Its official : public sector pay per hour is 49% higher than private sector

sarumite · 18-03-2011 12:17PM

erictheviking1 wrote: »

Yeah Right!:D You made that up.:)
Anyway,Sweden has a much more even distribution of wealth. Outside Stockholm, the cost of living is lower than even the UK. Property is much cheaper, schooling much better, the sick and elderly looked after. So again, its not like for like.
As for Hospital Doctors in Ireland, You only ever see foreign Doctors and students. I've no idea what they earn, but if the pay is so good why are they all emigrating? They seem to come back after they gain experience elsewhere to become GP's. and why not, when you can earn 60 lids for a 5 minute consultation. Nice!

Gotta call bull**** on that one...I live in Gothenburg and the cost of living there is higher than Dublin (and yes, I am from Dublin so I know the cost of living here)

sarumite · 18-03-2011 12:28PM

Count Dooku wrote: »

Today it was EUR 1 = SEK 8.9905 and I forgot to mention that data was about monthly gross

I must admit I stopped checking when I converted my euro at 8.9 something, but that sounds about right. Pretty steep decline from 10.5 when I first arrived in Sweden at the start of 2010.

noodler · 18-03-2011 04:33PM

ardmacha wrote: »

This is a typical lazy and dishonest article. It does not factor the effect of the pension levy and any discussion of pay cuts that does not is simply dishonest. It is lazy because there is nothing remarkable about the private sector suffering more in a recession. Firstly the recession was caused in the first place by the private sector where get rich quick construction schemes have gone bust. But also because demand for things such as law enforcement, health and education do not tend to vary much over time, so neither expand or contract greatly in economic cycles. Demand for many ephemeral activities in the private sector largely disappears when there is a recession.

Where to start:

1) No, we would have a recession whether or not we had a banking crisis. The banking crisis simply made it worse.

2) When you say the private sector caused the recession, to whom to you refer? The couple of hundred boards of directors, management etc in the banks who pursued poor policies? Hardly representative

3) If you wanted to persist with apportioning the same blame to a handful of bankers as to the 1.5bn currently working in the private sector then couldn't one take such a blatantly childish argument to extremes and blame those in the Department of Finance? Those in the PS who took out stupid mortgages on wages which the country could not possibly sustain? Or could we go and blame the various unions within the PS who clamoured for increases in wages whilst times were good, thus leaving us with a larger deficit now tha it otherwise would have been?

Honestly, you can't benefit from this boom and then simply blame the BIG BAD PRIVATE sector when the question of trimming the massive pay and pension nills comes around.

All morality aside, the Government lost alot of money over the past 3 or 4 years, like any company it had (and still has to) to reduce its outgoings. The guy working in retail didn't cause the recession either but still lost his job because of it.

noodler · 18-03-2011 04:39PM

sarumite wrote: »

Gotta call bull**** on that one...I live in Gothenburg and the cost of living there is higher than Dublin (and yes, I am from Dublin so I know the cost of living here)

For what it is worth, and I don't think anyone quoted it yet, but the HICP in Finland as of February 2011 was 113.6 whilst it was 106.1 in Ireland.

The main thing the HICP excludes is mortgage interest though - but I don't think that is what people in the thread were referring to in this 'cost of living' argument.

Eurostat

erictheviking1 · 18-03-2011 06:29PM

sarumite wrote: »

Gotta call bull**** on that one...I live in Gothenburg and the cost of living there is higher than Dublin (and yes, I am from Dublin so I know the cost of living here)

http://www.expatistan.com/cost-of-living/comparison/dublin/gothenburg

ardmacha · 18-03-2011 06:31PM

Welease wrote: »

If that were strictly true (in terms of avoiding a contraction now), then we shouldn't have seen an increase in overall PS numbers during the "boom" either....

The population of the State increased by 17% between 2000 and 2009, many public services have demand related to population and so could be expected to increase as in consequence. Numbers of students in education increased even more rapidly than this, so that we have the situation where the real spending per student in third level dropped in the "boom" as the increase in spending was less than the increase in the number of students. Things like the increased number of OAPs may have had implications for staff numbers in the pension section or in the HSE.

I am not denying that the PS acquired some surplus staff in the boom, but any analysis of staff numbers has to take into account things like population increase or student participation increases. And as K_mac said the numbers in education or the numbers in public health may increase in a recession.

Quite simply I am anti-rant and pro some attempt to actually measure things. The Bertie Aherne approach to analysis, common here, does nobody any good.

When you say the private sector caused the recession, to whom to you refer? The couple of hundred boards of directors, management etc in the banks who pursued poor policies? Hardly representative

Banks did the worst damage, but other businesses overextended themselves too, notably many in the building trade.

Those in the PS who took out stupid mortgages on wages which the country could not possibly sustain? Or could we go and blame the various unions within the PS who clamoured for increases in wages whilst times were good, thus leaving us with a larger deficit now tha it otherwise would have been?

The government and private sector "experts" declared the boom to exist, that being the case it is entirely reasonable for unions to seek pay rises. The 14% pay cut in the PS has removed that boom premium.

The guy working in retail didn't cause the recession either but still lost his job because of it.

He did, but his employer wasn't selling their goods for nothing as the government is in many cases.

gigino · 19-03-2011 12:38AM

ardmacha wrote: »

Firstly the recession was caused in the first place by the private sector where get rich quick construction schemes have gone bust.

Recession caused by the private sector - you are tarring the 1800,000 people in the private sectow with causing the recession ? lol I suppose you blame the Jews for Hitlers rise to Power ?

Last time I looked the government, the Central bank and the regulator were responsible for running, controlling and regulating the economy. They can + should make laws + enforce them. If they done their job properly we would not be in this mess.

ardmacha wrote: »

But also because demand for things such as law enforcement, health and education do not tend to vary much over time, so neither expand or contract greatly in economic cycles.

so why did spending on the public sector double between 1999 and 2009 ?

bryaner · 19-03-2011 12:53AM

gigino wrote: »

Recession caused by the private sector - you are tarring the 1800,000 people in the private sectow with causing the recession ? lol I suppose you blame the Jews for Hitlers rise to Power ?

Last time I looked the government, the Central bank and the regulator were responsible for running, controlling and regulating the economy. They can + should make laws + enforce them. If they done their job properly we would not be in this mess.

so why did spending on the public sector double between 1999 and 2009 ?

Oink oink. New material please..:rolleyes:

keithcan · 19-03-2011 12:57AM

gigino wrote: »

Last time I looked the government, the Central bank and the regulator were responsible for running, controlling and regulating the economy. They can + should make laws + enforce them. If they done their job properly we would not be in this mess.

Damn stupid public sector, not being able to stop property developers and bankers from giving in to their desires to profiteer without regard for others...
Gigino, if you ever break any law or even bend them, I hope the 'authorities' do their job and stop you, or else you can sack them.

sarumite · 19-03-2011 02:27AM

erictheviking1 wrote: »

http://www.expatistan.com/cost-of-living/comparison/dublin/gothenburg

Having moved from Dublin to Gothenburg I don't need half assed website to tell me what my bank balance tells me on a regular basis. The cost of living in Gothenburg is higher than Dublin on a day to day basis...whether thats my weekly shopping, few beers etc, it all costs more. To give a direct comparison lets look at video games since they are something refuse to buy in Sweden. The cost of a PS3 new release in Sweden is Sek700-750 wherease in Dublin I can get it for 50-55 depending on where I shop. Admittedly I don't own a house, which perhaps accounts for some discrepencies....though I think its fair to say Irish houses prices went through the roof.

erictheviking1 · 19-03-2011 03:54PM

sarumite wrote: »

Having moved from Dublin to Gothenburg I don't need half assed website to tell me what my bank balance tells me on a regular basis. The cost of living in Gothenburg is higher than Dublin on a day to day basis...whether thats my weekly shopping, few beers etc, it all costs more. To give a direct comparison lets look at video games since they are something refuse to buy in Sweden. The cost of a PS3 new release in Sweden is Sek700-750 wherease in Dublin I can get it for 50-55 depending on where I shop. Admittedly I don't own a house, which perhaps accounts for some discrepencies....though I think its fair to say Irish houses prices went through the roof.

To be fair the cost of rent or a mortgage is by far the biggest expense for most Irish families.The roof over your head is a necessity. A PS3 game is a luxury

erictheviking1 · 19-03-2011 04:01PM

gigino wrote: »

Recession caused by the private sector - you are tarring the 1800,000 people in the private sectow with causing the recession ? lol I suppose you blame the Jews for Hitlers rise to Power ?

Last time I looked the government, the Central bank and the regulator were responsible for running, controlling and regulating the economy. They can + should make laws + enforce them. If they done their job properly we would not be in this mess.

You've got some neck!:rolleyes::D:D
You constantly tar 300,000 people by blaming them all for the actions of a few hundred idiotic TD's and other gob****es who happened to be in positions of power:D

gigino wrote: »

so why did spending on the public sector double between 1999 and 2009 ?

Did it? Would most of that spending be the spending on motorways and other infrastructure where landowners,developers and buiders completely took the piss and fleeced the taxpayer with way over the top prices???
Get yourself a job, Sonny. you've far too much time on your hands!:D

sarumite · 19-03-2011 04:14PM

erictheviking1 wrote: »

To be fair the cost of rent or a mortgage is by far the biggest expense for most Irish families.The roof over your head is a necessity. A PS3 game is a luxury

I still Rent and it takes up 1/4 of my income ....the cost of living for the other 3/4's is higher. To be fair I used a PS3 game because it is an direct like for like comparison, unlike housing which changes value. As I mentioned, my weekly shopping etc is more expensive. Life in Gothenburg costs more on a week to week basis than life in Dublin.

gigino · 19-03-2011 10:09PM

erictheviking1 wrote: »

Did it?

Yes. Spending on public sector pay and pensions doubled between 1999 and 2009. That is not including money spent on capital projects / infrastructure.

Oh, and I have a job, and I'm not your sonny.

gigino · 19-03-2011 10:12PM

erictheviking1 wrote: »

To be fair the cost of rent or a mortgage is by far the biggest expense for most Irish families.The roof over your head is a necessity.

And these have come down a lot more than public sector salaries. A two-bedroom apartment, newly built to all government regulations, and with the benefit of tax incentives, can now be bought in Ireland for only a little bit more than a years average gross public sector pay. Crazy + unsustainable situation.

RichardAnd · 19-03-2011 10:52PM

gigino wrote: »

And these have come down a lot more than public sector salaries. A two-bedroom apartment, newly built to all government regulations, and with the benefit of tax incentives, can now be bought in Ireland for only a little bit more than a years average gross public sector pay. Crazy + unsustainable situation.

And if I had a Euro for every time you brought up this very shaky claim, I could buy one of those apartments.

gigino · 19-03-2011 11:15PM

Actually newly finished apartments are for sale with as low an asking price of € 40,000. This is considerably less than the average public sector annual salary of € 47,000.

http://www.daft.ie/searchnew_development.daft?id=12590

Do not shoot the messenger. Nothing shaky about the above except the absurdity of our public sector wagers being too high, among the highest in the world while we are one of the most bankrupt countries in the world.

bryaner · 20-03-2011 01:29AM

gigino wrote: »

Actually newly finished apartments are for sale with as low an asking price of € 40,000. This is considerably less than the average public sector annual salary of € 47,000.

http://www.daft.ie/searchnew_development.daft?id=12590

Do not shoot the messenger. Nothing shaky about the above except the absurdity of our public sector wagers being too high, among the highest in the world while we are one of the most bankrupt countries in the world.

You really need to get your facts right bud, you haven't got a clue and only repeat the same dribble over and over again..

Boring to say the least..:rolleyes:

gigino · 20-03-2011 01:32AM

bryaner wrote: »

You really need to get your facts right bud, you haven't got a clue and only repeat the same dribble over and over again..

Boring to say the least..:rolleyes:

rather than post a personal attack on me, perhaps you would go for the ball instead and say what part of the post did I get my facts wrong in ?

bryaner · 20-03-2011 01:39AM

gigino wrote: »

rather than post a personal attack on me, perhaps you would go for the ball instead and say what part of the post did I get my facts wrong in ?

Maybe have a look over the last 122 pages..:rolleyes:

gigino · 20-03-2011 01:44AM

in you post no. 1819 you highlighted my post no. 1818 and said I got my facts wrong. Did you look at the link ? Do you think it is wrong ? The facts do not lie.

bryaner · 20-03-2011 02:27AM

gigino wrote: »

in you post no. 1819 you highlighted my post no. 1818 and said I got my facts wrong. Did you look at the link ? Do you think it is wrong ? The facts do not lie.

I'm highlighting all your waffle over 122 pages..

gigino · 20-03-2011 02:33AM

I did not post over 122 pages. You highlighted one of my posts and said I got my facts wrong. I challenge you where in the post I got my facts wrong, I showed you the link, and all you can do is backpeddle and waffle.:D

bryaner · 20-03-2011 02:50AM

gigino wrote: »

I did not post over 122 pages. You highlighted one of my posts and said I got my facts wrong. I challenge you where in the post I got my facts wrong, I showed you the link, and all you can do is backpeddle and waffle.:D

Just one example..;)

Registered User

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Quote:
Originally Posted by gigino
Sorry to have to correct you yet again, but even an auld dog who lives along the border would know which side of the border , petrol and diesel is cheapest on, by observing which side of the border people fill up on. This has been consistently the case over the past 10-15 years, say the lifetime of the dog in question. You really have no excuse for your ignorance. Please check your facts . If you have filled your tank up north and thought it was cheaper, you were done ! You probably bought nappies up north too and thought they were cheaper. Sorry, they can be got cheaper down here now than in Asda.
Anyway, do'nt take my word for it, ask anyone who lives along the border.
Or look at the following AA survey from February.

http://www.aaireland.ie/AA/Motoring-...ol-Prices.aspx

[Irish Petrol Prices : February 2011

AA Surveyed in February (avg. retail price per litre)

Rep. of Ireland : Unleaded petrol 144.5 ; diesel 138.5

GB Sterling : Unleaded petrol (£ 131.9) € 155.8 ; diesel ( £132.5 ) € 156.5

The AA do historical price guides for fuel, you can check that too. Or have a look at any other fuel price survey on the net if you think the AA is in on the conspiracy to lower any current average 47k Irish public sector salary towards the average UK public sector salary of £22 to 23 k.

As you can see its considerably cheaper for petrol / diesel on this side of the border. If misguided public servants like you think otherwise, what else do you get wrong ? Please fill up this side of the border any more. Not only will you keep money circulating in this economy, but the considerable tax involved will go towards paying your own wages, and the rest of us in the public service. And you will save yourself up to a tenner on a tank.
CAN YOU READ I BOUGHT KEROSENE 9C CHEAPER PER LITRE IN THE NORTH

erictheviking1 · 20-03-2011 01:15PM

:rolleyes:

gigino wrote: »

And these have come down a lot more than public sector salaries. A two-bedroom apartment, newly built to all government regulations, and with the benefit of tax incentives, can now be bought in Ireland for only a little bit more than a years average gross public sector pay. Crazy + unsustainable situation.

What a load of bollix!:D:D
Here's the deal Son. A lot of people with a mortgage will have noticed the value of their houses/apartments have plummeted. However, and I will try to explain using one syllable words, the owners of these houses/apartments still have to pay back the original asking price. This means a mortgage takes up a BIG chunk of someone's wages.
Also, with interest rates on the up, people are having to pay more and more every month.
This will increase in the next few years as interest rates rise.This means that the cost of living is going up!:) I repeat! UP!
I would have loved to get my home for a nice price like that and so would everyone else with a family to rear but most ordinary Joe's had to pay much more for a home because of greedy builders, developers,buy to let chancers, golden circle members etc. who drove prices through the f***ing roof. Most of these greedy cnuts have now welched on their debts and left us to carry the f***ing can. These f***ing gimps are the people who have the brass f***ing neck to blame it all on working class people and the unemployed.
I've noticed you seem to give out a lot about the govt. thinking of scrapping section 23 tax breaks. Did you not realise that investments can go DOWN as well as up? The rest of us have to put up with it so why shouldn't you?
As for the whingeing about not qualifying for dole. Why not pay your way by paying class A1 PRSI? Thats what the rest of us have to do!
You Son, are a f***ing begrudger!.
Your rantings are totally baseless and idiotic:D You ignore most peoples views and post in every forum on every subject (No matter what the subject is) With the same old line about the Public sector. when your challenged you ignore it or retort with your now famous catchphrase about the public sector. You pretend to be a public sector worker when it is quite clear your not:(.
I mean lets face it, what worker would post on a boards that he earns too much and needs a paycut:D:D. Think about it son, its ridiculous! I noticed in one forum you posted in the ladies lounge pretending to be a woman:rolleyes:. Just what is your agenda??:D:D

Rant over! Now! ...
Dear God. Please let this f***ing thread die!
Its like f***ing Groundhog Day!

bryaner · 20-03-2011 07:53PM

erictheviking1 wrote: »

:rolleyes:

What a load of bollix!:D:D
Here's the deal Son. A lot of people with a mortgage will have noticed the value of their houses/apartments have plummeted. However, and I will try to explain using one syllable words, the owners of these houses/apartments still have to pay back the original asking price. This means a mortgage takes up a BIG chunk of someone's wages.
Also, with interest rates on the up, people are having to pay more and more every month.
This will increase in the next few years as interest rates rise.This means that the cost of living is going up!:) I repeat! UP!
I would have loved to get my home for a nice price like that and so would everyone else with a family to rear but most ordinary Joe's had to pay much more for a home because of greedy builders, developers,buy to let chancers, golden circle members etc. who drove prices through the f***ing roof. Most of these greedy cnuts have now welched on their debts and left us to carry the f***ing can. These f***ing gimps are the people who have the brass f***ing neck to blame it all on working class people and the unemployed.
I've noticed you seem to give out a lot about the govt. thinking of scrapping section 23 tax breaks. Did you not realise that investments can go DOWN as well as up? The rest of us have to put up with it so why shouldn't you?
As for the whingeing about not qualifying for dole. Why not pay your way by paying class A1 PRSI? Thats what the rest of us have to do!
You Son, are a f***ing begrudger!.
Your rantings are totally baseless and idiotic:D You ignore most peoples views and post in every forum on every subject (No matter what the subject is) With the same old line about the Public sector. when your challenged you ignore it or retort with your now famous catchphrase about the public sector. You pretend to be a public sector worker when it is quite clear your not:(.
I mean lets face it, what worker would post on a boards that he earns too much and needs a paycut:D:D. Think about it son, its ridiculous! I noticed in one forum you posted in the ladies lounge pretending to be a woman:rolleyes:. Just what is your agenda??:D:D

Rant over! Now! ...
Dear God. Please let this f***ing thread die!
Its like f***ing Groundhog Day!

Well said he's hardly idiotic enough to come back with more tripe is he??

Idbatterim · 20-03-2011 11:52PM

I would have loved to get my home for a nice price like that and so would everyone else with a family to rear but most ordinary Joe's had to pay much more for a home because of greedy builders, developers,buy to let chancers, golden circle members etc. who drove prices through the f***ing roof.

wasnt it the buyers that pushed prices through the roof?

bryaner · 21-03-2011 12:44AM

Idbatterim wrote: »

wasnt it the buyers that pushed prices through the roof?

ECB helped along the way!

gigino · 21-03-2011 01:20AM

bryaner wrote: »

ECB helped along the way!

and according to my stalker erictheviking ( and I am certainly not his son...he may have sons he does not know about but I am certainly not his son....when he assumes things, he makes an ASS out of himself as usual ) it was neither of the above, it was neither of the above, it was " greedy builders, developers,buy to let chancers, golden circle members etc. who drove prices through the f***ing roof" lol. Blame everyone but himself. Well now people have the opportunity in Ireland to buy a 2 bedroom newly built apartment for well less than a years average public sector salary !
Guess what ? He's still not happy
http://www.daft.ie/searchnew_development.daft?id=12590

What other country in the world could you buy a fine 2 bedroom apartment for €7,000 less than a years average public sector salary?

N.B. I am only too well aware that many people have mortgages from 4 , 6 or 8 years ago. In fact some of my colleagues have multiple mortgages, from holiday homes or investment properties etc. Others have no mortgages.

Vizzy · 21-03-2011 01:25AM

bryaner wrote: »

Well said he's hardly idiotic enough to come back with more tripe is he??

Obviously you were wrong

:):)

I think you must have angered the beast as he is back and posting the usual stuff on a few different threads.

A wooden stake perhaps ?

Its official : public sector pay per hour is 49% higher than private sector

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