Garda Siochana in Shell to sea sex shocker

prinz · 05-04-2011 07:55PM

RayM wrote: »

The fact remains that there is a very clear "Consequences" option on the poll, and only a minority of people selected it.

Yet almost twice as many chose that than chose any other options.

mikom · 05-04-2011 07:57PM

finty wrote: »

Its almost as if they spent the last few days strategizing how to create the most publicity from it.....

Probably seeking legal advice as well.

_feedback_ · 05-04-2011 07:59PM

finty wrote: »

Interesting that the protesters decided to release it on the internet and to the media before reporting it to the ombudsman.

and all nearly a week after the incident. Its almost as if they spent the last few days strategizing how to create the most publicity from it.....

Sure, she was in shock :pac:

The Examiner wrote:

“I think in the beginning it was just shock but because I’ve had to listen to it many times it seems to get more disturbing the more I hear it,” she said.

“It’s terrifying for campaigners but it’s much more serious for women living in the area.

Link

She mustn't have been that worried about the women in the area if she waited that long while planning what to do with it.

SnowY32 · 05-04-2011 08:01PM

153 people who voted are gardai lol

jill_valentine · 05-04-2011 08:02PM

finty wrote: »

Interesting that the protesters decided to release it on the internet and to the media before reporting it to the ombudsman.

and all nearly a week after the incident. Its almost as if they spent the last few days strategizing how to create the most publicity from it.....

No doubt. Largely irrelevant to the matter at hand, however.

Killer Pigeon · 05-04-2011 08:02PM

It really annoys me when some attention seeking D4 "activists" makes something big out of nothing and wastes the valuable time of the judiciary (including the time of the Minister for Justice) with their nonsense. FFS, from what you hear in the video it seems that none of the protestors were even in the car at the time; they didn't say it with the intention of the protesters even hearing it. All you hear is a couple of male Gardaí joking amongst themselves while passing the time on a trip back to the Garda station, in fact most of their conversation in the car was quite professional in content apart from that little hiccup. There's no real question here about policing standards, when they did confront the protestors they confronted them in a professional manner - the way they should have. If I was in a position of authority, the most I would give these Gardaí is a small slap on the wrist and then forget about it.

_feedback_ · 05-04-2011 08:04PM

jill_valentine wrote: »

No doubt. Largely irrelevant to the matter at hand, however.

How is the way they used the information irrelevant?

prinz · 05-04-2011 08:10PM

jill_valentine wrote: »

No doubt. Largely irrelevant to the matter at hand, however.

Surely the more publicity there is this is exactly what's going to cause the very issue you were complaining about earlier? I.E. causing a lack of faith in the gardaí amongst real victims..

DublinWriter · 05-04-2011 08:10PM

Tell you what guys, how about I install covert recording equipment in your place of work and residence? What do you think I'd find you saying? An off-colour or politically-correct remark? A personal jibe-at your boss?

The Shell-to-Sea guys have basically shot themselves in the foot with this.

For starters, we have a non-national who has travelled to this country with the sole and express purpose of political protest and who refused to give her name to a guard when requested.

In America, that would be orange boiler-suit time followed by enforced repatriation and not an hour down at the local cop-shop for tea and digestives and eventual release without charge.

Listen to the first fifteen minutes of that video. The various members were discussing the how the two women were posing a threat to public safety, causing an obstruction to traffic and how litigious the whole system is in regards to them not dealing with the situation correctly. I didn't see that part sub-titled, did you?

I have a relation who worked in the coroners office and you wouldn't believe the high-jinx that goes on there just to keep themselves sane.

As far as I'm aware the protesters didn't even bother to lodge official complaints with either the guards or the Garda Ombudsman. In fact the Office of the Ombudsman may even find itself acting ultra-vires in respect of this as they decided to launch an investigation on their own initiative.

Instead the protesters went straight to the media and played the sensationalist card and as we all know nothing sells a newspaper more than the word 'RAPE!' screaming across the banner headline.

Shame on the Shell-to-Sea people for this.

mikemac · 05-04-2011 08:10PM

SnowY32 wrote: »

153 people who voted are gardai lol

This isn't youtube

jill_valentine · 05-04-2011 08:11PM

elviscostello wrote: »

How is the way they used the information irrelevant?

Because regardless of how they presented the facts, facts they remain. The Guards said what they said, and that's not diminished by the fact that I find the protestors involved highly objectionable.

I have objected elsewhere to how this has been spun by the far left. I think it's grotesquely cynical and irresponsible to draw an equivalence between this case and what we've heard from Libya and Bahrain - as Worker's Solidarity has attempted to do - for instance; or to imply by innuendo that the threat of rape was used as an interrogative tool, which it clearly wasn't.

emptybladder · 05-04-2011 08:12PM

MOD EDIT. Don't drag other forums in here please.

Dionysus · 05-04-2011 08:12PM

emptybladder wrote: »

Me just loves the double standards on AH.

Jokes about paedophilia, rape, Madeline McCann etc are all perfectly acceptable.

And then the Shell to Sea recording causes outrage.

Am I missing something?

Yes, alas. Did it ever occur to you that there is no double standard but rather the same people who are trying to defend the "jokes" of these members of AGS are most likely the same sort of people who tolerate the above jokes? Did this occur to you for even a second - or is AH in your eyes some monolithic community.

LostinKildare · 05-04-2011 08:14PM

DublinWriter wrote: »

For starters, we have a non-national who has travelled to this country with the sole and express purpose of political protest.

How do you know this? Seriously, do you have a link for this?

prinz · 05-04-2011 08:15PM

SnowY32 wrote: »

153 people who voted are gardai lol

Ah now, neo-facist-pig-blueshirt-moron-boggers is the preferred nomenclature dude.

Guill · 05-04-2011 08:17PM

What if it was three priests in a car joking about rape and they were recorded doing so????

I'd say a lot of people would have different opinions.

These Guards have breached a code of ethics, which if i was found doing in work i would be subject to heavy diciplinary action. Possibly even get the door for.

_feedback_ · 05-04-2011 08:18PM

jill_valentine wrote: »

Because regardless of how they presented the facts, facts they remain. The Guards said what they said, and that's not diminished by the fact that I find the protestors involved highly objectionable.

But, you said that this will have a damaging effect on how rape victims percieve the Gardai, who are their first point of contact after assault. So would it not have been better for the ladies to report this to the Ombudsman and let them deal with it? The is not an issue with the whole force, this is a couple of lads in Mayo who cracked a silly joke.

It is very relevant how they made sure this went very public, and it is that which will cause any damaging effects on the way the Gardai are portrayed in relation to their members attitude to sex crime.

Sibylla · 05-04-2011 08:18PM

If this tape is found to be accurate this is completely unacceptable disgraceful behavior. I for one am personally disgusted members of AGS would speak to members of the public in this fashion. I can only imagine how frightened the women in question were, Gardai and all people in a position of power should never speak like this. It sends out a terrible message and should be dealt with harshly.

_feedback_ · 05-04-2011 08:20PM

Sibylla wrote: »

If this tape is found to be accurate this is completely unacceptable disgraceful behavior. I for one am personally disgusted members of AGS would speak to members of the public in this fashion. I can only imagine how frightened the women in question were, Gardai and all people in a position of power should never speak like this. It sends out a terrible message and should be dealt with harshly.

They didn't speak to them like that. Read the story please!!! :rolleyes:

prinz · 05-04-2011 08:22PM

Sibylla wrote: »

If this tape is found to be accurate this is completely unacceptable disgraceful behavior. I for one am personally disgusted members of AGS would speak to members of the public in this fashion. I can only imagine how frightened the women in question were, Gardai and all people in a position of power should never speak like this. It sends out a terrible message and should be dealt with harshly.

It never ends. The only people the gardaí spoke to, were themselves, no members of the public, not the women involved, nobody but a couple of gardaí.

jill_valentine · 05-04-2011 08:24PM

Hang on elviscostello, I get you now.

The thread is discussing Gardai comments, actions and consequences in relation to this matter, and I do think that's more important because ultimately the Guards are a more significant force in wider society. I was concerned that the discussion was about to derail into a hippy bashing AH fest if given the chance.

But no, I don't like how the protestors went about this either. Thing is, while I don't need to find reasons to dislike hippies - I already dislike hippies - I do demand a higher standard from the public servants I pay to keep me and my loved ones safe.

Eric Cartman · 05-04-2011 08:26PM

While what the gardai said was indeed unnaceptable, the shell 2 sea loopers are now sitting there knocking one out to the publicity this has given them , I do not condone what the gardai said (except for the reference to a 'krusty camp' and 'you wouldnt know what youd get off her' that part is true) It was lads having a laugh but they should have copped on a bit more. However , I think everyone should ignore it and everyone except the garda ombudsman should forget about it (like there was no need to have that auld wan from the rape crisis centre on the rte news flapping her gums about it)

the more we talk about it, the more those looper hippys get publicity , and the last thing we want is the one or two of them that dont have the IQ of a brain damaged cricket figuring out they can use this as a PR motive to get their frankly WRONG views and their violent abusive tactics some publicity

Im all for people having an opinion , I dont know if there is a god, I dont know if drugs should definitley be legal or not , I dont know if its a good or bad idea for gay couples to adopt or if ghosts exist , but I know shell 2 sea are wrong, they just are wrong, all of the time wrong wrong wrong, its bullshít

eco2live · 05-04-2011 08:28PM

They should be sacked. We don't need people like that with their disgusting attitude to women in the Guards.

I would say the Guards girlfriends, wifes and family are sick. Its not just a case of the camera being left on and them being caught. Total sickner!

When I first heard this story I thought it was just some innocent banter but after I heard the tape it is easy to hear that these jokers are sexist pigs. The girl was very distressed and they their degrading and bullying remarks even to each other about her told you in no uncertain terms what they thought of her. No concern for her at all. Seen as an object.

RayM · 05-04-2011 08:28PM

prinz wrote: »

Yet almost twice as many chose that than chose any other options.

Sorry, I'm still seeing 44% beside the 'disciplinary procedures' option. It's 'first past the post' and common sense is lagging behind.

elviscostello wrote:

The is not an issue with the whole force, this is a couple of lads in Mayo who cracked a silly joke.

They're not a couple of lads. They're a couple of on-duty members of An Garda Siochana, joking about forcing a female suspect to have sex with them.

DublinWriter · 05-04-2011 08:29PM

Guill wrote: »

These Guards have breached a code of ethics, which if i was found doing in work i would be subject to heavy diciplinary action. Possibly even get the door for.

Really? Which one? I wasn't aware that 'thought-crime' was an offence by the Garda Code?

The level of hypocrisy and misinformation about this incident is staggering.

_feedback_ · 05-04-2011 08:29PM

jill_valentine wrote: »

Hang on elviscostello, I get you now.

The thread is discussing Gardai comments, actions and consequences in relation to this matter, and I do think that's more important because ultimately the Guards are a more significant force in wider society. I was concerned that the discussion was about to derail into a hippy bashing AH fest if given the chance.

But no, I don't like how the protestors went about this either. Thing is, while I don't need to find reasons to dislike hippies - I already dislike hippies - I do demand a higher standard from the public servants I pay to keep me and my loved ones safe.

That's fair enough, but a very large part of the damage to the perception of the Gardai by potential victims is down to the protestors. The couple of lads in the squad car were being silly, but if the protestors were sincerely worried about potential rape victims and local women (like they say they were) they would have reported it in the correct way.

The relevant people could have been dealt with, without all the hysteria.

RayM wrote: »

They're not a couple of lads. They're a couple of on-duty members of An Garda Siochana, joking about forcing a female suspect to have sex with them.

They're also just a couple of lads.

eco2live · 05-04-2011 08:31PM

Hippies are sound

My name is URL · 05-04-2011 08:31PM

emptybladder wrote: »

Me just loves the double standards on AH.

Jokes about paedophilia, rape, Madeline McCann etc are all perfectly acceptable.

And then the Shell to Sea recording causes outrage.

Am I missing something?

Yes, context.

And I wouldn't say that finding the comments made by the Gardai to be unprofessional, unedifying and damaging is 'outrage', what's outrageous is the people saying that it's none of those things.

galwayrush · 05-04-2011 08:31PM

If this turns out to be true, the gardai involved deserve to be sacked at the very least.
Otherwise...YAWNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN

prinz · 05-04-2011 08:33PM

galwayrush wrote: »

If this turns out to be true, the gardai involved deserve to be sacked at the very least.

What would the very most be?

Garda Siochana in Shell to sea sex shocker

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