Ikea's Third World outsourcing adventure -- in the U.S

whiteonion · 12-04-2011 04:39PM #1

Ikea has built it's first factory in the United States, it should come as no surprise since wealthy countries usually ship off their factories to third world nations. This is yet more proof that America is rapidly deteriorating into a third world nation. This factory would not be able to operate in Sweden because it would be illegal to operate that kind of sweatshop in Sweden. http://www.salon.com/technology/how_the_world_works/2011/04/11/ikea_s_third_world_outsourcing_adventure_in_the_united_states You America lovers do you think that Ireland should follow its example and get rid of worker rights and get everyone to work for €6.50 per hour?

Sheeps · 12-04-2011 04:41PM

Yes, America is a third world country because they have an ikea factory. Well done, you absolute genius.

El Horseboxo · 12-04-2011 04:41PM

Probably a shít load of people who'd work for 6.50 an hour.

thebigbiffo · 12-04-2011 04:42PM

i'd hire a contractor at €6.50 an hour to put the stuff together - f'ucking ikea

Hookah · 12-04-2011 04:43PM

Sheeps wrote: »

Yes, America is a third world country because they have an ikea factory. Well done, you absolute genius.

In Sweden, IKEA plant workers start at $19/hr, get 5 weeks vacation and are unionized. In Danville VA, they start at $8/hr and get 12 days vacation (8 picked by IKEA), have mandatory overtime and required meetings discouraging union membership. (reddit)

I'd imagine this is the reason.

krudler · 12-04-2011 04:45PM

How much do the people who put the instructions for a tv stand into a bookshelf box get paid?

whiteonion · 12-04-2011 04:46PM

Sheeps wrote: »

Yes, America is a third world country because they have an ikea factory. Well done, you absolute genius.

If you would read the article you can see that the working conditions are horrible. Would you want the future of your children to be in a sweatshop like that?

Sergeant · 12-04-2011 04:46PM

It could also be to save on transport costs and allow new products to reach stores as quickly as possible. Zara and H&M are two clothing retailers who manufacture some of their range in Europe for these reasons.

sollar · 12-04-2011 04:48PM

Very interesting article. $8 per hour and 12 days off a year is brutal.

I notice the staff in sweden get 5 weeks holidays and no less than €19.

Good luck to the US staff i hope they get the union in

Sykk · 12-04-2011 04:49PM

whiteonion wrote: »

This is yet more proof that America is rapidly deteriorating into a third world nation.

LOL!

whiteonion · 12-04-2011 04:50PM

sollar wrote: »

Very interesting article. $8 per hour and 12 days off a year is brutal.

I notice the staff in sweden get 5 weeks holidays and no less than €19.

Good luck to the US staff i hope they get the union in

Capitalism is great and Swedish style socialism is horrible. Imagine being able to have 5 weeks off every year, get a decent wage and be treated like a human being at work?

Oh my GOD, THE HORROR, THE HORROR!

lcrcboy · 12-04-2011 04:50PM

oh great another America bashing thread :rolleyes:

General Zod · 12-04-2011 04:50PM

Sheeps wrote: »

Yes, America is a third world country because they have an ikea factory. Well done, you absolute genius.

RTFA.

Ikea staff in the US are being treated disparitavely to workers in Ikea Sweden, and the reasons being used to explain this are the same ones that American multinationals use to justify dodgy labour practices in 3rd world countries.

Ikea in the US are trying to prevent their staff organising a union and have 12 vacation days (8 of which are on company specified days)
IKEA in Sweden have a very good union with decent pay and 5 weeks vacation time.

Staff in the US are geing paid 6 dollars an hour (even less for the temp agency staff). Their corresponding staff in Sweden get $19 an hour.

No doubt we'll get the YAY capitalism RUIGHT TO WROK!!!! dimrods along shortly.

Sheeps · 12-04-2011 04:54PM

Hookah wrote: »

In Sweden, IKEA plant workers start at $19/hr, get 5 weeks vacation and are unionized. In Danville VA, they start at $8/hr and get 12 days vacation (8 picked by IKEA), have mandatory overtime and required meetings discouraging union membership. (reddit)

I'd imagine this is the reason.

If you earn $8/hr and it is considered a low wage because someone else where in the world earns double what you earn for the same job, you are not living in a 3rd world country.

Also they are not outsourcing. The plant in America I would imagine is there because it makes more logistical sense to manufacture and supply the American furniture market in America rather than build in Sweden and ship to America.

whiteonion · 12-04-2011 04:54PM

Child labour seems to be very common in the agricultural sector of America.
http://www.rnw.nl/english/article/child-labour-us-dangerous-double-standard

Normally Child labour is something that you associate with third world countries.

The collapse of the middle class, the high deficits, the militarism, everything points toward one thing. America is becoming a third world country.

aidan24326 · 12-04-2011 04:55PM

America is hardly a third world country but parts of it are certainly quite poor. Bear in mind that if you meet an American tourist or happen to work with an American that automatically puts them in the minority of Americans who own a passport, and the smaller minority still who actually travel abroad. Which also implies that they're probably middle-class American, reasonably well educated etc. You simply don't get to meet Chuck and Molly Sue from Kentucky because they don't leave the country, and most likely don't even own a passport.

jackiebaron · 12-04-2011 04:57PM

lcrcboy wrote: »

oh great another America bashing thread :rolleyes:

Well, if they come along and say that America is the land of milk and honey and numero uno and the greatest in the history of the fcuking galaxy and all this other sh!t and all the while their economy is down the crapper, their infant mortality rate is worse than Mexico's, they have more blacks behind bars than were slaves, they're getting their asses handed to them in foreign wars and their labour force is a sweatshop operation then yeah....I think a few uncomfortable facts should be pointed out.

Truth hurts, huh?

Sheeps · 12-04-2011 04:58PM

jackiebaron wrote: »

Well, if they come along and say that America is the land of milk and honey and numero uno and the greatest in the history of the fcuking galaxy and all this other sh!t and all the while their economy is down the crapper, their infant mortality rate is worse than Mexico's, they have more blacks behind bars than were slaves, they're getting their asses handed to them in foreign wars and their labour force is a sweatshop operation then yeah....I think a few uncomfortable facts should be pointed out.

Truth hurts, huh?

This post is so dumb it actually hurts.

TheZohanS · 12-04-2011 04:59PM

This might explain some of the difference in wages.

seamus · 12-04-2011 04:59PM

Not really comparable. Swedish workers on average pay 30% of their salary in tax. Americans pay 18%.

Considerably higher pay rates reflect a much higher cost of living in Sweden than in the US.

Swedish workers get a legally required 25 days.

This is nothing to do with unionism or third-world-ness.

The GDP of the United States is still higher than Sweden's, despite what appears to be very high rates of pay.

Comparing pay rates and employment directly between countries is no basis for any kind of economic comparison. If a piece of toast cost $1,000,000 in Sweden and workers received $50,000,000 per hour, all that would really say is that Americans are getting some really cheap toast.

jackiebaron · 12-04-2011 05:01PM

Sheeps wrote: »

If you earn $8/hr and it is considered a low wage because someone else where in the world earns double what you earn for the same job, you are not living in a 3rd world country.

Also they are not outsourcing. The plant in America I would imagine is there because it makes more logistical sense to manufacture and supply the American furniture market in America rather than build in Sweden and ship to America.

Wait till that wage hasn't moved upwards in 2 years yet inflation has doubled the price of everything. If it's not 3 rd World now in the US it's headed that was
40,000 below the poverty definitely isn't FIRST WORLD!

aidan24326 · 12-04-2011 05:02PM

Bear in mind also that worker rights in general in the US are nothing like what we have here. I used to work for a US multinational, and when they needed to cut a few thousand from the payroill, they cut most of those staff in the US, even though they have significant operations all over the world. Because US workers do not have any automatic entitlement to redundancy pay, there were people who had worked for the company for as much as 15 years who were just let go, see you and thanks alot. At least here after that long in a company you'd walk away with a nice few quid to tide you over. They also tend to have a much stricter approach to taking sick leave than we do here, you'll get fired much more easily.

whiteonion · 12-04-2011 05:03PM

seamus wrote: »

Not really comparable. Swedish workers on average pay 30% of their salary in tax. Americans pay 18%.

Considerably higher pay rates reflect a much higher cost of living in Sweden than in the US.

Swedish workers get a legally required 25 days.

This is nothing to do with unionism or third-world-ness.

The GDP of the United States is still higher than Sweden's, despite what appears to be very high rates of pay.

Comparing pay rates and employment directly between countries is no basis for any kind of economic comparison. If a piece of toast cost $1,000,000 in Sweden and workers received $50,000,000 per hour, all that would really say is that Americans are getting some really cheap toast.

Ehm you don't think the Unions had anything to do with making 25 days of holidays a law? The GDP is higher yes, but people on average are better off in Sweden.

seamus · 12-04-2011 05:04PM

jackiebaron wrote: »

40,000 below the poverty definitely isn't FIRST WORLD!

40,000 below the poverty line in a country of 300 million most definitely is a first world country.

Ehm you don't think the Unions had anything to do with making 25 days of holidays a law?

I don't know the intricacies of Swedish employment history, but I imagine like most countries, unions secured a handful of days back when there was no employment law, but later jumps in the number of days was done without union intervention, in line with similar increases elsewhere in Europe by libertarian party policies.

The GDP is higher yes, but people on average are better off in Sweden.

Proof? Cite?

Hookah · 12-04-2011 05:07PM

It's a little more than 40,000 I think.

How many people were poor in 2009?

In 2009, 14.3 percent of all persons lived in poverty. In 1993 the poverty rate was 15.1 percent. Between 1993 and 2000, the poverty rate fell each year, reaching 11.3 percent in 2000

http://www.npc.umich.edu/poverty/

speedboatchase · 12-04-2011 05:08PM

Aside from a really obtuse way of bashing America and lauding leftist paradise Sweden, why was this thread actually created? There's so much America-bashing in AH these days

Sheeps · 12-04-2011 05:10PM

jackiebaron wrote: »

Wait till that wage hasn't moved upwards in 2 years yet inflation has doubled the price of everything. If it's not 3 rd World now in the US it's headed that was
40,000 below the poverty definitely isn't FIRST WORLD!

Please, stop posting.

That's 0.013% of the population. In Ireland in 2009 5.5% of the population were in poverty. Ireland is not a 3rd world country.

whiteonion · 12-04-2011 05:11PM

seamus wrote: »

40,000 below the poverty line in a country of 300 million most definitely is a first world country.
I don't know the intricacies of Swedish employment history, but I imagine like most countries, unions secured a handful of days back when there was no employment law, but later jumps in the number of days was done without union intervention, in line with similar increases elsewhere in Europe by libertarian party policies.
Proof? Cite?

Look at the levels of crime, poverty, obesity, teenage pregnancies, mental health issues and so on. Google it.

I myself have been to America and once you get outside the fancy flashy city centres it's mostly a kip really. Now compare this to Sweden where the people enjoy one of the most highest standards of living in the world.

aidan24326 · 12-04-2011 05:11PM

seamus wrote: »

40,000 below the poverty line in a country of 300 million most definitely is a first world country.

Don't know where he pulled that figure from but I'd bet my bottom dollar that there is a hell of alot more than 40,000 people in the US living in what could be classed as poverty. Hurricane Katrina opened a can of worms in that respect, and showed a side of America that I think they'd rather the world didn't see. The New Orleans area had thousands of people who were very poor, had next to nothing (and no doubt less than nothing afterwards). And that's just one city. What you have in the US is a massive disparity between the small amount of haves and the very large amount of have nots, between Fifth Avenue and the trailer park. I know every country has class divide but I'm not sure there's anywhere that it's more pronounced.

whiteonion · 12-04-2011 05:11PM

Sheeps wrote: »

Please, stop posting.

That's 0.013% of the population. In Ireland in 2009 5.5% of the population were in poverty. Ireland is not a 3rd world country.

The horses running through council estates and all the poorly built houses make me doubt what you are saying is true.

seamus · 12-04-2011 05:18PM

Hookah wrote: »

It's a little more than 40,000 I think.

Thanks, I'm guessing he means 40 million, which would be closer to the 10%-ish figure.

No worse than countries like Denmark or the UK.

And whiteonion, claims that Irish council estates are indicator of a 3rd-world country just goes to show what a privileged and blinkered life you've led.

It's an insult to those in real poverty that you consider poor standard council housing, the dole and running around on horses in green fields without fear of persecution or murder to be "poverty".

Ikea's Third World outsourcing adventure -- in the U.S

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