Northern Ireland

K-9 · 01-12-2010 02:22AM

Alberto Gigantic Self-restraint wrote: »

Is it illegal?.

Didn't the Irish republic (shamefully) vote away (under articules 2 & 3) our constitutional claim to Northern Ireland?.

You and whose army?

greyed · 01-12-2010 02:34AM

brummytom wrote: »

Please - just have it back.

You know when your mate has a really hot curry? Like a tindaloo or something. And you take a bit. Maybe about a 5th of it.

You taste it, and think 'Oh Jesus Christ that's hot, I wish I'd never taken it'; and you spent the next century drinking water, waiting for it to cool down?

That's what Northern Ireland is to Britain. A Tindaloo. Please just have it back.

Thats what ye get for stealing your mate's food :pac:

smk89 · 01-12-2010 02:40AM

Alberto Gigantic Self-restraint wrote: »

Yes I want it back.

Past generations of Irish men and women died for a united Ireland, I'm not so shallow and self centered to ignore their sacrifice's.

So it'll cost us money, and more heart break - tough sh*t, its our's and will be forever.

Oh you mean the past generations that were motivated to hate England because of nationalism created by those in power.

Grow up, the past 80 years have changed the North. Now only 50% of nationalists want a united Ireland. It isn't your possession.

df1985 · 01-12-2010 03:02AM

They can keep it, its an absolute kip from my experience.Belfast is a dreary miserable dump, they build a new shopping centre though and all of a sudden its Paris. A lot of nationalists dont even want an united ireland anyway. They have a serious chip on their shoulder aswell, go to a gaa match involving a team from the six counties and listen to the abuse from our "brothers"-disgraceful.

People in the North seem to think we care about them and the situation, whereas I couldnt give a ****e if it floated into the Atlantic.

TheUsual · 01-12-2010 03:03AM

smk89 wrote: »

ONow only 50% of nationalists want a united Ireland. It isn't your possession.

Says who, where do you get 50%. Not 49% or 51% ?

And if that were true the SDLP would be a stronger force in politics in the 6 counties then they are today.

smk89 · 01-12-2010 03:38AM

TheUsual wrote: »

Says who, where do you get 50%. Not 49% or 51% ?

And if that were true the SDLP would be a stronger force in politics in the 6 counties then they are today.

http://www.ark.ac.uk/nilt/2009/Political_Attitudes/NIRELND2.html (at the bottom).

Your right it's actually 60% of catholics who don't want an united Ireland.

And the reason the SDLP isn't that strong is because catholics/nationalists tend to vote Sein Fein no1 and then the SDLP.

arid · 01-12-2010 04:12AM

I would like to see it happen someday. There shouldn't be a situation where a significant minority was opposed to it though. Need to be more 67 % than 51 %. The Unionists aren't going to just go away. Anyway they've been here hundreds of years now so why should they. We should be focussing on convincing them why it would be better. That doesn't mean tokenism like the Commonwealth but...

Anyway the most important thing is that nobody's killing each other over it. It's not worth it and it's not the way I would want reunification to happen.

Whatever about money. Everything costs money. Deal with it. Some people have such a hangup about cost all the time, they miss the whole point. There are significant advantages to an all-island economy and NI is underdeveloped anyway. A bit like Ireland in the early 90s before the original, real Celtic tiger (yes it did actually exist up to about 2001). The potential is there for them. As a big fish in a small pond rather than ignored by a London-centric government.

It's really up to NI to decide its own future. I wouldn't lose too much sleep over them but reunification would be great and is worth striving for.

charlemont · 01-12-2010 04:17AM

it should have been united years ago

flas · 01-12-2010 04:24AM

Alberto Gigantic Self-restraint wrote: »

Of course it'll reach Dublin.

As for savagery and being naive, I've seen war first hand. I understand completely what it mean's.. And before you hit me up with a civil war being worse, I was serving in Lebanon through their civil war in the mid 80's.

In my heart its still our's and I'm completely filled with confidence that should it come to a civil war I'd have the courage to stand up for my convictions.

you think the innocent women and children that would be caught up in the inevitable bombings that would ensue would feel the same? or their families? woop-de-do, you will stand up and many like you to kill people who at the time of war would be your fellow country men, id say the majority would not like blood shed on our streets, and seeing as you are a soldier is it not your mandate to follow the majority vote?

i understand there is no such thing as a clean war but this would be a war of the dirty kind!no warning bombs on the civilian population, basically what people in the northern part of this country had been seeing for 30 odd years.

it would need a serious, complex plan of action to see these events limited and not going on for as long as we know they can(years and years) and im not exactly convinced by our current governments plan making!

i dont think it should be just handed over, whatever about the economic situation it could put us in, good or bad, it would need to be done so as the majority would want it, a large majority at that, then welcome them with open arms, take the signs down along the border! it would be a monumental day in Irish history and one which we should be build towards.

TheUsual · 01-12-2010 04:26AM

smk89 wrote: »

http://www.ark.ac.uk/nilt/2009/Political_Attitudes/NIRELND2.html (at the bottom).
Your right it's actually 60% of catholics who don't want an united Ireland.

I read the page, and am none the wiser. How many people were polled ? What kind of people were polled ? Give me real information and I might believe you.

smk89 wrote: »

And the reason the SDLP isn't that strong is because catholics/nationalists tend to vote Sein Fein no1 and then the SDLP.

And this means that the majority of nationalists vote for Irish unity. You have proved my point. Thanks.

Mozoltov! · 01-12-2010 04:47AM

Cmdr Keen wrote: »

Erm money we don't have? If a united Ireland was achieved, you don't think the savagery would reach Dublin, then you are naive....

Fúck this bailout búllshít. The population of the EU is circa 520 Million. You go work out how much we'd be taking off each person if we're to get the full 85 billion.

I earn sweet fúck all but I wouldn't be too miffed about losing €160 if it meant saving the integrity and structure of a country.

I might even be extra nice and tell them they don't have to pay me back!

KeithAFC · 01-12-2010 04:55AM

I thought this boat had passed. Its not going to happen.

KeithAFC · 01-12-2010 05:00AM

Alberto Gigantic Self-restraint wrote: »

Of course it'll reach Dublin.

As for savagery and being naive, I've seen war first hand. I understand completely what it mean's.. And before you hit me up with a civil war being worse, I was serving in Lebanon through their civil war in the mid 80's.

In my heart its still our's and I'm completely filled with confidence that should it come to a civil war I'd have the courage to stand up for my convictions.

No you woulnd't.

Dionysus · 01-12-2010 05:02AM

irish-stew wrote: »

London can hardly afford it, how do you think Dublin would?

Because our government is better at managing its finances?

Dionysus · 01-12-2010 05:12AM

Alberto Gigantic Self-restraint wrote: »

Is it illegal?.

Didn't the Irish republic (shamefully) vote away (under articules 2 & 3) our constitutional claim to Northern Ireland?.

Technically, Alberto Gigantic Self-restraint, the Irish Republic never gave a inch millimetre. The 1st Dáil of the Irish Republic will live forever. As Ruairí Ó Brádaigh put it some years ago: you can't kill the dream.

The Republic of Ireland (official, internationally-recognised name: Ireland), on the other hand, has done all of the above.

arid · 01-12-2010 06:10AM

Don't see anything "shameful" about the changes to Articles 2 and 3. We still express a desire for re-unification, in a democratic way. Surely that's better than the old doublethink which claimed Northern Ireland was already ours - you can't solve a problem without acknowledging it exists.

Yeah the distinction between (Republic of) Ireland and the Irish Republic is very important. Someone please tell the BBC, Guardian etc.

Notorious97 · 01-12-2010 10:30AM

Ireland Unfree Shall Never Be At Peace......

Says it all really, yes we should accept it back with open arms, one island, one country, i fully believe in and support a 32 county Irish Republic, involving active participation from all sides of the communities across this island. There may be trouble at first yes, but i believe the country would come through it for the better. Irish people have come through worse and i definitely think a united Ireland will be for the best.

“Many suffer so that some day all Irish people may know justice and peace.” Theobald Wolfe Tone

Promac · 01-12-2010 10:51AM

df1985 wrote: »

People in the North seem to think we care about them and the situation, whereas I couldnt give a ****e if it floated into the Atlantic.

There's the biggest hurdle right there. A bunch of smug feckers in the south who don't give a ****e cause they got sorted 90 years ago and who cares about a bunch of black northerners anyway?

There's no physical border any more but there's never been a greater divide because of people like this idiot.

raymann · 01-12-2010 11:27AM

Promac wrote: »

There's the biggest hurdle right there. A bunch of smug feckers in the south who don't give a ****e cause they got sorted 90 years ago and who cares about a bunch of black northerners anyway?

There's no physical border any more but there's never been a greater divide because of people like this idiot.

you seem to be on the other end of the scale and are just as bad. i voted no because the last thing we need is a civil war to go with our impending grinding poverty.

i am a republican and i always thought the ideal solution was ireland becoming a very rich socially conciuos place and the a shift in the demographic changes up north. this combined with the softening of memories by a generation or two.

europe becoming more of single entity as well would help.

anything but civil war and genocide. not worth for the idealistic principle. not for them not for us.

problemchimp · 01-12-2010 11:45AM

People seem to think the troubles are over, but watch this space. Sadly the R.I.R.A. are getting stronger so I don't think there will ever be peace as long as the 6 counties are occupied. Oh and yes I would like it back please if that's ok.

paky · 01-12-2010 11:50AM

i dont recognise 'northern ireland' as a state and i never will. ireland has been free since 1916

Riddle101 · 01-12-2010 11:57AM

Ah sure we can take one more punch if it means a United Ireland, so yeah i'd like it back thanks

Promac · 01-12-2010 12:10PM

raymann wrote: »

you seem to be on the other end of the scale and are just as bad. i voted no because the last thing we need is a civil war to go with our impending grinding poverty.

i am a republican and i always thought the ideal solution was ireland becoming a very rich socially conciuos place and the a shift in the demographic changes up north. this combined with the softening of memories by a generation or two.

europe becoming more of single entity as well would help.

anything but civil war and genocide. not worth for the idealistic principle. not for them not for us.

I'm not on the end of any scale. I'm from Derry but I live in Dublin so I can talk from experience of both sides of the border.

Your scare-mongering about a civil war is a tired old argument - as bad as the "we can't afford it" argument.

As someone said earlier - many Irish men and women have fought and died for an end to British rule for centuries but people complain about being out of pocket a few bob or that they don't want a "civil war" - well here's a newsflash for you buddy, the problem's still there.

No-one in Britain wants Northern Ireland to stay in the UK - the only people that do are bitter protestants in the north and privileged toffee-noses on both sides of the border who are scared their taxes might go up a bit.

getz · 01-12-2010 12:26PM

paky wrote: »

i dont recognise 'northern ireland' as a state and i never will. ireland has been free since 1916

i see you have never read the,articles of agreement for the treaty between great britain and ireland, and the goverment of ireland act ? another point how could it have been free under a hostile goverment [irish free state]

Gunsfortoys · 01-12-2010 12:39PM

Promac wrote: »

There's the biggest hurdle right there. A bunch of smug feckers in the south who don't give a ****e cause they got sorted 90 years ago and who cares about a bunch of black northerners anyway?

There's no physical border any more but there's never been a greater divide because of people like this idiot.

You get infracted for this yet the OP and a few others get away with the "cleansing" etc comments. It shows there is a huge bias on this forum.

Notorious97 · 01-12-2010 12:43PM

Gunsfortoys wrote: »

You get infracted for this yet the OP and a few others get away with the "cleansing" etc comments. It shows there is a huge bias on this forum.

Just noticing now? Its the most anti Irish / anti republican place, these sorts of threads bring out them out. Im republican, i think the country should be reunited. Im all for working with unionists, the funny thing is they would have a much larger say in the running of the island than they currently do have a say in the UK affairs.

The rest of this thread is only going to be a disaster. Good Luck

PK2008 · 01-12-2010 12:48PM

Cmdr Keen wrote: »

Do we really want it back, like right now?

The amount of money the State (if it has any) would have to invest would be rediculous... it is a **** hole after all that needs to be clensed (woops, I meant cleaned :P) up...

Is it worth it?

Christ no, I cant understand a word those nordies say.

ReacherCreature · 01-12-2010 12:48PM

paky wrote: »

i dont recognise 'northern ireland' as a state and i never will. ireland has been free since 1916

1916? Sorry to burst your bubble but that's inaccurate.

maximoose · 01-12-2010 12:49PM

Gunsfortoys wrote: »

People in Northern Ireland have moved on, it is a pity their brothers across the border can't.

I wouldn't generalise like that.... From my own experience I would say that Irish people are much more welcoming to people from Ulster than the other way around.

Gunsfortoys · 01-12-2010 12:52PM

maximoose wrote: »

I wouldn't generalise like that.... From my own experience I would say that Irish people are much more welcoming to people from Ulster than the other way around.

I agree and perhaps I shouldn't have put everyone in the one frame, but when you have people generalising people from the North it is hard to be on an equal standing.

Although the likelihood of any of them saying it to your face is minimal from experience.

Northern Ireland

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