anyone here going to vote sinn féin?

dmaxontour · 08-02-2011 11:29AM

LordSutch wrote: »

he went very quiet long before the end of the debate. .

He looked to me like he was wanting to get in but waiting for a gap to get a word in. Maybe he shouldn't have been so polite. I was suprised when PK didn't go back to him at the end as the other 3 had said a piece. PK isn't very good at making sure everyone gets a fair and equal amount of time, and that's his job.

Having said that, I'm not sure of any presenters on RTE or TV3 that I'd rate, Ryan Tubridy being the worse... but that's going off topic.

Xclusiv Barber · 08-02-2011 11:43AM

LordSutch wrote: »

From five to forteen, that's a very scary prospect :mad:

quite right. Whoops. Sorry, brain elsewhere. I meant they may increase by two, to SEVEN seats. Ta for the wake up call!

Pete_Cavan · 08-02-2011 11:48AM

FRIENDO wrote: »

From a working man's point of view if my trade union rep was to say yes to management to what ever deal was offered we would always end up with the worst deal (FG, Labour and FF).
However when they say NO with a strong leadership we would be offered the best deal.

First of all, SF are fighting this election based on the promise they will reject the IMF bailout deal altogether, not renogotiate it. SF are not looking to get any kind of deal. Are you suggesting that SF are lying to the electorate, hoping to win seats based on the promise of rejecting the bailout, and then are going to renegotiate it like at the other parties say they will? So SF are fighting the election based on the mother of all empty promises? Unless this is the case, SF will not "be offered the best deal", they will not be offered any deal.

As far as SF getting the best deal, we have nothing the IMF want so we have practically no bargaining position. The best we can do is play ball. FG and Lab will get a much better deal than SF because they are willing to work with the IMF to reduce our deficit and get our public finances under control.

Xclusiv Barber · 08-02-2011 11:49AM

LordSutch wrote: »

From five to forteen, that's a very scary prospect :mad:

quite right. Whoops. Sorry, brain elsewhere. I meant they may increase by two, to SEVEN seats. Ta for the wake up call!

Xclusiv Barber · 08-02-2011 11:51AM

Posted that twice there. Sorry. Blasted gremlins.

FRIENDO · 08-02-2011 01:23PM

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

First of all, SF are fighting this election based on the promise they will reject the IMF bailout deal altogether, not renogotiate it. SF are not looking to get any kind of deal. Are you suggesting that SF are lying to the electorate, hoping to win seats based on the promise of rejecting the bailout, and then are going to renegotiate it like at the other parties say they will? So SF are fighting the election based on the mother of all empty promises? Unless this is the case, SF will not "be offered the best deal", they will not be offered any deal.

As far as SF getting the best deal, we have nothing the IMF want so we have practically no bargaining position. The best we can do is play ball. FG and Lab will get a much better deal than SF because they are willing to work with the IMF to reduce our deficit and get our public finances under control.

The last thing this country needs is more YES men (FF, FG and Labour) running to Brussels. Just like the the IMF/EU/FF/Green/Ind Govt Finance Bill which will and is destroying the Irish people, Fine Gael and Labour did not want to stand in the way of this bill being passed.
FG/Labour want the power of Govt but they dont want responsibility of the tough decisions.

Xclusiv Barber · 08-02-2011 01:51PM

Lads, lasses, I am old (enough) and hav a very open mind and consider myself quite liberal and very open to all debates, ideas, ideologies. However, Is it not patronising in the extreme, on all of us voters in ireland, of SF to have their president change parliaments (dont hav an issue with that bit), come in all @rse over tit and even go on record as having no knowledge of basic irish political fundamentals(DO hav an issue wit THAT bit), which they can do because they know louth is nailed on. I don't think SF are lying to the electorate, no, but i think they are trying to bluff the electorate. And they will bluff a minority, and, granted, a larger minority than ever before, and the capitulation of FF clears more room for this. But ultimately they will return 5 or 6 candidates perhaps 7 i think 8 is a stretch. Out of one hundred and sixty six.

sharkie66 · 08-02-2011 03:36PM

LordSutch wrote: »

But in all fairness PD was out of his depth, his SF economic figures just didn't add up, he was unable to get his message across, and he seemed to be all over the place, so much so, that he went very quiet long before the end of the debate. Sinn Fein know that they cannot get into Government this Dail, so they are flinging anything & everything around, hollow ideas, with a lack of any 'REAL' substance.

I will say that Mr Doherty can talk, he surely can, but his poilices are total rubbish.

Such!:eek:
You would say that! But all the top economists beg to differ! I know who I am going to believe and it is definitely not anybody to do with FF/FG/ex PDs etc.

Pat Kenny along with the majority of RTE's media hawks are so anti Sinn Fein that it stinks to high heaven! On the other channel mouthpiece of the mainstream political masters i.e. Network (for all except SF) Two there is an excuse of a programme called 11th hour which had mr colleran on talking about Sinn Fein as Shinners and other other offensive remarks spurted out in the most derogatory fashion. Complete propaganda and unfair broadcasting. Sinn Fein voters also pay the licence fee you know!

I though P. Doherty did a great job last night and if it wasn't for the constant interjections by the west Brit 'Pat PD Kenny' then he could have wiped the floor with the rest of the speakers.

By the way...Our Day is coming so all those in their cosy corners better be prepared for Major changes to a corrupt society. The Elites are shaking and well they might as like it or not unless they take on board the measures put forward by SF then social unrest Will happen. Mark my words the mainstream political parties will pay dearly if they don't take the masses out of abject poverty.:eek:

sharkie66 · 08-02-2011 03:46PM

Xclusiv Barber wrote: »

quite right. Whoops. Sorry, brain elsewhere. I meant they may increase by two, to SEVEN seats. Ta for the wake up call!

From what I can see in your posts about SF maybe your brain was very much elsewhere! Sinn Fein will do well in this election and remember that even seven seats is enough to gain speakers rights in the Dail. I suspect that you will be haring a lot more from Sinn Fein in the very near future so you might as well accept that Sinn Fein is on the way up whether you like it or not. :eek:

Sinn Fein all the way to sort out those corrupt fuddermuckers who destroyed this country.

jammyhog · 08-02-2011 03:48PM

it's FG and FF right wing policies that have this country destroyed, labour are'nt much better....Sinn Fein offer the only alternative to the consensus

LordSutch · 08-02-2011 03:53PM

sharkie66 wrote: »

By the way...Our Day is coming so all those in their cosy corners better be prepared for Major changes to a corrupt society. The Elites are shaking and well they might as like it or not unless they take on board the measures put forward by SF then social unrest Will happen. Mark my words the mainstream political parties will pay dearly if they don't take the masses out of abject poverty.:eek:

I'm scared :rolleyes:

You will obey us, our day is coming, you will be sorry, you will conform, hostages will not be taken, social unrest will happen, you will pay dearly, 'Exterminate'! 'exterminate', 'exterminate'!

Where's Matt Smith when you need him

NotorietyH · 08-02-2011 03:54PM

jammyhog wrote: »

it's FG and FF right wing policies that have this country destroyed, labour are'nt much better....Sinn Fein offer the only alternative to the consensus

Yes it's an alternative, but that doesn't automatically make it better. In fact it could very easily (and would very likely in my opinion) be a lot worse. It's like protesting against the sinking of the Titanic by setting fire to the lifeboats.

deelite · 08-02-2011 03:55PM

I'm voting for Sinn Fein - for no other reason than they're the only party that knocks on my door during the year.

LordSutch · 08-02-2011 03:58PM

deelite wrote: »

I'm voting for Sinn Fein - for no other reason than they're the only party that knocks on my door during the year.

Oh dear!

Surely a bit more thought should be put into who you are voting for?

Worztron · 08-02-2011 04:05PM

caseyann wrote: »

I dont believe they can after it is made.

I see.

takun · 08-02-2011 04:06PM

This really is a futile discussion.

The reality is that very, very, VERY few people who did not intend voting Sinn Fein anyway will be swayed by their economic plan, which makes sense to nobody but the already converted.

It probably doesn't make much sense to the already converted either, but they don't care what their economic plan is, don't care that it makes no sense and don't bother defending it, because they know it will never be tested anyway.

Aside from those for whom partition is the primary issue, the main reasoning for a Sinn Fein vote in this thread seems based on "because they are not the others", which is not a reason at all but an absence of reasons.

Pete_Cavan · 08-02-2011 04:12PM

jammyhog wrote: »

it's FG and FF right wing policies that have this country destroyed, labour are'nt much better....Sinn Fein offer the only alternative to the consensus

What right wing policies would they be then? Benchmarking public sector pay allowing wages to increase at a high rate than the rate of inflation and wage increases for all regardless of performance? Or was it constantly increasing the minimum wage to rates where Irish businesses can no longer compete and allowing the cost of living to spiral out of control? Or maybe increasing social welfare payments to among the highest in the EU? A lot of the policies pursued over the past 14 years under FF have been left wing.

And before you say it, letting banks fail would have been a right wing approach, the bailout was not a right wing policy.

SafeSurfer · 08-02-2011 04:13PM

sharkie66 wrote: »

[/B]

Such!:eek:
You would say that! But all the top economists beg to differ! I know who I am going to believe and it is definitely not anybody to do with FF/FG/ex PDs etc.

Pat Kenny along with the majority of RTE's media hawks are so anti Sinn Fein that it stinks to high heaven! On the other channel mouthpiece of the mainstream political masters i.e. Network (for all except SF) Two there is an excuse of a programme called 11th hour which had mr colleran on talking about Sinn Fein as Shinners and other other offensive remarks spurted out in the most derogatory fashion. Complete propaganda and unfair broadcasting. Sinn Fein voters also pay the licence fee you know!

I though P. Doherty did a great job last night and if it wasn't for the constant interjections by the west Brit 'Pat PD Kenny' then he could have wiped the floor with the rest of the speakers.

By the way...Our Day is coming so all those in their cosy corners better be prepared for Major changes to a corrupt society. The Elites are shaking and well they might as like it or not unless they take on board the measures put forward by SF then social unrest Will happen. Mark my words the mainstream political parties will pay dearly if they don't take the masses out of abject poverty.:eek:

You object to Sinn Fein being called Shinners calling it an offensive remark yet refer to Pat Kenny as a west Brit?

This is hypocrasy.

jammyhog · 08-02-2011 04:14PM

NotorietyH wrote: »

Yes it's an alternative, but that doesn't automatically make it better. In fact it could very easily (and would very likely in my opinion) be a lot worse. It's like protesting against the sinking of the Titanic by setting fire to the lifeboats.

our choices at this moment are more of the same or something different, i'm not going to pretend that the Sinn Fein plan is'nt dangerous, it is, we must default or face 20 to 30 years in the economic wilderness, i dont know about you but i'm not able for decades of emigration and mass unemployment which will be the case if we follow our current path which is agreed by the 3 main parties...FF go on about hard decisions, the hardest 1 of all would be to default and take our chances....another 3 years of cuts will finish us off

sharkie66 · 08-02-2011 04:17PM

LordSutch wrote: »

I'm scared :rolleyes:

You will obey us, our day is coming, you will be sorry, you will conform, hostages will not be taken, social unrest will happen, you will pay dearly, 'Exterminate'! 'exterminate', 'exterminate'!

Where's Matt Smith when you need him

Please try and keep to the thread as Dr Who has nothing to do with Irish Politics.

Sutch, you should not be scared as youy are one of the many who are suffering the drastic drop in standards of living. Aren't you suffering like the rest of us or are you one of the minority on this Island that rapes the poor while objecting to real change to make this unequal society a little more equal?

Sinn Fein want real change and you know this. Maybe their economic policy does not suit you but for a sizable amount of people here it does. Get real and try and move away fro your old "war" snide remarks. Peace Man and the war is over Bro!!:D

08-02-2011 04:18PM

jammyhog wrote: »

another 3 years of cuts will finish us off

Do ya think?

Are you aware that the Sinn Féin plan is one big Cut when the money runs out after a year and the bond markets tell us to fcuk off as opposed to us telling them to take a hike.

Yes one huge cut in the SF plan,thats all, just one where no teacher,guard etc gets paid any more as the money has dried up.
Good luck with winging it on that one,it's plain daft.

SafeSurfer · 08-02-2011 04:21PM

sharkie66 wrote: »

[/B]

Such!:eek:
You would say that! But all the top economists beg to differ! I know who I am going to believe and it is definitely not anybody to do with FF/FG/ex PDs etc.

Pat Kenny along with the majority of RTE's media hawks are so anti Sinn Fein that it stinks to high heaven! On the other channel mouthpiece of the mainstream political masters i.e. Network (for all except SF) Two there is an excuse of a programme called 11th hour which had mr colleran on talking about Sinn Fein as Shinners and other other offensive remarks spurted out in the most derogatory fashion. Complete propaganda and unfair broadcasting. Sinn Fein voters also pay the licence fee you know!

I though P. Doherty did a great job last night and if it wasn't for the constant interjections by the west Brit 'Pat PD Kenny' then he could have wiped the floor with the rest of the speakers.

By the way...Our Day is coming so all those in their cosy corners better be prepared for Major changes to a corrupt society. The Elites are shaking and well they might as like it or not unless they take on board the measures put forward by SF then social unrest Will happen. Mark my words the mainstream political parties will pay dearly if they don't take the masses out of abject poverty.:eek:

Again this is hyprocrasy. The rate of poverty in Northern Ireland where Sinn Fein are in power is higher than in the republic.

See the links

http://www.socialinclusion.ie/poverty.html#howcan

http://www.poverty.org.uk/i01/index.shtml?2

Also have a look at this link showing poverty to be higher in Northern Ireland where Sinn Fein are in power to any other region in the UK or Ireland.

http://www.innovations-report.com/html/reports/social_sciences/report-39840.html

jammyhog · 08-02-2011 04:25PM

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

What right wing policies would they be then? Benchmarking public sector pay allowing wages to increase at a high rate than the rate of inflation and wage increases for all regardless of performance? Or was it constantly increasing the minimum wage to rates where Irish businesses can no longer compete and allowing the cost of living to spiral out of control? Or maybe increasing social welfare payments to among the highest in the EU? A lot of the policies pursued over the past 14 years under FF have been left wing.

And before you say it, letting banks fail would have been a right wing approach, the bailout was not a right wing policy.

yes i agree the bailout was'nt a right wing policy, but cutting welfare, blind and carers money? FF were'nt following a left wing agenda they were just running the country the way they always have....BADLY!

sharkie66 · 08-02-2011 04:29PM

LordSutch wrote: »

Oh dear!

Surely a bit more thought should be put into who you are voting for?

Sutch,:eek:
Who are you to tell the rest of us what to do or not do? Get real and try your tiresome goading stunts elsewhere! Grow up, this is a political thread for those who like real discussion not just a place where you can take out your frustration on the rest of us.

Surely it is time for you to move to the thread that supports your point of view instead of belittling all those who have the courage to say who they are voting for on this thread.

Pete_Cavan · 08-02-2011 04:32PM

jammyhog wrote: »

our choices at this moment are more of the same or something different, i'm not going to pretend that the Sinn Fein plan is'nt dangerous, it is, we must default or face 20 to 30 years in the economic wilderness, i dont know about you but i'm not able for decades of emigration and mass unemployment which will be the case if we follow our current path which is agreed by the 3 main parties...FF go on about hard decisions, the hardest 1 of all would be to default and take our chances....another 3 years of cuts will finish us off

Defaulting will put us in the economic wilderness for the next 20 to 30 years. After we use up the NPRF covering this years deficit, how do you think we will get money for next year (bearing in mind the bond markets wont give us anything 12 months after we defaulted and they lost billions on us)? The only other option is a €17bn cut for budget 2012 to bring expenditure inline with income, which would destroy the economy.

And as far as another 3 years of cuts finishing us off, we need to get our budget deficit under control. That is the only way we will be able to return to the bond markets, the bailout money gives us four years grace to cut the deficit. SF cant possibly reverse all the cuts they claim they will because this will only increase the deficit. Again where do they think they are going to get the money to pay for an even higher deficit than we have at the minute?

SF know their plan will not work, they know they will not get into government to implement any of it, they are just appling to the gulible to win support.

jammyhog · 08-02-2011 04:34PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Do ya think?

Are you aware that the Sinn Féin plan is one big Cut when the money runs out after a year and the bond markets tell us to fcuk off as opposed to us telling them to take a hike.

Yes one huge cut in the SF plan,thats all, just one where no teacher,guard etc gets paid any more as the money has dried up.
Good luck with winging it on that one,it's plain daft.

who say's the bond markets will tell us to f off? chances are that the fact we've cut our national debt in half by default will stand to us, who would you lend money to? someone who owes 100 billion or 250 billion?

a conservative is a man who believes in never doing anything for the first time images%3Fq%3Doliver%2Btwist%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D1362%26bih%3D498%26gbv%3D2%26tbs%3Disch:10%2C3104&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=678&vpy=171&dur=3728&hovh=216&hovw=162&tx=111&ty=164&oei=wWBRTY_BEuqShAfriPXVCA&esq=11&page=9&ndsp=13&ved=1t:429,r:10,s:105&biw=1362&bih=498

images%3Fq%3Doliver%2Btwist%26hl%3Den%26biw%3D1362%26bih%3D498%26gbv%3D2%26tbs%3Disch:10%2C3104&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=678&vpy=171&dur=3728&hovh=216&hovw=162&tx=111&ty=164&oei=wWBRTY_BEuqShAfriPXVCA&esq=11&page=9&ndsp=13&ved=1t:429,r:10,s:105&biw=1362&bih=498

please sir...

sharkie66 · 08-02-2011 04:35PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Do ya think?

Are you aware that the Sinn Féin plan is one big Cut when the money runs out after a year and the bond markets tell us to fcuk off as opposed to us telling them to take a hike.

Yes one huge cut in the SF plan,thats all, just one where no teacher,guard etc gets paid any more as the money has dried up.
Good luck with winging it on that one,it's plain daft.

Scaremongering by the establishment and the Right.

Same old, same old:eek:

Sinn Fein on the way up, no doubt about it.:) Yeah:)!

LordSutch · 08-02-2011 04:35PM

sharkie66 wrote: »

Sutch,:eek:
Who are you to tell the rest of us what to do or not do? Get real and try your tiresome goading stunts elsewhere! Grow up, this is a political thread for those who like real discussion not just a place where you can take out your frustration on the rest of us.

Do you really think the only reason for you to vote for a political party is if they knock on your door? I have had the Mormons call at my door over the years, but that doesn't mean I would join them, a little considered free thought must be applied when voting for a political party.

sharkie66 wrote: »

Surely it is time for you to move to the thread that supports your point of view instead of belittling all those who have the courage to say who they are voting for on this thread.

I won't be voting for Sinn Fein, bye . . .

cosanostra · 08-02-2011 04:41PM

takun wrote: »

I have a pretty good understanding of how we got where we are, I am not asking about that. I am asking for an explanation where the Sinn Fein plan would take us and how. Because I genuinely do not see how it can possibly work and wonder am I missing something.

http://www.youtube.com/user/sinnfeinireland#p/u/3/5PNhFquGowU

Pearse will explain it there is plenty more videos explaining it there too!

fred252 · 08-02-2011 04:42PM

deelite wrote: »

I'm voting for Sinn Fein - for no other reason than they're the only party that knocks on my door during the year.

so what would you be doing if another party had knocked on your door also? toss a coin then i guess.

anyone here going to vote sinn féin?

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