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CHEMTRAILS

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 4,476 ✭✭✭Samba


    Um,

    This argument should be rather easily settled, if just a few people in various locations purchase on of these

    http://www.novadetox.co.uk/acatalog/aluminium-poisoning-test.html

    Take some readings from a few sources, drinking water would be a good start and then draw a comparison between historical records - anyone have an idea where one might find some info?


    Another tell tale sign would be the price of mining companies who process raw aliminium.

    Historic data for some companies has been surprisingly hard to find but his is quite shocking!


    http://markets.ft.com/tearsheets/performance.asp?s=CENX:DEU

    2009 saw a 256% rise

    http://markets.ft.com/tearsheets/performance.asp?s=ALM:CAS

    74.60% increase

    http://markets.ft.com/tearsheets/performance.asp?s=LALU:MIL

    http://markets.ft.com/tearsheets/performance.asp?s=NATIONALUM:NSI

    This is by no means evidence but quite coincidental, not all companies dealing in raw aluminium follow this patter, the rise in price could be due to other variables, mergers, contract negotiations etc so I haven't investigated the "reported" cause of rise in share price.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56 ✭✭chebonaparte




  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1 evodave


    the bristish royal family are from germany they are nazi, the wars are all staged to scare people and the banks are financing both sides to buid up a military. they are making their british colonies into one, usa not same as america, canada, mexico are resisting. over here their trying to merge all members into the eu, these iluminati are in every country they run all governments and military forces remember its only ordinary men who do the fighting not the chiefs, they are killing everyone beneath the eilte. they flouride your drinking water like the nazi scientist did to keep everyone slow and lazy, the feed us crap food with toxic in them, they give us vaccines for mercury posioning which goes to your brain and kills your memmory, these are all facts i did my research dont laugh at this its what you need to accept, the vatican are roped in aswell thats why they dress in black death, the universities make you put on black gown when you Graduate, they are blood suckers, these guys are not to be messed with they own private armies and cops all over the world, all this have research back to the egyptian pryramids, they have been at it since then everything you think you know about history is a massive scam all school books are published by them they also own the media remember they go after major companies and try to kill off the small ones which are still somebit independent, I know this is alot to take in but you must open your mind and question everything thats going on, they like to mess with your head espicially on tv if you listen to the words and look out for the illuminati symbols you will spot them everywhere, i see them on tv all the time now, i was like you before saw nothing, they use qoutes from the book of revalantions its was on a clint eastwood film, pale rider, "and hell followed with him" if you want truth you have to go back a long way this part i am finding really hard and cant figure it out but i think the celts might have the answers, remember these illuminati think their great and they steal everything including our history stuff like the book of kells not that i know much about that but basically they rape us and steal us, they create a birth cert for you and they own you and everything you think you own they can take of you in the morning, the cilmate has other plans for them, check out post glacial rebound, the earth is in orbital wobble and is ajusting herself, lots of bad stuff happening and coming in the next 2 years, volcanoes, lightning, snow, flooding, you name it its happening, check out rsoe site they put very little on there compared to whats really going on. cheers lads and best of luck.


  • Moderators, Arts Moderators Posts: 10,525 Mod ✭✭✭✭5uspect


    Wall-o-text. Do you honestly expect anyone to read that?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,205 ✭✭✭espinolman


    Chemtrails-project alice-strontium-CERN-teleportation .
    Use a search engine if interested .


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,205 ✭✭✭espinolman


    Chemtrails are nuclear . Particle A is in them , part of CERNs teleportation project .


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,537 ✭✭✭thecommander


    espinolman wrote: »
    Chemtrails are nuclear . Particle A is in them , part of CERNs teleportation project .

    Really?

    Originally Posted by espinolman
    I still think they damaged the planet's protective layer with the aerial nuclear tests in the early sixties , thats part of the reason they are doing it , out of desparation .
    Originally Posted by espinolman
    Its the most logical explanation for chemtrails i have found so far , they want the planet , but it is too bright for them , so just cool and dim the planet , the native human population is stupid enough to do all the work for them , and they just have to sit back relax and watch the humans preparing the planet for their alien race to take over .
    Chemtrails-project alice-strontium-CERN-teleportation .
    Use a search engine if interested .


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56 ✭✭chebonaparte


    its been very heavy cloudy overcast over gorey last couple days and finaly today in some breaks in the cloud all i see are huge severe fat fluffy bright white chemtrails and 3 planes doing them live now

    wtf are they doing?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,537 ✭✭✭thecommander


    its been very heavy cloudy overcast over gorey last couple days and finaly today in some breaks in the cloud all i see are huge severe fat fluffy bright white chemtrails and 3 planes doing them live now

    wtf are they doing?

    They're flying from one airport to another. You're assuming that they're spraying something, rather than it being an effect of flying.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 728 ✭✭✭joebucks


    They're flying from one airport to another. You're assuming that they're spraying something, rather than it being an effect of flying.

    why do these planes not appear on sites such as flightradar?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭gizmo


    joebucks wrote: »
    why do these planes not appear on sites such as flightradar?
    As of right now it's only showing 4 planes in our airspace so from that I'm going to guess it doesn't show all flights?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 728 ✭✭✭joebucks


    gizmo wrote: »
    As of right now it's only showing 4 planes in our airspace so from that I'm going to guess it doesn't show all flights?

    yeah indeed it doesn't show all flights. I find it strange that the flights that do not appear on it seem to be the ones causing these persistant contrails. Is there an internet app that allows you to track ALL flights?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,537 ✭✭✭thecommander


    joebucks wrote: »
    yeah indeed it doesn't show all flights. I find it strange that the flights that do not appear on it seem to be the ones causing these persistant contrails. Is there an internet app that allows you to track ALL flights?

    So because a flight doesn't appear on a free to use website, then that leads you to think we're being purposely sprayed with chemicals?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 728 ✭✭✭joebucks


    So because a flight doesn't appear on a free to use website, then that leads you to think we're being purposely sprayed with chemicals?

    No. Re-read the thread and you will get a better idea of my position on this theory.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56 ✭✭chebonaparte


    well anyone with a pairs of eyes can see this morning over Gorey wexford there was beautiful clear blue skies and suns shining so bright !

    few hours later i look out see 1 plane chemtrailing.

    later i see four to five planes repeatedly flying from east coast across skies white fluffy trails and they keep repeating same flight paths parallel until the trails that disperse create blanket clouds grey dirty clouds

    and now the sky is horrible and sun blocked where the planes continue to spray!

    even my da sees them near the beach coastline of wexford!


  • Moderators, Music Moderators Posts: 13,312 Mod ✭✭✭✭iamstop


    can we get more pics of chemtrails by people here who see them please?

    I'm sure you all have a digital camera and means of uploading. Jeez. :rolleyes:


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,205 ✭✭✭espinolman


    Really?

    Yes , really , i am looking into everything , i will find out the truth about what is going on .


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,537 ✭✭✭thecommander


    espinolman wrote: »
    Yes , really , i am looking into everything , i will find out the truth about what is going on .

    So you're searching for a conspiracy? Maybe there isnt one.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 112 ✭✭Mr Plough




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4 saraskas


    iamstop wrote: »
    can we get more pics of chemtrails by people here who see them please?

    I'm sure you all have a digital camera and means of uploading. Jeez. :rolleyes:
    Hi,

    Here are some photos taken on Christmas day in Bray and Adamstown. I have never seen so many before- in 3 hours I counted 18 planes constantly spraying- starting from the sea side.
    img4611s.jpg

    img4601yd.jpg

    img4602f.jpg

    img4603n.jpg

    img4607l.jpg

    img4608no.jpg

    img4606g.jpg

    img4599m.jpg

    Who doesn't believe in chemtrails- watch "What in the world are they spraying?" and you'll get a lot of answers and maybe change your mind.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,537 ✭✭✭thecommander


    saraskas wrote: »
    Hi,

    Here are some photos taken on Christmas day in Bray and Adamstown. I have never seen so many before- in 3 hours I counted 18 planes constantly spraying- starting from the sea side.

    Why can't they just be contrails/exhaust trails? How do you seem so sure they they're spraying something else?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 728 ✭✭✭joebucks


    saraskas wrote: »
    Hi,

    Here are some photos taken on Christmas day in Bray and Adamstown. I have never seen so many before- in 3 hours I counted 18 planes constantly spraying- starting from the sea side.


    Who doesn't believe in chemtrails- watch "What in the world are they spraying?" and you'll get a lot of answers and maybe change your mind.

    Thanks for uploading, I also noticed a huge amount of trails on Christmas Day bt didnt manage to get any snaps. All the planes were flying from east to west across Wicklow. Does anybody know of a website to check what flights were scheduled to fly across this region on Christmas Day??


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 37 A320-200


    Let me ask a question. Are all you people scared of Cirrus cloud aswell?

    Also:

    http://casper.frontier.nl/eidw/

    Rewind to the 25/12/2010 at 1300Z

    Play it back, and look at all the aircraft.

    Happy yet?

    Also, do any of you know how the Air Traffic control structure is set up in Ireland?

    Lastly, all the contrails dissipate.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9 thescientist


    From an airline mechanic:




    "For reasons you will understand as you read this I can not divulge my identity. I am an aircraft mechanic for a major airline. I work at one of our maintenance bases located at a large airport. I have discovered some information that I think you will find important.

    First I should tell you something about the "pecking order" among mechanics. It is important to my story and to the cause to which you have dedicated yourself.

    Mechanics want to work on three things. The avionics, the engines, or the flight controls. The mechanics that work on these systems are considered at the top of the "pecking order". Next come the mechanics that work on the hydraulics and air conditioning systems. Then come the ones who work on the galley and other non-essential systems. But at the very bottom of the list are the mechanics that work on the waste disposal systems. No mechanic wants to work on the pumps, tanks, and pipes that are used to store the waste from the lavatories.

    But at every airport where I have worked there are always 2 or 3 mechanics that volunteer to work on the lavatory systems. The other mechanics are happy to let them do it. Because of this you will have only 2 or 3 mechanics that work on these systems at any one airport. No one pays much attention to these guys and no mechanic socializes with another mechanic who only works on the waste systems. In fact I had never thought much about this situation until last month.

    Like most airlines we have reciprocal agreements with the other airlines that fly into this airport. If they have a problem with a plane one of our mechanics will take care of it. Likewise if one of our planes has a problem at an airport where the other airline has a maintenance base, they will fix our plane.

    One day last month I was called out from our base to work on a plane for another airline. When I got the call the dispatcher did not know what the problem was. When I got to the plane I found out that the problem was in waste disposal system. There was nothing for me to do but to crawl in and fix the problem. When I got into the bay I realized that something was not right. There were more tanks, pumps, and pipes then should have been there. At first I assumed that the system had been changed. It had been 10 years since I had worked on one. As I tried to find the problem I quickly realized the extra piping and tanks were not connected to the waste disposal system. I had just discovered this when another mechanic from my company showed up. It was one of the mechanics who usually works on these systems. I happily turned the job over to him. As I was leaving I asked him about the extra equipment. He told me to "worry about my end of the plane and let him worry about his!"

    The next day I was on the company computer to look up a wiring schematic. While I was there I decided to look up the extra equipment I had found. To my amazement the manuals did not show any of the extra equipment I had seen with my own eyes the day before. I even tied in to the manufacturer files and still found nothing. Now I was really determined to find out what that equipment did.

    The next week we had three of our planes in our main hanger for periodic inspection. There are mechanics crawling all over a plane during these inspections. I had just finished my shift and I decided to have a look at the waste system on one of our planes. With all the mechanics around I figured that no one would notice an extra one on the plane. Sure enough, the plane I choose had the extra equipment!

    I began to trace the system of pipes, pumps, and tanks. I found what appeared to be the control unit for the system. It was a standard looking avionics control box but it had no markings of any kind. I could trace the control wires from the box to the pumps and valves but there were no control circuits coming into the unit. The only wires coming into the unit was a power connection to the aircraft's main power bus.

    The system had 1 large and 2 smaller tanks. It was hard to tell in the cramped compartment but it looked like the large tank could hold 50 gallons. The tanks were connected to a fill and drain valve that passed through the fuselage just behind the drain valve for the waste system. When I had a chance to look for this connection under the plane I found it cunningly hidden behind a panel under the panel used to access the waste drain.

    I began to trace the piping from the pumps. These pipes lead to a network of small pipes that ended in the trailing edges of the wings and horizontal stabilizers. If you look closely at the wings of a large airplane you will see a set of wires, about the size of your finger, extending from the trailing edge of the wing surfaces. These are the static discharge wicks. They are used to dissipate the static electric charge that builds up on a plane in flight. I discovered that the pipes from this mystery system lead to every 1 out of 3 of these static discharge wicks. These wicks had been "hollowed out" to allow whatever flows through these pipes to be discharged through these fake wicks.

    It was while I was on the wing that one of the managers spotted me. He ordered me out of the hanger telling me that my shift was over and I had not been authorized any overtime.

    The next couple of days were very busy and I had no time to continue my investigation. Late one afternoon, two days after my discovery, I was called to replace an engine temperature sensor on a plane due to take off in two hours. I finished the job and turned in the paperwork.

    About 30 minutes later I was paged to see the General Manager. When I went in his office I found that our union rep and two others who I did not know were waiting on me. He told me that a serious problem had been discovered. He said that I was being written up and suspended for turning in false paperwork. He handed me a disciplinary form stating that I had turned in false paperwork on the engine temperature sensor I had installed a few hours before. I was floored and began to protest. I told them that this was ridiculous and that I had done this work. The union rep spoke up then and recommended that we take a look at the plane and see if we could straighten it all out. It was at this time that I asked who the other two men were. The GM told me that they were airline safety inspectors but would not give me their names.

    We proceeded to the plane, which should have been in the air but was parked on our maintenance ramp. We opened the engine cowling and the union rep pulled the sensor. He checked the serial number and told everyone that it was the old instrument. We then went to the parts bay and went back into the racks. The union rep checked my report and pulled from the rack a sealed box. He opened the box and pulled out the engine temperature sensor with the serial number of the one I had installed. I was told that I was suspended for a week without pay and to leave immediately.

    I sat at home the first day of my suspension wondering what the hell had happened to me. That evening I received a phone call. The voice told me "Now you know what happens to mechanics who poke around in things they shouldn't. The next time you start working on systems that are no concern of yours you will lose your job. As it is I'm feeling generous, I believe that you'll be able to go back to work soon" CLICK. Again I had to pick myself from off the floor. I made the connection that what had happened was directly connected to my tracing the mysterious piping. The next morning the General Manager called me. He said that due to my past excellent employment record that the suspension had been reduced to one day and that I should report back to work immediately. The only thing I could think of was what are they trying to hide and who are THEY!

    That day at work went by as if nothing had happened. None of the other mechanics mentioned the suspension and my union rep told me not to talk about it. That night I logged onto the Internet to try to find some answers. I don't remember now how I got there but I came across your site. That's when it all came together. But the next morning at work I found a note inside my locked locker. It said, "Curiosity killed the cat. Don't be looking at Internet sites that are no concern of yours."

    Well that's it. THEY are watching me.

    Well you already know what they are doing. I don't know what they are spraying but I can tell you how they are doing it. I figure they are using the "honey trucks". These are the trucks that empty the waste from the lavatory waste tanks. The airports usually contract out this job and nobody goes near these trucks. Who wants to stand next a truck full of sh--. While these guys are emptying the waste tanks they are filling the tanks of the spray system. They know the planes flight path so they probably program the control unit to start spraying some amount of time after the plane reaches a certain altitude. The spray nozzles in the fake static wicks are so small that no one in the plane would see a thing.

    God help us all,
    A concerned citizen."


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9 thescientist


    Why can't they just be contrails/exhaust trails? How do you seem so sure they they're spraying something else?
    Think it isn't/can't/wont happen here? THINK AGAIN*.* "They" don't feel it's our business to know
    The UK Ministry of Defence admits experimenting on public - 1940-1979 ..who knows about since then? Now?
    © Antony Barnett, public affairs editor
    Observer.co.uk


    Sunday April 21, 2002

    The Ministry of Defence turned large parts of the country into a giant laboratory to conduct a series of secret germ warfare tests on the public.

    A government report just released provides for the first time a comprehensive official history of Britain's biological weapons trials between 1940 and 1979.

    Many of these tests involved releasing potentially dangerous chemicals and micro-organisms over vast swaths of the population without the public being told.

    While details of some secret trials have emerged in recent years, the 60-page report reveals new information about more than 100 covert experiments.

    The report reveals that military personnel were briefed to tell any 'inquisitive inquirer' the trials were part of research projects into weather and air pollution.

    The tests, carried out by government scientists at Porton Down, were designed to help the MoD assess Britain's vulnerability if the Russians were to have released clouds of deadly germs over the country.

    In most cases, the trials did not use biological weapons but alternatives which scientists believed would mimic germ warfare and which the MoD claimed were harmless. But families in certain areas of the country who have children with birth defects are demanding a public inquiry. (Of course they were ignored, like we all are now when we ask what the hell is being sprayed up in the skies over our heads that's making us all sick ..~R~)

    *One chapter of the report, 'The Fluorescent Particle Trials', reveals how between 1955 and 1963 planes flew from north-east England to the tip of Cornwall along the south and west coasts, dropping huge amounts of zinc cadmium sulphide on the population. The chemical drifted miles inland, its fluorescence allowing the spread to be monitored. In another trial using zinc cadmium sulphide, a generator was towed along a road near Frome in Somerset where it spewed the chemical for an hour.

    While the Government has insisted the chemical is safe, cadmium is recognised as a cause of lung cancer and during the Second World War was considered by the Allies as a chemical weapon.

    In another chapter, 'Large Area Coverage Trials', the MoD describes how between 1961 and 1968 more than a million people along the south coast of England, from Torquay to the New Forest, were exposed to bacteria including e.coli and bacillus globigii , which mimics anthrax. These releases came from a military ship, the Icewhale, anchored off the Dorset coast, which sprayed the micro-organisms in a five to 10-mile radius.

    The report also reveals details of the DICE trials in south Dorset between 1971 and 1975. *These involved US and UK military scientists spraying into the air massive quantities of serratia marcescens bacteria, with an anthrax simulant and phenol.

    Similar bacteria were released in 'The Sabotage Trials' between 1952 and 1964. These were tests to determine the vulnerability of large government buildings and public transport to attack. In 1956 bacteria were released on the London Underground at lunchtime along the Northern Line between Colliers Wood and Tooting Broadway. The results show that the organism dispersed about 10 miles. Similar tests were conducted in tunnels running under government buildings in Whitehall.

    Experiments conducted between 1964 and 1973 involved attaching germs to the threads of spiders' webs in boxes to test how the germs would survive in different environments. These tests were carried out in a dozen locations across the country, including London's West End, Southampton and Swindon. The report also gives details of more than a dozen smaller field trials between 1968 and 1977.

    In recent years, the MoD has commissioned two scientists to review the safety of these tests. Both reported that there was no risk to public health, although one suggested the elderly or people suffering from breathing illnesses may have been seriously harmed if they inhaled sufficient quantities of micro-organisms.

    However, some families in areas which bore the brunt of the secret tests are convinced the experiments have led to their children suffering birth defects, physical handicaps and learning difficulties.

    David Orman, an army officer from Bournemouth, is demanding a public inquiry. His wife, Janette, was born in East Lulworth in Dorset, close to where many of the trials took place. She had a miscarriage, then gave birth to a son with cerebral palsy. Janette's three sisters, also born in the village while the tests were being carried out, have also given birth to children with unexplained problems, as have a number of their neighbours.

    The local health authority has denied there is a cluster, but Orman believes otherwise. He said: 'I am convinced something terrible has happened. The village was a close-knit community and to have so many birth defects over such a short space of time has to be more than coincidence.'

    Successive governments have tried to keep details of the germ warfare tests secret. While reports of a number of the trials have emerged over the years through the Public Records Office, this latest MoD document - which was released to Liberal Democrat MP Norman Baker - gives the fullest official version of the biological warfare trials yet.

    Baker said: 'I welcome the fact that the Government has finally released this information, but question why it has taken so long. It is unacceptable that the public were treated as guinea pigs without their knowledge, and I want to be sure that the Ministry of Defence's claims that these chemicals and bacteria used were safe is true.'

    The MoD report traces the history of the UK's research into germ warfare since the Second World War when Porton Down produced five million cattle cakes filled with deadly anthrax spores which would have been dropped in Germany to kill their livestock. It also gives details of the infamous anthrax experiments on Gruinard on the Scottish coast which left the island so contaminated it could not be inhabited until the late 1980s. (Wait..I thought the terrorists had anthrax they could drop on us any second and we're supposed to be terrified of them? ~R~)

    The report also confirms the use of anthrax and other deadly germs on tests aboard ships in the Caribbean and off the Scottish coast during the 1950s. The document states: 'Tacit approval for simulant trials where the public might be exposed was strongly influenced by defence security considerations aimed obviously at restricting public knowledge. An important corollary to this was the need to avoid public alarm and disquiet about the vulnerability of the civil population to BW [biological warfare] attack.'

    Sue Ellison, spokeswoman for Porton Down, said: 'Independent reports by eminent scientists have shown there was no danger to public health from these releases which were carried out to protect the public.

    'The results from these trials will save lives, should the country or our forces face an attack by chemical and biological weapons.'

    Asked whether such tests are still being carried out, she said: 'It is not our policy to discuss ongoing research.'

    antony.barnett@observer.co.uk

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Article/0,4273,4398507,00.html


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 9 thescientist


    i have been making people aware of ct for many years now. this is nothing new.this has been ongoing since ww 2..
    the british gov first admitted spraying the city of london frequently in the 70's as detailed in the release of secret gov military docs under the 30 year rule. they said they were spraying iodine as the pop had low iodine levels...yeh right....:eek:

    Think it isn't/can't/wont happen here? THINK AGAIN*.* "They" don't feel it's our business to know
    The UK Ministry of Defence admits experimenting on public - 1940-1979 ..who knows about since then? Now?
    © Antony Barnett, public affairs editor
    Observer.co.uk
    Sunday April 21, 2002 The Ministry of Defence turned large parts of the country into a giant laboratory to conduct a series of secret germ warfare tests on the public.
    A government report just released provides for the first time a comprehensive official history of Britain's biological weapons trials between 1940 and 1979.
    Many of these tests involved releasing potentially dangerous chemicals and micro-organisms over vast swaths of the population without the public being told.
    While details of some secret trials have emerged in recent years, the 60-page report reveals new information about more than 100 covert experiments.
    The report reveals that military personnel were briefed to tell any 'inquisitive inquirer' the trials were part of research projects into weather and air pollution.
    The tests, carried out by government scientists at Porton Down, were designed to help the MoD assess Britain's vulnerability if the Russians were to have released clouds of deadly germs over the country.
    In most cases, the trials did not use biological weapons but alternatives which scientists believed would mimic germ warfare and which the MoD claimed were harmless. But families in certain areas of the country who have children with birth defects are demanding a public inquiry. (Of course they were ignored, like we all are now when we ask what the hell is being sprayed up in the skies over our heads that's making us all sick ..~R~)
    *One chapter of the report, 'The Fluorescent Particle Trials', reveals how between 1955 and 1963 planes flew from north-east England to the tip of Cornwall along the south and west coasts, dropping huge amounts of zinc cadmium sulphide on the population. The chemical drifted miles inland, its fluorescence allowing the spread to be monitored. In another trial using zinc cadmium sulphide, a generator was towed along a road near Frome in Somerset where it spewed the chemical for an hour.
    While the Government has insisted the chemical is safe, cadmium is recognised as a cause of lung cancer and during the Second World War was considered by the Allies as a chemical weapon.
    In another chapter, 'Large Area Coverage Trials', the MoD describes how between 1961 and 1968 more than a million people along the south coast of England, from Torquay to the New Forest, were exposed to bacteria including e.coli and bacillus globigii , which mimics anthrax. These releases came from a military ship, the Icewhale, anchored off the Dorset coast, which sprayed the micro-organisms in a five to 10-mile radius.
    The report also reveals details of the DICE trials in south Dorset between 1971 and 1975.*These involved US and UK military scientists spraying into the air massive quantities of serratia marcescens bacteria, with an anthrax simulant and phenol.
    Similar bacteria were released in 'The Sabotage Trials' between 1952 and 1964. These were tests to determine the vulnerability of large government buildings and public transport to attack. In 1956 bacteria were released on the London Underground at lunchtime along the Northern Line between Colliers Wood and Tooting Broadway. The results show that the organism dispersed about 10 miles. Similar tests were conducted in tunnels running under government buildings in Whitehall.
    Experiments conducted between 1964 and 1973 involved attaching germs to the threads of spiders' webs in boxes to test how the germs would survive in different environments. These tests were carried out in a dozen locations across the country, including London's West End, Southampton and Swindon. The report also gives details of more than a dozen smaller field trials between 1968 and 1977.
    In recent years, the MoD has commissioned two scientists to review the safety of these tests. Both reported that there was no risk to public health, although one suggested the elderly or people suffering from breathing illnesses may have been seriously harmed if they inhaled sufficient quantities of micro-organisms.
    However, some families in areas which bore the brunt of the secret tests are convinced the experiments have led to their children suffering birth defects, physical handicaps and learning difficulties.
    David Orman, an army officer from Bournemouth, is demanding a public inquiry. His wife, Janette, was born in East Lulworth in Dorset, close to where many of the trials took place. She had a miscarriage, then gave birth to a son with cerebral palsy. Janette's three sisters, also born in the village while the tests were being carried out, have also given birth to children with unexplained problems, as have a number of their neighbours.
    The local health authority has denied there is a cluster, but Orman believes otherwise. He said: 'I am convinced something terrible has happened. The village was a close-knit community and to have so many birth defects over such a short space of time has to be more than coincidence.'
    Successive governments have tried to keep details of the germ warfare tests secret. While reports of a number of the trials have emerged over the years through the Public Records Office, this latest MoD document - which was released to Liberal Democrat MP Norman Baker - gives the fullest official version of the biological warfare trials yet.
    Baker said: 'I welcome the fact that the Government has finally released this information, but question why it has taken so long. It is unacceptable that the public were treated as guinea pigs without their knowledge, and I want to be sure that the Ministry of Defence's claims that these chemicals and bacteria used were safe is true.'
    The MoD report traces the history of the UK's research into germ warfare since the Second World War when Porton Down produced five million cattle cakes filled with deadly anthrax spores which would have been dropped in Germany to kill their livestock. It also gives details of the infamous anthrax experiments on Gruinard on the Scottish coast which left the island so contaminated it could not be inhabited until the late 1980s. (Wait..I thought the terrorists had anthrax they could drop on us any second and we're supposed to be terrified of them? ~R~)
    The report also confirms the use of anthrax and other deadly germs on tests aboard ships in the Caribbean and off the Scottish coast during the 1950s. The document states: 'Tacit approval for simulant trials where the public might be exposed was strongly influenced by defence security considerations aimed obviously at restricting public knowledge. An important corollary to this was the need to avoid public alarm and disquiet about the vulnerability of the civil population to BW [biological warfare] attack.'
    Sue Ellison, spokeswoman for Porton Down, said: 'Independent reports by eminent scientists have shown there was no danger to public health from these releases which were carried out to protect the public.
    'The results from these trials will save lives, should the country or our forces face an attack by chemical and biological weapons.'
    Asked whether such tests are still being carried out, she said: 'It is not our policy to discuss ongoing research.'
    antony.barnett@observer.co.uk

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Article/0,4273,4398507,00.html


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,405 ✭✭✭gizmo


    Why didn't you quote this line:
    In most cases, the trials did not use biological weapons but alternatives which scientists believed would mimic germ warfare and which the MoD claimed were harmless.

    :confused:


  • Posts: 0 [Deleted User]


    From an airline mechanic:
    ...

    God help us all,
    A concerned citizen."

    do you generally swallow what you are told by anonymous sources on the net?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,672 ✭✭✭seannash


    King Mob wrote: »
    do you generally swallow what you are told by anonymous sources on the net?

    agreed,is it really gonna be hard for these shadowy figures to figure out from the descriptive story the "airline mechanic" has told,who he is?

    im sure thats not a common series of events so no doubt he'll be sacked immediately and surely killed


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