Its official : public sector pay per hour is 49% higher than private sector

Japer · 14-12-2010 11:14AM #1

According to the governments own statistics department, latest released figures show that public sector pay per hour is 49% higher than equivalent pay in the private sector.

www.cso.ie/releasespublications/documents/earnings/current/earnlabcosts.pdf

Three years in to a crisis, and the economy is still burdened with the overhead of having an overpaid and over-pensioned public sector ( both compared with the private sector and other public services abroad, including in comparison with our nearest neighbour ). When will we ever learn?

RobbieTheRobber · 14-12-2010 11:21AM

Link doesnt work!

sollar · 14-12-2010 11:21AM

My pay isn't 49% higher than similar private sector workers

dissed doc · 14-12-2010 11:25AM

Private sector doctors make considerably more than their public sector counterparts.

strewthelvis · 14-12-2010 11:26AM

oh lord another tar em all with the same brush load of crap. Are you really that stupid? there are different levels of pay in the public sector as well as in the private sector. Thats like saying everyone on the dole is a lazy waster. Cop on sick of this stupid Public V Private bashing. How is that going to solve anything? Stupid sweeping statements without any basis.

dissed doc · 14-12-2010 11:31AM

Private sector developers make a hell of a lot more than public sector

Private sector building and construction workers make a huge amount more than public sector labourers

As a society, we require a social contract to ensure education, healthcare and security. Assuming we want to exist at a social development stage above South Africa. If those are not provided for at a social or state level, then Ireland's destiny will be for people to need to provide them first for themselves.

Dozen Wicked Words · 14-12-2010 11:35AM

My pay is not 49% higher than the private sector.

Cookie_Monster · 14-12-2010 11:37AM

I would assume this relates to average pay per hour but until link is fixed this is nothing more than another sniping contest between public and private

Japer · 14-12-2010 11:39AM

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Link doesnt work!

apologies, it does now.

ixoy · 14-12-2010 11:39AM

dissed doc wrote: »

As a society, we require a social contract to ensure education, healthcare and security.

What does that have to do with the rate of pay for those individuals though? If it's excessively high, it could still be lowered and the same services provided.

From my personal experience, civil servants are well paid per hour for their work involve relative to myself. 49% though? Nothing like it.

fliball123 · 14-12-2010 11:40AM

If this is true then there needs to be a scissors taken to the CPA..

BrianD3 · 14-12-2010 11:44AM

Japer wrote: »

According to the governments own statistics department, latest released figures show that public sector pay per hour is 49% higher than equivalent pay in the private sector.

It's not equivalent

In the private sector hourly earnings were effectively unchanged over the year at
€19.04, while the public sector saw a decrease of 4.6% from €29.64 to €28.29

Estimated averages do not reflect differences in characteristics of the job or the
employees.

Cookie_Monster · 14-12-2010 11:48AM

BrianD3 wrote: »

It's not equivalent

In the private sector hourly earnings were effectively unchanged over the year at
€19.04, while the public sector saw a decrease of 4.6% from €29.64 to €28.29

Estimated averages do not reflect differences in characteristics of the job or the
employees.

no, I'm sure its not. Does not take into account additional job security, better pensions, better holidays, lack of performance reviews and targets and so on.

nor does it take into account that the private sector will have a higher number of lower and higher earners overall.

sollar · 14-12-2010 11:52AM

Yeah a higher number of lower earners and a lower number of higher earners.

Japer you seem very interested in this (even obsessed), take the time to compile a proper comparison where job for job is compared between public and private and try and factor in education also.

The Muppet · 14-12-2010 11:54AM

Perhaps this goes some of the way in explaining why such services are more expensive when delivered by the public sector over the private sector.

Home care is now big business in Ireland: a 15-fold increase in providers over the last decade has created an industry worth approximately €500,000, according to RTÉ.

The investigation found that some companies were hiring workers with no training, no garda vetting and no checking of references. Distressing incidents, such as older people being force-fed, also came to light during the investigation.

http://www.thejournal.ie/hse-to-investigate-home-care-services-available-to-the-elderly-2010-12/

Riskymove · 14-12-2010 12:18PM

this is an ongoing issue with presentation of the statistics, particularly by this OP

the average pay of all PS and of all Provate sector cannot easily be compared, no matter how hard jimmmy/japer tries

the very same list now shows average pay in ICT and Financial and Insurance as now being higher than PS...which tells us a lot more about how things have been going in those sectors

it also shows that the average private sector wage is double the average for hotel and drink industry staff etc

Japer · 14-12-2010 12:18PM

The Muppet wrote: »

Perhaps this goes some of the way in explaining why such services are more expensive when delivered by the public sector over the private sector.

Like when a security man is employed in the public sector gets paid much more than the private sector equivalent ? We would all love to be on public sector level wages and pensions but suppose everyone in the country was like that, I am sure you will agree the country could not afford that and would be in a worse state than even it is now.

As regards "cowboy" type health care providers, that is up to the HSE and Gardai to regulate if they are breaking the law. The HSE is letting the taxpayer down if they are paying and failing to regulate cowboy operators.

fliball123 · 14-12-2010 12:25PM

Riskymove wrote: »

this is an ongoing issue with presentation of the statistics, particularly by this OP

the average pay of all PS and of all Provate sector cannot easily be compared, no matter how hard jimmmy/japer tries

the very same list now shows average pay in ICT and Financial and Insurance as now being higher than PS...which tells us a lot more about how things have been going in those sectors

it also shows that the average private sector wage is double the average for hotel and drink industry staff etc

So how did benchmarking work then?

Riskymove · 14-12-2010 12:47PM

fliball123 wrote: »

So how did benchmarking work then?

depending on your view

official: a thorough process whereby attempts were made to make like-for-like comparisons for 'similar' jobs

or

unofficial: made up for political reasons

Turnstyle · 14-12-2010 12:50PM

The cost of PS is strangling this country and the dogs in the street even know it, period! it has been this way for years and is consitently getting worse. While overpayment of employees may not be across the board the averages speak for themselves. Why do most things cost so much more in Ireland (eg, cars, health insurance, food, rates..) tax, thats why. Where does most of this tax go.. to pay an overstaffed, grossly overpaid and inefficient PS that wastes obscene amounts of taxpayers money at every chance. Did i read in a paper at the weekend that the head of the ESB is paid in the region of 750k... but hey "we need to attract and retain the right people" ya... :rolleyes:

fliball123 · 14-12-2010 12:51PM

Riskymove wrote: »

depending on your view

official: a thorough process whereby attempts were made to make like-for-like comparisons for 'similar' jobs

or

unofficial: made up for political reasons

Well lets do it again eithe officially or unofficially either way the P.S need a good cut 20% average accross the board

Riskymove · 14-12-2010 12:52PM

Turnstyle wrote: »

Why do most things cost so much more in Ireland (eg, cars, health insurance, food, rates..) tax, thats why

that does not really make sense as the PS pay all those taxes too

Did i read in a paper at the weekend that the head of the ESB is paid in the region of 750k... but hey "we need to attract and retain the right people" ya... :rolleyes:

the exchequer does not pay the salary of the ESB CEO

Riskymove · 14-12-2010 12:54PM

fliball123 wrote: »

Well lets do it again eithe officially or unofficially either way the P.S need a good cut 20% average accross the board

I direct you again to the stats for certain private sectors

Benchmarking may not result in what you want

it was a ridiculous process and should be done away with rather than continued.

Turnstyle · 14-12-2010 12:57PM

Riskymove wrote: »

that does not really make sense as the PS pay all those taxes too

pointless comment, where does it all go back to...

Riskymove wrote: »

the exchequer does not pay the salary of the ESB CEO

head of the DAA, the HSE, NTMA... list goes on, its all the one

fliball123 · 14-12-2010 12:59PM

Riskymove wrote: »

I direct you again to the stats for certain private sectors

Benchmarking may not result in what you want

it was a ridiculous process and should be done away with rather than continued.

No it should be slightly altered in the case where a like for like cannot be found ..compare to the rest of the EU ...

The Muppet · 14-12-2010 01:00PM

Japer wrote: »

Like when a security man is employed in the public sector gets paid much more than the private sector equivalent ? We would all love to be on public sector level wages and pensions but suppose everyone in the country was like that, I am sure you will agree the country could not afford that and would be in a worse state than even it is now.

As regards "cowboy" type health care providers, that is up to the HSE and Gardai to regulate if they are breaking the law. The HSE is letting the taxpayer down if they are paying and failing to regulate cowboy operators.

Which security man? are you sure he's not sub contracted?

Riskymove · 14-12-2010 01:01PM

Turnstyle wrote: »

where does it all go back to...

PS paybill is around 17-18bn gross

overall expenditure is over €50bn

The Muppet · 14-12-2010 01:03PM

Riskymove wrote: »

PS paybill is around 17-18bn gross

overall expenditure is over €50bn

What's the net figure ?

Turnstyle · 14-12-2010 01:04PM

Riskymove wrote: »

PS paybill is around 17-18bn gross

overall expenditure is over €50bn

and your point is...

Riskymove · 14-12-2010 01:06PM

Turnstyle wrote: »

and your point is...

PS pay is around a third of overall expenditure

yet you seem to think taxes are only for paying PS pay

What's the net figure ?

not sure off top of my head

a couple of billion less anyway

Japer · 14-12-2010 01:10PM

Riskymove wrote: »

PS paybill is around 17-18bn gross

Public service paybill in 1999 was only 9 billion. And things were not that bad them we still had some sort of a public service, a health system, a police force + judicary system then etc. Even the dogs in the street know the public service is over-personelled, overpaid and over-pensioned now. And do'nt crib about inflation. I know of properties which were sold recently for less than its 1999 value. Lidl and Penneys are selling stuff for less than they were in 1999. Your employer cannot afford to continue giving you a 49% premium, thats all.

Its official : public sector pay per hour is 49% higher than private sector

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