anyone here going to vote sinn féin?

Banbh · 03-02-2011 05:11PM

I'm not 'for' Gerry Adams or anyone else, except my family. I don't 'support' a political party the way people 'support' a football team. I vote for candidates based on their policies.

And I'm going to vote Sinn Fein as they are the only opposition to paying off the bankers. They are the only ones advocating an end to this ridiculous debt that FF/GR - with the approval of FG/LAB - have inflicted on us.

Has anyone got a short name for FF-FG-GR-LAB as I get tired typing it all out? There must be a short name for this alliance of the willing.

03-02-2011 05:14PM

Banbh wrote: »

Has anyone got a short name for FF-FG-GR-LAB as I get tired typing it all out? There must be a short name for this alliance of the willing.

It's called "The Mainstream"

lugha · 03-02-2011 05:41PM

sharkie66 wrote: »

If you have evidence to show us all here that Mr Adams was a member of that freedom fighting organization please bring it to your nearest PSNI /RUC station!

Regarding my view re Mr Ahern and the corrupt FF party being slander or idle gossip....umm just take a look around you lads and see what he and the FF mafia have done to the country. I think if you look closely you will find ample evidence that he is indeed all the above!:eek:

Short version. Allegations against republicans requires proof to the standard of a criminal court (in which case they whinge that there is no British justice). Allegations made by republicans are "facts" that the street canines are fully briefed on.

Can you really not see your own eye-watering hypocrisy? Much like the Jesuits, the republican propaganda machine did a mighty fine job.

SafeSurfer · 03-02-2011 05:41PM

sharkie66 wrote: »

SafeSurfer,

"Until proven in a court of law or otherwise we have to take Mr Adams word. Like it or not, believe it or not! Everything else is just slander and idle gossip."

So your opinion on Bertie Ahern is valid even though he has never been convicted of an offence whereas my view on Gerry Adams is "just slander and idle gossip"?

Which is it? If Bertie Ahern can be convicted in the court of public opinion then so too can Gerry Adams.

If you have evidence to show us all here that Mr Adams was a member of that freedom fighting organization please bring it to your nearest PSNI /RUC station!

Regarding my view re Mr Ahern and the corrupt FF party being slander or idle gossip....umm just take a look around you lads and see what he and the FF mafia have done to the country. I think if you look closely you will find ample evidence that he is indeed all the above!:eek:

Adam's covered up his protection of his brother Liam after he became aware of the abuse and did nothing to help the victim Aine Tyrell.

You make another unfounded assertion here without as much as a sniff of proof to back it up. Please do now!

Look at this interview with the victim, Gerry's niece Aine Tyrell

http://www.tribune.ie/news/article/2010/jan/24/aine-tyrell-gerry-adams-is-still-lying-about-abuse/

The tragedy that happened within a family is indeed private and spouting on about it here is taking the thread off subject.

The question is 'will you vote for Sinn Fein' and not ' Sexual Abuse in Irish families and its effect on the moral fibre of society'!

Look at these interviews where Gerry trips up on his own lies.

http://www.tribune.ie/news/article/2010/jan/03/exclusive-revealed-sf-cover-up-of-liam-adams-senio/

http://www.tribune.ie/article/2010/jan/24/the-truth-about-gerry-adams-has-been-dragged-kicki/

http://www.tribune.ie/news/article/2010/jan/24/aine-tyrell-gerry-adams-is-still-lying-about-abuse/

"If you have evidence to show us all here that Mr Adams was a member of that freedom fighting organization please bring it to your nearest PSNI /RUC station!"

Why would I go to a PSNI/RUC station acroos the border and surely you must know the RUC have been disbanded.

Again I do not believe the integrity of Gerry Adams is off topic as to whether people will vote for Sinn Fein or not.

You say to look around for the evidence that Bertie Ahern and FF are corrupt. I agree that members of FF have been convicted for corruption but Bertie Ahern has not.

I have linked to eye witness evidence of former comrades of Gerry Adams which claimed that he was the commander of a high level group of IRA volunteers called " The Unknown" who were tasked with "disappearing" suspected informants and collaborators.

What about the pictures of a young Gerry Adams in an IRA honour guard

I think most Irish people are intelligent enough to know that if it quacks like a duck and waddles like a duck its a duck.

the_syco · 03-02-2011 10:04PM

SafeSurfer wrote: »

I think most Irish people are intelligent enough to know that if it quacks like a duck and waddles like a duck its a duck.

The only reason he won't admit to it is that he's probably afraid that the US will suspend more of his bank accounts...

Banbh · 03-02-2011 11:05PM

@ Sharkie66
Can't you see what's happening here?
If you can't get the policy, get the man.

03-02-2011 11:10PM

Sorry for joining the thread late. in answer to the original question, YES, I will be voting Sinn Fén and have been doing since before it was popular to do so.

SafeSurfer · 03-02-2011 11:11PM

Banbh wrote: »

@ Sharkie66
Can't you see what's happening here?
If you can't get the policy, get the man.

@Banbh
Or you could say if you dont like the answer attack the question.

colly10 · 03-02-2011 11:33PM

Banbh wrote: »

@ Sharkie66
Can't you see what's happening here?
If you can't get the policy, get the man.

The man is the leader of the party, I think it's fairly reasonable to not vote for a party if you have zero trust in the leader.

I wouldn't trust them to make good economic decisions either, they have suggested raising corporation tax to make competition with the North fairer, how that could be a good thing for the republic is beyond me. I know that it's not their current policy (or so they tell us) but if they would suggest a policy like this for the republic because it's good for the north then how can I trust them to have the interests of ROI at heart?

Their policy is to heavily increase tax, that might be good in your opinion but I pay enough tax so could do without another 10%, most economists i've heard say it's a bad idea too

leincar · 03-02-2011 11:38PM

There are no circumstances in which I will vote for Sinn Fein. Never mind the fact that I could care less about the six counties. Never mind that they are tainted while Adams, McGuinness Ferris and people of that generation are at the helm.

What I do mind and object to is the proposal of an annual 1% wealth tax on assets over 1 million.

As some people will know from other threads, I earn by any measure and standard a great salary. I paid last year a six figure amount in tax, plus I pay taxes in the U.S. That is fine by me. Myself and my wife made a conscious decision to return and live in Ireland.

However, I have not spent 25 years climbing the greasy corporate ladder on my own terms, travelling the world spending a large chunk of time away from my family for any government to dip their hand in my pocket.

My main objection to a 1% wealth tax is it would be a tax on assets I have bought and accumulated on net income. My tax has already been paid and if I decide to sell some of my assets I will then pay capital gains. Again no problem with that, but to dip into my wallet every year for a levy on assets I may never sell or realise a profit on, is pure theft. Nothing more, nothing less. If it does come in with any administration I will be out of this country quicker than you can say "They haven't gone away you know."

crebel81 · 03-02-2011 11:40PM

Its plain for all to see...Votes for Sinn Fein are on the rise and people are afraid. The good oul IRA excuse washed with people before but I think people have moved on.

All irish politics has republican history so to question Sinn Fein on their links with the IRA can be very hypocritical at times.

I will be voting Sinn Fein. I like their 10 point plan. Some of the points are optimistic at times but going into coalition with another party can strengthen some of the ideas they have put on the table.

Everyone is calling for change. The mainstream parties have proven incompetant in the past, to put it mildly. And never mind the corruption. Sinn Fein are new and fresh with radical ideas and can only shake up the political system which is rotten to the core.

SafeSurfer · 03-02-2011 11:53PM

"Sinn Fein are new and fresh with radical ideas and can only shake up the political system which is rotten to the core."

New and fresh?

Sinn fein are the 2nd oldest political party on the island. Gerry Adams when he is elected will be among the oldest TDs in the Dail at 62.

The political system may be rotten to the core but it still allows us to reach our goals without shootings or bombings.

Pherekydes · 03-02-2011 11:54PM

Not voting SF.

Ex-PDF here, and I'm afraid I simply don't trust their senior politicians.

sharkie66 · 03-02-2011 11:57PM

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Look at these interviews where Gerry trips up on his own lies.

http://www.tribune.ie/news/article/2010/jan/03/exclusive-revealed-sf-cover-up-of-liam-adams-senio/

http://www.tribune.ie/article/2010/jan/24/the-truth-about-gerry-adams-has-been-dragged-kicki/

http://www.tribune.ie/news/article/2010/jan/24/aine-tyrell-gerry-adams-is-still-lying-about-abuse/

"If you have evidence to show us all here that Mr Adams was a member of that freedom fighting organization please bring it to your nearest PSNI /RUC station!"

Why would I go to a PSNI/RUC station acroos the border and surely you must know the RUC have been disbanded.

Again I do not believe the integrity of Gerry Adams is off topic as to whether people will vote for Sinn Fein or not.

You say to look around for the evidence that Bertie Ahern and FF are corrupt. I agree that members of FF have been convicted for corruption but Bertie Ahern has not.

I have linked to eye witness evidence of former comrades of Gerry Adams which claimed that he was the commander of a high level group of IRA volunteers called " The Unknown" who were tasked with "disappearing" suspected informants and collaborators.

What about the pictures of a young Gerry Adams in an IRA honour guard

http://www.google.ie/images?hl=en&source=imghp&biw=1020&bih=595&q=gerry+adams+ira+uniform&gbv=2&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=

I think most Irish people are intelligent enough to know that if it quacks like a duck and waddles like a duck its a duck.

The articles were all in the 'Sindo Tribune' a well known anti Republican paper which has been fed money by the Independent News and Media group i.e. The mothership of the Irish Independent and Sunday Independent which are not exactly the most Republican journals of the state:eek:! Pity the Trib is going to the wall all the same! It will be sorely missed.:D

You find it easy to take the word of a former colleague of Mr Adams as gospel but completely disregard Adams when he makes a statement! Wow. What hypocrisy! If I am not mistaken these colleagues of Gerry WERE convicted by the RIC/PSNI/RUC/UDR/BSpecials etc. You choose strange bedfellows to support your weak argument!

Regarding the picture of Gerry in the colour party. It is not a crime to be dressed in military garb or as far as I know anyway! I have hundreds of photos of visiting English, French, Italian tourists who all look strangely like fishermen but who knows maybe they are all members of an underground military organization. Then again I wouldn't bait bet on it!:)

While my sympathy goes out to all the victims here, I wonder why Liam Adams, the perpetrator, hardly gets a mention. Maybe we need to stop taking the spotlight off him by putting it onto others.

sharkie66 · 04-02-2011 12:05AM

SafeSurfer wrote: »

"Sinn Fein are new and fresh with radical ideas and can only shake up the political system which is rotten to the core."

New and fresh?

Sinn fein are the 2nd oldest political party on the island. Gerry Adams when he is elected will be among the oldest TDs in the Dail at 62.

The political system may be rotten to the core but it still allows us to reach our goals without shootings or bombings.

SS,
Shootings and bombings....err where? There is a Peace Process in progress.
I thought we were all supposed to MOVE ON and deal with the present, but maybe I missed something!

crebel81 · 04-02-2011 12:09AM

SafeSurfer wrote: »

"Sinn Fein are new and fresh with radical ideas and can only shake up the political system which is rotten to the core."

New and fresh?

Sinn fein are the 2nd oldest political party on the island. Gerry Adams when he is elected will be among the oldest TDs in the Dail at 62.

The political system may be rotten to the core but it still allows us to reach our goals without shootings or bombings.

Pardon me sir!! I am aware they are not a new party but they do have new idea's which appeal to me.

In relation to the above in bold, Hmmm there were not many options open to nationalists and republicans. Now I do not agree with bombings etc, but thats an argument for a different day. Move on!! There is a peace in the 6 counties for the first time. Nationalists and unionists have made huge strides in achieving this.

If you want to add something that is relevant to the present moment and that is foward looking rather than backward looking then be my guest

sharkie66 · 04-02-2011 12:14AM

SafeSurfer
You said in an earlier post.....

I have linked to eye witness evidence of former comrades of Gerry Adams which claimed that he was the commander of a high level group of IRA volunteers called " The Unknown" who were tasked with "disappearing" suspected informants and collaborators.

If the group was Unknown then how do you know it existed at all? Could it be that the so called former comrades of Gerry Adams were really only pulling the piss out of gullible journalists and who obviously fell hook, line and sinker for the spiel they Wanted to hear!!!!

SafeSurfer · 04-02-2011 12:22AM

sharkie66 wrote: »

The articles were all in the 'Sindo Tribune' a well known anti Republican paper which has been fed money by the Independent News and Media group i.e. The mothership of the Irish Independent and Sunday Independent which are not exactly the most Republican journals of the state:eek:! Pity the Trib is going to the wall all the same! It will be sorely missed.:D

You find it easy to take the word of a former colleague of Mr Adams as gospel but completely disregard Adams when he makes a statement! Wow. What hypocrisy! If I am not mistaken these colleagues of Gerry WERE convicted by the RIC/PSNI/RUC/UDR/BSpecials etc. You choose strange bedfellows to support your weak argument!

Regarding the picture of Gerry in the colour party. It is not a crime to be dressed in military garb or as far as I know anyway! I have hundreds of photos of visiting English, French, Italian tourists who all look strangely like fishermen but who knows maybe they are all members of an underground military organization. Then again I wouldn't bait bet on it!:)

While my sympathy goes out to all the victims here, I wonder why Liam Adams, the perpetrator, hardly gets a mention. Maybe we need to stop taking the spotlight off him by putting it onto others.

So because these publications are not mouthpieces for official Sinn Fein propaganda the words of the abuse victim who is interviewed and quoted in them is not to be believed?

So statements of other former comrades of Gerry Adams who were also convicted by the RIC/PSNI/RUC/UDR/BSpecials etc should not be believed?

Im sure Martin Ferris, Martin Mc Guinness, John Kelly et al would wonder what you mean exactly by strange bedfellows.

You find it easy to take the word of a former colleague of Mr Adams as gospel but completely disregard Adams when he makes a statement! Wow. What hypocrisy!

I dont see the hypocrisy in this. I choose to believe the word of one person based on evidence and choose to disbelief the word ofMr. Adams based on evidence. This is not hypocrisy.

"I have hundreds of photos of visiting English, French, Italian tourists who all look strangely like fishermen but who knows maybe they are all members of an underground military organization. Then again I wouldn't bait bet on it!:)"

I think you are being facetious here. Gerry Adams was photographed, uniformed as part of an IRA colour party, its not just a man in a funny hat.

And why you have hundreds of photographs of visiting English, French, Italian tourists who all look strangely like fishermen, if true is intriguing.

colly10 · 04-02-2011 12:25AM

leincar wrote: »

However, I have not spent 25 years climbing the greasy corporate ladder on my own terms, travelling the world spending a large chunk of time away from my family for any government to dip their hand in my pocket.

Totally agree with this, personally I don't earn much but most people who do get there through hard work, making good choices, taking calculated risks and making difficult decisions over a long period of time to make their way to the top. They pay a serious amount of tax and i've seen some that could be considered irreplaceable to companies. I wouldn't begruge them.
The majority of people do just enough to get by and some a little more, to get to the top you've got to be the best at every level your at, prove yourself and show your better, to do that takes alot, there's got to be some incentive

SafeSurfer · 04-02-2011 12:26AM

sharkie66 wrote: »

SafeSurfer
You said in an earlier post.....

I have linked to eye witness evidence of former comrades of Gerry Adams which claimed that he was the commander of a high level group of IRA volunteers called " The Unknown" who were tasked with "disappearing" suspected informants and collaborators.

If the group was Unknown then how do you know it existed at all? Could it be that the so called former comrades of Gerry Adams were really only pulling the piss out of gullible journalists and who obviously fell hook, line and sinker for the spiel they Wanted to hear!!!!

I didn't say the group was Unknown. I said they were called "The Unknown", hence the capital letters.

SafeSurfer · 04-02-2011 12:29AM

crebel81 wrote: »

Pardon me sir!! I am aware they are not a new party but they do have new idea's which appeal to me.

In relation to the above in bold, Hmmm there were not many options open to nationalists and republicans. Now I do not agree with bombings etc, but thats an argument for a different day. Move on!! There is a peace in the 6 counties for the first time. Nationalists and unionists have made huge strides in achieving this.

If you want to add something that is relevant to the present moment and that is foward looking rather than backward looking then be my guest

Not to take offence easily but I find this patronising. I will contribute posts that I deem relevent to my decision to vote for Sinn Fein as the OP asked, your guest or not.

colly10 · 04-02-2011 12:31AM

crebel81 wrote: »

Its plain for all to see...Votes for Sinn Fein are on the rise and people are afraid. The good oul IRA excuse washed with people before but I think people have moved on.

Historically, when things aren't going well, people are more likely to vote more left or right. The next election will be Sinn Feins best and it'll be down hill from there

caseyann · 04-02-2011 12:38AM

We should start wearing vote Sinn Féin jumpers.

I have decided i am voting Sinn Féin,They are getting their shot from me.Now lets hope they get in there and can show us what they are made of.

sharkie66 · 04-02-2011 12:38AM

colly10 wrote: »

The man is the leader of the party, I think it's fairly reasonable to not vote for a party if you have zero trust in the leader.

I wouldn't trust them to make good economic decisions either, they have suggested raising corporation tax to make competition with the North fairer, how that could be a good thing for the republic is beyond me. I know that it's not their current policy (or so they tell us) but if they would suggest a policy like this for the republic because it's good for the north then how can I trust them to have the interests of ROI at heart?

Their policy is to heavily increase tax, that might be good in your opinion but I pay enough tax so could do without another 10%, most economists i've heard say it's a bad idea too

So its okay for the mainstream rabble (including the FF mafia) to increase taxes when the IMF/EU tell them to but if SF propose to tax the wealthiest in society because they can afford to pay a little more. ..you tutt tutt them. Wow!

crebel81 · 04-02-2011 12:40AM

SafeSurfer wrote: »

[/I][/B]

Not to take offence easily but I find this patronising. I will contribute posts that I deem relevent to my decision to vote for Sinn Fein as the OP asked, your guest or not.

Well should we not be looking to the future rather than evaluating a party based on their associations with an army which is no longer active.

Your entitled to your opinion as much as the next man but I find it hard to understand why people keep harping on about the IRA etc. If you read up on your history or maybe you have, you might understand why the majority of nationalists were sympathetic to the republican cause.

You might think Sinn Fein et al have alot to answer for but indirectly ff et al have shattered peoples livelihoods as a result of their selfishness, incompetence and the galway tent culture. The list is endless.

Im not suggesting for one minute that you are associated with FF but just setting out what the realities are.

SafeSurfer · 04-02-2011 12:47AM

crebel81 wrote: »

Well should we not be looking to the future rather than evaluating a party based on their associations with an army which is no longer active.

Your entitled to your opinion as much as the next man but I find it hard to understand why people keep harping on about the IRA etc. If you read up on your history or maybe you have, you might understand why the majority of nationalists were sympathetic to the republican cause.

You might think Sinn Fein et al have alot to answer for but indirectly ff et al have shattered peoples livelihoods as a result of their selfishness, incompetence and the galway tent culture. The list is endless.

Im not suggesting for one minute that you are associated with FF but just setting out what the realities are.

Yes Crebel but by your logic we should forget what FF has done in the last 4 years also. We do not exist in a vaccum. My whole point is that Gerry Adams and the party he leads would have more credibility if he admitted that he was a member of the provisional IRA and a member of it's army council.

Fianna Fail, Fine Gael, Labour and Sinn Fein all have skeletons in their closet. Unfortunately some of those skeletons are more actual than literal.

sharkie66 · 04-02-2011 12:50AM

SafeSurfer wrote: »

I didn't say the group was Unknown. I said they were called "The Unknown", hence the capital letters.

Oh I know that SafeSurfer....but you too fell hook, line and sinker for the twisted joke fed to the gullible media hacks!

I nearly fell off my republican armchair laughing when I saw the statement. What a howl!

I will be voting for Sinn Fein because apart from their policies their old comrades can crack off a good joke now and again!:D

colly10 · 04-02-2011 12:50AM

sharkie66 wrote: »

So its okay for the mainstream rabble (including the FF mafia) to increase taxes when the IMF/EU tell them to but if SF propose to tax the wealthiest in society because they can afford to pay a little more. ..you tutt tutt them. Wow!

Is 8% a little more considering most that still have jobs have taken both pay cuts and pay freezes and have had their tax increased over the last 2 years. In my mind, no it isn't.

And does this crowd that can "afford to pay a little more" include companies because up to recently it did (despite the fact that they could not justify how it would actually have a positive affect on the ROI).

SafeSurfer · 04-02-2011 12:52AM

sharkie66 wrote: »

Oh I know that SafeSurfer....but you too fell hook, line and sinker for the twisted joke fed to the gullible media hacks!

I nearly fell off my republican armchair laughing when I saw the statement. What a howl!

I will be voting for Sinn Fein because apart from their policies their old comrades can crack off a good joke now and again!:D

Well I'm glad that a discussion about the murder of Jean Mc Conville among many others has given you a good old belly laugh.

leincar · 04-02-2011 12:55AM

sharkie66 wrote: »

So its okay for the mainstream rabble (including the FF mafia) to increase taxes when the IMF/EU tell them to but if SF propose to tax the wealthiest in society because they can afford to pay a little more. ..you tutt tutt them. Wow!

Define the 'wealthiest in society'. If you are talking about people on a salary over €100k, I think you are wrong. A lot of these people are suffering. Do you mean over €250k?

What way do you propose to tax these people? If it is a third rate of tax or another income levy, fine most will accept that. Not however, a wealth tax on assets or deposits where tax has already been paid. As I stated previously that is theft.

anyone here going to vote sinn féin?

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