gorman, executive director of Amnesty International Ireland, observed: “Eight years on from the end of Saddam Hussein’s oppressive rule, Iraqis are still not allowed to protest peacefully, free from terror and intimidation.”

* Two bombs exploded near a crowded market in the Iraqi city of Falluja yesterday, killing six people and injuring two dozen, while two roadside bombs in Diyala province killed 10, according to hospital and security sources. In a separate incident in the Iraqi capital, a roadside bomb killed three people.

Violence has fallen sharply in Iraq in recent years but Iraqi forces are still battling a stubborn insurgency that carries out bombings and other attacks on a daily basis.

Falluja, located in Iraq’s mainly Sunni western province of Anbar about 50km (30 miles) west of Baghdad, was the scene of some of the fiercest fighting at the peak of Iraq’s sectarian warfare.

America needs to hold back the F-22 and have bases all over the World to fight the Transformers when they arrive

GerM wrote: »

EDIT: Can you list all these terrorist attacks on U.S. soil leading up to 9/11 please?

I will do my best, I have tried to leave out obvious acts of domestic terrorism so the unabomber and oklahoma city for example has been left out. attacks in bold are those that happen close enough to 9/11 that the actions taken by the us would have made no difference.

the tldr versio is: in total there were 17 terrorist attacks or attempts from 1988 until 9/11 and shortly afterwards. since the US invaded afghanistan in 2001 and iraq in 2003 there has been 5 'successfull' attacks, two of which were students who happened to be muslims deliberately knocking people down with their cars, and 3 foiled attempts. also there is a noticeable difference in the amount of attacks against us targets abroad before the 9/11 attacks and after but i didn't include either

April 12, 1988: Japanese Red Army terrorist Yu Kikumura was arrested at a rest stop on the New Jersey Turnpike in possession of pipe bombs on his way to New York.

November 5 1990: Assassination of Meir Kahane head of Israel's Koch party and founder of the American vigilante group the Jewish Defense League in a Manhattan, New York hotel lobby by early elements of Al Queda.

January 25, 1993: Mir Aimal Kansi, a Pakistani, fires an AK-47 assault rifle into cars waiting at a stoplight in front of the Central Intelligence Agency headquarters, killing two and injuring three others, see FBI Ten Most Wanted Fugitives.

February 26, 1993: World Trade Center bombing kills six and injures over 1000 people, by coalition of five groups: Jamaat Al-Fuqra'/Gamaat Islamiya/Hamas/Islamic Jihad/National Islamic Front,[5] see FBI Most Wanted Terrorists, FBI Ten Most Wanted Fugitives, Ramzi Yousef.

June, 1993: Failed New York City landmark bomb plot, see FBI Most Wanted Terrorists

March 1, 1994: In the Brooklyn Bridge Shooting, Rashid Baz kills a Hasidic seminary student and wounds four on the Brooklyn Bridge in New York City in response to the Cave of the Patriarchs massacre.

March 5, 1994: In Salt Lake City, Utah, a gunman with a homemade bomb held several people hostage in the downtown public library. Police mortally wound the gunman before he is able to kill any hostages.

July 27, 1996: Centennial Olympic Park bombing, killing two and wounding 111.

February 24, 1997: Ali Abu Kamal opens fire on tourists at an observation deck atop the Empire State Building in New York City, killing a Danish national and wounding visitors from the United States, Argentina, Switzerland and France before turning the gun on himself. A handwritten note carried by the gunman claims this was a punishment attack against the "enemies of Palestine". His widow claimed he became suicidal after losing $300,000 in a business venture. In a 2007 interview with the New York Daily News his daughter said her mother's story was a cover crafted by the Palestinian Authority and that her father wanted to punish the United States for its support of Israel.

December 14, 1999: Ahmed Ressam is arrested on the United States-Canada border in Port Angeles, Washington; he confessed to planning to bomb the Los Angeles International Airport as part of the 2000 millennium attack plots

December 31, 1999 An arson fire causes one million dollars in damage and destroys the fourth floor of Michigan State University's Agriculture Hall. In 2008 four people that the U.S. government claimed were Earth Liberation Front members were indicted for that incident.

April 30, 2000 The Earth Liberation Front (ELF) claimed responsibility for causing over $500,000 in damages to construction equipment in Elettsville, Indiana. Fourteen pieces of logging and construction equipment were destroyed by the perpetrators, who filled gas tanks with sand, cut fuel and hydraulic lines and set a tractor-trailer filled with wood chips on fire. Graffiti found at the scene read, "Go develop in Hell," "ELF" and "This machine is evil." The equipment was being used for a state-run project to build a four-lane highway in the area. In their written statement, the group writes, "the government and developers are mad with greed and there will be no limit to what they destroy until we take away the profit from their schemes."

September 11: Attacks kill 2,973, and many more later from exposure to toxic dust in a series of hijacked airliner crashes into two U.S. landmarks: the World Trade Center in New York City, New York, and The Pentagon in Arlington, Virginia. A fourth plane, originally intended to hit the United States Capitol Building, crashes in Somerset County, Pennsylvania, after an apparent revolt against the hijackers by the plane's passengers.

Anthrax attacks on the offices the United States Congress and New York State Government offices, and on employees of television networks and tabloids.

December 12: Jewish Defense League plot by Chairman Irv Rubin and follower Earl Krugel to blow up the King Fahd Mosque in Culver City, California, and the office of Lebanese-American Rep. Darrell Issa, foiled.

December 22: 2001 shoe bomb plot.

July 4, 2002: An Egyptian gunman opens fire at an El Al ticket counter in Los Angeles International Airport, killing two Israelis before being killed himself.

2001 invasion of afghanistan
2003 invasion of Iraq (March 19–May 1, 2003)

zero attacks on us soil in 2003 and 2004, 2005

2006, Mohammed Reza Taheri-azar, an Iranian-born graduate of the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, drives an SUV onto a crowded part of campus, injuring nine.

2006, A major anti-terrorist operation by British Police disrupts an alleged bomb plot targeting multiple airplanes bound for the United States flying through Heathrow Airport, near London.

2006, An Afghani Muslim hit 19 pedestrians, killing one, with his SUV in the San Francisco Bay area.

2006,Federal Agents disrupt Derrick Shareef’s attack on an Illinois shopping mall planned for December 22. His intent was to commit “violent jihad” just before Christmas

May 7, 2007, A group of six radical Islamist men, allegedly plotting to stage an attack on the Fort Dix military base in New Jersey, were arrested by the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) on.

2008 A bomb goes off outside an empty military recruiting station in Times Square.

2009, Nigerian Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab attempts to detonate an explosive on an aircraft enroute from Amsterdam to Detroit. During the incident, the suspect ignites himself on fire until he is extinguished and overpowered by two passengers. The aircraft lands safely in Detroit with the only injuries reported to be the suspect himself and two others.

2010, New York City, New York, United States New York's Times Square was evacuated after the discovery of a car bomb.[46] US government believes radical Islamists in the Pakistani Taliban directed the plot, and may have financed it